Grow setup advice

[Integrum Stultus]

Currently working with a 36"x20"x62" tent and a full spectrum 300w LED. I have 5 gallon equivalent Super root air-pots that im going to fill with FFOF soil with some added perlite. I plan on running GH maxigro/bloom and kool bloom (both powder form). Was also considering a molasses supplement. Im going to throw some mykos (by XG) in on planting for solid root developement/nutrient uptake. Im planning on starting with autos (i have 3 diff seeds - 1 chemdawg, 1 blue dream and 1 gorilla glue) and eventually switching over to photos after i successfully grasp the basics etc. I've heard autos are best to try your green thumb out on.

With that said any tips or constructive critiscism is welcome, just dont be a 'Richard'.

Any info on any of these strains from previous grows would be great, as i said im new and wanna get it right.

 

[Guruth]

most importaint advice you can get from me is this...

!!!!!!>> DITCH ALL THE FANCY NUTES <<!!!!!

all you need is some starter soil that is fertilised for 3 weeks of vegging time (something like plagron growmix or anything simmilar really) and a fertiliser optimised for flowering stage. LIQUID FERTILISER!!!! read up on instructions and put in exactly as instructed... if you think you are not giving them enough nutes... reduce them by 20% . you can always add more nutes... you can not take them out!

seriusly... every grower including myself overcomplicates their first grow. and then when problems happen you have to many variables to figure out what the hell is causing them....

let me nitpick your setup now

first off light is perfect size for your grow... and i do mean perfect 32w per square foot of LED... 5w chips. if the light is of decent quality you will have a nice yield there. over a gram per watt!

i do like your choice of air pots too... ive been running them for some time now and i must say they work magnificentlty!

and now for the downsides... get ready for a asswhooping

you have no air circulation in your description... you need at least a 30-45w fan to move air oround (those small 15 clipons are worthless and computer fans are no go) you need a good 8 or 12 inch fan with some power behind it so it will make your babies dance. high wind conditions make for thick and healthy plants and also reduces your mold problems by quite alot! and you will have mold problems in a small space and no air movement... i guarantee you that! so get a nice fan to move air around and a fat outtake fan with at least 100cfm and a decent carbon filter (you will love me for this later) led lights produce less heat, but they still produce heat... alot of it. so get that air circulation going... more air the better...

second... 5 galon air pots are to big. no buts no maybes... THEY ARE TO BIG. plants will grow up to 60 inches in height in those... i have 40 inch high plants in 6 liter pots (2gal equivalent) and i have serious problems now with a 2 meter high tent... the pots you are using are perfect for a scrog. but for autos or 12/12 from seed they are just to big... plants will go wild in them and grow insanely tall.

try smaller pots and more plants... maybe go for 8 plants and 3 liter pots... they will be shorter and easier to manage but will fit your grow space nicely and you should get 15-20 grams per plant... ok for a first grow maybe 10 grams per plant... which is still very nice. they will grow about 20 inches in height and bush a bit and be nice and sexy!

and another thing about air pots... watering water them alot... when you think you wattered enough... ADD SOME MORE... and then a splash just for good measure. my plants in 6 liter pots are drinking about 30 fuid ounces (0.7 liters) PER DAY. you can not overwater a plant in an air pot... you just cant.. trust me just give them water plenty of it. they like water... did i say they like water?
if you water your plants and most of the water is coming out the bottom then you wattered enough... if your water is comming out the side holes... the soil is to dry and water is not being absorbed by it... water a bit... wait 30 min to let it spread out in the pot and water again. repeat until drainage is at the bottom only. remember water through side holes on the upper half means that the soil is to dry and water is just sliding on top of the dry soil and is not breaking through... surface tension and stuff it helps alot if you make a small cup in the soil on the top of the pot to pour water in.

thats in for now... if you have any questions... OPEN MOUTH AND ASK!! plenty of nice people here that will help

 

[fanleaf]

I would stick with the 5 gallon air pots like you are doing. I grow my Autos in 7 gallon air pots and never have tall plants. All of my plants are always short and very Stout. Look in my signature below at my current 6 Auto grow to see. You can always control height if needed. Usually if your plants are getting too tall it means you're probably lacking in the light department. Speaking of lacking in the lighting department I would also not agree with your light being perfect for your tent size. You are in the mid-thirties as far as actual watts pulled from the wall per square foot and that is at the very lowest recommended. If possible I would grab another maybe smaller one to get you somewhere in the neighborhood of mid forties as far as watts per square foot with 50 being optimal. The only LEDs that would be considered perfect at 180 Watts pulled from the wall or less would be white cob lights.

