hps lamp...ballast?

[mudrunner]

Sun System HPS 150 Grow Light Fixture (900490) Includes Bulb



does this light need/come with a ballast? do all MH and HPS lights require ballasts? is a 150 sufficent to grow two plants side by side in a dresser roughly 2'dx3'wx4.5't. and if it isnt would it be better for me to buy 2 150's instead of like 1 250 or 300? it seems like 2 smaller ones would probably have better light coverage, correct? since they could be spread out more? will heat be an issue in my grow box with that hps bulb? like would 2 computer fans (inlet and exhaust w/carbon scrubber) keep it reasonable?

feel free and suggest any other lighting ideas with me, im open to ideas although money is a bit of an issue as well as space in my grow box. well thank you guys in advance youve already helped me a ton

 

[TorturedSoul]

does this light need/come with a ballast?

Yes/yes.

do all MH and HPS lights require ballasts?

Yes.

is a 150 sufficent to grow two plants side by side in a dresser roughly 2'dx3'wx4.5't.

No, IMHO. You'll most likely get a harvest, but it won't be as much as you could attain with more light. A 150-watt HPS is good for around three square feet. It also doesn't have much in the way of penetrative ability, so either try to keep your plants short or lollipop them because it won't penetrate to the bottom.

and if it isnt would it be better for me to buy 2 150's instead of like 1 250 or 300?

Two 150-watt HPS lights will probably produce slightly more light than a 250-watt HPS. The 250-watt one will penetrate a little deeper into a canopy, but in a dresser you are going to be hurting for headroom in any event so that shouldn't be a factor.

it seems like 2 smaller ones would probably have better light coverage, correct? since they could be spread out more?

Hypothetically, yes (for the reason that you mentioned). Other factors will affect this, however. For example, those lights aren't the most efficient ones on the planet (I suspect that there isn't much if any difference in electrical usage between two of those and one 400-watt Lumatek-ballasted light) and reflector design plays a HUGE part in determining how much light reaches your plants and in the shape of the light's footprint).

will heat be an issue in my grow box with that hps bulb?

If you are going to use one - and especially if you are going to use two - in a small box such as a dresser, I would strongly suggest that you remove the ballasts from the reflectors and wire them remotely so that the heat that they produce will be somewhere else.

like would 2 computer fans (inlet and exhaust w/carbon scrubber) keep it reasonable?

I couldn't say. Depends on how much air they move. You've only got a 27 cubic foot box so 100 CFM of air movement will exchange it's air ~3.7 times per minute. Getting the ballast(s) out of the grow will help in any GR and immensely in a small area.

Keep in mind that a good carbon filter will restrict the airflow somewhat (you want the air to pass over/around as much of the carbon material as possible) - some computer fans move a fair amount of air when there are no restrictions but much less when it is restricted.

Also, ditch the intake fan and just get a better exhaust one (a 50 CFM intake fan and a 50 CFM exhaust fan won't move 100 CFM, only 50). Use a passive intake (vent). Negative pressure is a good thing, lol. Keeps odor from possibly escaping via cracks/etc.

feel free and suggest any other lighting ideas with me, im open to ideas although money is a bit of an issue as well as space in my grow box.

Looks like the lowest "total price" listed in your reference for two of those is $151. If you can add some more money (holding onto what you've got for 2-3 weeks if necessary or whatever)... The same website that had that price listed has a 250-watt Lumatek ballast for ~$111-$114 (plus shipping). That ballast is dimmable (it has settings for 150-watt, 175-watt, 250-watt, and 250-watt "Super Lumen" (about 10% overdriven)). That means that you can use a 250-watt, a 175-watt, or a 150-watt bulb (Lumateks and all other electronic/digital ballasts that I've seen can drive both HPS and MH bulbs, BtW). It will also allow you to run a 250-watt bulb at reduced power without harming it. You'd need to add a reflector, though. You can get a cheap "batwing-style" open reflector for ~$32. They're not great, lol, but I don't really see a good way to fit an air-cooled setup into a small dresser anyway and the walls would be close enough to the reflector that you would have some usable light reflected from them onto your plants (so the open nature of that reflector is not really a handicap in an application such as yours). Sand the inner walls of the box pretty smooth, prime them, calk all corner runs, and paint them with the brightest flat white paint you can find; or use uncreased mylar (personally, I'd go with the paint and also do the floor & ceiling to help seal the inner walls against moisture damage - and stick a drip-tray in there).

You would still need to add a bulb. If you've looked around you probably noticed that the selection is somewhat limited when it comes to 150-watt HPS bulbs. It's even further limited because some work with a medium socket (like most incandescents) and some work in a mogul socket (like larger HPS/MH). When you look at 250-watt bulbs, OtOH, there is more selection; not to mention the fact that you wouldn't be limited to 250-watt ones - or just HPS - with the Lumatek setup.

You could start out at the 150-watt setting (or 175-watt, say, a MH for vegetative) and then switch to a 250-watt bulb for later vegetative (if needed) and flowering. If heat became an issue either in this grow or next summer, you could drop the wattage with the flip of a switch.

