Last Remaining Seeds of Unknown Strain Bred By The Emperor Himself

[Kihlo B]

Last year at Hempfest, I was able to meet, and medicate, with the Emperor himself. Upon end of the evening and many hours of discussion of cultivation, from old school method to new and in-between, I was given a vial of 8 seeds. Around March I relocated from Los Angeles to Wyoming for school, was kicked out for possession, then moved to Denver, CO, (a recent MMJ state), and wound up working with a Hydroponics retailer. Unpacking some of my things from storage, I came across the thought lost vial of seeds. Excited, I ran inside and started the germination, now I dunno if elevation has anything to do with anything, but only 4 were still viable and actually popped a taproot. They're around 3 weeks along now, and growing relatively small and slow, and seem to have a "genetic default" called Triploid Mutation. I guess on every node is 2 branches with random nodes having 3 branches, and all sets of leaves having only 3 fingers, like in younger stages. Im at the 4th node and only have 2 branches, but still only 3 fingers, and can see the new growth starting, and can tell where there will only be 3 fingers still. Using a 400w MH for now in my basement apartment closet, summers here are hot as hell, temps in the 100's the last few weeks, keeping my room around 84* with light on, and 78* with lights off. Temps DID reach 91* when I went in there this morning, but forgot to leave the window open n shut off fresh air to the room. Using Fox Farm Organic soil, with bat guano and earthworm castings, plus another shot of earthworm castings to 2 of the 4 babies. Nutes are a 8-10-6 i think, im writing this from a friends computer and dont have them on hand. Fox Farm Tiger Bloom. I know its early for bloom juice, but had a sickness take effect quickly in the first week or so, and they are starting to liven up. Also, AS THESE ARE "SUPPOSEDLY" THE LAST REMAINING STRAIN OF JACK HERER'S CONCOCTION, IM OBVIOUSLY PRAYING AND PRAYING FOR SEEDS!!! I heard you can take this "triploid mutation" and stabilize it, thus creating a chromosome or "gene" in this strain. Maybe this was done on purpose? As triploid mutation and 3 branches has been reported to produce 1/3 more hydroponically. I dunno, so hoping with stress and strain put on these 4 plants, Im hoping to at least catch a male, n if not some hermies. I'll be starting a journal as soon as I can get my hands on a camera. Happy Growing everyone!

[ol hippy]

Interesting story ! I don't know much about mutations , genes etc, but my 2 clones I got from a disp has 3 fingered leaves all over the bottom of the plant ,I never saw 3 leafed pot plants like this either ?! There huge too ! Anyhow nice story , and welcome to 420 a great place to find out much about weed ! many storys here too !!

[Kronnoisseur]

Last year at Hempfest, I was able to meet, and medicate, with the Emperor himself. Upon end of the evening and many hours of discussion of cultivation, from old school method to new and in-between, I was given a vial of 8 seeds. Around March I relocated from Los Angeles to Wyoming for school, was kicked out for possession, then moved to Denver, CO, (a recent MMJ state), and wound up working with a Hydroponics retailer. Unpacking some of my things from storage, I came across the thought lost vial of seeds. Excited, I ran inside and started the germination, now I dunno if elevation has anything to do with anything, but only 4 were still viable and actually popped a taproot. They're around 3 weeks along now, and growing relatively small and slow, and seem to have a "genetic default" called Triploid Mutation. I guess on every node is 2 branches with random nodes having 3 branches, and all sets of leaves having only 3 fingers, like in younger stages. Im at the 4th node and only have 2 branches, but still only 3 fingers, and can see the new growth starting, and can tell where there will only be 3 fingers still. Using a 400w MH for now in my basement apartment closet, summers here are hot as hell, temps in the 100's the last few weeks, keeping my room around 84* with light on, and 78* with lights off. Temps DID reach 91* when I went in there this morning, but forgot to leave the window open n shut off fresh air to the room. Using Fox Farm Organic soil, with bat guano and earthworm castings, plus another shot of earthworm castings to 2 of the 4 babies. Nutes are a 8-10-6 i think, im writing this from a friends computer and dont have them on hand. Fox Farm Tiger Bloom. I know its early for bloom juice, but had a sickness take effect quickly in the first week or so, and they are starting to liven up. Also, AS THESE ARE "SUPPOSEDLY" THE LAST REMAINING STRAIN OF JACK HERER'S CONCOCTION, IM OBVIOUSLY PRAYING AND PRAYING FOR SEEDS!!! I heard you can take this "triploid mutation" and stabilize it, thus creating a chromosome or "gene" in this strain. Maybe this was done on purpose? As triploid mutation and 3 branches has been reported to produce 1/3 more hydroponically. I dunno, so hoping with stress and strain put on these 4 plants, Im hoping to at least catch a male, n if not some hermies. I'll be starting a journal as soon as I can get my hands on a camera. Happy Growing everyone!

