JCool09 Cabinet Hydro Caramelicious 9/2009

[jcool09]

hi JCool good progress so far.
How often are you foliar feeding? I was poking thru Cervantes Grow Bible a while back and recall he recommended once every ten days for foliar feeding. One thing that might be helpful, he did suggest misting with water before feeding to help condition the leaves for feeding and again 30 minutes or so after feeding to help leaves absorb nutes that may have dried on the leaves rather than been absorbed.
Of course he was discussing mature plants but might be even more critical for tender seedlings. My personal choice is to spray heavily enough to rinse any residue 30 minutes after feeding.
Hope the burn goes no further. good luck

Good to know Mmmmick. I was feeding too frequently and did not take any of the precautions you mentioned. I need to read up on these techniques before I resume. for your insight.

 

[McBudz]

Good news first

The three youngest seedlings are all looking well.

CAR2 - Day 3 - 10/08/09

UNK2 - Day 5 - 10/08/09

UNK1 - Day 6 - 10/08/09

This may be the last time I will be able to remove UNK1 from it's hole, roots were already difficult to get back in. They may fit better once they elongate and hang straight down. The root growth was different on this plant due to placement in the bubbler immediately after germination. By comparison CAR1 was six days old and had already poked a root out of the bottom before it went into the bubbler. All of the current CAR1 root development is from the bottom of the netpot.

Now for the bad news

I have some burning on the oldest and largest leaves of CAR1. This started with the lowest set of leaves and at the tips of the biggest set several days ago. You can see in this and earlier pics how the tips of the biggest leaves were turned down. There were too many variables introduced at the same time to be 100% sure of what is happening but I believe that it is a combination of:

Lights lowered to approx. 6" for a day from 10/06/09 - 10/07/09
- Lights raised back to 12" yesterday morning after spread of burned area was noticed.

Foliar feeding. 3x on this plant 10/01/09 , 10/03/09, 10/06/09. Think that's too much...? It felt so good while I was doing it... Duhhh...
- Cut that sh*t out for now. Patience.....

Perlite had Miracle Gro in it. DOH! I found this out a couple of days after putting it on top of the netpots. I had rinsed it well but I was not 100% sure that it was all gone. I was not very concerned at first because I was not watering from the top so I thought that any small amounts of MG that remained in the perlite would be negligible.
- Removed perlite, flushed STG cubes with H20, installed Hydroton pebbles on 10/05/09.

I also verified and adjusted:

PH
- Was slightly low last night, adjusted back into range.

Nutrient solution
- PPM was 240 or .28 of full strength. No adjustments made.

CAR1 - Day 16 - 10/08/09

Hopefully the burn will not spread any further; if it does I'm afraid I could lose the plant. The good news is that the burn is on the older growth which to me indicates past rather than current trauma. As always I would appreciate your thoughts and comments.

last pic looks a bit like old trauma. Closer inward toward the growth tip its pretty healthy looking. Just take it easy on the nutes and flush with plain RO pH adjusted water if this occurred with the current nutrient mix.

 

[Tead]

I tried foliar feeding a while back. I used a very low solution of my regular nutes. I wish I could remember my mix... but I know it was under 25%. Burnt the crap out of several babies real quick. If you plan on using foliar feeding in the future, I'd start low and test on a leaf or two, of maybe on 1 plant.
I'm a bit confused by your nute plan. You're using 25% mix in your tank to avoid burning your babies, but then you're spraying additional nutes on your leaves? Perhaps I'm not understanding what you're doing.

Seems like you could try a good flush to try to save them, but they're mighty small... you might be better off starting a new set of seedlings if possible. It might be quicker and you could avoid any stress related issues that might pop up later.

Beautiful cab design and implemetion! Very clean and functional!

Cheers!

 

[jcool09]

last pic looks a bit like old trauma. Closer inward toward the growth tip its pretty healthy looking. Just take it easy on the nutes and flush with plain RO pH adjusted water if this occurred with the current nutrient mix.

Thanks McBudz, that sounds like a plan. I appreciate your help.

 

[McBudz]

I tried foliar feeding a while back. I used a very low solution of my regular nutes. I wish I could remember my mix... but I know it was under 25%. Burnt the crap out of several babies real quick. If you plan on using foliar feeding in the future, I'd start low and test on a leaf or two, of maybe on 1 plant.
I'm a bit confused by your nute plan. You're using 25% mix in your tank to avoid burning your babies, but then you're spraying additional nutes on your leaves? Perhaps I'm not understanding what you're doing.

