Motafina Fall 2018: Damnesia, Chemdawg & Royal Cookies

[MotaFina]

I harvested Damnesia 2 tonight and began flushing Damnesia 1. D2 was huge, and D1 is even bigger. I won't be surprised if I get a full lb. out of those two combined. I'm totally beat from trimming...

 

[BluePhoric]

220+ grams per plant ! That's impressive!

You did 52 days veg time? Must help in getting this kind of harvest...

I vegged 35 days on this grow. Even so, WW became a bit too tall/big for my setup.
2 weeks more in Veg and it would have been a tree I guess ;-)

P.S.: Trimming is a pain...
BP

 

[MotaFina]

220+ grams per plant ! That's impressive!

You did 52 days veg time? Must help in getting this kind of harvest...

I vegged 35 days on this grow. Even so, WW became a bit too tall/big for my setup.
2 weeks more in Veg and it would have been a tree I guess ;-)

P.S.: Trimming is a pain...
BP

I flipped to 12/12 on day 66 from when the seeds went into paper towels. I don't count the seedling stage as part of the veg stage.

Those numbers aren't in the bag yet, but I'm sure it'll be close. Here's a shot of a couple of the colas:

D2Buds.JPG

• MotaFina
• Dec 3, 2018

D2 buds

 

[BluePhoric]

Nice buds ;-)

I start counting days of veg as soon as germinated and put into solo-cup with soil/coco...

Your veg would be ~63 days with my way of counting... if 3 days germinating.

When do you decide seedling stage is over and veg starts ?
BP

 

[MotaFina]

Honestly I'm kinda confused on how to count days. Probably do it different every time. I start counting veg days around when I have the 2nd set of true leaves starting to show...around 8 days or so.

But something always seems to mess up the timing. Like right now I've got three seedlings showing second set of leaves, and two seedlings that haven't popped out of the dirt yet. So when to start counting?

 

[BluePhoric]

Well... I germinate under dark. As soon as i put the seedlings under lights... It counts as vegging, for me.

As for flowering...
- I refer to "days since flip" for reference in my grow log.
- I wait 7-10 days after flipping before I count "flowering days", to better match the breeder's expected flowering days.

So if White widow i supposed to b ready in 54 days of flowering, I'm counting ~64 days after flip.
BP

 

[Far East Buds]

To me......

Vegging is less about time and more about size. I put in plants to flower 100% based on size. With clones... seeds... etc there are too many variables in veg to go off time.
Heck people argue over when flower starts.. When flipped to 12/12? or when pistils show.?

The larger the plant in veg the larger the yield from flower. But yes most people don't have the space indoors

Peace

FE

 

[BluePhoric]

To me......

Vegging is less about time and more about size. I put in plants to flower 100% based on size. With clones... seeds... etc there are too many variables in veg to go off time. Heck people argue over when flower starts.. When flipped to 12/12? or when pistils show.?

The larger the plant in veg the larger the yield from flower. But yes most people don't have the space indoors
FE

Circumstances...

Often there is an horizontal or vertical space limitation, sometimes schedule restrictions, sometimes a lighting limitation, etc.

Some may plan for 3 grows from September to May, then several smaller plants maybe good (SOG style). Their "yearly" yield may be very good that way. Would 2 grows with bigger plants yield more ?

About a longer veg time (indoor grow) : The longer you wait, the taller/bigger the plant will get, and the bigger the yield.
BUT the lights can only penetrate so deep, and there is a point of diminished returns. Less so with a 1000W hps... but LEDs or CFLs (worse)... I think for the majority, 4-6 weeks veg is ideal.

For me (with my current setup), if having a very healthy plant from the start, and if I make no mistake and the environment is well controlled, I think my preference would be a ~3 weeks veg. If the start is difficult (current grow), than a week more.

BP

 

[MotaFina]

Along these lines, I've been thinking about what is the most efficient use of the 4x4 tent and my current MH/HPS lights. I've tried 2 plants in 10-gal pots and 4 plants in 7-gallon pots. I would like to try a SOG setup with something like 15 plants in 1-gal, or maybe 9 plants in 3-gal, but I also have to consider possible legal impacts with that setup. For now, 4x7-gal seems best.

