Lil Neutrino's Bagseed CFL Poor Man's Grow 2009 - First Attempt

[Lil Neutrino]

Lilly after her growth spurt last night, looks like the topping worked...the two new growths at the top are equal in height and gaining size




Ms. Robinson after being LST'd last night...I'm not too fond of the green "stuff" but it works.




And Freja, I think this is at the end of day 2 of her LST...the leaves that have been pushed down to the dirt from the LST'ing don't appear to be too happy. Should I trim all of those or wait until they begin to yellow? I didn't want to remove too many of her energy generators until someone else had a chance to give me some input.




And finally...this is on some of Ms. Robinson's leaves, is it mold or is it normal? If it is mold or something can it simply be wiped off or should I prune those leaves?

Click HERE for the full-res version, much easier to see and doesn't look so much like a smudge as it does here in this thread. Thanks!

[Lil Neutrino]

Well...got my pH meter today and since the plants are having nap-time I figured I'd double-check the calibration (spot on) and test the distilled water I have. Turns out the distilled water is 7.7...can't wait for the lights to kick back on so I can do a soil test. It'll give me time to read up and find out how to do this since this meter is not supposed to go directly in to the soil. I read that you're supposed to add some soil to the distilled water but I don't know how much soil to add...or can I use it the same way I have with the liquid tester, collect the run-off and test that? Which would be more accurate?

Edit...nevermind, in my hurried excitement I posted just before I found the following helpful thread (just in case anyone else wants to know):

Ph (Thanks McBudz!)

[Lil Neutrino]

Let me start off by saying that I dislike the on/off operation of the Milwaukee tester already. What genius over there decided that instead of using a simple button that a sliding "rectangle" that needs to be held in position was a better idea (read: it is physically and ergonomically easier to push down than provide lateral movement with your digits)? Lame, maybe I'll rip it open and rig it up "correctly" (aka to my suiting) but I fear it will no longer be water-proof and then I'm out $20. *sigh*

Anyway, aside from the retarded method of operation to turn and keep it on it is pretty nice. Calibrates easily and is easy to read and use. I tested the pH buffer that came with it, my distilled water, and my run-off water from the soil. I noticed that with the distilled water that it would keep creeping and took forever to settle on a value...is that normal? The run-off on both the larger plants was 6.8 and I did not water Lilly as she just had a good soaking yesterday or whenever...her soil is still quite damp.

In a way I'm happy to see 6.8 because that means the liquid tester I have is fairly accurate. But it sucks because now I need to lower it a good 0.3 to 0.8 (depends what thread you read, even some stickies I have found disagree) and since I did not dabble in chemistry much as a kid I have killed the pH balance of 1.5 gallons of distilled water. WOW does lime juice from concentrate ever have an acute effect...it's as bad as hydrated lime only in the other direction. I added 5 or 6 drops to around half a gallon of distilled water and it wound up at 3.8! %#&*(^%(#%&(*#@%#%*( Yeah...so then I tried diluting with another gallon of water only to raise it to 4.1.

Now my question is since I just watered these plants should I keep trying to adjust the pH of the run-off down and rewatering til I get it where I want it? And if my run-off is 6.8 and I want to go down to 6.3 does that mean I adjust my water pH down 0.5 or will it be a gradual effect? Still wondering about trimming the growth UNDER the plants now that they are LST'd too. Thanks!

[Lil Neutrino]

Nobody? I know it's Friday night but damn...I thought stoners sat at home and chilled on the couch/computer lol. Seriously though, I really need some answers to these questions and I hate to start PM'ing people for answers.

Four more days and they're 28 days old!!!

[fuuji0019]

Looking good mate
Erm, im not 100%, as i have ph problems too. But looks like your on the right track, i would continue trying your method.

[Lil Neutrino]

Thanks fuuji,you know what sucks? The fact that I have nothing else to do except sit here and stare at these plants all day long since the weather has been garbage a lot lately and no job to go to. It's bad enough it's my first grow but top off the newb excitement with having to be with them every day all day and it can make one stir crazy! heheheh

I dug around about pH issues yesterday and I'll do so some more today. It's really out of my realm of comfort, see how badly I altered the pH of distilled water with lime juice? HA! I wonder if adding baking soda to raise it back up would be hard on the plants when they get it as water...as in, how many times can you alter the pH in multiple directions before the adulterants become an issue? I'm sure it really depends on what you are using though. Hmmm...thoughts to ponder!

Wish I could offer some advice for you on your problem with Jane, at least she's still producing though :)

[Ms.Fox]

^ I would really just go out and invest in some ph up and down. ;-) It cheap and easy. No more guessing.

[Lil Neutrino]

Yeah, but the "no job" part has me doing this as cheaply as possible although I know that the common household items don't buffer anything, just quick solutions. This sure gets expensive...it better allow me to at least break even in yield on what I spent on supplies hahaha. Although I guess if I don't do it properly it has an even higher chance of failing, durn logic! I don't want the aquarium/pool adjusters because they are high in sodium phosphate, right? I need the ones formulated for use with plants?

So let me make sure I am straight on this adjusting/testing pH thing. I'm going to do some research on here but if anyone wants to answer it here that'd be great so I can make sure it agrees with whatever else I find out. Now that I know my last soil run-off water was at 6.8 I need to adjust it down a little next time I water, say to 6.3-6.5?

