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Thread: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Special

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    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Talking 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Special

    First, even though this is my first post, I want to thank everyone here at 420. I have been studying the forms here for months and am truly amazed at the ingenuity and expertise here, and know I'll be seeking more help as I go through this grow.

    Some special kudos to guys like Scottyballz & others who, without even knowing it, have been a real inspiration and wealth of knowledge! You guys know your sh!t!

    Thanks to all of you, I feel like I'm already an expert grower EXCEPT for the small fact that I've never grown anything!

    Time to try to put all of this knowledge to the test!

    Before we start, I promise to get some pics uploaded in the next week or so when my new laptop gets here. My laptop is dying and I can only boot into safe-mode right now & can't upload any pics from my phone :(

    Stealth is extremely important to me and I have a spare room with a closet that's rarely used, so decided to dedicate the closet space for the grow. I also wanted to have some perpetual grow going on since getting seeds and clones is difficult as I'm in a state where this is frowned upon.

    I looked a dozens of the pre-built systems, but quickly realized they were all using very cheap components. I then started looking at modifying one of the pre-fabricated cabinets from Lowes or HD, but again, they were all cheaply made and most had cardboard backs which wouldn't do a great job of hiding the noise.

    I decided to build my own cabinet using 3/4" white Melamine. It would blend in well in the closet, wouldn't need to be painted/finished, and was nice & thick to help muffle the sounds of the fans & hydro pumps. Plus, the air handling unit is located directly behind the closet, so it would further mask any of the noises.

    I made the cabinet 48"W x 24"D x 73 1/2"H with a top shelf located about 16" down to house the fan, carbon filter, pumps, electronics, and other stuff. Since I'm using hydro, I wanted all the elctrical located at the top of the cabinet and the water at the bottom (water flows down!). I also wired the cabinet to a GFCI circuit and have a 500VA UPS system providing battery backup in the event of a short-term power failure.

    With the cabinet divided into two 2' x 2' (approximate) chambers for veg/mothers & bloom, I'm already wishing I had more room! I left the inside of the veg chamber with the white melamine and put permaflect film in the flower chamber on the sides and top.

    I'm hoping to maintain two strains as mothers/clones but to maximize yields I think I'm only going to flower one plant at a time using a combination of topping & LST. The plants will only be able to be grown to about 3' tall but I'm hoping to get 2-4 oz. per plant/harvest.

    I've purchased a couple of Waterfarms (the Complete system, not modular) that have been modified with additional holes, airstones, and larger pumps; and I made a DIY DWC bubble cloner using a 4 gallon container.

    I ordered (5) G-13 Pineapple Express seeds and (5) Barney's Farm LSD seeds from Attitude, who I HIGHLY recommend for seed delivery. Make sure to specify the STEALTH delivery option, if desired!!! They also added 3 freebie seeds from Kannabia Seeds: (1) Big Band, (1) Power Skunk, & (1) Kannabia Special.

    The truth is I can't WAIT to try some of the LSD, but since this is my first real grow, I figured I'd first try the Pineapple Express & Kannabia Special and see if I can get through an entire harvest before breaking out the LSD seeds. If I'm successful with this grow, the LSD will be next!

    The seeds came in on Saturday 12/18 and I started germination at approximately 10:00am using Sure-to-Grow 1 1/2" starter cubes. I'm pretty impressed with the STG media (seems MUCH easier than Rockwool and/or Hydroton!) and will be using it exclusively throughout this grow.

    I PH'd the water to 5.8 after adding just a small amount of Superthrive and 3% H2O2 and they spent the first 36 hours on a germination mat under a humidity dome before moving them under a T-5 that's on 24/0 right now. The seeds still haven't broken the surface, but the T-5 provides the small amount of heat that helps and as soon as they break, I want them to have access to light.

    I know everyone wants pictures, but until I can post them, here are a few links to the equipment I'm using:

    Using This T5 for Veg: GROW mh/BLOOM hps T5 COMPACT FLUORESCENT LIGHT 2'ft CFL - eBay (item 270652653488 end time Nov-14-10 19:00:15 PST)

    Using This LED for Flowering: 180w Blackstar Ultra Violet LED Grow Light Cree 2 watt LED's

    Note: I also have (4) 2700K CFL's I'll be using for "side lighting" during flower.

