Attention all California growers! CA Cannabis industry, market and laws.

[whereisjeff]

Ok folks, I'm making an attempt to push the boundaries and move the bar forward in regard to what we can talk about in the forums. Today Attorney General Eric Holder announced that the Feds will no longer be going after growers or distributors unless they break BOTH fed and state laws. So growing MMJ is Cali and distributing it through co-ops and dispensaries is now legal with the proper paperwork and we should be able to talk about it now.

So, I would like to create this thread to discus the business side of the medical cannabis industry in California, including different career fields and opportunities in the industry, the MMJ commodity market and how to stay within the law and out of jail. And I'm calling on all California growers, legal professionals and anyone with knowledge about the industry to contribute to this for the good of all.

I'll get us started with the following questions:

- How hard is it for a grower to arrange a business relationship to grow for a co-op or dispensary? How does one go about that?

- I realize the market price varies, but what is the average price a broker or dispensary pays for a pound to the grower? Is there a difference between the two? Does a grower have to go through a broker or direct to the dispensary?

- How does the market price vary from strain to strain and how do you find out what strain is in high demand and obtain those seeds or clones?

Thanks in advance to all that contribute!

[obiwannatokie]

Unfortunately what Holder says is nothing but words until cannabis is either removed completely from the CSA (ideal)or it is scheduled much lower in the CSA.(realistic)

Let's say that DEA just up and says we are going to listen to the AG and not use federal resources to enforce federal law in MMJ states, which is very unlikely. That still allows them wiggle room to target MMJ clinics that are perceived as being in violation with state law. For example they could still target caregivers who only provide MMJ and no other medical services, under the CA supreme court Mentch decision. This would include dispensaries that are not collectives of mmj pacients.

In short even if the DEA was to follow Holder's orders to the letter, (which legally they can ignore.) there is still plenty of wiggle room for them to harass MMJ operations under the guise of enforcing state rather then federal law.

We are not out of the woods yet.

[whereisjeff]

I know, we have a long way to go, but we're finally starting to make some headway. We'll see the federal law changed in the next few years, the dems in congress and the prez have bigger fish to fry before they use up political capital on this issue (ie: financial crisis, healthcare, 2 wars). Baby steps, my friend

Now, can anyone help answer the questions in this thread?

[Soniq420]

Very interesting topic. I'm really interested to see the answers as well.

[420]

me too, this may turn into a valuable resource to bring more people out of the Cannabis closet...
please make sure everyone stays on topic and no hookups...

[Bonehead]

Originally Posted by whereisjeff

- How hard is it for a grower to arrange a business relationship to grow for a co-op or dispensary? How does one go about that?

- I realize the market price varies, but what is the average price a broker or dispensary pays for a pound to the grower? Is there a difference between the two? Does a grower have to go through a broker or direct to the dispensary?

- How does the market price vary from strain to strain and how do you find out what strain is in high demand and obtain those seeds or clones?

I would like to add to this and ask how a grower can stay within the law when comes to the amount you can grow?

If you took a single grow with 6 plants and lets say they produced 150 grams each, doesn't that put you in violation of the Prop 215 (CA)? What would you do with the extra or how do you have a continuous grow-op when you can't actually predict the outcome.

I have been at one collective when it must have been buying day. I flood of people coming with duffle bags of something (wink) but I still do not know how the process works.

[hoppie]

It is weird how all this is panning out. In Washington the law states 15 plants and 22 or 24 ounces. I have a wonderful set of providers and I seem to feel just recently that maybe we have it even better then Cal. While there will always be those that stretch the boundaries the people here are really looking out for the patients welfare. I am retired and I have enough financial resources that if things were opened up enough I would invest in my own greenhouse and provide for both myself and others. It will be interesting to see how things turn out politically in the next few years.

[CharlieMopps]

I remember reading a while back on how the govt keeps tabs on mmj because of the interstate commerce clause in the constitution. I forget what it says tho, can somebody help me out.

[Soniq420]

Originally Posted by Bonehead

I would like to add to this and ask how a grower can stay within the law when comes to the amount you can grow?

If you took a single grow with 6 plants and lets say they produced 150 grams each, doesn't that put you in violation of the Prop 215 (CA)? What would you do with the extra or how do you have a continuous grow-op when you can't actually predict the outcome.

Two points from my understanding

1) That's per patient, so if you are a caregiver for more than 1, you get to prorate
2) The limits you quote are the "safe harbor" provision, meaning that no county can set the limit any lower than this. It does not necessarilly mean this is the maximum anywhere. I'd suggest you check the specific county you're interested in to understand their rules/limits

[Soniq420]

Originally Posted by CharlieMopps

I remember reading a while back on how the govt keeps tabs on mmj because of the interstate commerce clause in the constitution. I forget what it says tho, can somebody help me out.

Yeah, The enumerated powers clause of the Constitution (Article 1, section 8) is what should prevent the Federal government from having any power to involve themselves in a citizens right to use a plant. Essentially, the Constitution was structured so that it stated what the Fed's could specifically do, and all else was supposed to be prohibited from their authority.