It costs more initially, but you would be using less electricity than with two of those 150-watt fixtures. Many more bulb choices. Ability to use either HPS or MH. Much more efficient. Better penetration (on the 250-watt setting). Five year warranty on the ballast (last two are prorated, I believe). It's dead silent so you won't hear the ballast hum like you would with those 150-watt fixtures. You do not need to remote the ballast because it is a separate component - the reflector comes with an 8'(?) cord and the ballast has a 15'(?) electrical cord. Options, lol.

Oh yeah... Also, if (when) you later expand into a larger box, closet, giant underground cave (lol), et cetera, you will find that sticking a 250-watt MH into the Lumatek turns your box into a passable mother/clone box. Just a thought for the future.

If your dresser is the type that sits on legs so that the bottom is off of the floor, consider cutting the bottom out so that you have a little more vertical room.

 

[mudrunner]

Yes/yes.



Yes.



No, IMHO. You'll most likely get a harvest, but it won't be as much as you could attain with more light. A 150-watt HPS is good for around three square feet. It also doesn't have much in the way of penetrative ability, so either try to keep your plants short or lollipop them because it won't penetrate to the bottom.



Two 150-watt HPS lights will probably produce slightly more light than a 250-watt HPS. The 250-watt one will penetrate a little deeper into a canopy, but in a dresser you are going to be hurting for headroom in any event so that shouldn't be a factor.



Hypothetically, yes (for the reason that you mentioned). Other factors will affect this, however. For example, those lights aren't the most efficient ones on the planet (I suspect that there isn't much if any difference in electrical usage between two of those and one 400-watt Lumatek-ballasted light) and reflector design plays a HUGE part in determining how much light reaches your plants and in the shape of the light's footprint).



If you are going to use one - and especially if you are going to use two - in a small box such as a dresser, I would strongly suggest that you remove the ballasts from the reflectors and wire them remotely so that the heat that they produce will be somewhere else.



I couldn't say. Depends on how much air they move. You've only got a 27 cubic foot box so 100 CFM of air movement will exchange it's air ~3.7 times per minute. Getting the ballast(s) out of the grow will help in any GR and immensely in a small area.

Keep in mind that a good carbon filter will restrict the airflow somewhat (you want the air to pass over/around as much of the carbon material as possible) - some computer fans move a fair amount of air when there are no restrictions but much less when it is restricted.

Also, ditch the intake fan and just get a better exhaust one (a 50 CFM intake fan and a 50 CFM exhaust fan won't move 100 CFM, only 50). Use a passive intake (vent). Negative pressure is a good thing, lol. Keeps odor from possibly escaping via cracks/etc.



Looks like the lowest "total price" listed in your reference for two of those is $151. If you can add some more money (holding onto what you've got for 2-3 weeks if necessary or whatever)... The same website that had that price listed has a 250-watt Lumatek ballast for ~$111-$114 (plus shipping). That ballast is dimmable (it has settings for 150-watt, 175-watt, 250-watt, and 250-watt "Super Lumen" (about 10% overdriven)). That means that you can use a 250-watt, a 175-watt, or a 150-watt bulb (Lumateks and all other electronic/digital ballasts that I've seen can drive both HPS and MH bulbs, BtW). It will also allow you to run a 250-watt bulb at reduced power without harming it. You'd need to add a reflector, though. You can get a cheap "batwing-style" open reflector for ~$32. They're not great, lol, but I don't really see a good way to fit an air-cooled setup into a small dresser anyway and the walls would be close enough to the reflector that you would have some usable light reflected from them onto your plants (so the open nature of that reflector is not really a handicap in an application such as yours). Sand the inner walls of the box pretty smooth, prime them, calk all corner runs, and paint them with the brightest flat white paint you can find; or use uncreased mylar (personally, I'd go with the paint and also do the floor & ceiling to help seal the inner walls against moisture damage - and stick a drip-tray in there).

You would still need to add a bulb. If you've looked around you probably noticed that the selection is somewhat limited when it comes to 150-watt HPS bulbs. It's even further limited because some work with a medium socket (like most incandescents) and some work in a mogul socket (like larger HPS/MH). When you look at 250-watt bulbs, OtOH, there is more selection; not to mention the fact that you wouldn't be limited to 250-watt ones - or just HPS - with the Lumatek setup.

You could start out at the 150-watt setting (or 175-watt, say, a MH for vegetative) and then switch to a 250-watt bulb for later vegetative (if needed) and flowering. If heat became an issue either in this grow or next summer, you could drop the wattage with the flip of a switch.

It costs more initially, but you would be using less electricity than with two of those 150-watt fixtures. Many more bulb choices. Ability to use either HPS or MH. Much more efficient. Better penetration (on the 250-watt setting). Five year warranty on the ballast (last two are prorated, I believe). It's dead silent so you won't hear the ballast hum like you would with those 150-watt fixtures. You do not need to remote the ballast because it is a separate component - the reflector comes with an 8'(?) cord and the ballast has a 15'(?) electrical cord. Options, lol.

