How Do You Calculate Nutrient Mixtures?

[Buds Buddy]

Who is it, and what (field) is their doctorate in?

Emilya was my mentor. She is damned good. I have no idea if she has a degree. But she's been spot on every time I ask her for help. I have learned a ton of stuff from her & many others. Just never was this into growing till lately. So now I'm ready to advance my knowledge.
Up till now I've just been trying different grow methods (Soil, Coco & DWC) to see what I liked best. I prefer soil because it's the simplest method to me. I've gone through about a dozen different lights to find what I liked best. I've built a grow room & dialed things in with Humidifiers, Fans, Dehumidifiers, AC, etc. Yes, it took me this long to find the equipment I'm content with. Then I started learning about the effects of different Terpenes so I could choose the correct seeds. I've tried several Nutrient line ups to find the best bang for the buck. So the last 4 years haven't been a total waste.

 

[The Celt]

I all honesty Buds, if I were starting up a commercial grow and not growing LOS, after seeing the performance of Mega Crop (first nute I ever tried), I would be inclined to use it.

Its simple, cheap as far as nutes go, and so far has performed amazingly. As for the quality of the bud compared to LOS, I won’t know until Nov/Dec, but so far I am impressed

As far as your question goes about a nitrogen only fertilizer, it’s highly unlikely you will find one as part of a nutrient lineup, but they do exist. Crop farmers (grain, corn, potatoes, etc) use Ammonical Nitrogen and Urea fertilizers. 50 pound bags of little balls with numbers like 46-0-0 and 21-0-0 are common.

 

[Emilya Green]

Emilya was my mentor. She is damned good. I have no idea if she has a degree. But she's been spot on every time I ask her for help. I have learned a ton of stuff from her & many others.

Just for the record, I have multiple degrees in several areas of study. I have a Bachelor's Degree in Electronics Engineering, with a minor in Physics. I have a Master's Degree in Business Administration with a minor in Computer Science and then at 35 I was awarded a Doctorate for my Graduate Studies in Economics, where my thesis was very much related to the cannabis world. I argued that the double whammy of government interference in the free market by implementing unconstitutional prohibitions on hemp/cannabis and liquor, and the forced elimination of Henry Ford from the emerging automobile market, caused the Great Depression and Crash of 1929 and the oil crisis that we still are dealing with to this day.

 

[Auggie]

... or is there a nute to add just N ?

I use Jacks formula every day, for all of my 200+ girls.

 

[Auggie]

it’s highly unlikely you will find one as part of a nutrient lineup, but they do exist

Jacks has a nutrient mix that does quite well with MJ. A company that has been selling ferts to farmers for a hundred years.
You can actually get one of their scientists on the phone to answer a question.

 

[TorturedSoul]

I did ask about NPK ratios in the form of ppm for each N - P - K.

In my opinion, plant nutrients should list N-P-K-Ca - because calcium is pretty important, too, for most plants.

Not sure what increases N. Eggshells, Coffee Grounds, etc. or is there a nute to add just N ?

It's not "organic," AFAIK, but if you're not worried about such things, there's calcium nitrate. Actually, there are several formulations that are generically known as that, so you'd have to check the bag for the percentages. If I remember correctly, it absorbs moisture from the air (like brake fluid), so keep it in a sealed container.

And there's ammonium nitrate. It's HOT. I haven't used it for over 15 years and don't recall exactly, but I think it's either 34-0-0 or 36-0-0. And it definitely absorbs moisture, like it was made for that purpose. Endothermic reaction (put it in water, and the water loses heat). It also rapidly decomposes at just over 400°F, releasing huge amounts of oxygen (or, depending on the conditions, nitrous oxide); some of the biggest industrial explosion accidents have involved it (often in rather large quantities). Not really something to worry about if you only buy a ¼-pound at a time, lol, but it's interesting.

unconstitutional prohibitions on hemp/cannabis and liquor

The Supreme Court decided that the Eighteenth Amendment was valid in 1920 or 1921, and again in 1931. And it necessitated Twenty-first Amendment to repeal it. I assume that, by definition, anything that makes its way into a Constitutional Amendment... is not unconstitutional. I agree with the concept of the "unconstitutional Constitutional Amendment," sure; anything that so changes a nation's or state's constitution so dramatically that it becomes, in essence and in effect, an entirely new document should require exactly that - an entirely new document. But that tree has never borne fruit in this country. Some people made the attempt whilst challenging the validity of the Fifteenth Amendment, but those challenges failed.


