Help needed, mid flowering

[mufc420]

I have these 3 wedding cake photo periods, currently at week 6 since flowering.. there is something going on and i cant quite figure it out and looks like my plant is dying all the fan leaves are yellow and dying off but this is too early no? And ive not even flushed them yet either.. It is like a nitrogen deficiency but in flowering i thought the plant doesnt really need nitrogen and they thrive of phosphorus? These plants are currently being fed with emerald harvest 2part... i have stuck to the schedule but i give the plants a feed every monday and water every Thursday.
Any help or input would be much appreciated

 

[bobrown14]

pics wood be helpful.

Plants dont need nitrogen in flower.

Week 6 is 42 days. If my fan leaves are dying off there's something wrong.

Could be completely normal.

IF your in soil dont flush just water more frequently to run off and see how quick the plants suck up the run off. They should suck it up over night.

When that slows down you're in the window for harvest.

 

[mufc420]

There is pics mate, the fan leaves are 100% yellowing and dying off and at week 6 or 42 days that is too early if im right?
Ahh nice tip though pal thanks never knew that about the plant sucking the run off and the longer is a indication it could be close to harvest! I will keep that in mind, but unfortunately these are not quite done yet so i have a feeling something is going wrong

 

[mufc420]

pics wood be helpful.

Plants dont need nitrogen in flower.

Week 6 is 42 days. If my fan leaves are dying off there's something wrong.

Could be completely normal.

IF your in soil dont flush just water more frequently to run off and see how quick the plants suck up the run off. They should suck it up over night.

When that slows down you're in the window for harvest.

There is pics mate, the fan leaves are 100% yellowing and dying off and at week 6 or 42 days that is too early if im right?
Ahh nice tip though pal thanks never knew that about the plant sucking the run off and the longer is a indication it could be close to harvest! I will keep that in mind, but unfortunately these are not quite done yet so i have a feeling something is going wrong

 

[Tkmk]

Pics in natural light though please and thank you

 

[Tkmk]

pics wood be helpful.

Plants dont need nitrogen in flower.

Week 6 is 42 days. If my fan leaves are dying off there's something wrong.

Could be completely normal.

IF your in soil dont flush just water more frequently to run off and see how quick the plants suck up the run off. They should suck it up over night.

When that slows down you're in the window for harvest.

Plants always need nitrogen just not as much

 

[bobrown14]

Plants always need nitrogen just not as much

Not much if any in flower. They stored it up in the fan leaves.


Senescence is a thing, and likely what the op is experiencing.

Yes fan leaves will die off before the plant is ripe. Thats the natural progression.

Think fall colors on trees.. tree not dead but the leaves turn colors and fall off. Why do they turn colors die and fall off?

Senescence
Translocation
Abscission

Why wood a plant move Nitrogen from the soil when its stored in the fan leaves right there where the flowers are growing?? And the fan leaves are going thru the above 3 functions?

Water down the stretch and water more than normal. When the plant stops taking up the water out of the run out tray, she's close. All the fan leaves could have died and fallen off by then.

Think of fan leaves as a sink of energy during their early life. They have a different life cycle than the plant (think back to the tree scenario). Leaves die and fall off plant still alive right?

Later in the fan leaves life cycle they become a Source of energy and nutrients for the plants reproduction cycle.

So fan leaves are a SInk of energy storing up light energy with chlorophyll (green) then a Source of energy for the flowers. Reason they turn color is the chlorophyll is going thru a change and going back to the plant. So there's less and less chlorophyll in the fan leaves as they turn yellow or many other colors then fall off.

Its a natural process.

I've had plants start that process at 30 days and grow new fan leaves but thats not normal for hybrids or Indica cannabis plants.


Back to the OP and his pics. I didn't see them when I first read your post.

I see them now. It's difficult to tell with the yellow lighting.. but the flowers look good and thats what we are growing. They look pretty good actually. I dont worry about fan leaves unless there's a similar issue going on with sugar leaves. Sugar leaves are important going down the stretch.

I'd take a pic with a flash on your cell after lights out so we can see whats going on.

 

[mufc420]

Not much if any in flower. They stored it up in the fan leaves.


Senescence is a thing, and likely what the op is experiencing.

Yes fan leaves will die off before the plant is ripe. Thats the natural progression.

Think fall colors on trees.. tree not dead but the leaves turn colors and fall off. Why do they turn colors die and fall off?

Senescence
Translocation
Abscission

Why wood a plant move Nitrogen from the soil when its stored in the fan leaves right there where the flowers are growing?? And the fan leaves are going thru the above 3 functions?