For length of veg, I like to create a plant structure that supports about 15-20 colas. For me, that seems to take 7-8 weeks. I'm sure there's probably techniques I could try to improve on that.

 

[BluePhoric]

Along these lines, I've been thinking about what is the most efficient use of the 4x4 tent and my current MH/HPS lights. I've tried 2 plants in 10-gal pots and 4 plants in 7-gallon pots. I would like to try a SOG setup with something like 15 plants in 1-gal, or maybe 9 plants in 3-gal, but I also have to consider possible legal impacts with that setup. For now, 4x7-gal seems best.

For length of veg, I like to create a plant structure that supports about 15-20 colas. For me, that seems to take 7-8 weeks. I'm sure there's probably techniques I could try to improve on that.

There are so many ways and techniques to fit one's goals...

But the idea of not-training (maybe one topping) the plants in a s.o.g and harvesting sooner seems appealing.
That method may also be interesting to :
- try several different strains in one grow
- search for the best pheno of one strain

A friend of mine has a two level growing space. On the top shelf, vegging seedlings, clones, etc. Bottom shelf : flowering plants. The bottom is protected from light with a curtain I think. The space is limited, but he's always cloning and growing permanently. He has about 7 strains going.

Lucky you, you can legally grow a few plants...
I'm in Canada and it's legal to grow... but not in the province of Quebec; They are so incoherent. ;-(

P.s.: Growing big plants in small pots is great, but they have to be watered all the time. A SOG with different strains... may require constant attention to watering too.

 

[Far East Buds]

There are so many ways and techniques to fit one's goals...

But the idea of not-training (maybe one topping) the plants in a s.o.g and harvesting sooner seems appealing.
That method may also be interesting to :
- try several different strains in one grow
- search for the best pheno of one strain

A friend of mine has a two level growing space. On the top shelf, vegging seedlings, clones, etc. Bottom shelf : flowering plants. The bottom is protected from light with a curtain I think. The space is limited, but he's always cloning and growing permanently. He has about 7 strains going.

Lucky you, you can legally grow a few plants...
I'm in Canada and it's legal to grow... but not in the province of Quebec; They are so incoherent. ;-(

P.s.: Growing big plants in small pots is great, but they have to be watered all the time. A SOG with different strains... may require constant attention to watering too.

These are all my beliefs and I stake no claim to be an expert.
This is what i do... I have been running perpetual for 4 years... 30 strains max.. 20 right now? I always have clones going to medium veg into large veg into flower...
I just restarted flower after a month cleaning and resdesigning some things... (Non stop 2 years)

Running 5 plants 10 plants 30 plants in flower, Yield will be based on your lights and their footprint. Scrogs are very effective because it increases the footprint of the light. If the plant environment is all good of course. Temp, Humidity, feed etc.

Some people opt for many plants and yield less on each. Some more yield each and less plants..

So veg needs to be based on that.. If you have room and a system to prop up a 2 pound plant and veg it long enough I believe it will do it. Light being critical for that footprint.

Veg is all based on staging the plant for the shape and size for your setup. When I had height issues in the past I vegged quick. Now that I am scrogging I have had plants in veg 6?8? weeks? that are not ready yet.. maybe even another week. Based on my lights and setup I am lollipopping and scrogging to give all the energy to the footprint. I was getting 220 grams or so avg each plant before. Time will tell with the restart but I expect more.

Again all my beliefs not facts... But I have been goin at this a minute... In veg I beat them up and get them the way I want... Flower I want SMOOTH. The less I manicure and manipulate in flower the better. But veg let it rip.. All you will do is slow down veg... For me that is fine.. The bottleneck is flower...

Peace


FE

 

[MotaFina]

Thanks BP and Far East for the conversation! I believe that max efficiency in a homegrow situation would be by using two spaces (veg and flower), plus a small cloning space, a single good-quality high-yield strain, mother plants and clones. If I were focused on producing as much produce as possible in the shortest amount of time, that'd be my setup.

For just flowering tent efficiency, I should probably try a SCROG. I've been hesitant to try it due to the lack of plant mobility that the SCROG enforces and then the difficulty of reaching to the back plants for watering and trimming. Plus the extra work to design, build and install the screen itself. But realistically, in this current grow, I rarely moved the plants and I figured out ways to reach back there for watering. Painful but doable.