, and the forced elimination of Henry Ford from the emerging automobile market, caused the Great Depression and Crash of 1929 and the oil crisis that we still are dealing with to this day.
[/QUOTE]

 

[Auggie]

In my opinion, plant nutrients should list N-P-K-Ca - because calcium is pretty important, too, for most plants.

Agree.
Lots of it in Jacks B.
I use A&B in different concentrations depending on plant age.
Only thing really needed to add is magnesium ... especially if you in coco like me.

 

[Auggie]

some of the biggest industrial explosion accidents have involved it (often in rather large quantities). Not really something to worry about if you only buy a ¼-pound at a time,

Yes, it's not a substance that you want to store next to diesel fuel.

 

[TorturedSoul]

You don't really need the diesel fuel .

 

[Buds Buddy]

It's not "organic," AFAIK, but if you're not worried about such things, there's calcium nitrate. Actually, there are several formulations that are generically known as that, so you'd have to check the bag for the percentages. If I remember correctly, it absorbs moisture from the air (like brake fluid), so keep it in a sealed container.

And there's ammonium nitrate. It's HOT. I haven't used it for over 15 years and don't recall exactly, but I think it's either 34-0-0 or 36-0-0. And it definitely absorbs moisture, like it was made for that purpose. Endothermic reaction (put it in water, and the water loses heat). It also rapidly decomposes at just over 400°F, releasing huge amounts of oxygen (or, depending on the conditions, nitrous oxide); some of the biggest industrial explosion accidents have involved it (often in rather large quantities). Not really something to worry about if you only buy a ¼-pound at a time, lol, but it's interesting.

These things sound like they would work well. Might have to add quite a bit of Sweet Candy 0 - 17 - 28 to get the correct ratio though. Hmmm, got me thinking ... lol. This could get me in trouble; but hey, it was only a seed ... right ?

 

[Buds Buddy]

Agree.
Lots of it in Jacks B.
I use A&B in different concentrations depending on plant age.
Only thing really needed to add is magnesium ... especially if you in coco like me.

I just looked at this on ebay. Sounds like it would work. Think I'll buy some to have on hand whether I use it or not. It's one of those things like Baking Soda, Lemon Juice & Epsom Salts that could just come in handy at some point & time.
I've got a medicine cabinet in my grow room for my Emergency Needs. I'd rather have too much than not enough.

 

[InTheShed]

How does one get ahold of this spreadsheet?

Just got the okay. PM me if you're still interested!

 

[TorturedSoul]

Just got the okay. PM me if you're still interested!

Can we stipulate that I've already sent you a "private" message in which I expressed interest, lol?

 

[InTheShed]

Would have been faster if you just put that in a PM TS!

 

[Enjoil]

Your plants look awesome and healthy

No disrespect intended here- if the MC instructions say to feed 6g during flower, why only feed 4?
That’s the first thing @Emilya usually asks people when they talk about feeding 80% etc is Why not feed what the label says?

I ask because I’ve been seeing it so much lately. Lots of folks asking if their yellowing is due to under or overfeeding but they are not even feeding at 100% yet. I feel like people are doing their plants a disservice by not giving at least what is recommended.

I can imagine working in a facility that grows, they would have some sort of plan laid out for nutrient cycles etc. But if they don’t, simply going by manufacturers recommendations is a good place to start until you’ve established a fine tuned system geared toward individual strains.

How many times have you fried your babys?

 

[Justin Goody]

How many times have you fried your babys?

Not once since I started using MegaCrop. Lots of times years ago with FoxFarm.

 

[Pahval]

There is an application for windows called hydrobuddy which lets you see ratio of your npk and other nutes when mixing your own salts, you can copy label of lets say jacks nutes or mega crop inside, and see what salts you need to get there. Best of luck with your new career!

