Airy buds, frustrating

[steve47]

Hi everyone,
This is about my 12th grow while i keep improving my setup, knowledge and methods and i keep getting very similiar results all the time.. Now i'm getting the plant more bushy and still very airy.

On my last grow i grown Jock Horror Autoflower & Bubbleicious Autoflower under 250MH and then 250HPS with additional two 60w Eurolux where the light can't penetrate. The grow room dimenstions are-
1 meter tall
70cm wide
50cm deep
(While the actual grow space is much smaller because i need place for pots and lights..)

I have a little plate with holes to put the plants on which is about 20cm higher from ground level so the plants will also be closer to the lights.

Before that i grown regular indoor seeds- AK48 & Black Jack under the same setup.
All my seeds are from Nirvana which i heared good things of them and it is hard for me to believe the problem is with the strain as i been told in my grow shop..

The temps were 23-24 Celcius during the entire grow. Sometimes the temp dropped lower.
Humidity around 35%-48% during the entire grow. Mostly around the 35%-40%.

I have three sucktion vents for air circulation and one small fan to blow wind on the plants.

I tried to grow with LST and i tried to grow without any method too.

I'm using fertilizers very carefully and i don't get the leaves yellowing or anything..



I noticed that even in the end of the flowering when the flowers look healthy and fat.. I can still see
all the hairs/trichomes separated instead of building up to a nice bud.

I'm watering them one time every 3 days during veg and in the end of the flowering i feed them more because they'r hydrating the pot much faster.

I'm frustrated.. I want to smoke
I kept reading over forums and it seems like the problem should either be heat or lack of light but there was no heat this time and the plants are very close to the 250HPS so it doesn't seem right either..

Anyone have any idea what could it be that i'm doing wrong?
Thanks for all helps!

 

[oiuhdfukg]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

How close are the lights from the tops of the plants? Perhaps they're too far.

 

[steve47]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

I have a scrog stand i made so i have 2 levels.

On the first weeks they grow when they are still short i'm keeping them on the 2nd level where they get about 20-30cm far from the 250HPS.

When they grow and i start LST i take them to the 1st level where they get about 10-15cm far from the light but after 2-3 weeks they get about 3-6cm far from the light (and less).
Sometimes i take them 1 level down at that part which makes them at this stage about 15cm far from the light..

And it seem like they develope many branches and bud sites which i never had before i had this setup with the two levels..

 

[steve47]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

Does anyone here has experience with Nirvana seeds? Could that be the problem? :\

 

[MrWhat]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

I have a scrog stand i made so i have 2 levels.

On the first weeks they grow when they are still short i'm keeping them on the 2nd level where they get about 20-30cm far from the 250HPS.

When they grow and i start LST i take them to the 1st level where they get about 10-15cm far from the light but after 2-3 weeks they get about 3-6cm far from the light (and less).
Sometimes i take them 1 level down at that part which makes them at this stage about 15cm far from the light..

And it seem like they develope many branches and bud sites which i never had before i had this setup with the two levels..

the "problem" may be the distance between your plants and the HPS source. 3-6cm are not enough to have an even distribution of light!
At that distance you could burn your plants! Did you try to measure the temps at flowers level? the golden rule is: hold your hand at flowers height under HPS. is it too hot for you? then it is for your plants!

HPS bulb must be changed frequently because its intensity decrease a lot using it.

I hope you to solve your problem asap

 

[Light Addict]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

There may be one way to improve this situation without altering your setup please read my backbuilding guide below in my sig. Should aid you some

 

[CptnFantasy]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

Are you sure that the grow area is completely light proof? When the lights are off inside the grow cabinet/space is there any light penetration at all into the cab?

 

[steve47]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

Thanks Mr.What,
I tried measuring the heat on the flowers levels and it's good but if it's getting to hot then i have a SCROG net to play with
They doesn't get burn.. They used to on my first grows hehe.. I have this HPS bulb for less than a year

Thanks CptnFantasy,
The grow area doesn't get light when the lights off but the room does get some light from the grow room because of the vent holes, etc.. But i never had hermie problems or something..

Thanks LightAddict, i'm now in the middle of flowering with another plant so i will try this on it
But i still wonder what could be the problem because as much as i know, it show get denser without even using fertilizers, right?

 

[rillos]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

Does anyone here has experience with Nirvana seeds? Could that be the problem? :\

I grow with Nirvana seeds and never had any issues. I always get fat tight compact buds.

 

[Weaselcracker]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

How is it possible to grow 3-6 cm from a 250 watt bulb? Really? Well, I suppose I should take your word for it but it sounds like it would be way too hot and give very strange light distribution.
Definitely check out the backbuilding technique it's really great.

 

[steve47]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

I'm now going to try back building, it sounds great!
About the light bulb distance, most of the grow there is atleast 10-15cm distance but as much as i understand from the lights chart, the maximum distance shouldn't be more than 20cm so i guess 250HPS has a sh**ty range..

How far do you suggest me to keep them from the light at veg/flowering stage please?

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

Depends on what ya call airy bud ?

These are all Nirvana plants.

 

[Light Addict]

Re: Airy buds, frustrating..

Go Fuzzy

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

The very first pic was Northern lights by nirvana a topped plant i had other but no pic's taken !

The next couple below where a F1 hybrid known as Chrystal by nirvana.

The next few are pics of Blue Mystic by nirvana.

The very last was bubblecious by nirvana and some where in my first couple of grows some few years ago.


Dense bud ah more likely environmentel or strain related thing... other stuff could be mentioned tho !

 

[steve47]

Well yours looks far better than mine lol..
I checked my grow room again and i have a bit more distance from lights than i thought
and it seem to be in a good range.. I'm now trying to give less N and more PK and i will also try
the back building technique

But i still don't get why i'm getting such lame buds

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Could be environmental issue's...

High temperature for example, not enough light etc

 

[steve47]

The temperature / Humidity are good and the plants aren't too far, neither too close to the light bulbs
and apparently the strain is good too.. I have no idea what i'm doing wrong

 

[heanter]

i had the same problem with my 250w HPS but i harvested it too early.. was my first grow but this time going more experienced but i believe that it is because of the light sould get at least 400w HPS or 600w and changes will be so obvious ! also good quality ferts play big role.

 

[steve47]

I'm now getting a new setup for a bigger/taller/more ventilated grow room with 600w or 1000w not sure yet..

I'm using Bio Nova fertilizers, i have a full set and i'm doing it according to the fertilizing tables and what i have been guided to..
At start i used to get yellow leaves and such but now my plants grow real nice and much better than ever but still failing on flowering

I'm afraid of having the same results with the new setup because it's something i'm doing wrong..

 

[djbigshot]

funny thing to come across this post as I'm currently at the end of my first grow using Nirvana's jock horror autos. 2 plants both grown under the same conditions. Yet, one plant the one I will harvest this weekend is very airy and though good height 24inches.(for this plant apparently) still disappointing did not fill in as I hoped. the 2nd which is about 2 weeks behind is slightly shorter about 1.5 inches is filling in nicely fatter tighter buds but the buds are shorter. i do think the second will have as much if not more weight than the 1st. Hmm... Maybe they are from different mothers? Thoughts?