LED Grow Light Review

[diggler35007]

i purchased a tri-band off the net . they do not produce the lumens promissed . they work good for sup. lighting only. dont waste your time or money on it . unless you buy them big shits -like $2000.00. cant say about them though. mine cost $165.00 us dollhairs. shipping included.- better off with cfl's if the spectrums are right.

 

[rtgcel]

I have used these lights for over two years now and the results only get better. Run the lights on solar as well.

 

[TorturedSoul]

htgsupply.com

120watt LED.

Oh, that one. I thought you meant something new as in "recently created." I wasn't thinking; if that were the case you wouldn't have had prior experience with it lol. My bad.

Never really cared for HTGS. Nothing against someone trying to make a buck, but that guy's taken greed to a whole 'nother level. Still, such is the way of the world.

As far as that particular LED goes, if it works to your satisfaction, that's great. I haven't had the chance to use one although - IF it's the one that he's selling for $499.95 & that he mentions the PhD Botanist (a Dr. E.R. Myers, I believe) but doesn't list any real specs - I did get to see one for about 30 seconds before the guy's wife came home. Couple months later he'd sold it. Don't read anything into that though - he was about three days away from splitsville. People shouldn't attempt to hide things from their spouses lmao. So I never got to see whatever results he managed.

the 120 watt is rated for like 25 to 50 square feet. Better turn that back to about 4, 3 foot high plants in a square.

You mean four square feet? If that's how you'd compare it to 400 watts of HPS, the last time I ran numbers like that I was using CO2 injection/monitoring, semi-sealed chambers, and other things that I wish I could forget because knowing that I gave every bit of that particular setup away. Actually, I think it was 102 watts/sq. ft. but close enough lol. In a normal semi-hobby type setup I would be setup for 50-75 watts per.

Regardless, if you can consistently manage at least 8 ounces of well-trimmed & cured bud off of it or say 35oz. or more per year than I'd say it would not only hit the range of a really good 400-watt HPS setup but be worth investing in. Of course I read that you've not grown much with your setup so I understand that you wouldn't necessarily be expected to max it out production-wise on your first run. Or even your second, lol.

If you have a HPS bulb like a 600 or more, cops can see it plain and simple if they waNT TO. sure they may not have found you yet but if you get busted for somthing else or a neighbor turns you in, you better be ready for an infared scan...

Never been busted for drug-related "offenses" and the only arrests that did happen were LONG (as in decades) ago. I'm all grown up now, getting arrested (for anything) is for stupid punk kids. But I've partied with more than a few cops, K9 agents, etc. in the past 25 years. And one of them was nice enough to end my paranoia on THAT score about ten years ago when he bet $50 me he could pinpoint my grow within five feet the next time he did a flyover. Thermal properties, heat transfer, and the like aren't exactly black magic. Use a little common sense and put a little effort into design instead of slapping something together - which ought to be a given anyway whenever one is dealing with electricity and water in the same equation - and you'll find that you can easily set up an upper-story grow above which the snow won't even melt from your roof on a mild winter day; and a lower-story or below surface-grade grow which might raise the temperature throughout your entire home a couple of degrees (max) or add a little more load to your central air. Deal with the heat, keep the smell separate from the heat, understand the principles of electricity, load-balancing, & proper grounding, properly set up all your plumbing needs, and don't piss off the wife so badly that she decides that she'd like to see you rot in a 5' by 7' cell, don't leave empty hydroponics nutrient jugs lying around (or be caught carrying bags of soil in/out if you're a DIRTy guy lol) and you'll be fine. Assuming you keep your mouth shut & don't try to feed your ego, but that's common sense - like all the rest of it.

In short, grow with LEDs if you like. Do it because you like the challenge, because you can't afford the extra few bucks a month for electricity, because you like to play on the bleeding-edge, or because you wish to support the research (although, since typically only pennies out of the dollars spent on LED lamps are spent on research, you'd be better off just cutting a check just for research), etc. Just don't due it because you buy into the fear-mongering tactics of an ad-writer.

