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Is anyone doing a true CGE grow?

Undergrad

New Member
Hey everyone!

It's been sometime since I have visited the forums! IF anyone remembers me it would be under the name "Smokeyjoe" or from my journal "Smokeyjoe's first grow", I digress.

I have at this point 15-20 (I lost count) successful grows (I harvest every 4-6 weeks perpetually) and I have recently come upon the opportunity to redesign my room's. I am really interested in the CGE idea. I understand the basic concepts, sealed room, A/C, C02, Dehumidifier etc.
I am currently running 4 1000W in my flower room (12x14) and 2 600w in a 4x8 tent which will be turned into a veg room (was a second flower area). I also have a 3x3 tent which will probably house my 45 site clone machine.
I own 2, 8" hi output can fans and 2, 6" as well. My old setup had a CAN 75 filter w/8" HO scrubbing the room. 2 CAN 33, (one on a 6" one on an 8") in line with my air cooled hoods venting the triple scrubbed hot air out through my attic/ crawl space. Even with all that scrubbing the neighbors can smell it and so can I. I am a medical grower so legalities are not an issue here but security is. I am looking to build the perfect room. I have access to an electrician, carpenter, plumber/HVAC guy and money is not an issue, finding someone with experience at this is..
My question is does anyone here currently run a successful CGE or know of a link to one? I have been scouring the net and only come up with half assed threads without pictures that don't help much. My Electrician is coming wednesday and running me a couple more 20amp circuits for the room so I am trying to do a little more research on the subject.
:peace2::popcorn:
 

Vapedogg223

Nug of the Month: June 2012
Hi Undergrad,

I'm very interested in this topic... Like you, I couldn't find much in the way of detailed info or examples of a CGE out there.

I am in the early stages of building a small (8' x 11' x 7') grow room. I'm planning on dividing the area so that I have 2' deep shelving 8' wide for veging, and the rest of the space for flowering.

I have natural gas in the room already for a co2 generator, and will be putting in a through the wall air conditioner, and an in-wall electric register heater. My plans are to have everything run by a Sentinel CHHC-4.

My air-cooled hoods will take fresh air from outside and push it back outside, so no need for carbon scrubbing the exhaust air, and I won't be removing any of my co2.

I think I have a perfect area for a CGE, I just wish I could find more info on the subject in case there's variables I'm not thinking of.

I am considering doing a "construction journal" when I start, to help others looking for info, just like me.

You have a lot more experience than I do... I would love any input.:thanks:
 

Undergrad

New Member
It sounds like were both at the same stage. In the end I'm just going to end up doing what I think makes sense and be thankful that I live so close to the grow shop if anything does arise. How big is your area? Let's talk ideas! wish I could draw something up on my Mac and post it but I don't think I have any software to do that.
 

Undergrad

New Member
And technically if your bringing air from outside through the sealed lighting it's not considered a CGE in the true sense. I don't think I will have that option here but the room isn't built yet so.. Just thought I would add that. I'm headed to load up the truck with all the demo from my old room.
 

Vapedogg223

Nug of the Month: June 2012
Im about half way through the demo myself! I have 90% of the old ceiling down and I'm about to start tearing out some old cabinets. My house was built in the early 1900s so every time I tear out a wall, I end up having to take half a day to fix some old electrical fire hazard that somebody left for me.

Now that you mention it, I guess you're right about the lights. I just figured that since I have the ability to run outside air to cool my lights I should take advantage. Not sure it will make much difference for cooling in the summer with 90+ temps, but it should take care of the issues of not exhausting my co2. The HID lighting for flowering will be air cooled, but I'm planning on using T5 HO lights for veging, so no plans on venting that as of yet.

My space that I'm starting with is 8' x 11' x 7'...wish I had more! I looked around for design software for my Mac also, and actually found some good ones, they were just more than I wanted to spend, so I'm back to graph paper.

The hard part for me to figure out is that I need to fit a veg and flower area in the same space. I've decided on 2 foot deep shelving on the short side of the room which will give me roughly 24 square feet for veging if I use two rows of shelving. That will leave me with roughly 56 square feet for flowering.