Edit: its allready mentioned and explained in post how to mix your own nutrients

 

[Enjoil]

You don't really need the diesel fuel .

What the hell you guys doing with diesel? Lol? What blew up? Lol remember when all the dummies we’re trying to make bro open blasting and blowing themselves up! Omg idiots! Glad it wasn’t me!

 

[Buds Buddy]

It's all about understanding ratios and nutrient ppm levels in plants. Go outside those ratios and expect the plant to react negatively. Even then we can only guess since ratios are based on tissue samples. It would be assumed that we are controlling those ppm levels through the nutes, but does 200 ppm of K in nutrient form equate to 200 ppm of K in the tissue sample?
Potassium, Ca and Mg appear to be needed in larger quantities in comparison to other floriculture species. Increasing the levels of K, contrary to the Mulder's Chart, decreases the availability of Ca and/or Mg. Provide K, Ca and Mg in a 41 ratio avoids antagonisms. The image below shows how increasing K effects the uptake of Ca and Mg.

Poinsettias need around 200 ppm K to 100 ppm Ca to 50 ppm Mg and since cannabis is similar in that it's a short-day plant it's a good rule to follow.

So now you know that part. The next is understanding how much P a plant needs. A graduate student, Josh Henry, worked on optimizing P fertilization rates for his master’s degree thesis at NCSU. Plants require a baseline level of P to grow adequately. For a continuous fertilization program for plants grown in a soilless substrate, the target concentration is between 8 ppm and 15 ppm of P. Providing levels below that will result in less plant growth, while concentrations above that level provide little benefit.
Since there really is no data on P needs for cannabis increasing those levels from 15 ppm to 25 ppm would be an acceptable range. Higher than that and you risk antagonisms or stimulations. North Carolina State University has begun an experiment looking into optimal P rates supplied at a constant level throughout the cannabis crop cycle and most likely will refine those recommendations in the near future.
The image below shows the response of Alternanthera to increasing concentrations of P from 0, 5, 10, 20 and 40 ppm (left to right).

You can see the growth slowed after 10 ppm and basically stopped after 20 ppm. Phosphorus is also the primary contributor to plant stretch. Too much P will lead to excessive internode elongation and tall plants. That’s why it’s important to limit excessive P in grow applications. We often hear about growers wanting to add bloom enhancers and yet the plants don't want it and ultimately it leads to deficiencies because of overuse. The next image shows the nutrients that are from a tissue sample of a plant. Again notice the percentages and acceptable ranges.

You can use the following ratios as a guide to growing cannabis:
10 parts Nitrogen
1 to 2 parts Phosphorus
10 parts Potassium
5 parts Calcium
2 to 3 parts Magnesium
1 to 3 parts Sulfur
The micronutrients are important and most can be found in tap water(get a water report) but if you don't use it then of course you need to add those which most ferts carry enough of anyhow.

The nitrogen should be mainly in the nitrate form as it provides more compact and controlled growth. More extensive leaf and stem growth occurs with ammoniacal and urea nitrogen. In general, to avoid excessive stretching and oversized leaves, more than 60 percent of the nitrogen provided to plants should be in the nitrate form. Ideally 70 to 80 percent as this will provide a moderate growth response and avoid overly large cannabis plants.

I'm sure I bored many here but there's more that is readily available online to look up. Is it a science to figure it all out? Sure it is and that's why people spend years understanding it all. But if you try and follow the basics you'll do fine. Hopefully that's enough to get you on your way.

Thanks for the very detailed reply. From part of what I read there it sounds like me adding the Terpinator 0-0-4 to the MC is what probably caused the few Calcium spots on a few of the lower leaves on my current grow. I started adding 2 ml. per gal of CalMag.

 

[MrSauga]

From part of what I read there it sounds like me adding the Terpinator 0-0-4 to the MC is what probably caused the few Calcium spots on a few of the lower leaves on my current grow.

That's quite possible, and certain versions of MC also lack adequate amounts of Ca/Mg in their formulas. It's more noticeable in soilless mixes. So when adding more MC the problem is exaggerated since you're naturally adding more K at a value of 17%.