    Using This 4" Fan w/ Filter: 4" INLINE FAN CARBON FILTER COMBO ODOR CAN AIR INCH 6 8 - eBay (item 400151951436 end time Jan-05-11 0708 PST)

    I've got (2) of these fans (one in each chamber) blowing air up to the top of the cabinet where I have a passive exhause as well as the blower fan to extract the heat but I still think my ventillation will need some work: Best Electronics 120 x 120 x 25mm Low Speed AC Fan w/ 36" Power Cord (BT12025B1L) - FrozenCPU.com

    Using this Ph/TDS meter: Hanna HI 98130 pH & Conductivity Pen High Range - Mitchell Instrument Company

    I've also got (2) Waterfarm Complete systems and may order a 3rd depending on how the space gets filled: GENERAL HYDROPONICS

    I also have Advanced Nutrients Grow/Micro/Bloom plus Bud Candy, Big Bud & Overdrive, but since the Waterfarms came with GH Grow/Micro/Bloom formulas and I've heard good things about the ease of controlling PH with the GH nutrients, I think I'm going to start off with the GH base nutes and when I get a little more experience, graduate up to the AN.

    OK...that should be a good start for this journal.

    I welcome any comments & suggestions (as long as they're constructive!) and thanks again to everyone for their help in getting me this far.
    Last edited by 420; 08-20-2011 at 09:17 PM.

  2. #2
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    OK everyone...I figured out how to get around the safe mode issue by emailing the pics to myself (instead of uploading from my phone) and took it from there, so here's some pics of what's going on...

    First...I built a housing for the fan and to help further cut down on noise I glued some foam to the inside of the housing:



    another view:



    Sorry I don't have pic's of me building the cabinet, but was too busy working to take pics and the 3/4" melamine is heavy stuff!

    Here's what the finished cabinet looks like placed into the closet. I've taken the closet doors off to give a better view:



    And here's what the cabinet inside looks like:



    On the top-left you can see the carbon filter hanging, which I'll hook up once I start needing it. On the top-right, you can see the fan housing:



    The left side is for flowering, and that's where I have the UFO with the additional CFL's for side lighting:



    And, on the right side I have the DIY bubble cloner where right now I have the PE and KS germinating under the humidity dome with 24/0 lighting. The light is about 6 inches above the cloner, but I'll move it closer a couple of days after they sprout (hopefully soon!):



    And finally, here's what the closet looks like all closed up WITH the cabinet inside & running:



    It's virtually silent from just about all of the main areas of the house, BUT, instead of putting a hole in the closet and venting through there, I'm just venting into the closet, so even with the central A/C, I'm getting temp's as high as 84*...I'll need to work more on ventillation.

    That's about it for now...hopefully I get some sprouts soon and can update with some GOOD pics!

  3. #3
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    It's been a little more than 72 hours since I began germination and nothing yet. It does look like the PE may be trying to push its way up. Is it true that if you check them every 10 minutes, they germinate faster?

  4. #4
    420 Member decrimCA's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Wow - great details in this post. Thanks for sharing this.

    I like the setup: Advanced Nutrients Grow/Micro/Bloom plus Bud Candy, Big Bud & Overdrive.

    I would just suggest that you add Voodoo Juice to the mix, maybe some B-52 and you'll be in business. Well, that's what I use along with your chosen nutes, but I use Sensi A&B.

    Can't wait to see how this one goes.

    And yes, germination does go faster when you check on your plants every ten minutes.

  5. #5
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    DecrimCA, thanks for stopping by and thanks for the advice. I've looked at the Voodoo juice and everyone says great things about it, but it's a little pricey. I do have some Superthrive & Hygrozyme which I think will help with root production and will probably spring for some Voodoo juice once I get a harvest or two under my belt. I'm going to try to keep this posts as detailed as possible (partly, so I can go back and reference for my next grow) and I'll keep the pic's coming as we get more progress. Best!