Oh yeah... Also, if (when) you later expand into a larger box, closet, giant underground cave (lol), et cetera, you will find that sticking a 250-watt MH into the Lumatek turns your box into a passable mother/clone box. Just a thought for the future.

If your dresser is the type that sits on legs so that the bottom is off of the floor, consider cutting the bottom out so that you have a little more vertical room.

WOW... THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE ANSWER!!! and you laid it out so even the most entry level grower could understand. this is appreciated more than you know i was starting to stress out because no one was answering me and i figured it was because i asked a whole paragraph of stupid Q's and they werent going to waste their time with me. its kind of intimidating getting your foot in the door on something like this.

maybe you could answer this for me. ideally i would like to have this grow box suit me for the spring when i germ/ or possibly clone some for outdoor. however i would like to be able to slide a divider right in the middle horrizontially so i can have basically a shelf to stack 2x the clones in. thats actually why i was thinking on the 2 smaller lamps. i was just looking for a way around cfl's for this because honestly they seem kind of..... primitave i guess lol do you have any good ideas/suggestions on this. i know im asking alot out of one box lol

 

[TorturedSoul]

WOW... THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE ANSWER!!!

You're welcome.

and you laid it out so even the most entry level grower could understand.

i was starting to stress out because no one was answering me and i figured it was because i asked a whole paragraph of stupid Q's and they werent going to waste their time with me.

It's not a live help service, lol. If it was, I'd have an Indian accent and you couldn't understand me. We have 101,386 threads and 850,858 posts (and climbing) - it can take people a little while to get to any one individual post.

ideally i would like to have this grow box suit me for the spring when i germ/ or possibly clone some for outdoor. however i would like to be able to slide a divider right in the middle horrizontially so i can have basically a shelf to stack 2x the clones in. thats actually why i was thinking on the 2 smaller lamps. i was just looking for a way around cfl's for this because honestly they seem kind of..... primitave i guess lol do you have any good ideas/suggestions on this. i know im asking alot out of one box lol

You want two levels in a dresser that only has 4½' of vertical space and you want to use HPS lights? Only if the dresser is a tesseract, lmfao. You've got the height of each reflector, the space between the bottom of (each of) the reflector(s) and the top of the plants, the divider... where are you going to put your plants (and the containers they'll be growing in)?

If you're determined to make it a two-level affair, go buy the longest "shop-lights" that will fit across the width and cannibalize them for the end connectors & ballasts (or just buy the parts), paint the ceiling white, and mount a bunch of them (not so many for clones as you'd need for active vegetative and/or flower) directly to it & do the same with the divider.

Or get a taller box. Have you got a closet, lol?

BtW... Just how many clones do you expect to need regularly? You could root many cuttings in a dresser that size (and still have room for the mother) without turning it into a duplex.

Growing cannabis isn't rocket science, it's true. Still... If you're a novice carpenter you're more likely to succeed at building a cabin than at building a skyscraper. Keep things small and simple to start with. It'll allow you to learn the general things (and after a few grows, to know the behavior of the strain that you are growing).

 

[mudrunner]

You're welcome.

and you laid it out so even the most entry level grower could understand.



It's not a live help service, lol. If it was, I'd have an Indian accent and you couldn't understand me. We have 101,386 threads and 850,858 posts (and climbing) - it can take people a little while to get to any one individual post.



You want two levels in a dresser that only has 4½' of vertical space and you want to use HPS lights? Only if the dresser is a tesseract, lmfao. You've got the height of each reflector, the space between the bottom of (each of) the reflector(s) and the top of the plants, the divider... where are you going to put your plants (and the containers they'll be growing in)?

If you're determined to make it a two-level affair, go buy the longest "shop-lights" that will fit across the width and cannibalize them for the end connectors & ballasts (or just buy the parts), paint the ceiling white, and mount a bunch of them (not so many for clones as you'd need for active vegetative and/or flower) directly to it & do the same with the divider.

Or get a taller box. Have you got a closet, lol?

BtW... Just how many clones do you expect to need regularly? You could root many cuttings in a dresser that size (and still have room for the mother) without turning it into a duplex.

Growing cannabis isn't rocket science, it's true. Still... If you're a novice carpenter you're more likely to succeed at building a cabin than at building a skyscraper. Keep things small and simple to start with. It'll allow you to learn the general things (and after a few grows, to know the behavior of the strain that you are growing).

haha.. well, ill cross that out then no double decker. i have a very nice closet actually, but i live in an apartment and i guess they do walkthroughs 3 times or so a year (the tennant below me has lived here a while and i casually asked him) so im really not looking to get evicted. plus my girlfriend still isnt too hot on the idea of me growing. so out of respect im just trying to seclude the plant from her as much as possible. ideally i would like to plant 20 or so plants outside come spring time. i would really like to just germinate the plants indoors and move them outside so 1 harvest and im set for the year i just would rather save money and clone all those little guys rather than buying alll seeds. so if i could have a mother plant ready to pull some clones off in time... that would be ideal. i keep forgetting i just need to keep this one simple haha