12/12 from seed grows

[Racefan]

One has to think that while the 12/12 from seed is a good idea for those who live in a country that don't have rules on plant count, it's not the the smartest one when dealing with the draconian laws we have here in america. The more plants the bigger the chance of federal intervention with anything over 100 plants being a guaranteed federal case here in the USA. This 12/12 style requires a lot of plants for a decent yield and would scare the heck out of me and most with something to lose. It's not the style I have a problem with. I agree that it has a place in the grow world. It's the laws here in the USA that cause the problem. It doesn't matter if the plants are 6 inches tall or 6 feet tall. If you have 25, 50, 100 or even 200 containers with a plant in each one in your grow room you WILL be considered a big time grower and be treated as such. I'd rather grow 3 or 4 large plants, be considered a small time player if something happened, average 3 to 6 ounces per plant, get my pound or more and be done till the next harvest. It would take 20 to 30 plants or more grown straight from 12/12 to get the same yield.
Just my opinion. Any thoughts?

 

[Boss]

You can keep a rotation of nine for the average consumption. But you have a point about the number rule. However if it went to court, the jurors would think they were cute and set you free LOL

The only other thing besides ease of lightcycle and perpetual harvest is freshness.

 

[Racefan]

Remember...it's the feds who take away houses, properties and business's. They also average all plants out to one pound. It's how they get a street worth price. Even if the plants won't produce a ounce, the feds will say it has the possibility of a pound and it will be entered as such. The jurors will not understand cannabis growing and will believe the feds and their experts. The prosecuting attorney will cull any person who knows anything about cannabis or growing.
Who can keep a rotation of 9? I'm not following you there.
There are tons of ways for perpetual grows so a ton of plants isn't the only way. I can do it with one plant in the flowering room and small cardboard box with a extra floro. You have me on the ease of light cycle though.
I can't argue that sitting a timer on 12/12 and walking away isn't easier. You win that one hands down.lol Although... I haven't changed the time on either of my 2 timers in years so I basically have walked away. Maybe that one isn't so big after all.
Freshness??? I'm lost again....lol

 

[Boss]

If you plant 9 and get 4 males replant until you get females, and toss the males. By the time you are staying in rotation with females, you will average 9 plants in rotation 5 always being females in various stages of growth. Keeps you in enough for meds I would think. There would be no long jar time for these buds, because you produce as you use, very fresh.

It's not the best, it just has it's place. When producing per square foot, its good. If you have limited height, it's good too

Might it be better to grow other ways in the U.S.? Maybe

 

[Racefan]

Oh I see.lol Nice rotation. I use something similar. I only grow what I need to last till the next harvest. I always have a little left over but it makes nice hash material and compost once through the bags. That's why the freshness confused me. I never have any left to get stale.lol I can see where this method has a place but I worry about some new grower packing in 150 plants and thinking they are safe or will be overlooked because they are only averaging a ounce per plant. This method can be used just like you mention above and would work perfect for that. As long as the plant numbers are kept small anyway. I just wonder what kind of yield someone can get from a couple small pop cycle sticks of bud though?
Anyone else have any thoughts? As much as I love to debate with Boss only, I sometimes worry he thinks I'm picking on him or trying to push his buttons so I'd love to read what others think as well.

 

[420oclock]

Another way is to keep a mother plant of your favorite one or two strains. Take a few cuttings, root them, veg a little then flower. If you flower 2 - 4 at a time, you can take the next cuttings so that your rooted clones are ready to go at harvest time.

 

[Ugodmade]

what about if you sent your plant grown from seed on 12/12 let it bud, re vegged it in different room, then took cuttings from her and place the re vegged clones in the 12/12 room .

 

[Racefan]

What about the flowering clone method? You take cuttings from the flowering plant at 21 days into flower. Let it flower normally. Re-veg the cuttings and if the original plant is a 8 week strain the cutting should be done re-vegging and big enough to flower right about at harvest time. This way no mother plant is required and one could get by with a small card board box and a floro to re-veg the cuttings in.

 

[Boss]

I just wrote about the same thing in another post RF ;-)

 

[Boss]

Hmmm, lemme add Oregon to my move too list..

 

[Racefan]

Good call on all the above posts!! I tend to agree that I'd MUCH rather have fewer plants with larger yields per plant, especially based on what you've indicated about how the Fed stacks the deck. Here in Oregon, the OMMA says that we are allowed to have 6 plants in bud, no limit on size, so that works out just fine for us here!

On your last post, I never use a mother plant and always take clones to continue propagation. However, I usually take those clones on the veg side, a week or 2 before I move them to bloom. This has always worked really well and the resultant clones are always strong and healthy, usually showing enough roots inside of 2 weeks to plant in soil.

