Hardgraf's Black Sugar CFL Grow

[Hardgraf]

Hi everyone. This is my first grow so go easy!

I germinated 2 Black Sugar feminised seeds 2 weeks ago. They now appear healthy and are vegging. This is the strain description...

A stable multi hybrid of short squat indica's and short sativa's.

Here is a very easy, incredibly short strain famous for it's taste and effect. And the strange part is that it looks like an indica; short and squat like a NL, reaching a height of 40 - 50cm, but has lots of sativa smell and flavour. A licourice, flowery, fresh smell with a distant little earthy afghan undertone.
Basically, she grows like an indica, but has the characteristics of a sativa.

Why Black Sugar? With temperatures on the low side, flowers turn dark purple-ish/blue-ish and when dried black-ish/purple-ish covered in resin "sugar".

I haven't managed to find any previous grows of this strain so results should be interesting.

Soil: Westland Indoor Plant Potting compost. Ph 6.
Pots: 2l
Vegetation Lighting: 125W CFL bulb (6500k)
Flowering Lighting: 125W CFL bulb (6500k), 4 20W CFL bulbs (2700k)
Air Movement: 6" oscillating fan
Ventilation: None. 4" In-Line fan with Carbon filter on its way.
Nutrients: Currently None.

Proper ventilation should sort out the temperature in our grow area which now is consistently above 80. We are having a heat wave here in the UK and the room temp is currently 80 so the heat from the CFL is just making things worse. I aim to install the fan and carbon filter asap.

Also I'm aware that soon I will have to position the bulb horizontally in order to ensure that the plants take advantage of maximum light output.

 

[Hardgraf]

Just to add. Lighting is on 24hrs for vegging...

 

[donpaul.p]

hi mate, great start to your journal, its good to see another uk grower on here, not many of us but their are a couple i have bumped into.

can i just pick you up on a couple of things, the grow room walls been white is a good idea, not gloss though but think yours are just white emulsion, tin foil is no good at reflecting light so dont use it, it absorbs light and paint any walls white,

what i did was go to the rainforest sounding site and ordered a pack of 5 rescue mylar blankets, these cost next to nothing and i lined the walls with these as they reflect more light then paint, and tin foil only reflects heat and causes hot spots where as mylar dont do this.

i started with cfls and just used a load of 23 and 30 watt 6500k cfls for veg and get very little stretch from the plants, but the cfl your using is just a bigger size than the ones i was using, these types of cfl give off more light along the side of the bulb, so if you got the bulb horizontal instead of vertical you would get loads more light on the plants and it would spread out better, the end of the bulb is very poor at putting out light, so get the bulb running length ways and that will easily double if not triple the amount of light the plants are getting, when you get the bulb running above the plants side ways make a reflector, this is to stop the light shining upwards the reflector will keep all the light from the bulb bouncing back down into the grow space, the more light you can reflect back into the grow space the more the plants will grow.

i used a load of tin trays from the pound shop, not the best at reflecting but it worked as it was close to the bulb and it made a huge difference, after doing it i had no light going above the bulb so above the bulb was pretty dark, so this shows us that the plant is getting all the light it can, id say now your losing about 75% of the actual light your creating, so run the bulb sideways and make a reflector above it, as close to the bulb as you can and reflect the light back to the plants, i used cardboard also covered in mylar and made a sort of hood that went over the bulb and it hung down either side of the plant pots, so it was reflecting the light downwards but also inwards towards the light as the hood came right down to the pots so this stopped all light escaping.

i also noticed you have a fan in the picture, the worse thing you can do at this stage is have the fan blowing on the plants, this will dry the leaves out and stunt growth and could kill the plants, its best if you can get the fan blowing above the plants so it moves the hot air without it blowing directly on the plants, this will make them grow at their best.

