Balancing pH with RO water

[Jamers]

Hey guys im struggling a bit here getting my PH balanced using 100% RO water
Water PH before adding anything is 6.2 EC 0050
R DWC system 80 L

So far i have been adding first
Cal Mag at 5ml/Gallon Then
Nutrients to an EC of 1000 PH is 4.2
PH Up to 5.9
However the next day PH was up to 9.8!

So
1) I didnt mix the PH up enough so when it cycled through the system it mixed properly and that shot the PH up
or
2) I had read that RO water has no PH buffers so PH swings are likely and needs to be buffered

How do I fix this?
Saw this article ; Blog GHE hydroponic systems fertilizers bioponics » TIP – How to buffer reverse osmosis water
In order to PH buffer PH up to 10 then Back Down to 6 and this will buffer the water.
Does that mean PH up to 10 then down to 6 then add nutrients
or
PH up to 10 add nutes which will bring it back down to say 8 then add PH down the rest of the way back to 6.0 ??


Anyone Using 100% RO water can recommend what order to add what in ??
Should i be able to just add cal mag then nutes then PH up to 6.0 and it will be stable ?

Thanks for you're time
Much appreciated

 

[Bassman59]

I don't know what products you're using. But I suggest no matter what you use, do the following (this is what I do).

Add your nutrients to your RO water 4-6 hours before you plan to do your res change. I use three 5 gal water bottles and mix all three identical.

After you've added your nutrients to the water, go watch a movie or two. After being totally bummed because a terrible ending to your movie, go test the ph. Now adjust the ph with whatever you use, mix it up a little, and go watch a sit com. Sitcoms make you happy, your ph will adjust and make you happy too!

So now you've done your res change. 24 hrs has gone by, and you check it. It's gone up a little. Take a qt of nutrient mix out of your res, throw some ph down into it, mix a bit, add it back into your res. Check it in 1/2 hour, until you are used to how much it takes to adjust.

Things I have come to believe:

Low water temps and AN nutes or BPN nutes make for less adjustment needed when I make up my 15 gals of mix or during the week as I replenish 2 gals per day.

No less tha once per month calibrate my ph meter according to maker.

I don't need to dial it in perfect. If I see 6.1 I dont worry. I may more may not adjust it down a little. If I see 5.1 I will adjust it up a bit. So long as it's in 5.2-6.1 though I don't hardly have to touch it.

 

[StonerJ]

I use 100% RO water and what I do is after drawing a fresh reservoir fill off of the filter using a spare container of identical size to the working reservoir, I put an airstone in and aerate it for at least 24 hours or more. I then add the nutes at about 1/3 strength which always seems to bring the pH from the mid 8's down to where I look for it at 5.8 to 5.9. I then pump the old reservoir to waste (running a hose from the grow room to the bathtub drain in the next room), blow out my chiller lines to get all of the old solution out, and then pump the new aerated pH balanced solution into the reservoir.

Also, I've found that Cal-Mag is a good place to start with assembling the nute solution.

 

[DarkPoet]

I'm confused..

Hey guys im struggling a bit here getting my PH balanced using 100% RO water
Water PH before adding anything is 6.2 EC 0050
R DWC system 80 L

So far i have been adding first
Cal Mag at 5ml/Gallon Then
Nutrients to an EC of 1000 PH is 4.2
PH Up to 5.9
However the next day PH was up to 9.8!

So
1) I didnt mix the PH up enough so when it cycled through the system it mixed properly and that shot the PH up
or
2) I had read that RO water has no PH buffers so PH swings are likely and needs to be buffered

How do I fix this?
Saw this article ; Blog GHE hydroponic systems fertilizers bioponics » TIP – How to buffer reverse osmosis water
In order to PH buffer PH up to 10 then Back Down to 6 and this will buffer the water.
Does that mean PH up to 10 then down to 6 then add nutrients
or
PH up to 10 add nutes which will bring it back down to say 8 then add PH down the rest of the way back to 6.0 ??


Anyone Using 100% RO water can recommend what order to add what in ??
Should i be able to just add cal mag then nutes then PH up to 6.0 and it will be stable ?