However, on the rare occasions that I've had to take a clone from the bloom side, I've found that these take significantly longer to root as well as to grow to maturity.

Is there something I'm missing here (entirely possible!)? I've found that, while it works, cloning from the flowering side always takes far longer, and has a failure rate slightly higher than if taken from the veg side.

Are you saying there is an advantage to taking clones from the flowering side?

Thanks bro,
G

Yes there is a advantage to it. Check out this thread.

What is a flowering clone?

 

[Racefan]

Thanks I've been growing this great herb for 22 years in one way or another. But... even as much as I know or think I know...I still have tons to learn.

AHAH! Dude, you're a CANNABIS ENCYCLOPEDIA!!!

Thanks a lot for pointing me in the right direction...again! (and again some more I'm sure!)

On my way, thanks again for the assist!
Peace,
G

 

[blaze111]

100 plants + carries a 5 year minumum sentence.

What a bullshit law, minumum sentences are the biggest joke I've ever heard of.

to the DEA, now the USA can be known for having more prisoners than any other country.

 

[old_skool]

Hi Racefan,

One has to think that while the 12/12 from seed is a good idea for those who live in a country that don't have rules on plant count, it's not the the smartest one when dealing with the draconian laws we have here in America. The more plants the bigger the chance of federal intervention with anything over 100 plants being a guaranteed federal case here in the USA.

I agree, I didn't know about the actual plant count being 6 but now that I know that I am going to keep it at 6 or less.

This 12/12 style requires a lot of plants for a decent yield and would scare the heck out of me and most with something to lose. It's not the style I have a problem with. I agree that it has a place in the grow world. It's the laws here in the USA that cause the problem. It doesn't matter if the plants are 6 inches tall or 6 feet tall. If you have 25, 50, 100 or even 200 containers with a plant in each one in your grow room you WILL be considered a big time grower and be treated as such. I'd rather grow 3 or 4 large plants, be considered a small time player if something happened, average 3 to 6 ounces per plant, get my pound or more and be done till the next harvest. It would take 20 to 30 plants or more grown straight from 12/12 to get the same yield.
Just my opinion. Any thoughts?

RF,
I have seen in other posts you mention doing 12/12 grows in the past, were they CFL or HPS??? Did you do straight grow, SOG, SCROG, LST, etc... Are you saying that your yields with 12/12 were .5 to .8 per plant??

What I saw over at another forum was a way to either shorten or eliminate the vegetative cycle and basically get the same yield. For an indoor grow way-back-when I got about 2-4 z's per plant, is this unrealistic with a HPS 12/12 from seed???

Please remember that I am trying to clear 30 years of cobwebs here, and that when I grew back then it was all natural sunlight indoors or out, growing indoors with any kind of artificial lighting is new to me.

Thanks for your help brother,
Old Skool

 

[Boss]

I think 2oz a plant is not unreasonable, as long as you are running hps and the plants are healthy.

 

[Boss]

You have to remember, if they get your seeds, I don't care if you have one plant growing, they count each seed as a 1 pound plant. So remember that

 

[dart2]

I am looking into this myself for Oregon, but Racefan if both you and your wife had medical cards or you were a caregiver for more than 1 person would that double your plant count allowable under the ca state law at that address? I know the DEA would throw your entire family including the family pets into jail no mattter the state law. Just curious about the local 5-0.......

 

[Racefan]

Well the wife and I both smoke but I'm the only real medical person. Sure she could fake out the doctor with the old reliable "it helps me sleep and with PMS cramps" or the "I'm hyper with ADD and it calms me down" BS medical excuses for a card but she and I both disagree with the fake med users who get cards but truly don't deserve them. It's a gross violation of what the medical movement is all about and how it was intended to help the ill. Unfortunately half the med users I know or have met aren't true patients and are just using the law and a shady doctor to get away with a illegal act. IMO if it's not really medicine and a person is just saying it is to get high...well that person is setting back the med movement more than they realize. It's these "people" that give the real med users a bad name and give the feds ammunition against the rest of us who truly benefit from cannabis.
So while we could convince a doctor she could benefit from it just to grow more dope, we both won't because we know it's not really "medicine" for her and neither of us would feel good about doing things that way.

 

[Boss]

I think it's mental medication if you realize it or not

 

[dart2]

Seems fair enough you are an honest lad.........I was kinda thinking another way on this, if your wife is not sick great but what if another person you knew came to you and said hey I can't grow a stick in the mud will you be my caregiver I have a medical need and have a card?........oh he/she says I won't need much as I'm a medium type user of my meds. So, I am wondering can you then grow 2x the amount at your garden/place and then give the friend you are caregiver for what he/she needs and you continue to use the total plants/per oz. limit for two people under the current law in Ca?......