Here We Grow Again: LALG's 2018 4x4 DWC LED

[IslandGrow420]

i top a lot. i usually mainline my plants or top them at least 3-4 times. I'll do a bit of FIM'ing too. I usually take the first top after the 3rd node, then go from there. great way to get them bushy. then throw them into a scrog.

hey Letgro, what kind of trellis net did you get for your tent, the elasticated one with hooks to fasten to the poles in each corner?

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

Yeah mine I waited to the 7th and holly molly I wish I had done it sooner... Cali OG Haze loves to stretch like crazy... I looked some pics online and they can stretch half way to the moon!(okay YES it's a bit exaggerated but you get the main idea ) so 4 or 5 nodes would be good in my personal opinion

Lol, Good to know! I was wondering how they were going to stretch. My previous ladies (mostly indica) never stretched that much.

You can cut them down rather low if you want... Some people will grow them out and cut them 3-4 nodes down me personally I just cut them a node down and starting at node 3-4. If you happen to want to clone the top you can cut it 2-3 nodes down and trim it up and put it in a jiffy pellet or rapid rooter. I usually top 1 or 3 times... The first top then If I feel frisky I top those two after they heal and start growing otherwise I just go straight to LST. Also if you do transplants you can bury the stem some if you lollipop the bottom growth.

I do want a couple clones so I can make female seeds with them. I never considered topping and cloning the top. Great suggestion! Why didn't I think of that before? Lol! I've got rapid rooters waiting to be used.

Is it a scrog net or a support net? They are a tad different so I wanted to check.

i top a lot. i usually mainline my plants or top them at least 3-4 times. I'll do a bit of FIM'ing too. I usually take the first top after the 3rd node, then go from there. great way to get them bushy. then throw them into a scrog.

hey Letgro, what kind of trellis net did you get for your tent, the elasticated one with hooks to fasten to the poles in each corner?

I looked at the that I have. Yes it is the "net trellis" that is elasticated with hooks, that is the one! Is that more of a support net??

 

[IslandGrow420]

I have a couple of the same elasticated trellis nets...they work great for scrogging but a couple things to watch out for: 1) use tape to fix the height of the trellis on the tent poles in each corner, or your plants will push the trellis up. 2) ***because the trellis is elasticated, it bows in around the edges significantly, you lose 8-12" around the sides of your trellis....get some aluminium poles (something lightweight but rigid) that are almost the same length as your trellis and stick them around each side of your trellis to pull the sides back out. hard to explain but have a look at my tent in my current grow....you can see the aluminium poles. isn't perfect but it works well enough.
***I am assuming your elasticated trellis is exactly like mine.

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

I have a couple of the same elasticated trellis nets...they work great for scrogging but a couple things to watch out for: 1) use tape to fix the height of the trellis on the tent poles in each corner, or your plants will push the trellis up. 2) ***because the trellis is elasticated, it bows in around the edges significantly, you lose 8-12" around the sides of your trellis....get some aluminium poles (something lightweight but rigid) that are almost the same length as your trellis and stick them around each side of your trellis to pull the sides back out. hard to explain but have a look at my tent in my current grow....you can see the aluminium poles. isn't perfect but it works well enough.
***I am assuming your elasticated trellis is exactly like mine.

Thanks for the tips! I will check yours out for sure. Gorilla makes a "high cfm" kit with poles that keep the tent edges out. Wonder if that would work to keep my net in place (that is probably an expensive option though, I think they run about 50 bucks.) I will read up on scrogging more. I have a feeling mine will end up as more of a support net anyway, due to my lack of technique lol

 

[LedGuy74]

Lol, Good to know! I was wondering how they were going to stretch. My previous ladies (mostly indica) never stretched that much.





I do want a couple clones so I can make female seeds with them. I never considered topping and cloning the top. Great suggestion! Why didn't I think of that before? Lol! I've got rapid rooters waiting to be used.








I looked at the that I have. Yes it is the "net trellis" that is elasticated with hooks, that is the one! Is that more of a support net??

Yeah the holes tend to be larger and it's not as tight as a scrog as it's more elastic. Scrogs with a frame can be built for 10-15$

 

[IslandGrow420]

you could probably tie some rope around the outside of the tent poles and thread the trellis through the rope to pull the sides out. I had the aluminium poles handy and no rope!

there are some great video's on youtube about scrogging, i think most techniques involve super cropping like I use. but I'm sure you can LST your plants using the scrog the same way as you would tie branches down to the pot...won't hurt to experiment.

There is actually a good pic in the first skunk classic link in my signature of the aluminium poles and the trellis bowing inwards at the front. I find the holes are not too big and work fine...and a bit more convenient than building one for a tent. just saying...

 

[leftout420]

you can just build a frame with plastic PVC pipes like I have seen a lot of people doing on this forum... Rooster got a really nice scrogged plant and he did the frame with PVC pipes

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

you could probably tie some rope around the outside of the tent poles and thread the trellis through the rope to pull the sides out. I had the aluminium poles handy and no rope!

there are some great video's on youtube about scrogging, i think most techniques involve super cropping like I use. but I'm sure you can LST your plants using the scrog the same way as you would tie branches down to the pot...won't hurt to experiment.

