Down Under growing

[JengaBoss]

I'm a little confused, is this a re-veg?

If you harvested nugs of this same plant and then put it back under 18 hours of light to send it back into vegging then your slow growth would be exactly this. It is having to change where it allocates its energy to the plant. If re-vegging is what you have done, I would be on the look out for pollen sacks as you can stress the plant enough to turn the plant into a herm.

 

[Pommie]

Yes, a re-veg. Maybe I should turn my attention to one of the cuttings that are looking good.

How can I tell what a pollen sack looks like?

 

[Amy Gardner]

Hi JengaBoss and welcome to 420 Mag

I’ll add to the recommendations for soil growers to converse with about NoTill and living organic soil there are also @conradino23 , @bobrown14 , @UrbanAchiever , @LaquerHead and @Van Stank and others I can’t think of at this time. Plus, there is this thread

Building A Better Soil: Demonstrations & Discussions Of Organic Soil Recipes

We have a growing school of organic cannabis farmers on 420 Magazine and we figured it might be time to begin consolidating the recipes we have used to build the soil that grows our respective plants. The recipes follow different paths to the same ends - growing the best cannabis we can using...

www.420magazine.com

where lots of discussion of recipes etc. has and is taking place. I used all of those as resources when doing it myself (I couldn’t keep it up because of health problems and now I grow mostly using Doc Bud’s High Brix Blend - a living organic soil system of pre-prepared dry amendments, drenches and foliars). That thread will hopefully lead you on to others resources as well.

I’m in Aus too, on the NSW coast quite a bit further south than you up there in Sunny Queensland.

 

[Tony Urban]

Yes, a re-veg. Maybe I should turn my attention to one of the cuttings that are looking good.

How can I tell what a pollen sack looks like?

Pollen sacks look like bananas or bunches of bananas.

 

[Ganjier]

Welcome aboard Jinga. I'm also a newbie here at 420mag but have been growing organically since the 80's. For indoors I use an all organic soil base with about 30% coco coir added. I'm not into the indoor no till methods but I do recycle my soil by continual replenishment using compost, cover crops during fallow periods, worm castings, and added organic soil amendments as needed. My current soil base has been used in continual rotation for about 5 years now so after recovering from the upfront cost of building my base mix it's been relatively cheap to maintain since. Feel free to hit me up with any questions if you're interested in adopting this type of indoor method.

 

[Ganjier]

I haven't created a journal just yet, and not sure that I will in the future either, but here's a recent pic of the ladies that are indoors at the moment growing in the 5 year old organic mix that I mentioned.

In no way am I trying to show off as there are others here that likely have much better looking plants. I just want to demonstrate to you that you can pull consistent and repeatable indoor flower harvest of the highest quality using 100% organic methods at minimal cost when compared to some other methods. Wishing you the best of luck whichever method you decide to move forward with.

 

[JengaBoss]

Welcome JengaBoss, Not sure if no till is the same as Living Organic Soil but that's my recent medium. Got the recipe from a book by The Rev called True Living Organics. so far so good,

Just found a sample of that book on my Kindle. The TLO soil that The Rev mentions seems to be the same principle as notill, being solely focused on balanced life of living organism to work symbiotic with the plants. But from my interpretation of the short sample that I read that the main difference of TLO and NTG (notill) is that the TLO soil is recycled and rebuilt between harvest and also the use of teas and NTG you do not disturb the soil and use a cover crop, no teas are used, instead you top dress with Malted Barley Powder, Neem Cake and or Kelp meal, and keep the soil heavily mulched. (please correct me if I am wrong, again this was just a sample read on the Kindle). But seems the basics of the TLO and the NTG are on the same path, to feed the microbes and bugs and in turn they feed your plants

BTW I have ordered the second edition of that book (its not available in 2nd edition on Kindle) to have more of a read and understanding

My main concern with the NTG is that I want to do short veg cycles (1-2 weeks tops) and not sure if the plant will grasp any benefit from this organic soil style in such a short time frame.

