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Buds still loose and very leafy: help?

Stoned ape

Well-Known Member
I upgraded to Mars quantum boards because of heat issues. Had 600 watt hps in a 5x3 tent. 10inch exhaust fan. I am on my first run on the qs. My temps r under control now. And pretty happy with that investment. I think my plants are happier now.
 

Jelly Strains

New Member
@Rich Farmer thanks for that info.

the prob is, i tried increasing the MC and i started getting tip burn x.x so i had to back off and return to the usual amount.

i could use smaller pots, but what i don't get is...grow weed easy says "bigger pots = bigger plants". that's why i got 5g to begin with.

how are you feeding your plants 4 times a day?? o_O i only feed each plant 1 gallon every 2-3 days, when the coco is almost totally dry and the pot is light. don't you get root rot from the soil being wet all the time? don't your plants droop from overwatering?

i'm also concerned about getting fungus gnats. every place i've researched says "feed in coco only when the top inch of soil is dry and the pots are light, otherwise leave them alone."

@Alafornia Mom is doing just fine, thanks for asking :) but she still needs her meds. she tells me she isn't fussy, as long as it gets her stoned it's fine, but...i have this need to do things well and not half-ass them. i just feel like i could be doing better.

thanks for the answers guys.

<3 misty
hi guys, i've been away awhile. still growing mom's bud for her cancer treatment...been very, very busy though.

so i've managed to pull in some ok crops, but the buds are still kind of loose and they're very leafy. they just don't seem to fill out, dense up, thicken up, and become dense, tight nugs =/

quick rundown of the grow:

Red Poison Auto (Seedsman)
5g air pots
coco
315w CMH, 18" above canopy
daytime temp/humidity: about 72-76 and 45%, nighttime: about 62-65 and 45%
2 clip fans for circulation + 205 vent fan
Mega Crop, from about 1g per gallon to start, up to about 3.5g per gallon through chop
1g Bud Explosion per gallon seed to chop
hang dried in darkness, between 60-70f, about 45-50% humidity until stems snapped
3-4 weeks mason jar curing in 45-50% humidity

so, here are the buds right after i trimmed:

20200326_014717.jpg


here's a pic after about 5 days of hanging:

20200329_121528.jpg


here's one of the top buds after curing:

20200329_122555.jpg


20200329_122219.jpg


like...do you guys see how leafy the buds are? =/ they're also very light. they aren't dense and compact and hard...i'm wondering are there even ANY buds in there at all, or are these just all leaves?? the buds just don't want to thicken up, fatten up, and get dense. it's like they're all leaves in the colas or something.

they seem very rough and crumbly...they aren't sticky at all, and there's almost no aroma. there's a slight hint of skunk and citrus that was very strong during flower, but now it's like it all faded, and the bud feels dry and crumbly to the touch instead of sticky =(

i think this strain and my last one were derivatives of Northern Lights, which they say has very little odor...but the buds still aren't sticky. they're sticky as hell when i'm trimming (i need to scrape the shears multiple times), but then it's like it all goes away, poof, it's just gone after it's done drying.

i'm spending so much time and effort and $$ on this project...my mom needs her meds...please give me any suggestions so i can somehow grow buds more like this:

dense-nug-minecraft-sm.jpg


@Alafornia
@Barney86
@Mayne

guys please help me out here...this is my third completed grow and i'm following so many guides, but nothing seems to be working =(

thank you...

<3 misty
Hi,
It’s your lights. CMH are superb for grow but you really should consider switching over to hps for the last 4 weeks of flower.
I’d up your wattage too if you want hard nugs
 

RonT

Active Member
thanks, i appreciate the encouragement.

at this point i'm feeling like with my modest grow setup (one 315w light in a 3x5 tent), this is pretty much as good as it's gonna get. i use MC and do my best to keep the ph between 6.0-6.3, so probably without upgrading and adding more equipment this is about as good as it's gonna get.

there's also the strain thing, like you said. some strains are fluffier...some are tighter...some sparkle with crystals and are sticky, and others not so much.

i'd really like to grow compact, fuzzy buds that sparkle, but unless i'm doing something very wrong, i'm guessing a lot has to do with strains. i also grow autos, so i'm limited by the timeframe too...they're only gonna get so big and so good within 90 days.

thanks for the info.

if you have any suggestions about how i can get my bud to grow more like yours, i'd really love to hear them. there's always more to learn, and i'd like to do the best i can.

