Dual Arch MH / HPS for bloom?

[Papageno]

I just upgraded to a 1000W hood and ballast. I got it from one of our sponsors here.
Grow Light Clearance Kit - Grow Light Kits | Gro-Kart.com

The package comes with an HPS but it can take dual arch MH / HPS bulbs as well.
Full spectrum light bulbs| full spectrum lighting and light | Gro-Kart.com

I have only used HPS to bloom. So I am wondering if a dual arch is better for bloom as I suspect it has lower total lumens but much better spectrum.

Thanks

 

[MrBelvedere]

After one year you should replace your existing bulb, at that time you can upgrade. Make sense? hope it helps.

 

[Papageno]

yes...but that much I knew already. What I don't know is if it is an upgrade or not. I suppose you are saying it is better so maybe hidden in there is an answer.

 

[Fuzzy Duck]

Lumens has nothing to do with growing as it is a measurement of light to the human eye only & that mainly being the yellow & green spectrum... plants really don't use that much of the spectrum of light !

Most hps,mh dual arc are measured with lumen & that spectrum but i would more than likely look at kelvin measurement which suggest the peak of the colour spectrum the bulb puts out...


Dual arc put out slightly more blue spectrum than compared to hps which has very little etc... i'm not going to go in to mh as they are old school in my own opinion, when ya can do just as well with lower wattage cfl/T5/8 tubes of 6400k at a lower cost in electric & suitable results !



Dual arc bulbs are a more modern thinking & that plants will benefit with a little bit of the extra blue spectrum whilst in flowering, ye what is the plant doing in flowering ?

Ye growing bud...


Dual arc vs hps - hard to say, i've not seen to many side by side grows... ye i seen grow journals & growers use em, i've used em both... but yield wise i don't think their is much between em to be honest ?


A part from dual arc used in veg which has a less pronounced problem when compared to hps used for such... kind of makes dual arc one bulb for all... veg 'n' flowering !

 

[MrBelvedere]

A part from dual arc used in veg which has a less pronounced problem when compared to hps used for such... kind of makes dual arc one bulb for all... veg 'n' flowering !

This is good info. The dual arch would only be considered a "minor upgrade" in bloom. Ideally for veg you should use only a light with "blue spectrum" that is good for vegetative stage like a T5 fluorescent bulb. Those are perfect and your plants will not stretch. If you use a HPS in vegetative stage the red spectrum will make the plant stretch alot. During veg you want your plant to have only "blue" spectrum provided by a pure metal halide bulb, or a t5, or a led with blue spectrum. Hope that is clear. Make sense bro?

 

[Papageno]

So thanks for that. I was thinking that. I know lumens are not full spectrum measurement but it is a basic stake in the Ground. I really was using the terminology to make a point. 1000W spread out over 2 bulbs is 2 smaller bulbs. Who knows the exact break down but lets say it is 2 500W bulbs. Is that going to run cooler, dimmer...? Can I / should I lower it closer to the canopy? Will it get as good of penetration and square foot coverage? How much better or worse is Dual arch at 1000W than for example having two on a light mover (500W HPS, 500W MH)?

I don't mind at all switching out the bulb. I think for sure it makes sens for Veg. I was wondering more for bloom. I used to grow a lot but had to quit about 10 years ago when I moved. Till then I always used HPS for everything and I have had no problems at all vegging in HPS. I only did that because it was simpler and cheaper to have one light, ballast, hood and I have always just done it for myself. Now that I have a combo setup that can do both I was thinking for sure about getting Dual Arch for Veg but in bloom should I pull it and go back to just HPS?

I am setting up a new room and I suppose I can't do side my side but I could do back to back runs and try it out.

I wonder if it is even more complicated... like running dual arch through stretch +2 weeks and then running HPS to the end is the best. Man I need like 10 grow rooms to do this experiment.

 

[MrBelvedere]

If you have two HID fixtures, the ideal setup is to use pure metal halide in veg. Then in bloom use the dual arch. The dual arch bulb in bloom will keep your plants short and compact when you flip to 12/12. When you flip to 12/12 the plant grows like crazy for the first two weeks, this is where the dual arch will keep your plant tight and squat as possible. I thought you were on a limited budget, sounds like you have good budget to set it up perfectly Good discussion guys!

 

[Papageno]

Well I am on a budget but I like to understand things.

So I just got back from the hydro store and asked them about it while I was there for something totally else. First off the Dual arch are 600W HPS and 400W MH. After hearing that I seem to recall that from somewhere. They suggested for bloom use the 1000W HPS. I think for stretch it probably makes sense to wait until that is done to switch the bulb.

Unfortunately after showing them the setup I got from the 420mag sponsor they told me that I should just stick with my 400W HPS. The bulb included is substandard and will cause a 30% reduced yield and through the glass even worse. They also said the ballast is going to be problematic. Well no wonder it was so cheap. At least I have a backup.

 

[Alienpus]

Really, stick with the 400W, that's what they said? Wow, the bulb you have puts out 120000 lumens post 100 hours, my hortilux put 140000 initial so about the same after 100 hours. The spectrum is not as good but still 30% less I'm not so sure. Everybody who has an air cooled hood will loose a small fraction due to the glass why would yours be any worse. Of course if you compare a top of the line 120$ bulb to yours there will be a difference it's not a fair comparison, a Ferrari goes faster than a toyota it doesn't mean you got screwd for buying a toyota. And to top it off your ballast will be problematic, so the hydro store guy sold enough of the grow-kart kits and customers returned them enough for them to be considered problematic. You might not have the best quality out there but I call bullshit on your hydro guy.

 

[Papageno]

Thanks!!! I know he wanted to sell me some bulbs but I wanted to mention it. I am a tinkerer and I like to build up slowly. I might even put both of my lights in there just because I can. I will burn down the cheap one that comes with it and then see about a Hortilux. I mean I got a 1000W setup for 200 bones. As long as I get 3 good runs out of it I wont care if the ballast goes tits up. I will probably end up putting a fan on the ballast and that probably extends the life like 90%.

I am really excited. I used to grow for like 10 years back in the 90's and early 2000's. I stopped around 2004 as I moved states and never had a chance to really get started again. I always went real small in a cabinet. We just passed a law in Oregon where I live that allows me to grow 4 plants for personal use no license or nothing. So I am cleaning out my garage. I have a 5x5 Gorilla tent on order and I am going to make a make a 5x5 SCROG in that suka. 400W always worked good enough for a small cabinet but for 5x5 I really feel like I need to go big. I was looking for a 600 but when I found that 1000 for $200 I just had to take it.

 

[dlowks]

I just upgraded to a 1000W hood and ballast. I got it from one of our sponsors here.
Grow Light Clearance Kit - Grow Light Kits | Gro-Kart.com

The package comes with an HPS but it can take dual arch MH / HPS bulbs as well.
Full spectrum light bulbs| full spectrum lighting and light | Gro-Kart.com

I have only used HPS to bloom. So I am wondering if a dual arch is better for bloom as I suspect it has lower total lumens but much better spectrum.

Thanks

Hey about gro kart are their products good quality and reliable im wanting to buy one of their kits but ive havent found any reviews about their products... are they good?