Water down the stretch and water more than normal. When the plant stops taking up the water out of the run out tray, she's close. All the fan leaves could have died and fallen off by then.

Think of fan leaves as a sink of energy during their early life. They have a different life cycle than the plant (think back to the tree scenario). Leaves die and fall off plant still alive right?

Later in the fan leaves life cycle they become a Source of energy and nutrients for the plants reproduction cycle.

So fan leaves are a SInk of energy storing up light energy with chlorophyll (green) then a Source of energy for the flowers. Reason they turn color is the chlorophyll is going thru a change and going back to the plant. So there's less and less chlorophyll in the fan leaves as they turn yellow or many other colors then fall off.

Its a natural process.

I've had plants start that process at 30 days and grow new fan leaves but thats not normal for hybrids or Indica cannabis plants.


Back to the OP and his pics. I didn't see them when I first read your post.

I see them now. It's difficult to tell with the yellow lighting.. but the flowers look good and thats what we are growing. They look pretty good actually. I dont worry about fan leaves unless there's a similar issue going on with sugar leaves. Sugar leaves are important going down the stretch.

I'd take a pic with a flash on your cell after lights out so we can see whats going on.

Sorry mate had a hectic day so not had chance to reply but i have watered them again today. And will water everyday and feed every monday. I have took some pics when lights was out to see what your input or thoughts are.. im just concerned there is more yellowing daily. The smell and the flowers are looking delightful. Thanks for your help bud.

 

[mufc420]

Pics in natural light though please and thank you

I have added pics mate, thankyou

 

[mufc420]

Pics in natural light though please and thank you

I have added pics mate, thankyou

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi Mufc! I agree with you... something is wrong. This is not normal and you need to figure this out. Your leaves are dying because nutrients that the buds need are being stripped from those leaves in order to keep the process going. This can happen for several reasons... bugs attacking the roots, bad nutritional mix that doesn't have what the plants need, watering with the wrong pH fluids and my favorite, a salt lockout due to heavy use of nutes with no periodic flushing of the soil. Without further clues I can't give you any more of a definitive answer, but I refuse to do like others and justify this as normal. Unless I am having some sort of problem, my plants stay green right up to the end.

 

[mufc420]

Hi Mufc! I agree with you... something is wrong. This is not normal and you need to figure this out. Your leaves are dying because nutrients that the buds need are being stripped from those leaves in order to keep the process going. This can happen for several reasons... bugs attacking the roots, bad nutritional mix that doesn't have what the plants need, watering with the wrong pH fluids and my favorite, a salt lockout due to heavy use of nutes with no periodic flushing of the soil. Without further clues I can't give you any more of a definitive answer, but I refuse to do like others and justify this as normal. Unless I am having some sort of problem, my plants stay green right up to the end.

Hi Emilya! Merry 4/20 eve!! Thank you very much for your input.. it is a great help in making me understand and is very much appreciated. If you dont mind can I scratch your head and see if we can come to some viable solutions to try? I know its time consuming and you will have your own garden but i had these vegging for 4months because i had autos in the tent that needed finishing before i could flip the lights. So i have invested alot of time and effort into this and dont want to collapse on the final hurdle .. these was from seed put into 5l pots, mixture of soil and hydro balls (from a friends advice). I feed them emerald harvest 2part and i go off the schedule which i could post if you need? I feed them every Monday and water every Thursday. But from advice i am going to water everyday 2l water each and feed on Mondays as usual.. i havent checked the ppm in the soil as of yet. I thought emerald nutrients balance the ph and when i ph when mixed it reads around 5.9-6.2. Same when watering. They are under a 600w hps. Week 7 feed due today when lights come on around 8pm. Is there any other info i could give to try and find a solution? Or a couple of remedies to try as this is so much hard work and effort to get wasted. Thanks again ..

 

[Emilya Green]

Hi Emilya! Merry 4/20 eve!! Thank you very much for your input.. it is a great help in making me understand and is very much appreciated. If you dont mind can I scratch your head and see if we can come to some viable solutions to try? I know its time consuming and you will have your own garden but i had these vegging for 4months because i had autos in the tent that needed finishing before i could flip the lights. So i have invested alot of time and effort into this and dont want to collapse on the final hurdle .. these was from seed put into 5l pots, mixture of soil and hydro balls (from a friends advice). I feed them emerald harvest 2part and i go off the schedule which i could post if you need? I feed them every Monday and water every Thursday. But from advice i am going to water everyday 2l water each and feed on Mondays as usual.. i havent checked the ppm in the soil as of yet. I thought emerald nutrients balance the ph and when i ph when mixed it reads around 5.9-6.2. Same when watering. They are under a 600w hps. Week 7 feed due today when lights come on around 8pm. Is there any other info i could give to try and find a solution? Or a couple of remedies to try as this is so much hard work and effort to get wasted. Thanks again ..