Seems like you could try a good flush to try to save them, but they're mighty small... you might be better off starting a new set of seedlings if possible. It might be quicker and you could avoid any stress related issues that might pop up later.

Beautiful cab design and implemetion! Very clean and functional!

Cheers!

yes its always a good idea to test an inconspicuous area of the plant before spraying everything down. I personally don't foliar feed nutes to my plants. While leaves will take in nutes I feel like they weren't made to do this. If I do foliar anything its strictly stuff that was meant for foliar application or for pest management, azatrol, neem, etc etc.

 

[jcool09]

I'm a bit confused by your nute plan. You're using 25% mix in your tank to avoid burning your babies, but then you're spraying additional nutes on your leaves? Perhaps I'm not understanding what you're doing.

Perhaps I was not understanding what I was doing... Doesn't really make sense in hindsight. My thought at the time was to do a mild foliar feed while the plants roots were still developing. In my attempt to help I was a bit heavy handed and AGAIN did more harm than good.

Seems like you could try a good flush to try to save them, but they're mighty small... you might be better off starting a new set of seedlings if possible. It might be quicker and you could avoid any stress related issues that might pop up later.

Wow, really? Only the oldest plant shows any damage. I should probably see these through so I can keep learning what not to do next time.

Beautiful cab design and implemetion! Very clean and functional! Cheers!

very much for the compliment and for your advice, I really appreciate it.

 

[Tead]

I was thinking of the end product instead of seeing it as a learning grow. I don't know what the odds are that you'll get hermies, but since you're at such an early stage, starting from scratch would avoid those risks. As a learning tool, I can see your point.

If it were me, I, personally, would prefer to learn with healthy babies rather than plants that are challenged.

my 2 cents

btw... I have that exact white cabinet... perhaps it's time to do some cabinet conversions. Thanks for the idea.

Cheers!

 

[McBudz]

I was thinking of the end product instead of seeing it as a learning grow. I don't know what the odds are that you'll get hermies, but since you're at such an early stage, starting from scratch would avoid those risks. As a learning tool, I can see your point.

If it were me, I, personally, would prefer to learn with healthy babies rather than plants that are challenged.

my 2 cents

btw... I have that exact white cabinet... perhaps it's time to do some cabinet conversions. Thanks for the idea.

Cheers!

I dont think he needs to start over.. I've torched a few young plants here and there. Once grown out enough I clipped the damage leaves and all went well. If it makee you feel better plant another in parallel but I would still see this one out.

 

[jcool09]

yes its always a good idea to test an inconspicuous area of the plant before spraying everything down. I personally don't foliar feed nutes to my plants. While leaves will take in nutes I feel like they weren't made to do this. If I do foliar anything its strictly stuff that was meant for foliar application or for pest management, azatrol, neem, etc etc.

Thanks for the tips on the foliar. I purchased high quality foliar products I just neglected to do the proper research before introducing them to the environment. This is my first grow in a long time and I have to keep from pushing the plants and just let them grow.

I was thinking of the end product instead of seeing it as a learning grow. I don't know what the odds are that you'll get hermies, but since you're at such an early stage, starting from scratch would avoid those risks. As a learning tool, I can see your point. If it were me, I, personally, would prefer to learn with healthy babies rather than plants that are challenged. My 2 cents.

Tead, I would love to have a great end product and I hope that I don't end up with hermies. I did not know that veg stress can cause hermies when flowering. That's very good info to keep in mind. As far as starting over with new plants I kind of did that since the first batch of seeds I tried to germinate were a flop (1/5 mostly my fault) and CAR1 is the only survivor. The other 3 plants are at various early stages from 4-7 days old and have not been subjected to the sh*t that I put CAR1 through. So it's kind of like I have started over in a way. Another concern I have about starting over is that without having gone through the entire process I will still encounter scenarios that may result in bad decisions next time. I already have some Feminized Super Lemon Haze seeds waiting for my next "perfect" (yeah, right!) grow. I respect your opinion and truly appreciate the time you spent reading and posting to my journal.

btw... I have that exact white cabinet... perhaps it's time to do some cabinet conversions. Thanks for the idea. Cheers!

I think it is time to take out a few shelves and make it all bright and shiny on the inside! Good luck and send me some pics when you're done.

I dont think he needs to start over.. I've torched a few young plants here and there. Once grown out enough I clipped the damage leaves and all went well. If it makee you feel better plant another in parallel but I would still see this one out.

Thanks, McBudz. It looks like I may have increased the chance of a hermie with the worst one but que sera sera. When life gives you lemons make Lemon Haze! I think I'm going to add that to my sig!

