Are they ready to flush yet?

[Backlipslide]

Sorry @InTheShed
Sorry @Emilya

My intentions weren’t for an argument at all, let’s roll another one and smoke it together, let’s agree to disagree if it helps. Your both like emilya said are “expert level people” in my opinion. You both have valuable arguments, For me to say I pick so and so’s side or agree with so and so, wouldn’t be proactive at all. (I’ve said this in my head too many times nothing makes sense anymore lol) so that being said I apologize to you two as I feel I provoked this argument

I tip my cup in your direction for a nice clean crisp cheers against your glasses

 

[Jack420]

Team no flush

 

[Emilya Green]

Sorry @InTheShed
Sorry @Emilya

My intentions weren’t for an argument at all, let’s roll another one and smoke it together, let’s agree to disagree if it helps. Your both like emilya said are “expert level people” in my opinion. You both have valuable arguments, For me to say I pick so and so’s side or agree with so and so, wouldn’t be proactive at all. (I’ve said this in my head too many times nothing makes sense anymore lol) so that being said I apologize to you two as I feel I provoked this argument

I tip my cup in your direction for a nice clean crisp cheers against your glasses

Thank you Baklipslide, but I don't think that Shed and I are actually arguing. I think in this fine thread we are realizing that we actually mostly agree with each other. He has a point to make, and I agree with him, and I don't think he has ever said not to flush if it is to clear salts and debris out of the medium. I have actually come around to his way of thinking, due probably to the well presented scientific studies, that nutrients do not end up in the final buds, even the dreaded magnesium that I even recently stated that i quit giving at the end because I thought I could tell that it added an aftertaste. Twice now, I have purposely broken my own rule and kept giving my calmag+ product right to the end, in my organic grows. No dreaded metallic aftertaste resulted. My thick head has realized that my initial assumption was wrong and now I think I was actually tasting some kind of end of grow deficiency, probably magnesium. Go figure. I am still learning... how about the rest of you?

 

[CanGrows]

Alot of very useful information.
I have been noticing the crystalized salts building up on the outside of my soft pots and on the bottom drain cutouts on my plastic pots.
I followed the rule of when feeding to let a considerable amount of water/nutrients run through the medium to remove the buildup- but after more reading I may flush with some ph6.0 water on the next watering.
I noticed one of my plants the leaves curled upwards and turned purple, I'm wondering if this has something to do with it.
But once these ladies are done I'm planning a Reno in my grow room to upgrade to an auto watering system to remove some of the time commitment.
Anyways thanks for all the food for thought!

 

[Emilya Green]

Alot of very useful information.
I have been noticing the crystalized salts building up on the outside of my soft pots and on the bottom drain cutouts on my plastic pots.
I followed the rule of when feeding to let a considerable amount of water/nutrients run through the medium to remove the buildup- but after more reading I may flush with some ph6.0 water on the next watering.
I noticed one of my plants the leaves curled upwards and turned purple, I'm wondering if this has something to do with it.
But once these ladies are done I'm planning a Reno in my grow room to upgrade to an auto watering system to remove some of the time commitment.
Anyways thanks for all the food for thought!

yep, the salt definitely builds up and you can see it if you look for it. Your purpling leaves with odd twists and curling upward make me think phosphorus deficiency... but again, that very commonly could be a salt lockout too. Let's see what the flush does.

 

[InTheShed]

My intentions weren’t for an argument at all

We aren't arguing! As Emilya said.

I don't think he has ever said not to flush if it is to clear salts and debris out of the medium.

I never have. Any time your substrate has an imbalance of almost any type, a corrective flush (3x the pot size as Emilya mentioned) followed by full strength correct nutes is my recommendation.

nutrients do not end up in the final buds

Hate to be a pest, but nutrients do end up in the final buds (and everywhere else in the plant), they just can't be flushed out.

I may flush with some ph6.0 water on the next watering.