 

[BluePhoric]

For the small artisanal grower like you and me, I think the most important is to have fun and be proud of the end result.

Trying things, changing techniques/setup once in a while is part of the fun, and after different experiments one can decide what suits him best.

P.S.:
With a few plants, one can do a LOT of training without using scrog. I too, dont like the scrog lack of mobility...

But then... training takes time, and it becomes boring. This time, after doing extensive training on the last grows, I decided I would just top the plant a few times. Worked wonders. Plant is taller than highly trained plant, but who cares. Results are excellent.

 

[MotaFina]

I'm having a bit of a problem with drying/curing. It's so dry here now that the hanging buds are bone dry on the outside within about 3 days....crispy and falling apart. But when I jar them at that point, they really moisten up in the jar then need to be taken out and laid out on paper or go into paper bags for hours at a time to dry out more. I'm afraid of ending up with grassy smelling buds. So this is my newest challenge.

 

[BluePhoric]

I'm having a bit of a problem with drying/curing. It's so dry here now that the hanging buds are bone dry on the outside within about 3 days....crispy and falling apart. But when I jar them at that point, they really moisten up in the jar then need to be taken out and laid out on paper or go into paper bags for hours at a time to dry out more. I'm afraid of ending up with grassy smelling buds. So this is my newest challenge.

Wine boxes = slower drying ;-)

Or anything that can "contain" the buds somewhat and keep water from escaping the buds to fast...
Big paper bags are ok too...

 

[MotaFina]

Yeah, I forgot about the wine boxes. I don't get out very often so haven't looked around for one yet.

 

[MotaFina]

Damnesia 1 is now harvested, dried and in jars.

I'm calling this a successful grow!

All these strains came out great. The Damnesia is amazing. The high seems consistent with my past grow. The Royal Cookies is a strange strain with no big buds, just very small, but very crystal nugs. And a strange, kind of earthy, fuel smell. The Chemdawg has an awesome smell and a great high.

Here's my yields:
Damnesia 1: 222.0 g - 7.93 oz
Damnesia 2: 249.7 g - 8.92 oz
Royal Cookies: 146.4 g - 5.23 oz
Chemdawg: 133.3 g - 4.76 oz
Total: 751.4 g - 26.84 oz

I got a lot of popcorn too - probably another 3-4 ounces of popcorn and sugar leaves that I'll make into hash. I think my next grow, I'll experiment with lollypopping to try to limit the popcorn. I don't really mind it but it makes trimming more work, and making hash is definitely a lot of work.

I'll post a full synopsis with bud photos before I close out this journal.

 

[BluePhoric]

Congrats ! You did get > 220g with each Damnesia !

Big yielding plants those Damn it seems, compared to the others...
Still, > 1.6 pound total !!!

I'll probably get my biggest yielding plant on this grow... Lots of nutes and the addition of HPS light... its a BUSH.
Can't estimate anything tho.

First grow was about 70Gr/plant, second grow was ~100... on cfls.
Should be well over 100gr this time ;-)

 

[BluePhoric]

Popcorn...
Do you find popcorn bud no good to smoke/vape ?

I think I'll do this, from now on :

I'll keep all the popcorn and good trim in a separate jar.

I only Vape. I always grind some quantity of buds at a time (they are still moist from the mason jar).
I put that pre-grinded quantity in small 35mm film cans (where it dries a little bit more; it vapes better).
When I vape, I use what's in the film can.

I think when I'll pre-grind buds, I'll always integrate some % of popcorn/trim. It'll be mixed in the film can.
I dont mind having 10-20% of that in my smoke.

Less hassle than making hash/cannabutter/whatever.

My freezer is full of cannabutter, rarely use it, will last forever.

BP

 

[MotaFina]

My problem with popcorn is with the trimming. I get tired of trimming the little leaves off the little buds, so I end up just lopping them off into a pile and then add them in with my sugar leaves. After an hour or so of trimming, what I consider 'popcorn' goes from dime-sized to quarter-sized. By the end of the trim job, I'm lopping off big ol' buds as popcorn, just to get done with the work!