<3 misty
I’m not a professional but I think this could be some of you issues. I don’t think a 315CMH is very effective in a 3x5 area at 18”. I had the same results as you with 3x6 area. In a 3x3 area I get nice solid colas. 3x6 area I get fluffy colas. JMT
 

BIGJAYDIGGLER

Active Member
Not necessarily true about doctored photos n pgr....these are grown in soil, barely any nutes.





All about genetics, lighting and skill.
Those yours? Sweet. I'm starting new. You used no nutes? What do you mean by lighting?
 
Looks like you have the science down pat, just a little better watering schedule. Also would think about switching to soil which is a little more forgiving than coco when it comes to the amount of time needed to correctly tend to the plant. Have not grown autos yet but just got auto bubblegum seeds to try out, what’s your lighting schedule? From everything I’ve seen a 20/4 schedule is optimal.
 

multiVortex

Grow Journal of the Month: Mar 2020
Looks like you have the science down pat, just a little better watering schedule. Also would think about switching to soil which is a little more forgiving than coco when it comes to the amount of time needed to correctly tend to the plant. Have not grown autos yet but just got auto bubblegum seeds to try out, what’s your lighting schedule? From everything I’ve seen a 20/4 schedule is optimal.

Autos indoor with quality lighting, 18/6 is plenty.
 

Noone32

Member
I had the same issue as you. The only way I fixed it is was with many changes. I think the biggest was genetics. I won’t do autos as a main grow anymore because they are usually airy and commonly lack massive amounts of resin/tricomes. A slow dry (60-65% for 7-10 days) and good glass jar cure will tighten up the buds a great deal, I was amazed how good a big cardboard box keeps this range and I will not go back to drying in my tent with a humidifier going. High temperatures and very low humidity during flower was also an issue. I also suspected LED and CMH lighting may be an issue as well and switched to MH/HPS which gave me the best quality I have seen but CMH shouldn’t be an issue as long as the bulb is 3100K or below. I am still experimenting with growing mediums but am starting to believe that going back to the basics of when most of the genetics were selected for their best traits, using sea of green, seems to be getting me the best results. MH/HPS, potting soil/perlite mixture half and half, cheap and common fertilizer for veg and bloom(I’m trying 1/2 strength miracle grow but won’t know the results of it until this grow is over)
 
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AlohaHaze

Member
Aloha, had the same issue with my RDWC my adjustment was 18/6 lighting schedule and when drying, I used to hang and dry but found the herb net dryers to be best. The weight of the bud as it dries compacts them. As long as you turn them everyday as they dry they will condense and be firmer if that is what you’d like the end product to be. Once they were at what I believe was a good time to jar them up I’d place a 62 bovida pack in there to ensure it didn’t continue to get larfy. I now use it as my preferred method of drying. Haven’t had an issue since.
 

2Crispy

Active Member
I'm glad you started this thread, as this is a topic I want to learn about as well. Although this thread gets sidetracked on different topics, let me share what I know about preserving aroma and having the buds tighten into little green nuggets. I have done some some research, both reading and applying, and what I have found is;

1. Genetics. There are physical differences between sativas and indicas affecting their bud density. I believe sativas to be more fluffy. Autos have the ruderalis bred into them giving even more variation. Finding the right genetics is the key. In the case of aroma. I have no proof, but I feel like over the years breeders may have purposely attempted to limit the smell of the plant in order to have a stealthier grow and selected phenos that were less pungent. Maybe I'm wrong.

2. Light. Too low of an intensity is going to make the plant stretch as is grows to find more light, elongating the flowers as it grows.

3. Heat. Too much heat and the plant grows in a fashion to give it space to increase surface area for air flow to cool itself.

Considering factors 2 & 3 finding a way to deliver enough light intensity without causing excessive heat is paramount. Sativas can take more heat then indicas, but I try to keep my room no hotter than 78 degrees. LEDs are a great way to do this in the summer.