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[Integrum Stultus]

1st off let me thank the both of you guys for resonding and giving your opinion. I appreciate it.

As for the height issues i could always train them.

Pertaining to the lighting issue i planned on running the 300w to start and then introduce 2 additional LEDs, both GL60LED (180w; 2.5"x2.5" coverage). Was either going to suspend them also or angle them up from the floor.

I haven't started my grow yet. Ive been obtaining supplies/equipment, i want my set-up perfect before i sprout any girls. Chances are I'm only gonna run 1 at a time, maybe 2 next run if the 1st is a success. As for the pot size i do also have the 3 gal equivolancy super root pots. As for the nutes i was considering going thru the motions of k.i.s.s., hence the GH nutes. The last peice of equipment im going to be picking up is a variable speed 6" exhaust fan with carbon filter/scrubber (390 cfm rating). I have a 6" clip on for circulation. No intake.

Have either of you had any experience with the auto strains I've listed?

Any tips on temps and humidity? I was thinking 78-82 F and 55-60% during light and then 70-73 F and 40-45% when dark. (Just numbers in my head any corrections would be great). Nute schedule? I dont plan on introducing nutes untill 3-4 wks in (FFOF is hot stuff and i dont want my girl(s) getting burnt). Light schedule? I was considering 20/4 or 18/6. Any additional supplements that have been successful? Basically any info, i will take. I dont feel like i can get enough info to satisfy my craving for knowledge! LoL

 

[Guruth]

problem is his strain selection and tent height.... his tent is just to low for pots that size i am afraid... pots are almost 13 inches high... we can reasonably expect for flowers to go 40 inches in height since he picked some sativa dominant stuff and dont forget you need about 20 inches of space for lights (setup + clearance to the top of the plants) so we are 40+14+20... thats 74... hes 12 inches short... so best case scenario is he has 30 inch high sativas.... yeah wishfull thinking

managing height issues is all fine and dandy for an experienced grower like you or me... but hes quite new and i think a shorter bushier strain will serve him quite well... or a sativa in a smaller pot.

i do agree that big pots equal big yields... but topping an auto cause its to high is just sad

you can try your plants.. you will learn alot, but autos are realy bad learning tools... they are unforgiving to mistakes and almost imposible to control... i did the same mistake with starting with an auto strain... ended up with low yield and uncontrolable plants...

photoplants are not hard to grow... they are actually easier... since if you make any mistakes you can just extend the veg period a bit and all you loose is a week or 2... and still get a great result!

as for humidity... anything betwen 50 and 65% is great during first 8 weeks... for the last fev weeks try to get it as low as you can... below 40% is great.

reducing the humidity helps with thc production since all taht stinky mess is actually plants protection against dehydration

and please please... get a larger fan than 6'' clipon for circulation... those are useless... and i mean useless... i literally doubled my yield just by ditching a 6'' clip on fan and sticking a powerful 40w oscilating 8 incher in the tent... remember... air means co2 supply and heavy circulation means that the o2 bubbles that form on the leaves get stripped away... more food for plants.

ventilation is the most importaint part of the grow... i can not overstress how importaint it is... if you have only one quality item to pick... pick a fan for circulation of air in the tent!

and be carefull with lights... 150w of led is plenty for your tent... a decent 150w led will produce 150grams of dried bud with ease if you treat your plants right... to much light is just as bad if not worse than to little light. 32w per ft2 is enough... you need 30+ to succesfully flower a plant under led. if you shove all taht in your tent you will have what? 60w per ft2? way to much... you will poison them and you will ahve serious ehat issues even with leds... go easy and just learn with one plant... dont overdo it... use one light then add one more for the next grow and so on... i tried sticking a 300w led in 2.5x2.5 tent just for the shits and giggles... it burned my plants in about 3 hours... and i mean crisp burn 20 inches of clearance too

 

[Jimmycricket]

Firstly do not start your seeds in ffof, they will burn and die instantly. The soil is too hot for that. either start them in a different pot with much lighter nuted soil and then transplant them after 2 or 3 weeks to ffof, or you can layer your soil so that in the center near the top it is light soil then as it expands out the soil becomes much more nutrient rich.

Personally I would use 14/10 or 16/8 on autos. Or if you wanted to go for the gold you could do 8/4/8/4 or 7/5/7/5. It sounds unnatural and well it is. But autos do not require a continuous 10 hours of dark to get enough auxins built up in the system to flower they just naturally produce them after a certain amount of time. So using a 12 hour period for a full duration of the cycle could give you the most growth per dollar of electricity. The reason being cannabis needs at least 4 hours of dark to use up its stored energy that it collected from the photosynthesis, so if you can collect the light for 7 to 8 hours, use up its energy then go collect more you would never reach a cap for storage on said energy.

