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20% THC and the common grower

TheFertilizer

Well-Known Member
Okay I've got some issue with how THC testing is perceived, and maybe a little with the generalization going on about those who are interested in it.

I hear so much talk about "ceilings" and all the myriad of different effects from different flowers... And I just truly can't relate. The actual differences from one strain to the other are so subtle and inconsistent for me, and I have tried a lot of different weed , from different growers, before recreational as well. I'm not doubting others ability to sense the subtle differences and quantify them, but I guess for me personally I just don't have as refined sensibilities. I'm perfectly willing to admit that may be my shortcoming, but it's the truth. I've been smoking daily for 15 years straight, so frankly if I think I need high THC, it's not because I'm some dumb kid chasing a trend.

Meanwhile, I also question how open other growers are to the idea that they think their weed is so great because of ego. Ego is a touchy word since we tend to cast a negative connotation to it in society, but there's not necessarily anything wrong with valuing something that's a reflection of yourself over something that isn't. I just think people bind themselves from the possibility that part (a significant part) of their enjoyment comes from the fact they grew it themselves over a chemical difference. It's not arrogance; you know exactly the work that went into it, how much of yourself you poured into it, why would you not value it above anyone else's? I mean it's kind of like comparing a home-cooked meal to a fine dish served at a restaurant. It could be the classiest joint in the world, it will never have that taste of home. In the same way, no store-bought weed will ever capture the same feeling of smoking your own. I think as objective as we may try to be, that it's still a huge sub-conscious factor that greatly alters our enjoyment.

For ME, the desired usefulness from THC testing would be so that I could look at a package and know, "This will get me this high." I don't really want to rely on strain reports, or anecdotal reviews, because most of the time they don't align with my own experiences. When people tell me, "Oh well, this strain has no ceiling, if it's not strong enough you can just smoke more," I find myself at a plateau after a few bowls and can't smoke much more than that a time because it taxes my lungs. That's all fine and dandy if all we're smoking for is fun, but what if relief from a specific ailment is needed. I simply can't expect consistency in anecdotal reports of such things for the reasons already discussed above; varying phenotype, unscrupulous breeders, etc. and so on. I would at least hope I could count on a laboratory analysis.

I don't really want cannabis to ever become like alcohol, but one thing that I appreciate about alcohol is that if you look at a can or a bottle and it says that it is 5% ABV, then you can easily know how much you're consuming, and have a reasonable level of predictability in how it will effect you. When you go buy a bag of pot, and it says 25%, the actual veracity of it being 25% is just not reliable. I would really suspect a lot of the time people smoke a low testing strain and say, "That was some of the best weed I ever smoked," it actually had more THC content than what it was specified and vise versa. The inconsistency means no smoker can ever predict how a certain level of THC will effect them since they can't accurately track it.

I think it's very hard to deny that higher THC percentages equal a more intense high. Otherwise people wouldn't be so drawn to things like hash and other concentrates. However I think there's a side effect people aren't paying attention to. When those people who like concentrates spend day in and day out dabbing 60-80% BHO, it boosts their tolerance up to the point where even the best flower won't get them high at all. I know people who have been real keen on dabbing for a while who tell me they basically can't get high with flowers anymore, and these are people who grow their own. It's a real problem, because when we're talking about self-medication, it's leading to people who grow their own going from getting their relief from flowers, to in no time having to squish their shit between hair-straighteners just to get a strong enough dose, fast enough, to effect them. THC is not the single active ingredient like people once thought, but if we can't even accurately test THC, then any meaningful testing of CBD or terepenes or the like can't be done either.

25% is not an insignificant percentage, and I kind of tend to wonder how much people like us have been spoiled to high THC content weed. We spoil the heck out of our plants, and get stuff that gets us high, and chances are we have higher tolerances than the average pre-roll buying light-weight at the pot stores. So if we spend all this time and energy growing the best possible plants we can, and then go buy some half-assed bud from the store, of course there's way more chance of it not getting us as high. For one thing even if the THC content was equal, did they store it worth a damn, or are all the terpenes gased off? Then, don't forget, how much of our enjoyment of our own comes from the fact it's our own. At the end of all that, the number they print on the bag probably isn't even right, so you might buy their strongest strain expecting (hoping) it to be at least on par with your own, and it might just be bunk with a big number; then that just reinforces the notion that the THC rating is meaningless, but in reality it's just misapplied.