No matter what you think about the need to pH your nutes, you definitely don't need to pH your flush water. It's going to be pushed out by the nutes you finish your flush with.

 

[Nunyabiz]

For those needing to flush salt out of your soil it's best to use Yucca extract in the water.
It aids the flushing of the salt as a wetting agent plus the sugar helps get rid of the salt.

 

[InTheShed]

Bakers add salt to recipes to counter-act the sugar. I haven't figured out why they don't just use less sugar to begin with, but I'm no baker!

 

[Emilya Green]

For those needing to flush salt out of your soil it's best to use Yucca extract in the water.
It aids the flushing of the salt as a wetting agent plus the sugar helps get rid of the salt.

Bakers add salt to recipes to counter-act the sugar. I haven't figured out why they don't just use less sugar to begin with, but I'm no baker!

I believe that this is essentially what the flushing product Sledgehammer is... sweetened yuka water.

 

[InTheShed]

I wish to state the following as clearly and loudly as I can: All synthetic grows should preform a true flush of their system as the plants go into the final bud stretch in the last 2-3 weeks of the grow. This flush is not to wash the nutes out of the final product, this is simply to clear the medium of salts so that during that final bud stretch, the maximum amount of water and finishing nutes can be uptaken into the plant.

I don't ever flush nutes from my ProMix HP with MegaCrop. But that's just me.

Okay, so I've read Emilya's post about flushing in flower to clear the substrate of salts many times, but I've never done it because my plants always seem to do alright without it, not showing any deficiencies or excesses.

But after she posted it again yesterday (ad nauseam perhaps ), I thought I would go to my soil engineer over at ProMix to get his take on it. Here is what he said [note: this is not cannabis-specific, as our conversations don't reference plants]:

"When any fertilizer is applied to a container, the plant will take up nutrients leaving some behind. Plants do not have the ability to select or choose which elements they want or need. This can create some imbalances in the root zone.

"A plain water irrigation leaches out the elements that are not used or any waste ions (such as sodium and/or chloride) that may have accumulated (all nutrients are supplied in fertilizers as mineral salts). Irrigate plants to allow 15-20% of water to flow from the bottom of the container.

"Generally, a good practice over a course of a week is to irrigate with fertilizer solution three times and follow the fourth irrigation with plain water to leach excess nutrients/salts. This would be applicable to all growing media."

Emilya confirmed! And even magnified if we are to flush once a week . I won't go that far, but I will be flushing per Emilya's instructions above. (I already water to runoff...most of the time.)

 

[d42zero]

This flush is not to wash the nutes out of the final product, this is simply to clear the medium of salts so that during that final bud stretch, the maximum amount of water and finishing nutes can be uptaken into the plant.

I'm a newbie and that sentence really cleared up what people mean by the end flush, I'd read other stuff about cutting off nutes in the last week or two and it had also used the word 'flush' so your clarification was really valuable, thanks

 

[Nunyabiz]

One of the many reasons I prefer the simplicity of Living Organic Soil.
No salt build up to flush from my soil, my roots are always sucking up water like a sponge.

 

[scrogster]

Plants, however, do not stop growing when they are being flushed. Rapidly expandingbuds can be seen even while the flush is removing the nutrients. ... So although growers aim to remove nitrogen from the buds byflushing, the plant concentrates nutrients in the buds from other places in the plant.

 

[InTheShed]

Maybe this will help, maybe not. Here is a chart of nutrient analysis in harvested buds from clones in hydro subjected to various degrees of fertigation, from no nutes to full nutes, for the last two weeks prior to harvest.

No significant differences beyond standard error margins.

 

[scrogster]

I know I know lol you'll never change my ways its what works for me and my flowers are chronic once all said and done. Fire..... as im sure yours are.

 

[CanGrows]

 

[CanGrows]

One of the many reasons I prefer the simplicity of Living Organic Soil.
No salt build up to flush from my soil, my roots are always sucking up water like a sponge.

My next grow is going to be super soil or no media