im not sure where your growing but i switched from cfls to hps for flower and im getting higher temps with the 400watt dual spectrum high pressure sodium light but i leave my grow door open to let the air escape, i have a fan blowing every now and again but my plants are well into flower so can cope with the fan i have blowing about 4ft away from the plants, plus it rotates so its not constantly blowing on the plants.

you will get a good grow with cfls, the plants seem to love them, you got a few things to sort out to get the best out of the plants but ill give you all the advice i can give and help you the best i can.

so here is a quick list of things i would say could be improved on and will increase the health and growth of the plant.
1, make sure all 4 walls are white flat paint or order some mylar rescue blankets, i got 5 blankets for less than £3, and it done me 3 grow rooms and i gave 1 blanket away and got 1 left un used so you will only need 1 blanket.
2. change the way the light hangs get it so its running sideways and not hanging, the side of the cfl gives off the most light, this is unless you get one of those parabolic reflectors or make one, but cfls lose light very quick the further away from the bulb, you can check this by holding you hand just under the bulb then move it away, after about 2 inches the light drops off loads, so get the light as close as you can, this will prevent any stretch but i found i got little stretch anyway.
3 make sure the fan is not blowing directly on the plants at this stage it causes the leaves to evap to quick and dry out, a gentle breeze is ok so if the plants are barely moving when the fan is on then this is ok, or have the fan blowing above the plants.
4, you need to start thinking about nutrients, you will need one for the veg cycle and one for the flower cycle, i was very lucky and got donated some bpn goodness and my plants are all the better for it.

great start to your journal though, we all love plenty of pictures,

when your plant starts to look light green then this is time to feed nutrients, so unless you go to hydro store and buy something for these plants then the best thing to do is go garden center and get a 2 stage feed, one for veg and one for flower, make sure its for edible plants like tomato and not for rosies,

ill tell you more about the NPK content off the nutes as you get further into the grow.

the lighting schedule your using is ok, a lot of growers say 24-0 gives you the most growth, but when a test was done it was found that 18-6 produces the best and most root mass, and since its the roots that produce the most from these plants and take up the nutrients then i found that something inbetween was better so i use 20-4 for my veg, i tried the glr toutine and 12-12 from seed and 20-4 and found thte 20-4 gave the most growth, i never tested 24-0 in that test but have used 24-0 and i wasnt to impressed with it after a while so switched back to 20-4.

theirs loads of top growers on here who im sure will be a long as soon as they see your keeping your journal up to date.

welcome to 420 and great to see another uk grower in here, we are few and far between but, we all help each other the best was can

for seeds go to herbies head shop, then scroll down right hand side of the page and click on pick and mix, then on the left hand side choose less than £20, then look through the list, seeds start from £1.24 each and £3 for postage and even if you only buy 1 seed you get 3 free, if you buy the special kush for instance just 1 seed, i think their £1.50 and pay the £3 postage then herbies sends you 2x big bud#2 seeds and 1x any other seed, the any other seed is always either an auto fem or a femenised seed, these will be female for sure and for free is a bonus, as your in the uk delivery is the very next day, i have use them for months now and buy 1 seed at a time just to get the 3 seeds for free, so i have been buying autos for £3 and getting £15 worth of free seeds, so pop along to herbies if you want cheap seeds,

give us a shout back if you want to ask anything, feel free to come across and have a look at my journal, i used cfls right up till a few weeks in flower but i was using nearly 400watts so it made sense to switch to hps, now ive got some very nice looking buds.

i also got an outdoor grow going and its well out the way, been in ground 3 days now and i checked on them today and their doing well so hoping for some good outdoor plants by the end of sept, thats if the weather stays like it is.

sorry for the long post just wanted to give you the best advice i could and give you the best start possible, good luck with the grow, any questions ask them here or clink on my journal below this post and ask it their as i have many growers who help and advise me, so im sure they wont mind answering any questions you may have

 

[Mr Mud-Pie]

The only thing i can say really is that the CFL's light comes from the side of it so if u can make it so its verticle u would get a shit ton more lumens and ur plants would love it u check vote in the Contests! since u seam new im subed +reps

 

[donpaul.p]

had the light covered mud pie, i all ready gone through all the things i done wrong from the start, its good that i can now pass on what i learned from everyone on here, you included,

 

[Hardgraf]

Thanks for all the help and interest. I have some Mylar sheeting and a light reflector on the way so the CFL will soon be horizontal.