 

[jcool09]

I would like to thank all of those who have been reading and posting again, I really appreciate your support. Here is today's plant update:

CAR2 - Day 4 - 10/09/09

UNK2 - Day 6 - 10/09/09

UNK1 - Day 7 - 10/09/09

CAR1 - Day 17 - 10/09/09

CAR1 slight damage on new growth

CAR1 new growth is mostly healthy

 

[Mmmmick]

I would like to thank all of those who have been reading and posting again, I really appreciate your support.

looking perfectly healthy now that you're past that bit of burn, you should be fine. I don't think you need to foliar feed anymore unless you see changes that require fast action.
Lots of info on 420. if you feel the need to do something sometiimes a quick search can help with the process or even give a better approach to whatever you're planning. I'm sure any situation that these plants can encounter has been experienced by someone in these forums. Good resource once you get used to using it.

good luck

 

[Keith Lake]

Originally Posted by Soniq420
Geeking in to your journal with math support

Thanks, Soniq. Of the four plants two are Carmelicious (CAR) and two are Unknown (UNK). I may have a 15/16 chance of one female but as you illustrated in your two plant example I am reduced to a 75% chance of having a CAR female. Producing any bud would be nice but "The Goal" is to stay true to the title of the thread with the Caramelicious strain. I really appreciate that you are following my journal.

Maybe we need someone to geek in with remedial reading comprehension support for me

 

[jcool09]

looking perfectly healthy now that you're past that bit of burn, you should be fine. I don't think you need to foliar feed anymore unless you see changes that require fast action.
Lots of info on 420. if you feel the need to do something sometiimes a quick search can help with the process or even give a better approach to whatever you're planning. I'm sure any situation that these plants can encounter has been experienced by someone in these forums. Good resource once you get used to using it. good luck

Thank's for the comforting words Mmmmick. I think I'm going to hold off on the foliar for a while. I owe it to myself to read up on the foliar concepts before I attempt anything.

Maybe we need someone to geek in with remedial reading comprehension support for me

Dude, you can misread my thread all day long for all I care. What matters is that you're here and you're contributing.

 

[jcool09]

Hydro Update

I just swapped out the bucket with a clean one and loaded her up with a fresh batch of nutes.

H20
Crystal Springs
Baseline of 20 PPM

Aqua Vega A+B Grow
Full strength is 8ml each part per gallon
EC Range of .8 - 1.2 or 580 - 860 PPM (adjusted +20 PPM)

Used .25 dilution or 2ml each part per gallon
EC Range of .2 - .3 or 145 - 215 PPM (adjusted +20 PPM)

House and Garden Root Excelurator
Full strength is 1ml per gallon.

Used 1.0 dilution or 1ml.

PPM
Solution was measured at 190 PPM.

PH
PH came in slightly low with the AV and RE in solution. Added .125ml PH up to bring PH into 5.5-6.0 range.

I think I'm going to invest in a PH meter. I feel like I'm guessing at the measurements and I would really like to be able to track the changes on a more granular level. I bought the Hannah Primo PPM meter and love it; it's simple and it works. Can anyone recommend a low-cost PH meter that is reliable and easy to use/maintain?

 

[budlover3388]

hey jc i cant speak from experience but from the journals ive read people seem to mention ph600 milwaukee a lot.I googled it and it cost around 20 bucks and read nothing but good things about it in here @ 420mag.

 

[dgh420]

Great Journal!

 

[Tunes420]

Looking good

 

[jcool09]

hey jc i cant speak from experience but from the journals ive read people seem to mention ph600 milwaukee a lot.I googled it and it cost around 20 bucks and read nothing but good things about it in here @ 420mag.

Good to hear Budlover. I saw some similar comments in the product review forum and ordered one.

Great Journal!

Thank you dgh420. Good to have you on board.

Looking good

Thank you, brother grower. Much appreciated.

 

[jcool09]

Plant update

New growth continues to be vigorous but older growth is browning out. My assumption is burn from accumulated nutes. I have reduced the PPM down to 170 and also lowered the PH into the low 5s.

CAR2 - Day 8 - 10/13/09

UNK2 - Day 10 - 10/13/09

UNK1 - Day 11 - 10/13/09

CAR2 - Day 21 - 10/13/09

CAR1 and UNK1 were both FIMmed today after the pictures were taken. I could use some insight on the burning I am seeing on the older growth on CAR1 and UNK1.

 

[Tead]

Nutrient burn really takes quite a while to work thru your plant and show it's full fury. Most of the damage seems quite old already and the new leaves look fine.
IMHO, it looks like you've recovered well from it.

Cheers!