Anyway I'm rambling but my point is I think there's plenty of merit for THC analysis, but that's hard to see because it's being abused with the current status quo. Ultimately, I'd hope to see it useful as a dosing guideline, but that's not very reliable now because the numbers are inaccurate. The only way we can hope to make it reliable is to insist they make it more accurate, and not throw the baby out with the bathwater and advocate against analysis all together. Once the THC content on the bag matches what's actually in the bag, it will provide the consistency people need to not be guessing if it will get them high.
 

Jackalope

Well-Known Member
This thread has become more interesting than I originally thought.

Testing does provide useful info. It still must be used right by both the growers and the buyers. It would be great if they said "Take buds from this portion of the plant". Then all would be similar as far as what would be tested......... I know people would still cheat but hear me out LMAO.

If it was all from the same place on the plant. No one cheated. Then testing would give us a good idea of what is in there.

Terpene testing is going to be more important in time. The more they find out how their effects blend with the THC the more popular it will become. Terpene profile will tell you a lot about flavor and effects. In ways this can help tell you what the effects will be almost as much as THC content. Plus it can tell you how that THC will will affect you. Certain terpenes have certain effects.

Bottom line is higher THC strains are better if they really are that high. Part of the problem is what kind of high it is going to give you. Indica/sativa percents can no longer tell you what the effects will be. Some strong strains may not have the effects you were expecting. That does not mean that they are not as strong as posted. It is all in effects and how one person is affected. Just because it doesn't affect you the way you expect does not mean it isn't strong.

I am another person that wants the higher THC because of tolerance more than bragging. Bragging is where high THC numbers matter. Whether they are selling it or showing it off. That's when numbers are quoted LOL. "Mine is this strong" as opposed to "How strong is that"

Testing for terpenes as well as THC and CBD. Can tell you tons of info. It does you no good if you don't know what all that info means. Same as THC percent, it doesn't matter what the percent is. What matters what it can do with that percent. It all comes down to effects. If a strain does not have a fun happy high at 16% it is going to be just as boring at 25% just stronger.

Effects matter so much more than percentages. Still testing does give you a baseline go with. If all that info was available and it was accurate. Then you could learn what combinations you liked. The right percentage of certain terpenes and this amount of THC and CBD will probably do this for me. It would make strain selection easier.

Said so much I don't even know what I still want to answer or ask LMAO. Best shut up now. Great input people.
 

Jackalope

Well-Known Member
Rant on brother. Oregon I see it as the model for the rest of the world after the prohibition ends.

This has all played out before and why our country has an Ag bill from congress to stabilize pricing and help the farmers in lean times. Problem here is cannabis is illegal federally and won't/can't be included in the Ag bill.

We should do what Canada is doing. Prices set

Farmer - $5/gm
Government - $2/gm
Dispensary - $3-$5/gm

retail customer pays - $10-$12/gm

Everybody wins.

Guranteed prosperity for everyone.
Prolly never see that here in the USA sadly.

The way it is now in Oregon; that's how the economy goes down the tubes and everyone bankrupt and the end result is shit for quality.

The alternative market holds everything together until the "people in charge" get a brain.

Great idea if they do it right. Pricing is what screwed the Washington growers early on. Their Grower prices made it so the only way to make money was to grow high producing strains. This in itself dropped quality. What it really did was make it so a small time grower could never make a buck.

Outlaws will have to take up the slack again. The best weed will end up being found from private and small batch growers. Really funny how someone in a legal state can become a outlaw for growing quality weed. They will and have I am sure. Some growers and all smokers will always prefer a quality product. Looks like we will find ourselves dealing in dark allies again in no time LMAO.
 

Pinktiger777

Well-Known Member
That’s why I, as a Missouri grower, plan to stay way under the radar.
 

pontiacman

Well-Known Member
Co-op is going to be the way to grow of the future. Just get a few friends that grow different stuff real well. Group together and cover all everyone's needs.
Already there friend. I have friends in extracts and oils as well as flower. We don't compete with each other but help each other out when the need is there.
It works well.
 