Ahh, well... At least you didn't say that HID lighting causes fires.

I keep waiting for them to come out with tri-band LED's. Not a tri band panel, but individual LED's that have 3 elements in them... red, green, and blue and have 4 wires coming out of the bottom (power for each element and a common)... these would allow you to control the spectrum of each individual LED and tailor your light output.

Sounds what you're looking for is a SUPER bright gigantic OLED. Me too. Maybe someday they'll get around to inventing one for us instead of the television, monitor, cell phone, and pda people.

In the meantime, have you talked to the folks at CREE?

Cree Introduces World's First IPx5-Rated Tri-Color LED for Full-Color Displays

DURHAM, N.C., JUNE 17, 2009 – Cree, Inc. (Nasdaq: CREE), a market leader in LED lighting, announces the first commercially available water-resistant, surface-mount, high-brightness LEDs for outdoor video screens. This RGB (red-green-blue) LED has an IPx5 rating, indicating that the LED is protected against low-pressure jets of water from all directions.

Cree Screen Master CLV6A-FKB LED"We've developed a water-resistant, red-green-blue LED that can be used in indoor and outdoor video screen applications," said Paul Thieken, Cree director of marketing, LED components. "Previously, LEDs had to be encapsulated to protect them from water. By incorporating encapsulation at the LED level, we can help our customers save time and money."

"Displ'aire, working with Cree, is changing the rules for LED displays," says Leo Stearns, Displ'aire's CEO. "Cree's involvement started with us early in our development cycle, and they provided the support we needed to rapidly deploy our new technologies. Displ'aire portable, daylight-visible displays and the new water-resistant Cree LEDs are a perfect technology match for creating brighter, more efficient displays that can better stand up to the elements."

Source:

https://www.cree.com/press/press_detail.asp?i=1245244814243

They also manufacture some really freaking bright LEDs:

Cree Announces Industry's Brightest and Highest-Efficiency Lighting-Class LED Cree to Demonstrate XLamp® XP-G LED, Features 132 Lumens per Watt Efficacy, at LIGHTFAIR International

DURHAM, N.C., APRIL 30, 2009 – Cree, Inc. (Nasdaq: CREE), a market leader in LED lighting, announces it is demonstrating the newest addition to its lighting-class XLamp® LED family–the XLamp XP-G LED–at LIGHTFAIR International in New York, May 5-7, 2009.

The cool white XLamp XP-G provides 139 lumens and 132 lumens per Watt at 350 mA. Driven at 1 A, the XP-G produces 345 lumens, which is 37 percent brighter and 53 percent more efficient than the brightest XR-E LED. The XP-G LED has the highest lumen density of any available lighting-class LED, and it is based on the XLamp XP family package.

"The XLamp XP-G again raises the level of performance available from our XLamp LED family," said Paul Thieken, Cree, marketing director, LED components. "This product is designed for customers requiring the highest levels of brightness and efficacy."

The XLamp XP-G LED is being demonstrated at Cree's LIGHTFAIR International Booth #1463. Cree is currently taking sample requests for the XLamp XP-G and targets the product to be commercially available the third quarter of calendar 2009.

Source:

https://www.cree.com/press/press_detail.asp?i=1241094842732

In fact, I thought those were the brightest LEDs in the world. But I was WRONG lmao. A... friend of a friend works with LEDs (building them from components they order to spec) and has for a few years, so he makes a point of trying to stay current with the industry.

It seems that a company called Luxeon actually makes the brightest and most efficient LEDs in the world. They've got a little module that puts out just shy of 32 times as much illumination as the top 1-watt "high performance" LEDs. Of course, that comes at a price, lol so I guarantee that they aren't currently in use in ANY of the LED lamps sold as grow-lights. They currently run $186.73 - not per lamp, but per LED module! Oh yeah, I believe that's wholesale pricing for LARGE lot orders. Still, imagine 100 of them specced to the wavelengths you designate in one fixture. Would be a little pricey at $18,673.00 (plus cost of associated components which would be negligable, considering).