There is actually a good pic in the first skunk classic link in my signature of the aluminium poles and the trellis bowing inwards at the front. I find the holes are not too big and work fine...and a bit more convenient than building one for a tent. just saying...

That is a good pic showing those poles. Not to mention the beautiful plants. I have a feeling I will do the same thing with my net. Super cropping - also interested in this method of training. I super cropped one plant last year out of necessity. I just did it because I was going out of town for a week and it was getting close to my led. One week later it was back up where it was as if I hadn't done anything at all.

you can just build a frame with plastic PVC pipes like I have seen a lot of people doing on this forum... Rooster got a really nice scrogged plant and he did the frame with PVC pipes

Yeah I have seen a few nice frames made from pvc. That might be something I will do in the future, if I stick with scrogging.

 

[IslandGrow420]

I've got two trellises that i made from pvc in my garage. The elasticated one is more convenient for a tent as you can lift up the front and duck under it to get into the tent. also, when you are trying to reach the growth at the back there is some give from the elastic, whereas a pvc bar across the front of your tent is a bit restrictive. also, you can adjust the height really easy on the elasticated one whereas in the pvc you have to lengthen or shorten the poles. i spent $15 and opened up a plastic bag and i was done. tent war: elasticated 4 - 0 PVC

 

[IslandGrow420]

sounds like you know how to super crop already to me.....

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

sounds like you know how to super crop already to me.....

Very carefully lol

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

I've got two trellises that i made from pvc in my garage. The elasticated one is more convenient for a tent as you can lift up the front and duck under it to get into the tent. also, when you are trying to reach the growth at the back there is some give from the elastic, whereas a pvc bar across the front of your tent is a bit restrictive. also, you can adjust the height really easy on the elasticated one whereas in the pvc you have to lengthen or shorten the poles. i spent $15 and opened up a plastic bag and i was done. tent war: elasticated 4 - 0 PVC

Accessibility is key

 

[IslandGrow420]

In a small confined space like a tent I just found the pvc trellis too restrictive and I was not able to be as flexible as with the elastic one (pardon the pun!). If I want to set my canopy 6 inches higher than my last grow the trellis takes a second to adjust height. I have both of my tents side by side in a 10ft room so side and rear access is very limited. If I had a large grow room with high ceilings I would not use any tents, and I would use all pvc trellises...

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

Okay team, I'm definitely having root issues. The dreaded slime/root rot has reared its ugly head in my reservoirs. I had to do an emergency root cleaning with h202 yesterday. They had dark, nasty film on all of them. I rinsed them off and dipped them in the h202 and rinsed them again. It got a lot of the nastiness off of the roots, not all, but a lot. When I checked on them this morning they were not weeping like before. I ordered the supplies to make a tea for beneficial bacteria. Hopefully I can get this sorted out. Here are some after cleaning pics...

 

[IslandGrow420]

Hey Letgro, have you tried Hydroguard by Botanicare. Basically botanicare identified the most dominant benny and put it in a bottle. I have used it on every DWC grow and I will not attempt a DWC grow without it.

I will say that when the plants are small with small root systems it is hard to get the bennies going as they have nothing to live on...whenever I do a res change with small plants the roots turn a dark orange and even though the plants look great the roots do not. That is because I have emptied out the bennies and the new ones I added in need time to colonize the small root system again. Once that happens they turn white and look great again. Anyway, that is my theory from what I have seen.

If you are brewing teas be careful about what organic matter you are using - your res will end up slimy, unless you are going to top feed with the tea and not let too much get into your res. some people say to top feed right before the res change so you get the tea into the roots but it doesnt end up sitting in the res for long enough to get slimy.

at least you caught the root problem early on!

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

Hey Letgro, have you tried Hydroguard by Botanicare. Basically botanicare identified the most dominant benny and put it in a bottle. I have used it on every DWC grow and I will not attempt a DWC grow without it.

I will say that when the plants are small with small root systems it is hard to get the bennies going as they have nothing to live on...whenever I do a res change with small plants the roots turn a dark orange and even though the plants look great the roots do not. That is because I have emptied out the bennies and the new ones I added in need time to colonize the small root system again. Once that happens they turn white and look great again. Anyway, that is my theory from what I have seen.

If you are brewing teas be careful about what organic matter you are using - your res will end up slimy, unless you are going to top feed with the tea and not let too much get into your res. some people say to top feed right before the res change so you get the tea into the roots but it doesnt end up sitting in the res for long enough to get slimy.

at least you caught the root problem early on!

I have not used Hydroguard in particular, I use Flying Skull z7 for my beneficial nutes. I think I forgot to use it on the first fill up of the reservoir though! Aaand I think that is what let the nastiness take hold in the first place. This is my first time dealing with any root issues. I have a buddy who used the tea mix and suggested it to me. Here are the directions for the tea I plan on using, stolen from another site...