Thanks for you're time
Much appreciated

first of all I belive that the buffering you are descriping is for Water that drops in PH, not rising.
second, as far as I can tell from what I've read, that Means PH up to 10 then down to 6 then add nutrients.
Third I'm guessing if this only makes your problem bigger, then I would suggest trying to make it lower than it has to be like 4-5 then up it to 6..
fourth I did the buffering on regular Water, and had an insane rise in PH within 24 hours, and I'm guessing you will the same hence the third..

and then to my story ..

see my problem is that I start out with an EC value of 0.04 Ms, and a PH around 6.6 normally I would lower this to around my needed values to 5.5-5.6 with my old nutrient from GHE standard Flora series, this would then within 6 hours DROP to 4.5-4.7 in PH, and then I had a constant battle to try and balanced it out.. redoing Water, also trying out my Mineral filter for my RO which adds calcium, magnesium, potassium and sodium, Thus raising the lvl of my Water to a stumbeling 10.5 pH and then lowering that.. also skipped any lowering but no matter what I do my Water always DROPS in PH, only working solution I found with GHE (and tried so far) was 50-50 not 20-80 as they recommend.. and that kind of removes the Whole point of using RO to make clean Water to use for this..

so after changing tank a lot the last 4 weeks, I of course also read a lot around, a few as you are saying they have problem with it rising ? which kind of makes me Wonder what you are doing to your Water vs. what I'm doing ?

anyways, I after reading a lot I changed to AN's, PH perfect micro, grow, Bloom.. also 3 point as my old was.. this is suposedly made for RO Water, though they state an avg. EC lvl of a 0.1-0.15, this being a bit higher than mine.. Anyways, my problem still persists, though not as violent as before.. not it at least takes it 12-24 hours to get around 4.8-5 in Ph but since this in my book still is to low, I can't help to get back to what it is you are doing to your RO Water vs. what I'm doing to mine, since yours is rising like madness, but mine is dropping.. and if you ever found a solution to your issue .. ?

 

[GreatLife4All]

I would check the calibration on your pH meter. R/O water which has a EC of 50 should have a pH very, very close to 7... and if anything be a little bit over (depending on your local waters composition).

If your meter is properly calibrated - you have been given a wealth of great information from other members above.

 

[DarkPoet]

I would check the calibration on your pH meter. R/O water which has a EC of 50 should have a pH very, very close to 7... and if anything be a little bit over (depending on your local waters composition).

If your meter is properly calibrated - you have been given a wealth of great information from other members above.

sorry.. ARE YOU FUKING KIDDING ME ?
my calibration is off .1-.2 so in theory it could be closer to 7 but, where exactly do you see ANY FUKING SOLUTION, add ANY ANSWER to the basic Q, how come HIS is RISING, when MINE IS DROPPING !?! WHERE EXACTLY do you see ANYTHING about that !?!


besides that, CAL MAG; doesn't make your solution rise in PH as you would expect from and alkaline product.. and that didn't help, so if you as you don't, have a clue about the Whole debate, keep the fuk out of it..

I btw did already before actually reading this post try a CAL MAG: Botanicare - Hydro 101
and guess what, that didn't help out at all.. now what I'm trying to find out, is why his PH is rising when mine is dropping, what exactly are we not doing alike, since we have this difference, since that would most likely be the ACTUAL solution to both our problem, not just some guesswork as it seems you think is a fuking solution .. GreatLife4All !!

 

[GreatLife4All]

My friend... you need to chill out a little.

You are correct that I did not read all posts... too much information.

I have also been screwed by calibration a lot... and you are getting very low readings that don't make sense.... likely a real issue for you.

But now that you have so eloquently pointed out to me what your REAL question is... let me see if I can help you.

And a warning... cuss me out one more time and you are on your own. I don't mind helping... but with incomplete information coupled with a bad attitude... it simply isn't worth my time.

A GUESS...

THere are three states with respect to nutrient solution. You can have either a perfect amount of nutrients, too many nutrients, or too few nutrients in the solution for the plants current needs (which change daily).

If you have too many nutrients, the plant will suck up water and leave some of the nutrients behind. Less water with the same nutrients means that the PPM increases... and the pH will drop. When this happens, add pH adjusted water - no additional nutes - until the pH stabilizes and starts to rise. The other alternative is to throw out your nute solution and start over with a balanced set of nutes at an appropriate EC level.

You have now found a new maximum nute level for this stage of growth - though it could be a single element such as phosphorus that is too high as well.

I still believe that your meter is off and that the reason you have too many nutes is due to bad calibration... pH Up and Down add phosphorus and potassium to the water. And adjusting from 4 back to a level around 6 takes A LOT of ph Up... and thus adds a lot of potassium into the water. If you are already running K hot - it is an issue and will result in EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE SEEING. So please calibrate your meter to eliminate this possibility.