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    420 Member jcool09's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Krip View Post
    I looked a dozens of the pre-built systems, but quickly realized they were all using very cheap components. I then started looking at modifying one of the pre-fabricated cabinets from Lowes or HD, but again, they were all cheaply made and most had cardboard backs which wouldn't do a great job of hiding the noise.
    I have been using two of the Lowes cabinets for a little over a year. I have a 3'x1.5'x6' for flower and a 2.5'x1.5'x6' for veg/males/clones/moms etc. and they have held up pretty well. I also did a lot of research before I started but I was not properly prepared for the heat and odor problems. The carbon scrubber is likely not going to cut it- I would discuss your specific environment with an expert at your local hydro store if you can. Nothing sucks more than to find out the hard way and then scramble to make modifications while your grow is offline (been there). I asked about carbon scrubbers but was told that the only solution in a closed area that would remove odor completely was an ozone generator. Unfortunately it only worked when it was physically located in the cabinet and set to run long enough that it also caused plant damage. The only way I could deal with the odor and heat was to get the air completely out of the cabinet and the room.

    The following was the solution that worked for me. The bottom/first shelf of my cabs are 4" off the floor so I was able to cut out the middle section for ventilation intake leaving a 4" perimeter around the edges to provide footing for the plastic storage shelf units (from HD) that fit inside perfectly. I have a 4" flexible duct mounted on he top rear of the cabinet that has a T that provides a raw intake and also connects to the hood of my 250w MH/HPS lamp. The 4" duct runs through the wall in to the attic above where a 6" duct booster in-line fan creates suction and then exhausts into an eave with a soffit vent to get the air and humidity outside. With the help of some weatherstripping and the insulation foam I have made the doors and sides light and airtight so the negative pressure created by the duct fan create a cool air flow from the botom of the cabinet and no odor escapes into the room. This system worked reliably through the 14 weeks of my SLH grow. The room would be odor free until I opened the cabinet. I used the ozone generator in the open room to remove the odor while I was lovin' on my ladies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Krip View Post
    The seeds came in on Saturday 12/18 and I started germination at approximately 10:00am using Sure-to-Grow 1 1/2" starter cubes. I'm pretty impressed with the STG media (seems MUCH easier than Rockwool and/or Hydroton!) and will be using it exclusively throughout this grow.
    I discovered these at the beginning of my 09/2009 grow and had very poor results. This grow was a failure but I learned a lot. You can see the early versions of my cabinet and shelving design. I followed it up with a very productive SLH grow that I decided not to journal due to time constraints. I hope you have better luck than I did with the STG, I look forward to some pics when your babies sprout. If you do have trouble and are looking for something else my local hydro store has what they call "super starter plugs" that are sold individually out of a plastic bag behind the counter. They're made from a brown organic material that is rubbery and pre-moistened. They retain a perfect moisture balance for starting seeds; I have had nearly perfect results so I'll never go back to using anything else. I'm currently doing a Lowryder2 soil grow- I linked to your journal from Dr. Feelgood's LED / autoflower grow. I'm interested to see how these new LED lights work out. You've got me hooked, I'm going to sit back and enjoy your journal and hopefully learn a few things myself.

  7. #7
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    JCool, thanks for stopping by and thanks for the tips. I just read through your entire first journal and perhaps I'm making some of the same mistakes. On the STG starter cubes, I've basically had these under 24/0 lighting since 36 hours after first starting germination. I'm also probably guilty of messing with them too often.

    I've also used quite a bit of weatherstripping to get negative pressure in the cab and during flower, I plan on adding some ONA and hoping that with only one plant (depending on pheno), the odor won't get too bad, but certainly acknowledge I'll need to work on my ventillation and probably drill through the closet wall or ceiling to vent.

    Again, I really appreciate the helpful advice and expect it will take a few grows to get it "dialed in". I'm also looking forward to see how the LED performs for flower.

    It's good to have you in for the ride!

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    420 Member turttle's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Nice mr krip.I like your set up.In my opinion this is the best way to go.Quality is best done with your own two hands and yours is basic well hidden and blends in with your home like its ment to be there.Awsome.
    If your interested in the leds be carefull there are only a hand full that work.I would recomend --- 300 watt 12 band unit.Runs about 700 if you mension Irish boy.This light has gone threw many grows on these forums and seem watt for watt equal to hps but plants are a lot healthyer and picture purfect.Another one would by hydroponics hut with 7 band.I ran a couple of there 90 watt units and they did ok but I traded them in for a hh250 watt which I am in the process of seeing how well it holds up.

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    420 Member Dr Feelgood's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Hey krip your set up is clean, i'll be watching

  10. #10
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Guys,

    Thanks for the good words. I've been watching both your grows hoping to learn from the experienced.

    Which brings me to my update...

