Leaf Problem On Flowering

[WiseTiger]

Strains: Kaya 75 ; White Kush
Soil: a mix with perlite I bought
Light: 2x 250w HPS
air intake 21ºc
air canopy hight around 26ºc to 28ºc
night temps 18ºc to 20ºc
Feeding water PH used to be around 6.5 to 6.8(I think, since I use PH paper test I had for urine and not a digital one) and I think the sickness started to show after I started feeding with this water from my well
changed to 6.2 to 6.5 PH water that I was buying and feeding before because of the sick plants
the nutes
N - 2
P - 13
K - 14

I also had the fan on the ground but wasn't fanning the mothers, only the 6 clones, I now hanged it from the ceiling to fan all over the canopy, and yesterday and today I only gave no-nute water to my plants.
The clones leaf tip are starting to become yellow, and the mothers have brown spots on theirs, besides having red stem yellow leaves... I'm worried

Pictures of the leafs
The nutes(spanish)

One of the clones starting to yellow on the tips

The mothers leafs

the signs might have started about 2 weeks ago
any ideas? changed the airflow to the upper part, changed the water I was giving them and cut on the nutes
I've seen the deseases chart and initially thought it was Mn problem, necrosis, red stems and yellow leaf... damn :/

Thanks

 

[Stealthboat]

It's either a ph imbalance or just overfeeding. Those nutes look strong on the P and K so overfeeding might have happened. But since your soil is a mystery I'll leave you with this: soil ph should be 6.5-6.8 and hydro/soilless should be anywhere from 5.6-6.2. And are you using anything for micronutrients? If not it's probably deficient in a few micronutes

 

[GreenUnity]

i've got almost the same problem as you..i'm thinking it's over feeding

 

[WiseTiger]

no micronutes besides the ones present in the flowering fert... maybe I'll buy one
2w ago I flushed and I think it started then, or at least the plants had yellow leaves a few days after (I'm studying away from my garden so I end being 2 to 4 days away from my garden sometimes and water them with a temporized pump)
and it was also on that flush that I started using tap water with the 6.5 to 6.8 PH... I thought nute block because PH turned some nutes unavaiable?! makes sense to me, is this right?

 

[Stealthboat]

Here's a good sticky with lots of good reading info: Cannabis Plant and Pest Problem Solver - Pictorial
And here a few pics that describe how ph work: nutrient availability charts - Blogs - 420 Magazine ®

 

[WiseTiger]

I decided to add a llittle vinagre on the water to lower the pH, since the simptoms seem to be Mn deficiency and Mn is more avaiable at acidic pH, I hope it works, the white kush is really bad looking and is the one I have the most expectations for, as an indica-mostly plant
the Kaya 47 is strong as hell and already has brown pistyls, besides it is a light feeder and doesn't need that much water

hoping for the best

 

[AKgramma]

it's going to take time for your plants to recover from nute burn. For ANY species of plant, nutrients that are too "hot" or given in the wrong dose will fry the veins in your leaves. Those leaves won't recover. It's a one-time-deal for leaves. They don't heal themselves. However, you can improve new growth by laying off the nutes for a month or two and see if healthy new leaves form. Use plain water and let the soil flush itself out.

After that, when the plant recovers, you can add 1/4 the dose for nutes up till the final flush before harvest.

 

[Weaselcracker]

I hate to confuse the issue- but, in case it helps.... I was having similar issues especially with one plant, and the other plants looked like they were heading down the road towards having the same problem. First appeared as burnt leaf tips and so I kept dialing back on the nutrients thinking it was nute burn. After flushing the problem got much worse. Eventually I gave all the plants a full feeding which stopped the spread of the deficiencies, and now they're doing fine -minus all the damaged leaves which I cut off. The one plant that was doing the worst was the one in the smallest pot. It was getting watered more often and because of the runoff I think it was getting the nutrients flushed out more than the other plants.
I posted a little bit about it on someone else's thread here -

Oh no! Problems so close to the end! Please Help!.

I realize this does make the list of possible causes slightly more confusing, but that's how these things are sometimes -confusing. I just posted this chance that it may help- because in my case I was totally stumped for weeks. Good luck mate!

 

[AKgramma]

what Weaselcracker said. ;-) I defer to the man with 1,165 posts!

 

[Weaselcracker]

Ha ha. Keep in mind I'm the guy who just had a bunch of deficiencies from under feeding my plants. To be honest though, underfeeding is a new one for me. It's always been overfeeding I had to keep my eye on. And I really didn't expect such drastic symptoms to appear from underfeeding. I thought they would just get slow growth and be 'weak' looking. Instead I had a lot of yellow and black leaves, tips curling up, and they looked like shit. So I flushed them of course...

 

[AKgramma]

Ha ha. Keep in mind I'm the guy who just had a bunch of deficiencies from under feeding my plants. To be honest though, underfeeding is a new one for me. It's always been overfeeding I had to keep my eye on. And I really didn't expect such drastic symptoms to appear from underfeeding. I thought they would just get slow growth and be 'weak' looking. Instead I had a lot of yellow and black leaves, tips curling up, and they looked like shit. So I flushed them of course...