I'm greatly interested in this, I grew up a Portland local where Jack suffered his heart attack that ended up taking his life. I'm not a fan of emery and some of the others, but Jack had a spot in my heart, he really cared about legalization of cannabis, and preserving it with good genetics, he wanted to benefit our community and support him 110%!!!! It sounds like this triploid mutation was on purpose, it also sounds like it has Afghani in it as they have popped up with 3 leaf fingers more frequently in my garden's. I just moved from Colorado awhile back, I wish I could get a clone of that to distribute to the medical community here in California, It'd be great to bring more of the 'Emperors' genetics mainstream.... I'm dreaming now though lol, can't wait to see the grow show buddy!!!!!!

[MedicalNeed]

I know one of the Cinderella strains I have seen are odd looking branched plants with mostly only 3 leaves.
I did have some with more than 3 leaves but not down low nor up near the top.
It was also a hard to clone and get going strain.

[YxKill]

nice im proud

[The Butcher]

great story.

So heres a suggestion that is completely doable.
1. get them ladies nice and healthy
2. If they are all ladies, trust me your happy
3. I am a breeder and have attempted many a times to hone in on changing the amount of fingers on a Cannabis leaf. This is not an easy thing to do, so if they are all that way then YES it was done on purpose. thank you JACK RIP
4. Cut clones and please distribute the cuts...PLEASE FOR CANNA'S SAKE
5. Purchase STS to turn one of the female clones into a male and pollinate the hell out of a nice big mom. This will create fem'd Seeds that will help carry on the genetics. Using STS is allot safer then attempting to turn a plant hermie.

Let me know if you need help with this process. I will walk you through it all. PLEASE PM me if your interested.

[Growheart]

Really interested to see where this thread goes... Share the wealth, Jack would have wanted it!

[Kingdiamond]

Interesting story ! I don't know much about mutations , genes etc, but my 2 clones I got from a disp has 3 fingered leaves all over the bottom of the plant ,I never saw 3 leafed pot plants like this either ?! There huge too ! Anyhow nice story , and welcome to 420 a great place to find out much about weed ! many storys here too !!

I recently grew a UBC chemo plant that only had the 3 leave pattern all the way to the top she was a spindly girl too i had to tie her all the way up a stick but she produced some of the most potent smoke Ive ever had.

[Kronnoisseur]

Kihlo B where you be bra?
I wanna see these beauty's, we all do, hope you can share..
Seen plenty of 3 fingered leafed plants harvested 2 this month, but the internode branching is getting me warm and fuzzy.
Fantastic story with the emperor too!

[Giomeister]

i am curious from a first time growers eyes.

Where would a guy obtain such seeds if he wanted them?

I would be curious.

I am for the decriminalization of pot. Truth be told i have not smoked in 20 plus years. However looking at my Rx box. This is why i want this path.

The medical benefits are astonishing and the idea of smoking in my home as a patient greatly appeals to me.
I am pretty straight laced guy as they say. I work long abnormal hours and have no money. Yet i get heavy pain killers and muscle relaxers. and sleeping pills to get to sleep.

I stress and my stomach is upset. I do not eat like i should because of the acid reflux.

So, i seek an alternative.

where would i get these magic seeds from Jacks Beanstalk.??
No more messing with HMO's for a regular refills. and no cost just nurturing and time to get primo plants.

[Kronnoisseur]

i am curious from a first time growers eyes.

Where would a guy obtain such seeds if he wanted them?

I would be curious.

I am for the decriminalization of pot. Truth be told i have not smoked in 20 plus years. However looking at my Rx box. This is why i want this path.

The medical benefits are astonishing and the idea of smoking in my home as a patient greatly appeals to me.
I am pretty straight laced guy as they say. I work long abnormal hours and have no money. Yet i get heavy pain killers and muscle relaxers. and sleeping pills to get to sleep.

I stress and my stomach is upset. I do not eat like i should because of the acid reflux.

So, i seek an alternative.

where would i get these magic seeds from Jacks Beanstalk.??
No more messing with HMO's for a regular refills. and no cost just nurturing and time to get primo plants.