Soon, I'll have the exhaust installed too which will get the temperature under control.

 

[donpaul.p]

sounds like you got everything covered then, im sure you will see a huge difference when the light is the other way and the mylar is up, the exhaust fan will keep the temps in check as well, anything around 78f is perfect for the plants, mine have grown at slightly lower in evg and slightly higher in flower, but they still seem to be healthy, but 78 im told is the best range for the plants to take in what they need from the air and the growing medium and nutes, ph is a big part as well, but i dont have a ph tester myself to check the run off, i should have one and im trying to find one i can use, but my plants are doing ok without one, but if i had a problem it would be harder to tell what the problem is without checking the run off from the pots with a ph tester,

 

[Hardgraf]

Quick update

Been away for a few days. The plants are doing great!

Got the CFL bulb horizontal now in the reflector with the bulb positioned about 3" from the canopy.

I've also installed a digital thermometer and hygrometer which reads...

Average Temp: 80
Humidity: 57%

 

[donpaul.p]

the temps looks good, anything around 78 is perfect, the only thing i would say is that see how much height the plants get, mine didnt get much height with cfls but i was using a lot of smaller cfls so just see how things go, some people have no problems with height issues but mine didnt want to gain any height at all and chose to just bush out instead, mine might not of been a light issue, it could of been compost etc etc so just see how things go, but by the sounds of it you got it all dialed in nicely

 

[Hardgraf]

Here we go...

Mylar will go up when I have some time.

So the temp at the top of the grow room is 78. At the plant canopy it's 91! Is this a problem? The plants seem to be doing fine and there is a lot of air circulating.

]

 

[donpaul.p]

its a bit on the high side mate, the lighting set up looks great though, nice reflector, same one i use for my hps, the temps a bit on the high side at plant level, you should notice the leaves pointing up at the edges showing us that its suffering from heat stress, it will stunt growth, if the very edge of each leaf blade is curling upwards then the plant is trying to lose heat and this will cause it to lose water and damage the leaves, possibly raise the light about an inch or hang a temp gauge at plant level and have a fan gently blowing across the plants so its bringing cool air in and taking the hot air out, as long as the fan is only gently blowing on the plants it will be ok, you dont want a strong wind on them as this will case water to leave the leaf to quick, but a gentle breeze is ok and would strengthen the stem

 

[Hardgraf]

its a bit on the high side mate, the lighting set up looks great though, nice reflector, same one i use for my hps, the temps a bit on the high side at plant level, you should notice the leaves pointing up at the edges showing us that its suffering from heat stress, it will stunt growth, if the very edge of each leaf blade is curling upwards then the plant is trying to lose heat and this will cause it to lose water and damage the leaves, possibly raise the light about an inch or hang a temp gauge at plant level and have a fan gently blowing across the plants so its bringing cool air in and taking the hot air out, as long as the fan is only gently blowing on the plants it will be ok, you dont want a strong wind on them as this will case water to leave the leaf to quick, but a gentle breeze is ok and would strengthen the stem

Hi, thanks I will raise the light a little. The temp gauge is literally right under the middle of the bulb and it's a pretty big bulb hence the high temp.

Got my nutrients sorted yesterday, organic tomatoe plant food made here on a city farm. It suggests diluting 1/10 so I'll probably use 1/20 and take it easy. No need to feed yet anyway as the soil is packed with nutrients ample for the first 4 weeks or so.