The divider between the two areas is the biggest pain. Obviously it has to be light proof and I'm probably going to end up using some kind of curtains with a partial wall since sliding doors will take up too mush space according to my calculations.

Are you planning on an environmental controller of some kind? How are you planning on dealing with the heat from your lights, just the A/C or are you thinking water cooled?

Money is the main thing holding me back right now. If I had the cash I would probably have it half built already, but I ended up spending much more time and money than originally anticipated on my current "temporary" grow space.
 

Undergrad

New Member
If you can frame up a wall and wrap it with panda plastic there are zipper systems that will make a door in a solid wall of plastic just stick and cut. Probably the most efficient way to split a room, create entries to put on a bee keeper suite etc. I have done a couple rooms this way before it works great and is cost effective as well. It should be easy enough to seal plastic to plastic with the walls and flooring being 6vmil panda plastic.
I am working on the same issue but I have a bit more space, I also have 10' ceilings. I am going to attempt to essentially "finish of" the garage by framing a wall across the garage door area, insulating it drywalling it etc. I feel like my old flower area was not well defined and did not take advantage of the equipment so I will frame off the flower section this time and wrap it with plastic, floor to ceiling.

On my old grow I essentially split my garage in half with plastic and flowered in one half and veg'd in the other. This time I will do the same thing with a finished room which should help with temps in summer and winter, along with sealing the room and using climate control.
I hope to find a dual zone unit for the AC but if I can figure a way to loop the A/C'd air through the veg area and back again that might make a single zone unit doable but I am going to avoid cutting corners if possible. I am going to use an environmental controller for sure to run the C02 and the A/C etc. I might look into running outside air through my lights in the winter. I run my flower room at night to avoid heat right now but as anyone thats done this before knows sometimes you just go for it and deal with issues as they arise.
Hopefully we can get someone else with some experience to chime in soon! I will start posting some pictures of my area as it stands now this week sometime.
 

Undergrad

New Member
Just found a thread on it somewhere else that seems to be what we are looking for. For some reason I cannot share the thread here, maybe because it a competitors site idk.Its late Ill figure out how to share it with ya later.
 

TorturedSoul

Member of the Month: May 2009, Oct 2010, Sept 2017
And technically if your bringing air from outside through the sealed lighting it's not considered a CGE in the true sense.
Whether it would be splitting technicalities or not, it would seem to be good sense. If you're bringing air from outside of the GR to cool the lights and exhausting it without it ever coming into contact with the actual space, I'd think that would still meet the "sealed" aspect of the grow.

But more importantly, that air would be heated - but it would just smell like hot air (which doesn't seem to smell different than cool air?) instead of hot air with lots and lots of cannabis. You mentioned that your neighbors can smell it currently?
 

Undergrad

New Member
Currently my room is being rebuilt but towards the end yes it was detectable by a neighbor occasionally.
This is why I am redesigning my room.
If I could bring air in and out through the lights I would but I don't see how I could pull that off in my situation so the idea of just not venting anything sounds great to me.
 

TorturedSoul

Member of the Month: May 2009, Oct 2010, Sept 2017
Guess you've got to work within your constraints.

However it turns out, stay safe.
 

CantKeepMe V

New Member
Have you looked into a mini split a/c system? You can get a 13 seer unit for around $700 or $800 if I remember right. This would be big enough for your grow unless you've got a garage full lol

I'm currently putting together a CGE, although it's in a 80x25x40 cabinet, flower in the top & veg in the bottom.

Good luck with your operation.

To control CO2 look into an AQ-100 from CO2meter.com as well as the digital relay board (Found under the AQ500) to turn on the co2. It could also be used as a method for controlling anything pertaining to temp/rh as well.

Inside the AQ-100, when taken apart you find a slightly limited AQ-500 inside with the K33 RH/temp/co2 sensor piggybacked inside.
 

Undergrad

New Member
Thanks I do plan to fill the garage so I will be going for a larger size but mini split a/c is the way I will go for sure. Thanks for the suggestion on controllers, we have a local wholesaler that sells C.A.P. and a few other brands of controllers that I am looking into. I also intend to go DWC for the first time with this room. For veg and flower.
 