Jackalope

Well-Known Member
Nothing wrong with a little friendly competition lol. It also helps to make things better. It started with harvest festivals way before Cannabis cups. People got together to share and show off their best stuff for the year. After your experience with the Oregon cup. You will see the need for simplicity in competitions. Once a year get a bunch of friends together and test away. Let the growers judge. We know badass when we see and smoke it. If they are honest a true winner will arise.
 

bobrown14

Grow Journal of the Month: Dec 2017 - Photo of the Month: May 2020
The best weed will end up being found from private and small batch growers. Really funny how someone in a legal state can become a outlaw for growing quality weed. They will and have I am sure. Some growers and all smokers will always prefer a quality product. Looks like we will find ourselves dealing in dark allies again in no time LMAO.

My little flower stand has been BOOMING ever since it went legal here in my state.
Go figure.

I'm sure 420% there are folks like me/us that keep a few of our friends VERY happy. They may go down to the dispensary and test the waters but at the end of the day quality always stands out. Folks with a discerning palate will always go for quality over crappy.

I sometimes cure my weed for 6 months before I even open the jar. You wont find that kind of weed in a store situation. Pretty sure about that, not yet anyways.

Fert brought up EGO. Try and avoid that whenever possible. The proof is in the pudding as they say. You grow shit and you gonna be sitting on the shit for a while. Sometimes called a 6 month cure, LOL. J/K, I wouldn't cure crappy weed for that long it would never make it that far in flower in my grow room. Gets given away IF it grew out. I've tossed many plants, usually they dont make it out of VEG.

Good weed - grow it and they will come. That's how I look at it. Consistency is critical for success no matter what the tests are telling us. We know what good weed is.

Tests are explaining why a 15% THC Durban fuck me up WAY higher than a 30% Indica that all I wanna do is eat the kitchen down and take a nap.

The 30% THC tho reads good on a label.
 

Jackalope

Well-Known Member
I am a firm believer in proper selection. It doesn't really work for me. Growing unknown strains all the time I can't tell shit from them during veg. I pretty much have to try everything first hand after they finish. Everything ends up being grown out. Later in flower I can spot lesser plants. By then the room is there so I might as well finish them out. Now days it seems all strains are covered with trichomes. What is in them is what matters.

Still no matter what strains we grow. If they are not clones or a S-1. Then there is going to be a few lesser plants. Lots of this gets used for edibles or oils. Always something to do with it. Now that I don't grow out unknown freebies from seed banks I run into less shitty plants.

As bad as it sounds. Most of my lesser plants are shared with others. Sharing the great weed and keeping the crap weed would be stupid. Don't get me wrong. I do smoke and share the good stuff with others. I just found that it was a great way to get rid of the weed I wasn't going to smoke. My friends Love free weed.

Now by lesser I don't mean crap. If weed doesn't get me high it goes in the trash. I just mean the plants that don't show great smell and taste like other phenos. That is what I meant about growing better genetics for a better average on THC percent. Now days my bad weed is still pretty good.

Like you mentioned. You can't cure in flavor. You can enhance it but if it is not there it won't improve. After the first initial dry. I know enough about them to know which ones I want to give a proper cure. Some go to cure while others are smoked soon after.

A perfect plant might have it all. Strains rarely do. While flavor is important. I lean more towards effects. I can put up with mediocre flavor more than I can with mediocre high. Still with every harvest the effects are getting better and better. Now that I know how strains affect me it is easier to choose them now.
 

vtwin906

Well-Known Member
Now that I know how strains affect me it is easier to choose them now.

Maybe you could help me choose...? I am 72yrs old and the smoke I have just trashes my energy level, just wanna snooze out all day. I'm not sure if it's the smoke or age/bio-chem ... anyway more than a couple small hits will turn me into a dishrag for like 24 hrs and in order to start feeling energetic again I have to abstain for 2 days. The only medication I take is a low dose diuretic for blood pressure and I don't drink much alcohol any more.