But since looking at one module for a second or two will cause some severe vision "artifacting" for several minutes and likely a couple of days of feeling like you forgot to drop your shield while welding (sand in your eyes?), I'd guess that a lamp like that WOULD out-produce the sun over a small area.

 

[Jamahl]

LED light review with no pictures of plants grown under LED....yep youve convinced me.

 

[Tead]

I'm like... starting to be a bit amused by the strong opinions in both camps regarding LED's. Funny... well, funny to me anyway, but I've always been a bit twisted.

Cheers!

 

[Tead]

Yes... yes... let the war of words flow. I dance in the wreckage with devastation as my serenade!

Ok... I've taken a dark turn... time for bed.

Cheers!

 

[HydroGrowLED]

I'm currently running 1512W of LED over a 5' x 6' canopy (22 plants SOG). I personally designed the lights, and I also publish the NM I use without an issue.

Anyhow, the oldest plants in the pictures below, will be ready to harvest in 3-4 weeks.

 

[HydroGrowLED]

Nice Grow! I am pretty happy with my store bought LED's there in the same casing as yours but no custom spectrum. I am glad to see such a commercial like grow with LED!!

I wonder what all the nay sayers of LED are thinking??????

Just about everyone uses the same casing, but what LED's make up the light are where there are major differences. Aside from the spectral differences, I also use way more intense LED's than any other company, which allows for penetration all the way to the bottom of the plant. Most companies give you a 120 degree light, we make a 60 degree light. With their lights (and you know this already) 30-40% of the light created ends up on your walls where there are no plants. Our lights target all of that light downwards towards your canopy. My grow is one of several large-scale LED grows currently going on around here. My friends are loving the new lights.

 

[HydroGrowLED]

Yeah OK, I definatly get you on the 60 degree versus wide angle led. However in my specif senario, the walls are so close to plants Im prolly gettting 90% of my light

I checked out your site I like the selection, however heres my question. Your 63w system comes in the same case as my 120 watter. it has 114 1 watt led. why don't you max that container out and put in the 114 led's?

I ask this becasue I considered your lights but space is an issue for me. i don't wanna put a 63w light in the place where i could put a 120w

You've got an odd light then lol. Most MFR's make a 112 LED or 119 LED model for their "120W". If you look at our 126W Panel (the most comparable to their 120W), it is much larger, allowing for the light to cover more area with the 60 degree lens. When using 60 degree LED's, it is important to space them out in order to achieve a respectable coverage area per watt, and to do so evenly. If I were to cram 119 LED's into the same board as my 63W, then I'd still have the same footprint, but with way too much power. I had a design like that originally, which can be seen on my site. It was my beta light prior to my production models. My 119W light did a GREAT job at growing plants, but it had far too small a coverage area (especially in terms of cost). I saw right away that it could compete with a 400W HID no problem, but there was no way anyone would buy it if it could only cover 1' x 1.5'. Instead, the 126W covers 3' x 2', and beats a 400W without an issue. It has a much more respectable coverage area per watt, which gets difficult to achieve when you use narrow beam LED's.

Anyhow, most people are using at least an 8 square foot grow space (4' x 2'), where they want to spread the wattage they have evenly over their area, instead of cramming it into 1 central source, and making it shoot out in all directions. We want people to use "sheets" of LED's over their plants, and get away from the central light for an entire room concept. It's almost like the difference between using a single 1000W light, or 3, 400W lights. Granted, if you're growing in a tiny area, and want a lot of light within that space (almost 100W LED per square foot), I could always make you another beta light lol. But as it sits, the 63W gives you about 30-40W LED per square foot, depending on height. The 126W gives you 20W - 35W LED per square foot, and the 318W gives you 40 - 55W LED per square foot. That's a lot of light within each unit's coverage area, which guarantees that you'll always have great results. If I used 120 degree LED's, in an enclosed area, even if the light does bounce off the walls, it is still not as bright of light as what is emitted in a 60 degree beam. Penetration is key to a successful bloom.

