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Black Sabbath - Sweet Leaf

Brick Top

New Member
A little trivia about the beginning of the song is the repeated cough is Tony Iommi, Black Sabbath's guitarist, coughing after taking a big hit and it was caught on tape .... so it was used as the beginning of the song.




 

WeedLover80

New Member
I actually knew that. Do you know the song "Don't Start (Too Late)"? Do you know where the title for that song came from?
 

Brick Top

New Member
I actually knew that. Do you know the song "Don't Start (Too Late)"? Do you know where the title for that song came from?

No, I don't. What's it's origin?

But I'm sure if you know the origin to the song name I'm sure you know why, how and when Tony Iommi lost the tips of two fretting fingers on his right hand.
 

WeedLover80

New Member
No, I don't. What's it's origin?

But I'm sure if you know the origin to the song name I'm sure you know why, how and when Tony Iommi lost the tips of two fretting fingers on his right hand.
When they went to record the song, Tony wasn't ready. He said "Don't Start!.....ah, too late." They didn't have a song title at the time so they decided to call the song "Don't Start (Too Late)." I always thought that was kind of interesting.
 

Brick Top

New Member
When they went to record the song, Tony wasn't ready. He said "Don't Start!.....ah, too late." They didn't have a song title at the time so they decided to call the song "Don't Start (Too Late)." I always thought that was kind of interesting.

It's funny the way things like that happen. It's sort of similar to while filming the Beatles movie "A Hard Day's Night" and they didn't have a title yet and weren't close to having come up with one thought to be good and after a long night of shooting with many retakes when they ended and everyone was going home Ringo was asked how he was doing. Being like Yogi Berra and often saying things that were phrased oddly, that sounded like they didn't make much sense but still in a way did make sense, Ringo replied that it was a hard day's night, as in the night shoot was a lot of work, like a hard day of work, but at night. The director and producers liked the sound of it and the movie became "A Hard Day's Night."

Another funny one is the Bachman - Turner Ovrdrive song "Takin Care of Business" wasn't written to have a stutter in it when sung. Randy Bachman's brother had a stutter and for a joke when they all went to the recording studio to record the song Randy sang it the first time with the stutter. They all got a laugh, Randy then sang it as written, when both the joke version and the how it was intended to be sung version were both listened to they knew the one with the stutter added as a joke was better and it ended up being a big hit for BTO.

There's probably a number of songs whose titles came from something someone said or did, even as a joke, at the right time and right moment and it struck a cord with someone and was picked to be the title that up until them hadn't been thought up.
 

Brick Top

New Member
I spent a whole year studing tony's style. Its funny how that really sharpend my blues style.
Like so many other baands/groups before Black Sabbath was 'Black Sabbath' they were a blues - blues/rock band.

Look at Led Zeppelin for example. One of their biggest early hits was "When the Levee Breaks." It was written and first recorded by Kansas Joe McCoy and Memphis Minnie in 1929 about the great Mississippi River flood of 1927 when a large section of levee gave way and for months a long section of the river was 80 miles wide. Led Zeppelin started out playing blues and covered very old blues songs and ended up with hits.

Big Joe Williams recorded "Baby, Please Don't Go" in 1935 and it's one of the most covered songs ever. Not only did other blues artists cover it but many others like Bob Dylan, Paul Revere and the Raiders, The Amboy Dukes and later Ted Nugent covered it again with a different group. The Doors, AC/DC, John Mellencamp, Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, Before Van Morrison went on his own a group he was part of covered a slightly different version that was a John Lee Hooker version that he did under the name Texas Slim.

The blues gave birth to rock music. It was just sped up, altered slightly and made a whole lot louder and flashier and then over time evolved into a new genre. But those who relied on it for their beginnings and then helped it to evolve still retained a bit of the blues in their style. Later groups didn't, but those who had their roots in the blues never totally lost all of it.

Just being curious but do you string your guitar(s) like Tony using an .008” gauge for the top E like Jimmy Page, Brian May and Billy Gibbons all copied?

Have you tried what he does, for D# (root) tuning, his gauges are .008, .008, .011 (unwound), .018 .024, and .032. For C# tuning, he uses .009, .010, .012 (unwound), .020, .032 and .042?


Or do you do like Stevie Ray Vaughan did, Pete Townshend and Malcolm Young who all use (or used) .012″ or heavier?

Tony proved you don't need heavy strings for heavy sound.
 

Dusty Kiefers

Well-Known Member
I go S.R.V. Style tuned down1/2 step. Dont play much anymore, but my 7 year old starting to get into it and wanting to learn. She will listen to freedi king and led zeppin with me somtimes but loves fckn pop music.