CantKeepMe V

New Member
http://www.hydroinnovations.com/pdf/14032011-CoolingSystemChart R2.pdf

Check that out for calculating how many BTU you have to counteract. I suggest you use cool tubes, and exhaust light heat out of the CGE. Forget about the fact that it's not technically a CGE like that. Counteracting that heat would be pointless. You'd most likely need two 18k btu mini splits. How is that worth it for one room?? Quick answer, it isn't!

DWC, make sure you chill the root zone. 62-68* F

Also, the AQ-100 I was talking about hooks up to a computer via USB and it logs temp/humidity & CO2 on a very easy to read graph..via a computer

 

Undergrad

New Member
I currently have air cooled hoods but I just don't see any way to pull air from outside and exit it the same way from my garage. I am not sure how other people achieve this without cutting holes in exterior walls?
My last exhaust set up vented through the attic above the room and was detectable even when scrubbed 3 times. I have thought about using the attic again but I feel (could be wrong) that after running the lights for probably an hour the attic will fill with hot air and negate any attempts at cooling the lights since its basically a loop where air just drifts out of passive venting in attic, trying to run enough ducting to reach the exterior vents would probably negate the ability to draw air through the hoods.
I am looking for any thoughts on this venting via outside air situation, so please feel free to chime in!!
I will calculate the BTU but with my current light set up I would need about 18k BTU cooling and intend to probably go 1 size up just in case. It is only a 1 car garage running just over 5k watts of light 4k in flower 1k in veg but before I buy I will be calculating over and over. The computer hookup via usb sounds like a nice feature.
Chill the root zone, got it!
 

Vapedogg223

Nug of the Month: June 2012
If you can frame up a wall and wrap it with panda plastic there are zipper systems that will make a door in a solid wall of plastic just stick and cut. Probably the most efficient way to split a room, create entries to put on a bee keeper suite etc. I have done a couple rooms this way before it works great and is cost effective as well. It should be easy enough to seal plastic to plastic with the walls and flooring being 6vmil panda plastic.
I am working on the same issue but I have a bit more space, I also have 10' ceilings. I am going to attempt to essentially "finish of" the garage by framing a wall across the garage door area, insulating it drywalling it etc. I feel like my old flower area was not well defined and did not take advantage of the equipment so I will frame off the flower section this time and wrap it with plastic, floor to ceiling.

On my old grow I essentially split my garage in half with plastic and flowered in one half and veg'd in the other. This time I will do the same thing with a finished room which should help with temps in summer and winter, along with sealing the room and using climate control.
I hope to find a dual zone unit for the AC but if I can figure a way to loop the A/C'd air through the veg area and back again that might make a single zone unit doable but I am going to avoid cutting corners if possible. I am going to use an environmental controller for sure to run the C02 and the A/C etc. I might look into running outside air through my lights in the winter. I run my flower room at night to avoid heat right now but as anyone thats done this before knows sometimes you just go for it and deal with issues as they arise.
Hopefully we can get someone else with some experience to chime in soon! I will start posting some pictures of my area as it stands now this week sometime.
Thats sort of what I'm using now...panda film and tarp zippers. The main thing I don't like is that the zippers seem to want to come off the plastic over time and I'm always adding tape and pressing them back down. Also the zippers ive been using are not light proof, so you do need some type of "airlock" or atleast two layers of the plastic with staggered zippers...

Have you looked into a mini split a/c system? You can get a 13 seer unit for around $700 or $800 if I remember right. This would be big enough for your grow unless you've got a garage full lol

I'm currently putting together a CGE, although it's in a 80x25x40 cabinet, flower in the top & veg in the bottom.

Good luck with your operation.

To control CO2 look into an AQ-100 from CO2meter.com as well as the digital relay board (Found under the AQ500) to turn on the co2. It could also be used as a method for controlling anything pertaining to temp/rh as well.

Inside the AQ-100, when taken apart you find a slightly limited AQ-500 inside with the K33 RH/temp/co2 sensor piggybacked inside.
Hey CantKeepMe V,

I looked into the mini splits, I might still decide to go that way, but I like the idea of a sleeved, through the wall unit for one big reason...if it breaks down I can go out and grab any through the wall unit that will fit in the sleeve, replace it, and be back up and running in less than and hour (give or take...).