4. Airflow, don't overcrowd your grow space

5. Drying/Curing. Too much heat during this phase will burn off delicate terpines. I try not to let my room get above 72. This is mandatory for maximizing aroma. I used to trim wet, as soon as I cut the plant down. After doing some research i found techniques that have you dry the whole plant, for a few days, then trim the fan leaves, before breaking down into branches and drying some more. The sugar leaves start to crisp up a bit although the stem still bends. This is when I trim the buds and place into a paper bag. The branches can have that smell of musky hay from a barn but after trimming off the leaves it removes all that. I have found this technique to be helpful in preserving the scent. Also 62% has been the textbook answer for when to place into jars. I have found that to be too high. I take mine to 58%. Lastly, drying takes about 10 days, curing takes a minimum of 2 more weeks. Curing longer, up to 6 months helps the flowers to tighten up. I know its difficult to have to wait nearly half a year to get at your crop, but I believe it makes a difference. I have had jars of weed that I have forgotten about and have found, those are the tightest buds I have ever produced. This is where I am hung up on how the commercial grower turn around their products so quickly. There are many organic things that improve with age, wine, cheese, pickles etc.

Looking at your pictures i feel like the grow is good, the nutreints dont seem to be a problem and lower humidity levels in the lst few weeks of flower is helpful. Its the dry/cure part where you might see the best opportunity. Take some of your stash and hide it somewhere for 6 months and check your results.

I'm still learning with every crop too.
 

Jungleboy420

New Member
ok, i'll try watering every day for the rest of my current grow (Lowryder Auto). since it's still pretty small (less than 12"), i'll give it 3/4 of a gallon until it's bigger and drinking more.


about feeding 6g of MC per gallon...i got up to about 3.5g and beyond that, i was getting nute burn on the tips.

i'll usually scale it back to about 2.5g of MC because i'm adding 1g of Bud Explosion too. can someone shed light on this for me please? am i not feeding them enough? o_O

<3 misty
Sounds to me like it could be bad genetics.. Some seed companies don’t really care what they’re giving you they just want to make the $$. Do your research and find a company that has good reviews on their genetics and I would stay away from auto flowers they can be finicky. you should be able to pull about a pound off that light. Whenever I get a batch of seeds I will start them all. I will take three or four cuts off each one label them in flower the seed plants. Then I pick the ones that I like the best and take as many cuttings as I can using the F1 cuts that I took. you can have everything rooted and ready to go by the time your first grow is done . I’ve seen up to 18 ounces off one Sunsystem 315 lec.! I’m not sure how big the spaces but let’s say you can fit 9 15 gallon pots (I use pro mix HP, ammended.) You could put three plants in and wait two or three weeks and put another three in with another 23 weeks and put another three and you’ll be able to continue perpetual harvest being able to process three plants at a time is very convenient if you are short on time you also have a constant supply of herb!
Good luck to you let us know how you do
 

Jungleboy420

New Member
Sounds to me like it could be bad genetics.. Some seed companies don’t really care what they’re giving you they just want to make the $$. Do your research and find a company that has good reviews on their genetics and I would stay away from auto flowers they can be finicky. you should be able to pull about a pound off that light. Whenever I get a batch of seeds I will start them all. I will take three or four cuts off each one label them in flower the seed plants. Then I pick the ones that I like the best and take as many cuttings as I can using the F1 cuts that I took. you can have everything rooted and ready to go by the time your first grow is done . I’ve seen up to 18 ounces off one Sunsystem 315 lec.! I’m not sure how big the spaces but let’s say you can fit 9 15 gallon pots (I use pro mix HP, ammended.) You could put three plants in and wait two or three weeks and put another three in with another 23 weeks and put another three and you’ll be able to continue perpetual harvest being able to process three plants at a time is very convenient if you are short on time you also have a constant supply of herb!
Good luck to you let us know how you do
I get a bail of pro mix one cubic foot of worm castings make sure you get a mineral mix do you have your micro nutrients covered and then I use Growth science organics line at half strength all the way through flowering and I will occasionally top dress with a bloom mix
A1B23FC5-2AC3-4F23-B8E9-8916067D259B.jpeg
 

Jungleboy420

New Member
And if you just change one thing at a time you’ll be able to see when your results improve, revealing where you were going wrong! Good luck!
 
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