 

[HydroGrowLED]

3W LED's have a lower lumen per watt rating vs 1W LED's. It's commonly misinterpreted that 3W or 5W LED's can actually carry light energy farther than a 1W LED, however if you call any major LED MFR (Cree, Luxeon, Osram), they will tell you that it is not true. They will also tell you that in terms of lumens per watt, it is currently a lot more efficient to use multiple 1W LED's, sometimes by more than double! So while 3W and 5W LED's are nice in theory, they're not currently practical in application.

A few of my customers thus far are growing in small closets/boxes that are no more than 2' wide, and no more than 4' long. When they want to pack the most power into their area, I recommend the 318W. In my opinion, using any more LED light per square foot than what it puts out, is overkill. Depending on how large of an area you will be growing with, I would make a personal recommendation to you about how to setup your lights and which to use. If you still wanted to do things differently, I'd have no problem making a couple of custom units for you. I already have all of the design work finished and tested, it's pretty easy to get more made. Based on your plant height though, you'll likely want to use a 30 degree LED, unless you don't care about the bottom 12" of your plant. It's not that the 60 degree can't go that far, it's just that when it gets there it doesn't have much energy left to penetrate the lowest buds, meaning they will be rather small.

 

[HydroGrowLED]

The 318W is 34" long, so do you have a 30" area? As far as the cases go, they're the same as you find anywhere else, but my competitors put 300W on the same board as my 126W, and 600W on the same board as my 318W. The side thickness is only about 2" all the way around, and the light itself is 3.5" thick (heatsink, LED's, plexiglass, power supplies, fans). Anyhow, at what height do you begin bloom? I personally start at 18", and my plants never top 3', although most stay under 2.5'. I top them about 3x before they go into bloom, making nice little bushes with lots of head colas.

 

[Droopy Dog]

I've been watching this thread and also SFHaze's Journal using the Haight LED set up.

Anyone else use the Haights? They recently became a 420 sponsor. Questions there also, like is their heat sinking so good, that's why they don't use fans? I'd be talking about that, WHY they don't need fans

I've been following LEDs somewhat for years, but mostly in terms of flashlights a la candlepowerforums.

I'm sold on LED, but still, there are a lot of questions here and not many hard answers.

DD

 

[HydroGrowLED]

I've been watching this thread and also SFHaze's Journal using the Haight LED set up.

Anyone else use the Haights? They recently became a 420 sponsor. Questions there also, like is their heat sinking so good, that's why they don't use fans? I'd be talking about that, WHY they don't need fans

I've been following LEDs somewhat for years, but mostly in terms of flashlights ah la candlepowerforums.

I'm sold on LED, but still, there are a lot of questions here and not many hard answers.

DD

LED's are chips, which require certain operating temperatures in order to achieve maximum brightness, and longevity. Failure to operate a LED at it's appropriate temperature can result in drastically reduced life and lumen output. Think of a LED chip like your computer processor: if it didn't have a heatsink on top of it to get rid of the heat it creates, and then a fan to pull the heat off the heatsink, the processor would run much slower, and eventually burn up. It's the same thing with LED's: you run em hot, and they'll burn out over twice as fast. This would be great if I wanted people coming back to me in 2 years to buy another panel, but I'd rather they be able to get 5+ years out of our lights.

Our 126W unit measures 19" x 12.5" and weighs 20lbs. Over 10lbs of that, is taken up by our high quality heatsink that is attached to the back of the LED board. We also use high quality Japanese made cooling fans, to make sure that they operate flawlessly, and economically for years to come. Our design allows you to get longer life from the LED's, and allows them to achieve maximum brightness, which is why you get a 3 year warranty with our product. Marijuana has peak absorption points at 439nm, 469nm, 642nm, and 667nm, with peak Carotenoid absorption points at 439nm and 483nm. Missing any of these points will have a dramatically negative effect on the outcome of your crop. We give you 440nm, 470nm, 640nm, 660nm, 740nm, and 3000k white.