Now that I can grow legally as of last week I'm trying to pick a sativa auto-fem that could avoid the body buzz and hopefully boost or maintain my energy.... would you have a recommendation? I am looking at Lemon AK by FastBuds which claims to be 'energetic'. I won't need more than a few plants to sustain myself and my wife, but would try 2 varieties for comparison. I'll set up both an indoor and outdoor grow. Because we are in a townhouse until May I have to wait to get started until then so I have plenty of time to select my options.
 

Jackalope

Well-Known Member
I understand you wanting a auto. The simplicity is nice. My suggestion would be Cinderella 99 from Grimm Brothers. It is a photo strain that comes in regular or feminized. It also finishes really fast. A grow of it as a photo strain will still finish as fast or faster then most Auto strains.

My main reason for suggesting it is that it has been one of the best daytime sativas I have grown. It is strong which could be a problem if it is just THC that is the problem. If it is just a case of to much indica in other strains then it might be perfect. It affects are all mostly in the head and last for a long time.

Drugged sleep can make it harder to restart in the morning. If the strains that are smoking are putting you asleep then you may not be getting good sleep. Everyone is affected differently so it may take some time to find a strains that works for you.

If it is the THC that is the problem. You may look for a Sativa Dominant CBD strain. The lower THC and higher CBD might be what you need for effects and enjoyment.
 

vtwin906

Well-Known Member
I understand you wanting a auto. The simplicity is nice. My suggestion would be Cinderella 99 from Grimm Brothers. It is a photo strain that comes in regular or feminized. It also finishes really fast. A grow of it as a photo strain will still finish as fast or faster then most Auto strains.

My main reason for suggesting it is that it has been one of the best daytime sativas I have grown. It is strong which could be a problem if it is just THC that is the problem. If it is just a case of to much indica in other strains then it might be perfect. It affects are all mostly in the head and last for a long time.

Drugged sleep can make it harder to restart in the morning. If the strains that are smoking are putting you asleep then you may not be getting good sleep. Everyone is affected differently so it may take some time to find a strains that works for you.

If it is the THC that is the problem. You may look for a Sativa Dominant CBD strain. The lower THC and higher CBD might be what you need for effects and enjoyment.

Thanks for the input! I read somewhere that late harvesting can intensify body effects... the last QP I picked up was not from the grower I know, he picked it up from another grower and I don't know any specifics. I've only used up an oz since I got it in June. I used to be hitting the bong with coffee every morning .... when I try than now I'll be useless before afternoon comes around.

Our fixed income requires cost cutting wherever possible so looking to minimize the electric bill and I suspect that a photo strain would be way less economical than an outdoor harvest. I am however thinking about an LED light to get things started a couple weeks early. We have very long days by the end of June but can't trust the weather in May, we get mid month snow in many years.... I just read the CInderella info and maybe not a good bet for the climate here.
 

Jackalope

Well-Known Member
Yeah it is mostly a indoor strain. Lots more strains will be bred for outdoor in the near future. Now that it is legal it can be grown outdoors without risk. Genetics will be changing also. Lots of indoor stuff will grow outdoors. The problems arise when they don't get a short enough day to start flowering so they can finish early enough.

No problem outdoors is fine. Especially on a fixed income. I am there myself. I just don't have the outdoor climate to grow in. The starting earlier is a great idea. Whether it is CFL or LED you can give your plants a big jump by starting early. They may not grow real fast under a small light. They will get a chance to build a good root system and get some age to them. Older a plant is the better it will flower when the time comes. For photo strains how many days they grow does not effect them. Starting Auto's early might shorten their outdoor grow time by starting them indoors. Still may be fine but it needs to be considered.

It has been a long time since I grew outdoors. I have finish 2 strains outdoors even here. One was a early saiva from Sensi seeds it did ok was fairly strong and finished in a real crappy climate. The fact that it finished outdoors made it a winner. The other is a lot better strain. Not sure if you can find it anymore. Texada Timewarp. It is a Canadian strain that was bred to be grown outdoors. It might be worth looking at. Peak seeds has it I am not sure who else might carry it.
 
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