Now with that last part said however just keep it simple. Use anything from 10/14 all the way up to 20/4, just dont change it a bunch and keep it consistent. Next dont over feed the plants and do not over water. your temperature range and humidity range sounds fine if you can keep it there, and make sure your whole tent has good airflow with no stagnant air.

Good luck

 

[Integrum Stultus]

I havent started tmy geow yet, so changes can be made. That was my intention by gauging you fine folks' opinions (other than being a noobie).

Tent size is completely dependent upon the space i have available so i cant chang that. Butttttt.. I can change strains im going to grow and the pots (although the super root 3 gallon equivolancy pot is about 11" in height so its not much difference. With the 5er its big enough (diameter wise) that i can fill it maybe 9" or 10" high with soil which in turn will give me back a couple inches. What strains would you reccomend for my size tent so im not growing out of it? LoL!

Ive canned the 6" clip on. Going to order like an 8" ocilating fan like you reccomended.

The 300w led's true rating is like 150 and the other 2 havent been purchased yet. I may just buy 1 extra (they are rated at i think around 80-90w) just in case. How did you calculate the wattage per? Im a little confused with my calculations. I planned on only doing one.

Thanks for the advice LEGO!!

I had planned on starting them in diff soil and then transplant into ffof 2-3 wks in. Layering the soil is a great idea, i hadn't thought about that. 7/5/7/5 sounds interesting. I may try that and depending on results go to 16/8 if they dontlike it after 2 wks or so.

What is your opinion on my exhaust? 8 incher rated at 390cfm with a scrubber rates the same. Enough to remove and replenish? How do you work those numbers (formula)? As for feeding i was gonna start off light (ffof has plenty to start with after transplant) maybe half the KISS recomendation, 3.5 g, and let my lady(s) tell me if they want more or less. What is your typical water schedule?

Thanks for your input and knowledge Jimmy!!

 

[Jimmycricket]

watering shouldnt ever be on a schedule. It changes constantly as the plants get bigger and depending on their phase of growth. Basically when growing in soil you simply water when the soil is dry.

as for the formula just multiply the base by width by height of the tent that will be your cubic feet and get a fan that has at least that many cfm.

As for feeding yes start off with low nutes and slowly build up as the plant gets bigger.

 

[Integrum Stultus]

Ok so 3x2x5=30sq ft.. With that said an 8 inch exhaust @390 is more than enough, correct? Now with that cleared up how is the wattage per calculated? Simple math would suggest that Lego is wrong with his calculations of 32w per.


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[fanleaf]

Lego is about right on. A 300w led will pull an actual 180w+-from the wall. You dont have but 5 square feet. square feet divided by 180 and your at only 36w psf. Thats pretty low man. Need more light if you want to get what you can from your area. 45-50wpf is perfect. 30-40 will grow but not like 50 will plain and simple.
Your room 20"X36"=5 square feet. 5'x50w each=250W at the wall not the advertised wattage.

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[Integrum Stultus]

Thanks Fanleaf, I've been following some of your feeds.. Good stuff going on in your world!!! Now as for my wattage/cubic feet issue LEDwise do you have any suggestion on how to get my closer to the 50w per.. Think i should pick up one of thise 10 inch leds (80-90 actual) to pair with what i have now? Pretty sure what i have puts out 140-150 actual. That would get me much closer to that sweet spot of 250w...


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[Major PITA]

If the 300W LED is the Mars Hydro, it actually pulls about 135-140W. It is good for a single plant, at most. With a 5 gal pot in a tent that size I wouldn't run more than 2 photo plants unless you are going SoG and keeping them small. If you double that amount of light, you should be in pretty good shape for the bloom phase. I haven't done autos so I'm not sure how many to grow.

 

[Integrum Stultus]

Its an Apollo led, youtube vids have it around 138-140 true wattage. I was planning on running 1 or 2 autos to start and then prob sizing down the pot size to 3 gallon and then running 2-3 autos perpetual with an additional light if the 1st run develops good yield (prob wont run a photo until next year).


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[Major PITA]

Its an Apollo led, youtube vids have it around 138-140 true wattage. I was planning on running 1 or 2 autos to start and then prob sizing down the pot size to 3 gallon and then running 2-3 autos perpetual with an additional light if the 1st run develops good yield (prob wont run a photo until next year).


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The pot size choices seems backwards to me.
Autos are typically smaller = smaller pots. Photos are bigger = bigger pots.
Your "300W" LED should do a great job on a single auto. Cut coverage to 1/4 of their spec' for real world use (8 sq. ft. is really more like 2 sq. ft.).
It sure looks like Apollo uses the Mars Hydro lights but with their name on them.