You can't. I got tons of the world's best elite cuts, lived in Portland Oregon where Jack had his complications, and I'm super jealous lol. I wanna see those NODES!!! Sounds like you need Maui Wowie, Trainwreck, and Alaskan Thunderfuck since your an old schooler. Jack Herer, the strain named of him from Sensi Seeds is pretty good stuff, not OFF THE HOOK but it's something Jack could appreciate from above with thanks for the honor of being in ones garden. Good if your not looking for something intense and just need to be medicated. Mr. Nice and Afghan are good Indica strains I could recommend that are available in seed, pretty potent, and fairly easy to grow.

[Giomeister]

Great white shark and white widow seem about the path i seek. Simple, yet kickass potent/.

[Kronnoisseur]

Great white shark and white widow seem about the path i seek. Simple, yet kickass potent/.

I got a White Widow I can vouge for some of my biggest nugs so far indoor and outdoor good single cola stretcher! I'll post or pm some pics to ya! Outdoors planted end of July in not the best Norcal weather fertilized as directed on bottle for grow and bloom, mollasses used this week, it will give you the standard for typical White Widow outdoor with some care. They say to harvest is end of October/early November, I think I'm going to have to harvest the 20th because of mold problems from the moisture this time of year. One plant is 3-4 ft the other is 6ft+ and indoors I harvested and have pics of one, it was my best plant the entire last grow in my opinion, didn't weigh it but it grew huge with big nugs. I don't support consistant hermie fem seeds only one properly done, Mr. Nice had the original White Widow and spread from the company I think early nineties and so did his strains that one the original cannabis cups. What GHS has today called White Widow (since the company owns the name) is an F2/S2 or so on bred to what they thought was White Widow, though the bud going around is all the new GHS White Widow and is the staple of White Widow today. You wan't the real White Widow... Check out Mr. Nice - Black Widow, the old name was trademarked, the strain is not theirs tho...

[Giomeister]

if i wanted to try new strains when i get to that point. Like the jamacian variations. I wonder how hard it is to get them.

Would not be hard to mail to yourself i suppose.

[Kronnoisseur]

Colchicine Information


Posted by PAXCO on March 21, 1999 at 11:41:04:


Polyploidy (favorable traits in Cannabis) has not been shown to occur naturally in Cannabis; however, it
may be induced artificially with colchicine treatments. Colchicine is a poi- sonous compound extracted
from the roots of certain Colchicum species; it inhibits chromosome segregation to daughter cells and
cell wall formation, resulting in larger than average daughter cells with multiple chromosome sets. The
studies of H. E. Warmke et al. (1942-1944) seem to indicate that colchicine raised drug levels in
Cannabis. It is unfortunate that Warmke was unaware of the actual psychoactive ingredients of Cannabis
and was therefore unable to extract THC. His crude acetone extract and archaic techniques of bioassay
using killifish and small freshwater crustaceans are far from conclusive. He was, however, able to produce
both triploid and tetraploid strains of Cannabis with up to twice the potency of dip- bid strains (in their
ability to kill small aquatic organisms). The aim of his research was to "produce a strain of hemp with
materially reduced marijuana content" and his results indicated that polyploidy raised the potency of
Cannabis without any apparent increase in fiber quality or yield. Warmke's work with polyploids shed
light on the nature of sexual determination in Cannabis. He also illus- trated that potency is genetically
determined by creating a lower potency strain of hemp through selective breeding with low potency
parents. More recent research by A. I. Zhatov (1979) with fiber Cannabis showed that some
economically valuable traits such as fiber quantity may be improved through polyploidy. Polyploids
require more water and are usually more sensitive to changes in environment. Vegetative growth cycles
are extended by up to 30-40% in polyploids. An extended vegetative period could delay the flowering of
polyploid drug strains and interfere with the formation of floral clusters. It would be difficult to determine if
canna- binoid levels had been raised by polyploidy if polyploid plants were not able to mature fully in the
favorable part of the season when cannabinoid production is promoted by plentiful light and warm
temperatures. Greenhouses and artificial lighting can be used to extend the season and test polyploid
strains. The height of tetraploid (4n) Cannabis in these exper- iments often exceeded the height of the
original diploid plants by 25-30%. Tetraploids were intensely colored, with dark green leaves and stems
and a well developed gross phenotype. Increased height and vigorous growth, as a rule, vanish in
subsequent generations. Tetraploid plants often revert back to the diploid condition, making it diffi- cult to
support tetraploid populations. Frequent tests are performed to determine if ploidy is changing. Triploid
(3n) strains were formed with great difficulty by crossing artificially created tetraploids (4n) with dip- bids
(2n). Triploids proved to be inferior to both diploids and tetraploids in many cases. De Pasquale et al.
(1979) conducted experiments with Cannabis which was treated with 0.25% and 0.50% solu- tions of
colchicine at the primary meristem seven days after generation. Treated plants were slightly taller and
possessed slightly larger leaves than the controls, Anoma- lies in leaf growth occurred in 20% and 39%,
respectively, of the surviving treated plants. In the first group (0.25%) cannabinoid levels were highest in
the plants without anomalies, and in the second group (0.50%) cannabinoid levels were highest in plants
with anomalies, Overall, treated plants showed a 166-250% increase in THC with respect to controls and
a decrease of CBD (30-33%) and CBN (39-65%). CBD (cannabidiol) and CBN (cannabinol) are
cannabinoids involved in the biosynthesis and degrada- tion of THC. THC levels in the control plants were
very low (less than 1%). Possibly colchicine or the resulting polyploidy interferes with cannabinoid
biogenesis to favor THC. In treated plants with deformed leaf lamina, 90% of the cells are tetraploid (4n
40) and 10% diploid (2n 20). In treated plants without deformed lamina a few cells are tetraploid and the
remainder are triploid or diploid. The transformation of diploid plants to the tetraploid level inevitably
results in the formation of a few plants with an unbalanced set of chromosomes (2n + 1, 2n - 1, etc.).
These plants are called aneuploids. Aneuploids are inferior to polyploids in every economic respect.
Aneu- ploid Cannabis is characterized by extremely small seeds. The weight of 1,000 seeds ranges from
7 to 9 grams (1/4 to 1/3 ounce). Under natural conditions diploid plants do not have such small seeds
and average 14-19 grams (1/2- 2/3 ounce) per 1,000 (Zhatov 1979). Once again, little emphasis has
been placed on the relationship between flower or resin production and poly- ploidy. Further research to
determine the effect of poly- ploidy on these and other economically valuable traits of Cannabis is
needed.