    It's now been 5 days since I put the seeds into the STG cubes and they still haven't broken the surface. JCool warned about having bad luck with STG and warned against messing with them too much, but, since I was getting impatient, I had to mess with them a little...

    I took a sterilized tweezers and gently started pulling back the fibers on the STG cube. I think they were too tight to allow the seeds to easily break surface. Once I pulled them back to "loosen" the material, I gently recovered the seedlings.

    The PE seed was just below the surface and I was careful not to complete expose either seed completely. I can't really tell what's going on with that one just yet, but it does seem to be close to the surface.

    The KS seed was definately further down than the PE BUT as I was pulling back the fibers, I could see some green (unlike the PE which still appeared brownish), so I do think I will get at least one viable sprout.

    If I don't see them break surface in the next 48 hours, I'm gonna start germinating a couple more seeds as a backup plan.

    I'm getting pretty anxious here!

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    420 Member turttle's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    I have been having issues with starting seeds in rock wool my self.For cloning it works great but I think I keep drowning the seeds possibly as RW holds to much moisture.I have better luck if I sit the RW on a tray with heat matt.Also what I did with my new seeds I am just starting is I cut a middles portion of the rock wool out and filled it with starter soil.So far I think this works better for me.

  12. #12
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Turttle, thanks for the tip. I'm definately going to start my seeds differently next time, but I haven't totally given up on the STG yet. On this round, I didn't soak the seeds in water at all or wait for a developed taproot before placing in the STG cubes. I just put them in a well-saturated STG cube, then put it in a humidity dome on a head mat for 36 hours. After 36 hours, I put the cubes into some STG inserts that hold the cubes and fit into netpots in my cloner. I put the water level about an inch or so above the bottom of the netpots figuring it would keep the bottom moist and help drive the roots down. I've also been supplementing with light surface misting when I no longer see condensation on the humidity dome.

    From my "minor surgery" last night, it appeared that both seeds were taking, but they were having problems poking though the small center hole in the STG cube. They looked to be surfacing just off-center and were having trouble making it though the "skin" that covers the cube around the center hole.

    Last night, shortly after my last post, I got a closer look at what was going on and then took some small (sterilized) scissors and cut back the skin of the STG cube making an area where the seeds could more easily emerge. I made sure the fibers weren't too "tight" and gently recovered the seeds by pulling some surrounding fibers back over. I also raised the light about to about 12" to try to encourage some stretching.

    When I checked them this morning, they looked good and like they're just poking through now. I'll take some pics later and post them tonight.

    I saw this really great method of germination I'm going to try next time...

    I wish I could find the link so I could post it, but essentially, the guy makes a small tube out of a 4x4 piece of sandpaper that he rolls up & tapes. He puts the seeds in the tube and shakes the tube lightly for about two minutes to scuff the outside of the seeds. This supposedly thins the shell and helps them absorb water and break out easier. He then soaks the scuffed seeds for about 8 hours, then takes the seeds and puts them in a kitchen strainer (mesh screen bottom). He then wraps a wet towel completely around the strainer and puts it in a sink with the faucet set to just a drip (literally one drop every few seconds or so, just to keep the towel moist). That way, the seeds don't drown, either. He used older seeds that were stored in a freezer to show the effectiveness of the technique and in 36 hours had something like a 94% germination rate, even with the old seeds.

    In any event, I think it might be better to get the taproot going before putting in the starter cubes. I always thought people did this because they didn't want to waste a cube if the seed didn't germinate, but I can see the advantages of getting to line up the seedling a more optimal way in the cube once it has a taproot.

  13. #13
    420 Member Ultrabudda's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Try a paper towel, fold over twice, place in plastic bag in a warm dark place. Just add enough water to wet the towel "not too much". In a few days you should see seeds open.
    One persons weed is another persons flower !

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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    Everything is looking great can't wait till you have some plants growing in that fine system you have there.

  15. #15
    420 Member of the Month - September 2011 - Plant of the Month - January 2012 Mr. Krip's Avatar
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    Re: 1st Time Stealth DIY Cabinet Grow- Hydro/T-5/LED Pineapple Express & Kannabia Spe

    UPDATE FROM PREVIOUS POST:

    Here's that video on germination...it's pretty cool, although, the guy fills the time with lots of cools trich shots, so it's a little longer than needed:


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