Never fear, these plants are very resilient and they are not going to collapse in the end... they are doing exactly what they need to do to finish out the grow. It is just going to be an ugly finish and logic tells us that if the plants are struggling like this that something might be missing, forcing the plant to make do with what it has available.

I don't know why your friend recommended hydro balls in with your soil, but I guess some folks just can't totally trust soil to do the job. Next time, I recommend more soil and less hydro equipment... maybe add some extra perlite and worm castings instead.

So you alternate feeding and watering... which is the proper way to run soil. Now someone has advised you to water a bit every day, so that oxygen will never get down to your lower roots. Yes, I understand that it is bloom and that you need them to use and process more water, but the rules still apply. Roots need to see oxygen periodically in order to stay healthy. I push water on my own plants for 3 waterings, and then on the 4th, I let them dry out a bit longer, just for that reason. You of course are free to follow whoever's advice you wish to, but please think about what you are proposing to do.

Soil ppm is useless to measure or try to adjust to... this is not hydro. You have done well in finding a soil expert to get your advice from rather than from a hydro centric advisor. Your pH and ppm readings of the runoff and the soil are worthless. They tell you nothing about what is really going on in the soil. You also need to work harder on getting into the soil pH range for all of your water inputs, both when you feed and when you give plain water. 6.3 pH is your target... not below that and not above it... at 6.3 pH the most nutrients are the most mobile in your soil. Then, due to the nature of the buffers in the soil, the pH of the column of saturated soil in your container will begin to drift upwards, taking your nutrients, and/or water, all the way through the 6.3-6.8 pH range that is suggested for soil grows. Accuracy counts and this is probably part of the problem that has been building up all through your grow... one of your macronutrients is having some trouble getting picked up.

Since your pH isn't that far off though, and since you are getting such a severe lockout, I believe the main problem here is that your soil is clogged up from the leftover salts that are a product of using chelated nutrients. Over time these salts build up to the point that the soil can no longer hold a lot of nutrients for the plants, it is busy holding salt. Heavy nutrient programs need to be flushed periodically, and as a matter of course I would always flush at least at the 6 week point, just to clear the pipes for a grand finish, where the plants need more nutrients than ever before in order to finish up the buds. By flush, I mean the proper use of that term too... not the act of giving only water for a period of time, I mean flushing that soil of all the leftover salt by pouring 3x the container size of fresh un-pH adjusted water through that soil in one sitting. When I used synthetic nutes, I would periodically carry my plants to the shower, where I would flush them in this way... sometimes up to 5x in a grow, but ESPECIALLY at week 6. This is what you could do now to all the plants to finish out better... but nothing is going to save all the leaves that have now been scavenged for their nutrient load. Next time, throw out all the hydro folk's advice and try running your soil in this traditional way... and I believe you will thank me at this point in your next grow.
Good luck!

 

[bruno12345]

I dont know How much nitrogen you deprived your plants.

I like the 2-1-3 NPK ratio for flowering.
A bit more phosphorus in early flowering to help with the stretching phase.

But believe me, nitrogen is Still needed in good Portions. A yellow leave dont produce energy with efficiency, and buds/yield also depends on energy

Emylia Said good, i dont think this plant is supposed to yellow, keeping It green is maximizing.

I would flush those plants, and them saturate with 700ppm plus extra Mg.

I also feed almost every watering, but i dont know If this applies to your case/nute schedule.

 

[bobrown14]

Senescence
translocation
abscission

These are normal conditions for cannabis grown naturally.

I see it all the time just like that.

Unless you grew the strain before its impossible to make any other call.

You dont want all those leaves green at harvest. The best thing will be when they all FALL off and you're still flowering. You aint smoking fan leaves.

Look at the flowers - they are turning purple. The fan leaves are dying before harvest just like they are supposed to do.

Carry on... things look fine.

 

[grow boy420]

I have these 3 wedding cake photo periods, currently at week 6 since flowering.. there is something going on and i cant quite figure it out and looks like my plant is dying all the fan leaves are yellow and dying off but this is too early no? And ive not even flushed them yet either.. It is like a nitrogen deficiency but in flowering i thought the plant doesnt really need nitrogen and they thrive of phosphorus? These plants are currently being fed with emerald harvest 2part... i have stuck to the schedule but i give the plants a feed every monday and water every Thursday.
Any help or input would be much appreciated

What's the temperature's running at daytime and night time?