Do you think some of the dosing problem is using artificial, rather than organic fertilizer? It seems that it would be too easy to burn the plants with too strong concentrated chemicals. Organics, if done correctly are much weaker by dose, but provide more long-term nutrition.

Curious as to your POV.

 

[Weaselcracker]

I think you are right. Though to be honest, I can't answer your question because I am just not expert enough. It's true that my outside garden plants and the plants in my greenhouse thrive on organic compost and manure and never seem to be as finicky as the indoor garden. They are also in a much more forgiving situation with large amounts of soil and don't experience pH problems because of the natural buffering qualities of real soil. My indoor plants are in pro mix which is kind of like the Wonder Bread of soils. Easily flushed and doesn't contain much in the way of nutrients or any buffering qualities. I'm using botanicare nutes for the cannabis, which is somewhat 'organic', for whatever that's worth. It definitely is possible to over fertilize with the nutrients I'm using, though I haven't had a big problem with this in the past. My problems arose because I recently started using a ppm meter and all of a sudden started getting confused, because it looked like my ppm readings were a bit too high at the feedings I had traditionally used-so I started dialing back on the nutrients, and then getting more problems. Live and learn... I'm not even sure that these botanicare 'organic' nutes suit themselves to a ppm meter. I may just revert to measuring everything out by the milliliter as I used to do

 

[AKgramma]

I think you are right. Though to be honest, I can't answer your question because I am just not expert enough. It's true that my outside garden plants and the plants in my greenhouse thrive on organic compost and manure and never seem to be as finicky as the indoor garden. They are also in a much more forgiving situation with large amounts of soil and don't experience pH problems because of the natural buffering qualities of real soil. My indoor plants are in pro mix which is kind of like the Wonder Bread of soils. Easily flushed and doesn't contain much in the way of nutrients or any buffering qualities. I'm using botanicare nutes for the cannabis, which is somewhat 'organic', for whatever that's worth. It definitely is possible to over fertilize with the nutrients I'm using, though I haven't had a big problem with this in the past. My problems arose because I recently started using a ppm meter and all of a sudden started getting confused, because it looked like my ppm readings were a bit too high at the feedings I had traditionally used-so I started dialing back on the nutrients, and then getting more problems. Live and learn... I'm not even sure that these botanicare 'organic' nutes suit themselves to a ppm meter. I may just revert to measuring everything out by the milliliter as I used to do

I'm getting a little philosophical here.... Each plant is an individual and we need to tune in on what each of our plants need, how they are responding, and when they "want" us to stop fussing with them. Once we start using meters and stop "listening" to the plants, we get into trouble. And so do the plants.

 

[Weaselcracker]

I'm getting a little philosophical here.... Each plant is an individual and we need to tune in on what each of our plants need, how they are responding, and when they "want" us to stop fussing with them. Once we start using meters and stop "listening" to the plants, we get into trouble. And so do the plants.

I agree with the sentiment completely about listening to the plants. Unfortunately it's not so easy to know what they are saying sometimes! Knowing the ppm I'm fertilizing at just seems like one more useful tool in figuring that out, not something that's going to make me one step removed. It's just my own lack of knowledge that's to blame in reading the signs. I don't have any regrets at all though, because I don't think there is any way I could have done things differently under the circumstances. It made sense to flush first before looking at the next possibility. I'm just very happy to have learned one more thing. I've been running a perpetual grow for five years straight- on and off grows before that-and pretty much feel like a new grower. In some areas I feel like I'm just starting to get stuff figured out. Growing two rooms as a perpetual, for personal use, I don't sweat it if things go wrong. There are always more plants coming, and it's all a learning curve for me. I actually enjoy most reading the journals where people face challenging problems and make mistakes. I admire the ones who can grow perfect plants without a hitch- but it's not my reality and I'm 100% fine with that for now. Now that I'm on 420 I'm learning so much faster than I ever did before.

 

[AKgramma]

So very true, especially at how much we have to learn from 420! It is really addictive to get on a thread and read every opinion, and soak up every way of getting to one's goal. Sometimes a whole day is gone just in reading posts!

 

[Weaselcracker]

Yeah it's addictive alright!
Part of my issue right now is personal circumstances that mean I have to be away from the grow a lot, and have very little time when I am there- so I actually have more time to read up on 420 than I do to spend at the grow.
Also- I have a dozen mostly new strains going at the moment, and between all the different strains, phenotypes, flowering stages, vegging, revegging, seedlings and clones- I'm stretched pretty thin. Listening to one plant is easier than listening to two roomfuls of plants of all ages- all shrieking at me at once in slightly different languages, lol... When I look back at how much I've learned since I stopped lurking on the forum and joined- I'm always grateful.

 

[WiseTiger]

I agree, altough I need my time to study and work on my essay's, I just wander on the forum reading stuff to learn more and more...
My nutes are organic, or at least that's what the package says, and I have always given then the lower recomended dose, so a burn isn't likely, right? Deficiency is probably the deal, besides I've been rethinking my waterings... I used to water every day with nutes, plants should be given time to feed on the nutes right? So they haven't soaked all I've given them, nute-blocked N wich was easy since I had little on my nutes right now and other deficiency's came along...

I've been giving them water with molasses only, gess molasses won't hurt the plants, and I'm buying micronutes tomorrow and giving them some on thursday