 

[JengaBoss]

Hi JengaBoss and welcome to 420 Mag

I’ll add to the recommendations for soil growers to converse with about NoTill and living organic soil there are also @conradino23 , @bobrown14 , @UrbanAchiever , @LaquerHead and @Van Stank and others I can’t think of at this time. Plus, there is this thread

Building A Better Soil: Demonstrations & Discussions Of Organic Soil Recipes

We have a growing school of organic cannabis farmers on 420 Magazine and we figured it might be time to begin consolidating the recipes we have used to build the soil that grows our respective plants. The recipes follow different paths to the same ends - growing the best cannabis we can using...

www.420magazine.com

where lots of discussion of recipes etc. has and is taking place. I used all of those as resources when doing it myself (I couldn’t keep it up because of health problems and now I grow mostly using Doc Bud’s High Brix Blend - a living organic soil system of pre-prepared dry amendments, drenches and foliars). That thread will hopefully lead you on to others resources as well.

I’m in Aus too, on the NSW coast quite a bit further south than you up there in Sunny Queensland.

LOL actually I am further south than you, I am down on the SE burbs of Melbourne. I do appreciate the connections to NTG both users and the thread alike

 

[Amy Gardner]

Oh OK! Why did I think you’d said southern QLD I wonder Never mind. I think you nailed the difference btw NoTill and the Rev’s style quite well.

ANd you may be right about the short veg thing. But people grow sucessfully with 12/12 lighting from seed so what you’d be doing is somewhat similar, but with longer lighting in early veg. If you flip the lighting at 2weeks, the plants will still veg for a while because they won’t go into flower until they reach sexual maturity which is usually about 4-6 weeks I think. It’s noticeable by the transition to alternating nodes, instead of opposing ones.

 

[StoneOtter]

Just found a sample of that book on my Kindle. The TLO soil that The Rev mentions seems to be the same principle as notill, being solely focused on balanced life of living organism to work symbiotic with the plants. But from my interpretation of the short sample that I read that the main difference of TLO and NTG (notill) is that the TLO soil is recycled and rebuilt between harvest and also the use of teas and NTG you do not disturb the soil and use a cover crop, no teas are used, instead you top dress with Malted Barley Powder, Neem Cake and or Kelp meal, and keep the soil heavily mulched. (please correct me if I am wrong, again this was just a sample read on the Kindle). But seems the basics of the TLO and the NTG are on the same path, to feed the microbes and bugs and in turn they feed your plants

BTW I have ordered the second edition of that book (its not available in 2nd edition on Kindle) to have more of a read and understanding

My main concern with the NTG is that I want to do short veg cycles (1-2 weeks tops) and not sure if the plant will grasp any benefit from this organic soil style in such a short time frame.

Yes you described TLO as I see it. Thanks for the NTG description. They do both sound like they get to the same place with a little difference. I have the 2nd edition. Either way will get a good organic grow on in my opinion. Maybe pick the most pleasant one to you.

 

[Ganjier]

No till container gardening has it's roots in the no till large scale agricultural farming methods that have been gaining traction of the past 20 years or so. In medium to larger scale agricultural applications the two main benefits when converting from conventional tillage to no till are reduced soil erosion which equates to reduced mineral and fertilizer runoff and reduced fuel cost. No till has other benefits such as reduced soil compaction and improved moisture retention along with minimal soil microbe disturbance. However, reduced soil erosion and reduced fuel requirements are the big 2 that typically would convince a farmer to make the swap. With crops where no till is feasible to pull off, the reduced soil erosion and runoff coupled with reduced fuel cost can result in huge cost savings while maintaining a similar overall yield. For a farmer this could mean the difference between making a profit at the end of the year or working hard all year only to end up in the red having to borrow money to sow next years crop.
Neither of the big 2 benefits mentioned above really apply to growing indoor cannabis in containers. It's my understanding that the main perceived benefit to indoor container no till is the minimal disruption of the soil microbes. In my opinion, container no till seems like a cool experiment to play around with but doesn't bring many benefits to the table and doesn't seem to be very practical when compared to the more traditional TLO type method of organic gardening. Keep in mind that TLO is just a new name that's been attached to the way mankind has always farmed up until the 1950's when synthetic fertilizers were first introduced.
I'm not saying that one method is better than the other. Just trying to help to shed some light on the differences between the two methods.