"The recipe is really simple. Start with non-chlorinated water. I make 2 gallons at a time, but you can easily adjust the additives for whatever amount you wish to make. Now put the water into a bucket and throw in a couple air stones. The more air the better. You want the water to be almost turbulent from the bubbles. Now, add 15-30ml of aquashield and about 1/4-1/2 scoop of the ZHO powder. You will be breeding these into the billions so it doesn't really matter how much you start with, just don't overdo it. Now take an old sock or pantyhose and fill it with about 2 handfuls of EWC or Ancient Forest. Tie off the sock and place it in the water above an air stone, or better yet, feed an air stone down into the sock itself. If you want, you can just throw the EWC directly into the water and strain it out later with cheesecloth or even an aquarium net. Next, add about a tablespoon of molasses to wake up the microbes and give them something to eat. We will only be feeding the microbes in this tea; never add food for the microbes to the res itself. It's okay if the bennies in the res starve. You will be replacing them every few days. Now let the tea bubble at room tempeture for 48 hours. It can be used after 24, but will be more active and diverse at 48. If you use EWC you will probably notice a foam eventually, this is normal. After 48 hours you can store the tea in the fridge where it will stay fresh for about 10 days. Once it starts to go bad it will develop an odor. If you ever detect an odor from your tea, throw it out and make a new batch. Fresh tea can have a range of smells from earthy to mossy to shroomy. Bad tea smells like gym socks, fecal matter, or decay.

Initially, add about 1 cup to your res for every gallon of water, and then add 1 cup total every 3 days after. If you can, pour a little over the base of the stalk to inoculate the root crown. Your water might get a little cloudy but your roots will stay white and stimulated. When you use tea and practice proper res maintenance you can feel confident your roots will be healthy. By multiplying the microbes this way your products should last a great deal longer. Once you have eradicated slime and simply want protection from future outbreaks, adjust the tea dosage to 1 cup per 10 gallons about once per week."


It sucks. Hope I can get that shit out of there.

 

[IslandGrow420]

Letgro, this is right up my alley. I have been benny hunting for years now lol.

The main ingredient in that tea is Aquashield...which is what they now call Hydroguard. You do not need to brew it in a tea, you can add it to your nutrient mixture....the dose is 2ml per gallon. Having said that, the part about "awakening the bennies" in the recipe is something I do, just not with all the organic material (not even molasses anymore). I find awakening them helps with when I res change small plants with small root systems. I brew my Hydroguard (only for a res change, I just add it straight from bottle for maintenance top ups) with a sweetener (Sugaree at the moment) which is made for hydroponics. I used to brew organic teas for my soil grows...that recipe is deffo going to create some serious benny activity, I am down for you trying it! I like the small dosage....I do not think it will slime things up. There are other benny products out there...especially for teas. I use Earthjuice BioRighteous for brewing teas in my organic grows.

The ZHO is mycorrhizae fungus. Earthjuice Rooters Mycorrhizae is the stuff I use. I used to mix the fungus and bennies in my organic teas together for a while, but I did some research and apparently they compete against each other. Plus, the mycorrhizae is better for soil. Having said that, I sprinkle some on the roots when I put my clones into net pots with hydroton clay balls. I do not think you need this in your tea but up to you.

The Flying Skull you are using is not a benny (beneficial bacteria). It is a enzyme product. It is pretty similar to the one I use...Hygrozyme. The enzymes break down organic matter (like dead root material) into food the bennies can use. Perfect!

Pick a benny product (Hydroguard) and an Enzyme (Flying Skull), and find a carbohydrate that will not slime your res, and you will be good to go. Try experimenting wit the tea recipe and see what happens....that is how I started learning about bennies etc.

Something I have never tried is running a sterile res. Product like Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O2), UC Roots, Res Clear etc, kill all living life in your res. So definitely do not use any of these in your res if you are running bennies!

You roots are not that bad, by the way. Hydroguard would clear that up in less than a week. Let me now what you decide to do, I am hella interested, deffo a hot topic for me!

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

Man Island, thanks so much for the info. This is my first encounter with bacteria, good or bad. I honestly thought my z7 would be enough to prevent any problems. I would be happy to throw some Hydroguard in there if you think it would clear it up. That sounds way easier than brewing a tea. I'm about to post this and hit up amazon for some Hydroguard! Thanks Island!

I'll try to get my buddy to post his results of tea use in a his DWC system, he abandoned his journal but maybe I can get him to post an update lol.

 

[LiveAndLetGro]

Hydroguard on the way! Be here Monday.

 

[IslandGrow420]

holy shit you are not playing around lol! good job bro!

do not let me talk you out of brewing the bennies...your plants have small root systems and it would help speed up the benny reaction if you brew them first, but like I said you do not have to. if you want you can brew your bennies in a simple tea, just use a bit of molasses (less is more) and the hydroguard and let them bubble overnight. I usually add 1.5 times (3ml per gal) the recommended dose to make sure there are tons of bennies in the res. A quart bottle will last ages, and the bennies will not survive in the bottle forever, so I use the stuff generously.