Colchicine is sold by laboratory supply houses, and breeders have used it to induce polyploldy in
Cannabis. However, colchicine is poisonous, so special care is exer- cised by the breeder in any use of
it. Many clandestine cultivators have started polyploid strains with colchicine. Except for changes in leaf
shape and phyllotaxy, no out- standing characteristics have developed in these strains and potency
seems unaffected. However, none of the strains have been examined to determine if they are actually
poly ploid or if they were merely treated with colchicine to no effect. Seed treatment is the most effective
and safest way to apply colchicine. * In this way, the entire plant growing from a colchicine-treated seed
could be polyploid and if any colchicine exists at the end of the growing season the amount would be
infinitesimal. Colchicine is nearly always lethal to Cannabis seeds, and in the treatment there is a very
fine line between polyploidy and death. In other words, if 100 viable seeds are treated with colchicine and
40 of them germinate it is unlikely that the treatment in- duced polyploidy in any of the survivors. On the
other hand, if 1,000 viable treated seeds give rise to 3 seedlings, the chances are better that they are
polyploid since the treatment killed all of the seeds but those three. It is still necessary to determine if
the offspring are actually poly- ploid by microscopic examination. The work of Menzel (1964) presents
us with a crude map of the chromosomes of Cannabis, Chromosomes 2-6 and 9 are distinguished by the
length of each arm. Chromo- some 1 is distinguished by a large knob on one end and a dark chromomere
1 micron from the knob. Chromosome 7 is extremely short and dense, and chromosome 8 is assumed to
be the sex chromosome. In the future, chromosome *The word "safest" is used here as a relative term.
Coichicine has received recent media attention as a dangerous poison and while these accounts are
probably a bit too lurid, the real dangers of expo- iure to coichicine have not been fully researched. The
possibility of bodily harm exists and this is multiplied when breeders inexperi- enced in handling toxins
use colchicine. Seed treatment might be safer than spraying a grown plant but the safest method of all is
to not use colchicine. mapping will enable us to picture the location of the genes influencing the
phenotype of Cannabis. This will enable geneticists to determine and manipulate the important
characteristics contained in the gene pool. For each trait the number of genes in control will be known,
which chromosomes carry them, and where they are located along those chromosomes.

PAXCO

Hope this info helps someone, I think it pertains to the subject. Also, if you want new strains your better off with cuttings, and for getting cuttings California is the place. You arn't going to get more pure old school genetics than thats here, this is where high grade started most of the stuff today is just based from strains brought from california to holand, amsterdam, and what not. Attitude seedbank, seedboutique, speedyseedz, and drchonic are all good ones I hear, no experience myself do research on those guys tho I've heard well it's a place to start anyways. Acapulco Gold and Columbian Gold are available in seed form, also thai stick is available from gypsy nirvana I think. I've heard some stories about thai stick and crazy hashish in the day.

Here's the link on the ploids http://www.cannabase.com/cl/bcga/bre...colchicine.htm