 

[Integrum Stultus]

LoL! From the specs and everything i c i agree about the panels. I have seen deals on 2 mars 300 for like $180. From what im seeing on 420 mag Mars makes a great product.

The size difference between a 3 gal and 5 gal equivalency super root pot is minimal dimensionally, 3gal is 10.8x10.5 (9.2 liter vol) 5gal 12.4x11.5 (14.6 liter vol), those volumes in gallons is actually 2.4 and 3.9 gallons respectively. With that said the gimmick with these pots and their air pruning is a yield as if the plants were in actual 3 and 5 gallon pots.

My hope is for just that to get a 5 gallon plants yield from a plant living in 3.9 gallons of soil. The manufacturer claims the design of this pot prunes the roots and prevents circling, has great airflow (higher concentrations of o2 at the root level), has great drainage, promotes more feeder roots etc.

Stronger root system = stronger plant = bigger yields more flowers and better fruit. .




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[Major PITA]

LoL! From the specs and everything i c i agree about the panels. I have seen deals on 2 mars 300 for like $180. From what im seeing on 420 mag Mars makes a great product.

The size difference between a 3 gal and 5 gal equivalency super root pot is minimal dimensionally, 3gal is 10.8x10.5 (9.2 liter vol) 5gal 12.4x11.5 (14.6 liter vol), those volumes in gallons is actually 2.4 and 3.9 gallons respectively. With that said the gimmick with these pots and their air pruning is a yield as if the plants were in actual 3 and 5 gallon pots.

My hope is for just that to get a 5 gallon plants yield from a plant living in 3.9 gallons of soil. The manufacturer claims the design of this pot prunes the roots and prevents circling, has great airflow (higher concentrations of o2 at the root level), has great drainage, promotes more feeder roots etc.

Stronger root system = stronger plant = bigger yields more flowers and better fruit. .




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Two MH 300 panels were $120 with free shipping. Looks like they run $138 now.

 

[Integrum Stultus]

Its like 140$, i was way off. I think that 180$ was for the MH 400 II..


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[Guruth]

im running mars hydro now... they are magnificent lights. also i tried sticking the 700w(326 true watts) mars hydro into 2.5x2.5 tent and there was so much light it poisoned them and they started dieing after 2-3 hours. thank god i checked the tent and saw burned leaves so i could put in 400w light back in and saved the grow....

dunno about other lights but mars hydro is bright as fuck... naked eye i would say at least as much as my friends 600w hps... but dunno... i think its just the color spectrum messing with my eyes

just stick with the lights you have now and see how they run...

like i said i am running a 700w hars hydro in 1x1m tent atm on a 12/12 from seed... the plants grew abut 90-100cm high and the flowers have mad mass already... 7 weeks since sprout

do not underestimate LED... good leds are about as exelent as bad leds are crappy

for example... my friend uses a 400w no name led and can barely get 75-80 grams of yield... i gave him one of my mars hydro lamps and with nothing changed he went to almost double that.

LEDs are in a bad spot now... everyone is lieing about specs and pwoer... they are lieing about spectrum and shitlaod of stuff... its hard to get a good led light... i had good and bad. i actualy started with a no name ufo 100w true power in a 2x2ft tent. my yield was a wooping 17 grams from 4 plants.... tossed the light in the bin and bought mars hydro... never looked back. there are some other exelent companies out there... i just stuck with mars cause of their EXELENT customer support

gear wise you are good... dont do a to big of a grow for your first grow since yield is gonna be shit anyways... take it as a learning experience and learn as much as you can. but keep it simple and easy to learn.. kinda like a drivers license... get the basics down first and then switch to manual gearbox and racetracks.

as for 30w per square foot not being enough... well i have an 11ft2 tent(3.3x3.3) and mars hydro do about 1.3 grams per watt yield with propper care. so 400grams per m2? thats a very very nice yield for one tent

 

[Integrum Stultus]

With my vertical limits in mind what strain would you recommend Lego?? Thats my main concern you guys have pointed out. Beans will be the last thing i obtain. Apollo clearly states this light, although advertised as 300w, in fact true power is 170w. I hope that'll be enough for 2 ladies, that way i can have something to get me thru until i finish my 2nd run. Nothing but shit available for shit prices.

The yield you speak of at 400m2... Is that autos or photos?

Nice metaphor!! .......


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[Major PITA]

Stick with something mostly indica. IMO one Apollo will barely do 2 plants. It will be OK in veg, but not optimum for flower. They don't have much coverage.