As a result, when they wanted to push further into the people's business and get more power and control they had to figure out a convoluted rationale (strawman) to justify their actions. The interstate commerce clause was the stretch they used.

I ask you though... What does a man growing a plant in his own home for consumption in is own home have to do with Interstate Commerce?

[CharlieMopps]

Ah, yes. From capitalism magazines website:
Back in 1942, the Supreme Court authorized the vastly expanded powers of the federal government under Franklin D. Roosevelt's administration by declaring that a man who grew food for himself on his own land was somehow "affecting" prices of goods in interstate commerce and so the federal government had a right to regulate him.
Stretching and straining the law this way means that anything the federal government wants to do can be given the magic label "interstate commerce" -- and the limits on federal power under the 10th Amendment vanish into thin air.

[Marbles420]

Originally Posted by Bonehead

If you took a single grow with 6 plants and lets say they produced 150 grams each, doesn't that put you in violation of the Prop 215 (CA)? What would you do with the extra or how do you have a continuous grow-op when you can't actually predict the outcome.

Originally Posted by Soniq420

Two points from my understanding

1) That's per patient, so if you are a caregiver for more than 1, you get to prorate
2) The limits you quote are the "safe harbor" provision, meaning that no county can set the limit any lower than this. It does not necessarilly mean this is the maximum anywhere. I'd suggest you check the specific county you're interested in to understand their rules/limits

I agree with Soniq420, these are only guidelines and are NOT binding laws. If a patient stays within the guidelines, they will have little or no trouble with the authorities if investigated. If you are over the guidelines, you still stand a good defense if you can prove that it's medically beneficial by a legal recommendation from a Cannabis Doctor. The doctor's can recommend more cannabis (above the guidelines) if he or she feels you require it. And BTW, we need more dispensaries/Co-Ops in So Cal.

[ForbiddenAct]

The biggest paycheck today are defense attorney (both public and private), prosecuters (city, state, local), Marijuana brokers, drug testing labs, and lobbist.

I think, for the most part, the government is the only one randomly testing their employees, and the D.O.T. is randomly testing truck drivers and Airline pilots (probably a good thing if you drive a VW Bug or fly the airlines regularly). I suspect if you look deep enough into government testing, you'll find your Right Wing Republician lobbist using it as a tool in keeping drug testing labs profitable enough to keep them open....(for pork spending).

If your trying to understand how the MMJ industry will materialize, you can study the alcohol and tabacco industry.

Chances are the mmj industry will look for the skills of those in the tabacco and alcohol industry. They have the same type of customer, and deal with a lot of taxes and regulations. We already know that a glass a day of wine adds 20 years to your life().

Money brings out the best of everyone, so as the industry begans to bring billions of tax dollars to states, the negative stigma, assoicated with Marijuana, will follow the lines of today's view on alcohol and tabacco.

There are drug companies who have proprietary business plans, secert and ready to act, when the FDA and DEA management are replaced with a more competent workforce. Not to say the the workforce is uneducated, just that the environment in those workplaces are very political, and having any view other than status quo, will get you in trouble, and more than likely fired. I hear we are making head way, and the government is having a hard time find replacements that still hold those original views. Not even our president holds to their beliefs, but this is why it has been so difficult to make a lot of progress, until the last 10 years have showed us whats to come.

This week Obama ask for a 100 million dollar cut in spending. It would be pretty easy to do if they disbanned(merge) the DEA into small department under the FDA, and focused more on healthcare needs of the american population.

Could it be the DEA is losing their war because its beliefs are not in line with the writings in the bible? The victims of this war have sacrifaced their life(jail), just as Jesus did 2008+ years ago. It may take another 100 years, for historians to conclude, that these people are actually angels sent from god to continue Jesus's work on earth.

Is it not god who supplied the world with this spirtual plant of plenty? Maybe we should have a spritual section in this forum.

May god bless all his warrior's, as I thank them for their efforts too bring peace, to the american communities and abroad.

[Bonehead]

Originally Posted by ForbiddenAct

Could it be the DEA is losing their war because its beliefs are not in line with the writings in the bible? The victims of this war have sacrifaced their life(jail), just as Jesus did 2008+ years ago. It may take another 100 years, for historians to conclude, that these people are actually angels sent from god to continue Jesus's work on earth.

Is it not god who supplied the world with this spirtual plant of plenty? Maybe we should have a spritual section in this forum.

May god bless all his warrior's, as I thank them for their efforts too bring peace, to the american communities and abroad.

Well said ForbiddenAct.

[Soniq420]

Obama also went to Mexico (this week/last week) and said we need to "crack down" on illicit drug use in the US. Not exactly an end the drug war type of message

I think what his actual policy ends up being is still an open issue. It seems to move around a lot. I'm praying his inner conscious will lead him to do what's right, not what the entrenched infrastructure is crying for.

re the 100 million spending reduction Obama was talking about; that represents 13 minutes of spending for the federal government. I'd think if he digs real deep, he might be able to scrape that together