 

[StoneOtter]

No till container gardening has it's roots in the no till large scale agricultural farming methods that have been gaining traction of the past 20 years or so. In medium to larger scale agricultural applications the two main benefits when converting from conventional tillage to no till are reduced soil erosion which equates to reduced mineral and fertilizer runoff and reduced fuel cost. No till has other benefits such as reduced soil compaction and improved moisture retention along with minimal soil microbe disturbance. However, reduced soil erosion and reduced fuel requirements are the big 2 that typically would convince a farmer to make the swap. With crops where no till is feasible to pull off, the reduced soil erosion and runoff coupled with reduced fuel cost can result in huge cost savings while maintaining a similar overall yield. For a farmer this could mean the difference between making a profit at the end of the year or working hard all year only to end up in the red having to borrow money to sow next years crop.
Neither of the big 2 benefits mentioned above really apply to growing indoor cannabis in containers. It's my understanding that the main perceived benefit to indoor container no till is the minimal disruption of the soil microbes. In my opinion, container no till seems like a cool experiment to play around with but doesn't bring many benefits to the table and doesn't seem to be very practical when compared to the more traditional TLO type method of organic gardening. Keep in mind that TLO is just a new name that's been attached to the way mankind has always farmed up until the 1950's when synthetic fertilizers were first introduced.
I'm not saying that one method is better than the other. Just trying to help to shed some light on the differences between the two methods.

I've heard the condensed version of this. It is a curious thing. Oh well another good method to consider one day.

 

[JengaBoss]

No till container gardening has it's roots in the no till large scale agricultural farming methods that have been gaining traction of the past 20 years or so. In medium to larger scale agricultural applications the two main benefits when converting from conventional tillage to no till are reduced soil erosion which equates to reduced mineral and fertilizer runoff and reduced fuel cost. No till has other benefits such as reduced soil compaction and improved moisture retention along with minimal soil microbe disturbance. However, reduced soil erosion and reduced fuel requirements are the big 2 that typically would convince a farmer to make the swap. With crops where no till is feasible to pull off, the reduced soil erosion and runoff coupled with reduced fuel cost can result in huge cost savings while maintaining a similar overall yield. For a farmer this could mean the difference between making a profit at the end of the year or working hard all year only to end up in the red having to borrow money to sow next years crop.
Neither of the big 2 benefits mentioned above really apply to growing indoor cannabis in containers. It's my understanding that the main perceived benefit to indoor container no till is the minimal disruption of the soil microbes. In my opinion, container no till seems like a cool experiment to play around with but doesn't bring many benefits to the table and doesn't seem to be very practical when compared to the more traditional TLO type method of organic gardening. Keep in mind that TLO is just a new name that's been attached to the way mankind has always farmed up until the 1950's when synthetic fertilizers were first introduced.
I'm not saying that one method is better than the other. Just trying to help to shed some light on the differences between the two methods.

Thanks for that bit of info Ganj. Even though I was aware that NTG was used in large scale applications, I never really looked at the broad scope as to why, with except the part that cross flows into indoor smaller scale NTG and that is the lack of disturbance of the microbes. Reading more into it, it just made sense, little living creatures have a nicely created home/environment and then one goes and takes a fork or trowel thru the soil and breaks it up. When I read that, I instantly had a vision on my head of a million angry ants after you kick an ant mound, and the amount of time and energy that it takes for the ants to rebuild their home/environment.

 

[Ganjier]

Your analogy of kicking an ant mound and the time and effort that it takes for them to reestablish their mound is spot on.