I'd be more than happy to facilitate some sort of friendly grow-off between our panel and theirs (depending on whether or not they'd accept the challenge), so you all can see the difference. It would be nice to find a good member from this forum who could carry out the test. I'd want to put my 126W against their PPF-800 (that's a 126W $400 panel vs a 186W $750 panel). As it is already, watt per watt, we come out about $2 cheaper ($450 for 90W Haight = $5/W, $400 for 126W = $3.17/W), so it would make it a lot of fun for me to have the cheaper panel come out on top. We're confident in what our light can do, I hope they are equally as confident in theirs.

And by the way, any questions you have, I'd be more than happy to answer. I'm extremely knowledgeable when it comes to LED's and growing plants with them.

 

[Bolivar]

HydroGrow, what's the explanation of the folks who had good results vegging with LED lamps, but couldn't get decent flowering with them? I just recently read a journal here where the guy basically gave up after an excellent start to his grow because he couldn't get them to really flower. (Sorry, don't remember whose lamps he was using.)

 

[HydroGrowLED]

HydroGrow, what's the explanation of the folks who had good results vegging with LED lamps, but couldn't get decent flowering with them? I just recently read a journal here where the guy basically gave up after an excellent start to his grow because he couldn't get them to really flower. (Sorry, don't remember whose lamps he was using.)

First, it's hard to group LED's together, as there are literally hundreds of combinations that make up the grow lights you see on the market. Some lights are only red/blue, others are red/blue/white, others are red/blue/orange, then you have quad-band, 5-band, and a whole bunch of other "band" branding going on, where they refuse to tell you the spectral output of their lights.

Anyhow, the main reason most LED lights aren't capable of flowering well, although they work alright in bloom, is that they lack 660nm, which is the main drive engine for flowering. A lot of companies just give you 630nm, which barely stimulates one type of chlorophyll, as the absorption point for our plants is at 642nm, not 630. So a plant can carry out vegetative growth without 660nm (although it won't be anywhere near as good as it is with 660nm), but it can't do without it for bloom. The reason why other lights don't bloom well, even though they contain a 660nm LED, is that they use 120 degree LED's, which lack the intensity needed to penetrate your canopy. Without penetration, you can never have large, dense colas. Either that, or they had horribly improper ratios of colors. And by the way, anyone trying to sell you a light with orange, is just after your money.

 

[Droopy Dog]

Thanks. I'll have questions, but need to get my thoughts organized so I don't sound like a total idiot.

The grow off sounds like a really neat idea.

DD

 

[Bolivar]

Just doing some calculations in my head, I can see that 3 of the 63W units placed side-by-side in a row (long axis of the units perpendicular to the long axis of the grow tubes) would probably be a nice coverage for an AeroFlow2 18, which is the system I'm about to start using. I've already got HID set up, but now I'm thinking about trying LEDs once I get a complete grow under my belt.

 

[Droopy Dog]

I'm looking at a 4'x4' ebb and flood, SOG, cuttings at ~6" to flower.

DD

 

[HydroGrowLED]

Just doing some calculations in my head, I can see that 3 of the 63W units placed side-by-side in a row (long axis of the units perpendicular to the long axis of the grow tubes) would probably be a nice coverage for an AeroFlow2 18, which is the system I'm about to start using. I've already got HID set up, but now I'm thinking about trying LEDs once I get a complete grow under my belt.

Yes, the 63W units are fairly narrow, making them excellent light sources for those types of aero systems. With LED you'll have higher chances for success, as there is no heat stress to worry about, you can get the lights nearly as close as you like, and your plants use less water (not to mention the power savings).

 

[BWC BayArea]

bigtires001 Start LED Grow Light Journal

This has been a debate on this site for some time. By all means if u have had great success and know what ur doing with LEDs PLEASE start a journal >Journals in Progress - 420 Magazine. If u can back up ur claim that ur light can do what Tortured Soul can do with a 400W we need to see this. U will probably have one of the more popular journals for having mastered somethin no one else here seems to have done. LEDs don;t seem to finish well for NE 1 else. Please share bigtires001, now I'm intrigued. HydrogrowLED if u have something to share please do. U can start a journal too. I'm not trying to be facetious, I'm serious.