 

[Rudealis]

I have spring water in my tap.
ph from tap can be enywhere from 4 to 8.. and ppm is 3-20

my ph dropping also.in early bloom now.. after adding nutes and balancing ph. in 12h it will drop from 6.5 to 5.2-4.8 and keep dropping if i dont bump it up.
ec remains about the same and i have signs of calcium defiencies.

I mix the ph up liquid with water before adding to res.

tryed to mix my ratios and low and high ec but no difference..

Meter calibrated right and about every week now... i check with the ph 7 and ph 4 solutions before calibrating and its usually spot on and couple times been 0.1 off. allways use clean cups and dicard exxes to keep the calibrating liquids pure.

 

[Rudealis]

F annoying to be addin around 8ml of ph up every morning and night.

Forgot to mention that i have a circulating system with 20L res.
And plants are in pipes that have low level of fast flowing water and roots look fine. Cant see or smell enything rotting and no slime enywhere..even the res feels clean after a week. Only other problem is that my water temp is maybe bit too high at 23c but i moved the res out of the tent so will see if it helps eny..

If i add ph up with 5l of water to the res same story in the morning when i just add the normal 0'5L with 8ml up.

Ghe mineral magic should have ph buffering properties but i see no difference with or with out it.

One plant in different container in a coco/soil mix looking fine and no signs of deficiency but i cant read her runoff cause of scrog...

 

[Rudealis]

Well i kept the battle going and did not change water in the res for 2 weeks while every morning and night i kept adding ph up.

Suddenly one morning the ph was 6.8 and it been stable since.
Only couple days later i noticed i had to add fresh water cause my plants started finally drinking and the ec was going up. added 4 liter of water with a ph of 6.5 and ph measured few hours later at a stable 6.8

been at 6.8 well over a week now and plants started to heal from the calcium defiencies.
Yesterday the ec had dropped under my margin and i added 3 liters of water with nutes @6.5ph and the solution in the res stabilized to 6.7 and the budding has started ok with the fattest ones now being about inch thick and almost 2"tall...

So i guess my water reached the limit of its capability to buffer down and finally stabilized .

Only problem remaining is what to do when i need to change and clean the res since i dont care to fiddle with the water for two week beforehand...

somewhere someone wrote that it might help to bump the ph up to 10 and instantly down to 4 and then to your desired ph to balance RO water so i'm going to try this when i need to change water since my small samples behave differently than in the real world..

 

[Bill284]

Well i kept the battle going and did not change water in the res for 2 weeks while every morning and night i kept adding ph up.

Suddenly one morning the ph was 6.8 and it been stable since.
Only couple days later i noticed i had to add fresh water cause my plants started finally drinking and the ec was going up. added 4 liter of water with a ph of 6.5 and ph measured few hours later at a stable 6.8

been at 6.8 well over a week now and plants started to heal from the calcium defiencies.
Yesterday the ec had dropped under my margin and i added 3 liters of water with nutes @6.5ph and the solution in the res stabilized to 6.7 and the budding has started ok with the fattest ones now being about inch thick and almost 2"tall...

So i guess my water reached the limit of its capability to buffer down and finally stabilized .

Only problem remaining is what to do when i need to change and clean the res since i dont care to fiddle with the water for two week beforehand...

somewhere someone wrote that it might help to bump the ph up to 10 and instantly down to 4 and then to your desired ph to balance RO water so i'm going to try this when i need to change water since my small samples behave differently than in the real world..

Hello @Rudealis hope you are well my friend. Welcome to 420magazine.
Your posting on a dead thread from 2013.
If you want a discussion with feed back start a post in frequently asked questions.
Happy growing.
Stay safe.
Bill

 

[Katooo]

sorry.. ARE YOU FUKING KIDDING ME ?
my calibration is off .1-.2 so in theory it could be closer to 7 but, where exactly do you see ANY FUKING SOLUTION, add ANY ANSWER to the basic Q, how come HIS is RISING, when MINE IS DROPPING !?! WHERE EXACTLY do you see ANYTHING about that !?!


besides that, CAL MAG; doesn't make your solution rise in PH as you would expect from and alkaline product.. and that didn't help, so if you as you don't, have a clue about the Whole debate, keep the fuk out of it..

I btw did already before actually reading this post try a CAL MAG: Botanicare - Hydro 101
and guess what, that didn't help out at all.. now what I'm trying to find out, is why his PH is rising when mine is dropping, what exactly are we not doing alike, since we have this difference, since that would most likely be the ACTUAL solution to both our problem, not just some guesswork as it seems you think is a fuking solution .. GreatLife4All !!

Yes mate just add 20% tap water to your ro. That still comes out at 0.0 EC and the water is now stable... Problem solved...