Also, I'm looking at the Sentinel CHHC-4 because it's an all in one controller. You plug your A/C unit, your CO2 generator, your heater, and a humidifier or dehumidifier into the controller. Then you program it for what temps, CO2 ppm, and/or humidity you want for lights on, and what temps, CO2 ppm, and/or humidity you want for lights off. The controller has one sensor that takes all the readings, and has a photo cell. You hang it in the canopy, it knows if the lights are on or off and controls everything accordingly.

There are a lot of disadvantages to growing indoors...light (or lack thereof)probably being the biggest. The biggest advantage is being able to control the environment (and very precisely if done right). I've been able to make it work pretty good so far in my current grow space without an environmental controller, but I have become convinced it can be done much better and with way fewer headaches with an all-in-one controller.

I currently have air cooled hoods but I just don't see any way to pull air from outside and exit it the same way from my garage. I am not sure how other people achieve this without cutting holes in exterior walls?
My last exhaust set up vented through the attic above the room and was detectable even when scrubbed 3 times. I have thought about using the attic again but I feel (could be wrong) that after running the lights for probably an hour the attic will fill with hot air and negate any attempts at cooling the lights since its basically a loop where air just drifts out of passive venting in attic, trying to run enough ducting to reach the exterior vents would probably negate the ability to draw air through the hoods.
I am looking for any thoughts on this venting via outside air situation, so please feel free to chime in!!
I will calculate the BTU but with my current light set up I would need about 18k BTU cooling and intend to probably go 1 size up just in case. It is only a 1 car garage running just over 5k watts of light 4k in flower 1k in veg but before I buy I will be calculating over and over. The computer hookup via usb sounds like a nice feature.
Chill the root zone, got it!
I envy you man! I wish I had the space for 5000 watts!!!

I lucked out because the room I'm converting is in the basement and was used as a summer kitchen. I have gas already there from the stove, my air intake is an 8" vent where the old stove had an exhaust and theres an unused chimney that I will be exhausting the hot air out through, and the A/C unit can go in what was a window.
 

Undergrad

New Member
Good stuff Fratdogg223!!
Ahh to have a basement..
I intend to go with an all in one controller myself. My local shop sells the Sentinel and I will probably be getting the same one you are looking at.
 

burtburt69

New Member
To control CO2 look into an AQ-100 from CO2meter.com as well as the digital relay board (Found under the AQ500) to turn on the co2. It could also be used as a method for controlling anything pertaining to temp/rh as well.

Inside the AQ-100, when taken apart you find a slightly limited AQ-500 inside with the K33 RH/temp/co2 sensor piggybacked inside.
Hey. I joined this site cause I saw your post on the AQ100. I bought one of these and looked under the hood. I see two locations for what seems like G5V-1 relays.

Was planning on using this with a UPB I/O device to control a UPB appliance outlet for the CO2 solenoid.

Wanted to know your set up...

Also, I tried to download the AQ500 software and use it to program the AQ100 but am having some issues. Have you gotten any documentation from CO2 meter on the AQ500 schematics or anything?

Please hit me back. I got to 2x600w in a 5 x 5 with 2x8" Iceboxes ready to go. I just need to work out this AQ100. It looks like a great option if it works.
 
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TorturedSoul

Member of the Month: May 2009, Oct 2010, Sept 2017
I see two locations for what seems like G5V-1 relays.
That's one of them on the bottom-right corner of the device, isn't it?

Interesting piece of kit.
 

burtburt69

New Member
Yeah. That's where I got the PN from. You can find them by google searching under shopping.

It looks like they are powered by the transistors just above them. This circuit is intact in the AQ100 even though it's a picture of the AQ500.

The problem I'm having is programing the threshold triggers for the relay.

The software isn't working right...

Trying to see if anyone else has had success with these. Again could be awesome or a complete waste of money. Haven't figured that out yet :)
 

burtburt69

New Member
ok. I was able to change the thresholds for CO2 to trigger relay2. one on the end...

i set it to 0-1200, exclusive, relay 2, on sensor 0.



this image doesnt show the right fields but you get the point... the program sets when the relay fires. which is basically a 1amp switch.
 
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