Or do I need to use a small amount of distilled water that I have tested the pH of just prior to using, water the plants til I have just enough run-off to check the pH, and use that as my reference to adjust the new water for a full soaking? How much can I adjust down at a time without shocking the plants? Thanks!

And now some new pics (links to full-res pics are underneath each pic)!

Freja...she's still having leaf issues as you will see. I think some damage may actually be due to heat but since I'm using CFL's and her leaves are always at least 1" away from them I find that hard to believe. I can hold the bulbs and it doesn't burn my hands and the heat I feel at 1" is not uncomfortable. I wonder if it has to do with the fact that she's slightly higher in elevation in the cabinet and it getting up to 84-86F'ish at night. I've been having luck with cool weather lately at night and open windows to keep ambient down, I think last night it only got up to 80.5-81F in there :)


Freja 1


Freja 2


Freja 3


Freja 4

Ms. Robinson is actually looking great imho, green, bushy, and minimal signs of problems. There is that leaf in the last photo here that is starting to curl, it is the same leaf I asked above if it had mold on it or what (no replies yet). I think I'm going to cut it off today as it has started to yellow and curl up.


Robinson 1


Robinson 2


Robinson 3


Robinson 4

Lilly with my graphing calculator from college for a size comparison, the new shoots at the top are growing at the same rate so yep...topping worked for sure.


Lilly 1


http://www.420magazine.com/gallery/data/500/Lilly_2.jpg

In "Freja 4" and "Robinson 3"...these are the branches that I was asking if I should trim them off as they are on the underside of the main branch that is being LST'd or if I should just leave them until they start to turn yellow from lack of light.

Thanks for taking the time to read my posts! I know they can be a bit long but I love detail...

[CharlieMopps]

As long as the leaves are green, they're making food, leave 'em on there. I may have missed it but do you know how many lumens you have in your room and the sq. ft. of your floor space. PLants are looking great btw.

[Lil Neutrino]

Thanks Charlie, kind of what I figured but I always like second opinions when it comes to things I'm not too familiar with.

Square footage is 8ft^2 (4'W X 2'D), probably could have gone a little smaller but I wanted to have room in case they bushed out a bunch and I was already having some slight temperature issues so figured best to go a bit bigger.

I have 10 26W 6500K's in there rated at 1600 lumens on the package. However, according to the manufacturer website that is initial lumens, mean lumens is 1300 so a grand total of 13,000 lumens.

For flowering I have the same number/wattage of bulbs but 2700K. They're listed as having 1750 initial lumens and just shy of 1400 mean lumens, so 14,000 lumens or so for flowering. Will add more if needed and when/if funds become available.

[Lil Neutrino]

They are looking better, not as much spotting/yellowing occuring. I did some trimming yesterday to remove the bad spots but only cutting the parts off the leaflets that were effected.

Today I topped some of the new growth that has appeared since LST'ing a few days back, mostly out of curiousity to see if I could do it effectively. Ms. Robinson is looking great, leaves are nice and green, very bushy, and has exploded with side growth since LST'ing.

Freja is now taking up water again as her pot felt a bit lighter today so that's good, one less thing to be concerned with.

Lilly's new shoots are still pointing almost straight up but still developing larger leaves. I'm still debating if I'm going to 12/12 her in the next day or two...again, kind of a curiosity thing to see what happens since she's been a runt since day one. And also because of her strong sativa looks, she may take longer to mature anyway so giving her a head start may not be a bad idea.

No indication of preflowers on any of them yet though but I'm still hoping for at least two ladies (I figure statistics dictate I'll get at least one male).

[Ms.Fox]

I am so happy things are looking better for you! When do we get to see your lovely plants again?

[Lil Neutrino]

I'll post a couple pics later tonight, I'm hoping that Freja's improved appearance is actually due to whatever it was having fixed itself rather than me trimming off the affected leaves.

Also need to reprogram my A/C to run a bit cooler during lights on, especially in the morning when I'm not up and about yet. I woke up earlier this morning and knocked it down a few degrees as the internal temp had risen to 85F (still staying around 5-7F above ambient) after closing the window because of the annoying bird "songs", more like skipping CD. A few hours later I rolled over and glanced at the temp and jumped out of bed to crack the door open since it was now reading 87F! :( Went look at the A/C since it wasn't running and saw that it had reset to the preprogrammed temp of 82F as it's programmed for a new temp four times a day. Matter of fact, I'm going to reprogram it right now before I forget...again...for the umpteenth time lol.

[Lil Neutrino]

One pic of Lilly, upper leafs are starting to lay over flatter


Freja, looking better






Ms. Robinson, no Brazilian bikini wax for her! She likes the natural bushy look As you can see the LST'ing is really working on her, lots of new growth along the main branch starting to come up for light!




And some of you may recall my pic a few days back where I tried to take a close-up of a discolored spot that was a bit orange and I had asked if it was mold or a fungus. For quick reference see the last two pics of post #31 on this page. I took a nice high-res pic of it today, cropped it, and blew it up. It doesn't look normal to me and I was told that fungus can have a capitated gland like trichomes...full size pic link is after the photo for a better look.

FULL SIZE PIC HERE

I can zoom and crop it a bit more if anyone thinks an even closer shot would help. They look like they have the capitated shape (mushroom head) to me but can't quite tell for sure, does this look like a fungus to anyone? Thanks!

[CharlieMopps]

idk, i've never seen a leaf that close up. If you're woried it might be fungus there are many fixes out there, i'm drunk and can't think of any atm.
Otherwise the plants seem to be responding well to the lst.