 

[donpaul.p]

just keep a good eye on the temps, i mean low 80's wont harm the plant, mine had even hit the 90s a few times and my plants didnt show signs of stress but that was not on a daily basis, it all depends on the weather outside, and now its shittiy and rainy so temps are down and my doors closed, ill possibly be harvesting one of my plants later, just need to check the trichs with microscope to see if their just ripe enough to harvest,

with nutes, id start at 1/4 strength, these plants are classed as weeds so dont need strong nutes, im using something that has been designed for these plants so i can use it at full strength but when i was using baby bio i started at quater strength then upped it till i was at nearly full strength, the leaves will tell you if its to much as they will get yellow patches, but we can sort that out at the time.

your plants will also tell you when to add their first feed, when you see the top part of the plant look a lighter shade of green than the rest then this is a sign its lacking the N part of the NPK nutrient rating, so thats when to start adding.

now as your using something not designed for plants you would be better off with 2 different feeds, in veg you need something higher in N from the NPK range and in flower you need something lower in N and higher in P, so if you could get some nutes arranged like that then you should be ok, basically you want a nute for growth and veg stage and you will need one for the flower stage, just make sure the nutes are for edible plants to be on the safe side and not for normal plants that are not eaten as they could make it taste nasty and un-smokable been the worse case, tomato based nutes is what people use and you have picked up on that, so check the NPK rating on it and post it on here and we can have a look and let you know what stage its best for and what you should be aiming for when you choose your flower nute

 

[Hardgraf]

Great, thanks for the info

So, 1st mistake made, got to the garden yesterday afternoon and one of the plants was showing signs of heat stress. Some yellowing of the leaves. The temp under the lamp at stem level was 92!

I've now moved the light a good 5" above the plants. The temp at soil level is now 77 with an indirect breeze running over them, much better.

1st Lesson learned- these big 125 CFL bulbs give off more heat close range than normal household type bulbs therefore you can't place the plants 2" from the bulb!

Hopefully this plant will recover, what do you reckon?

 

[donpaul.p]

you should be ok now you got the temps down,

 

[Hardgraf]

Hi guys. Quick update...

Bit worried about the 2 plants that were heat damaged. They seem to be growing new stems and leaves but they are drooping somewhat and looking a little sorry for themselves...

I'm reluctant to trim the heat damaged leaves due to the small size of the plants but maybe it would be a good idea as they seem to be shriveling up and could potentially cause fungus problems?

I had another plant germinated at the same time on the window sill. It's been under the light with the heat damaged plants for a few days and is thriving therefore I'm guessing that the current environment is fine and it's the previous heat damage that has stressed the other plants...

 

[donpaul.p]

i wouldnt trim anything off yet, just leave it till it gets a few more leaves or they wilt and are no longer holding their weight, at least while they are still standing they are still sort of working and trying to fix things, you need to check the temp at plant level, it sounds like you got it sorted so put the plants back under the light now, make sure the breeze is not to much as this can cause the same affect as heat damage and will cause the leaves to wilt and dry up, i know cuz its what i did to mine early on, what soil are you using and have you added any nutes yet, if you have then leave the nutes out for a bit they look dark green so they dont need anything just yet, just make sure you dont over water and keep the temps around 70 to 80 and they should recover and really start to grow

 

[Hardgraf]

Yeah thanks, I'll make sure that the fan is not blowing directly onto them. I find that the temp fluctuates a lot due to the garden being situated in an attic alcove so changes in the weather affect it quite a lot.

Really I need to look at isolating the garden more so I can control temp better.

No nutrients as yet. Just the ones that reside in the potting soil. Bit of patience and they should grow and look more healthy.

 

[donpaul.p]

keeping my fingers crossed for you, looks like you got it all under control then mate, does it tend to get hot in the attick, could cause problems during budding, may need some soure of cool air coming in and the hot out,

 

[Hardgraf]

Quick update. Heat damaged plants are finally recovering well and vegging is really taking off now.

Temperature is at a more constant 25 degrees