Love me sum blues history keep it comming.
 

Brick Top

New Member
I go S.R.V. Style tuned down1/2 step. Dont play much anymore, but my 7 year old starting to get into it and wanting to learn. She will listen to freedi king and led zeppin with me somtimes but loves fckn pop music.

Love me sum blues history keep it comming.
Elvis Presley made a big splash on the Ed Sullivan Show singing "Hound Dog but but it was first performed by rhythm and blues singer Ellie Mae “Big Mama” Thornton.

Blind Willie McTell did "Statesboro Blues" in 1928 but mention the song and almost everyone will say it's an Allman Brother's song.

Blind Willie McTell - Statesboro Blues - YouTube

The Red Hot Chili Peppers covered Robert Johnson's "They're Red Hot" that was released in 1937. Robert Johnson is the bluseman the character "Tommy" in the movie "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" was based on. The story goes that Robert Johnson met the Devil at a crossroads out in the country at midnight one night and sold his soul to become a great bluesman.

The Doors "Back Door Man" is a Howlin Wolf song.

Foghat had a big hit with “I Just Want to Make Love to You” but it's a 1954 Muddy Waters sung, written by Willie Dixon song.

The Beatles were one of over 300 bands/groups that covered Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller’s “Kansas City,” which was written by the duo and recorded by Texas blues artist Little Willie Littlefield in 1952.

"Madison Blues" is a blues song by blues artist Elmore James, recorded in 1960. George Thorogood and the Destroyers also made a studio recording of it in 1977 and both Fleetwood Mac and Thorogood have recorded live versions of the song.

The list goes on and on and on.

In other cases it was some of the legends of blues that inspired later musicians that were never bluesmen to become musicians. Carlos Santana's father taught him how to read music and play the violin but when he first heard B.B. King Carlos knew he wanted to learn to play the guitar, and look where that led.

Without the blues rock and roll, once an African American slang term for having sex, would never have existed, or at least not at all in the way or form it did.
 

Brick Top

New Member
I go S.R.V. Style tuned down1/2 step. Dont play much anymore, but my 7 year old starting to get into it and wanting to learn. She will listen to freedi king and led zeppin with me somtimes but loves fckn pop music.

Love me sum blues history keep it comming.

If you want to see if you can get her more interested in the blues go to YouTube and watch Buddy Guy Live From Red Rocks 2013 FullHD 3D (Optional) .... it's over an hour long and not a 420 thing so I didn't post the link but Buggy puts on an amazing and exciting show and has Quinn Sullivan join him. Quinn could play the heck out of the blues when he was just 8-years old and he's 16 years old now, if I counted right, and maybe seeing someone younger playing the blues might get her more into them. You might want to start the YouTube watching with the video 8 year old guitar whiz Quinn Sullivan and Buddy Guy ... it's from 2007.

If you've never seen Quinn play, especially when only 8, you'll be amazed. With the excitement Buddy Guy adds seeing an 8 year old play the hell out of the blues might peak her interest in the blues some.
 

WeedLover80

New Member
I spent a whole year studing tony's style. Its funny how that really sharpend my blues style.
Yeah, all of those 70's rockers were heavily influenced by the blues. Tony's developed a much darker, deeper tone than others like Jimmy Page.
 

Brick Top

New Member
Yeah, all of those 70's rockers were heavily influenced by the blues. Tony's developed a much darker, deeper tone than others like Jimmy Page.

He is considered by many to be the father of heavy metal and he did it using ultra-light gauge strings. Conventional heavier gauge strings like Stevie Ray Vaughan, Pete Townshend and Malcolm Young used/use hurt the fingers he lost the tips of so he started using banjo strings for some strings and eventually convinced string makers to manufacture them for guitars. Jimmy Page, Brian May and Billy Gibbons all copied him and switched to the same ultra-light gauge strings. Part of his 'sound' came from the music written but also in part from his custom made pick-ups, the first two by John Birch and the third by John Diggins (Jay Dee).

J.T. Riboloff, formerly of Gibson, used a coil winding machine trying different numbers of turns and different gauges of wire. Different magnets were tried with each. Different milled pole pieces of different sizes were tried and about a half dozen different pickups were made for Tony to try. He made his pick but being handmade custom pickups they were difficult to duplicate so anyone who wanted ones like them were gambling on what they would end up with. In time a way was figured out to duplicate them accurately and Gibson began offering Tony Iommi Signature pickups. Another factor was the Floyd Rose vibrato Tony went with.

The combination of ultra-light gauge strings and other parts being custom made or unique or different than most others used, the guitar they were in, a Gibson SG, the music that was written and the skill of Tony and the result was something different and something special and something unique.
 
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