Not having much luck with coco

[TheFertilizer]

So I'm just trying coco for the first time in hempy pots. The top is coco, the bottom reservoir is perlite. So far though I've been having trouble getting both clones or seeds to root.

At first when I planted clones, I pre-charged with about 220 PPM of Flora Nova Bloom and CalMag and pH'd to 6.1 (maybe). Those clones died within a bout a week, and I think I wasn't watering them frequently enough. Dug them up, no root development. I also suspected that perhaps the nutrients were too strong, or that my pH measurement weren't accurate because all I had was the drops and a cheap meter. So I bought a good meter (Apera PH-60), and started using plain water pH'd to 6.0 for another couple clones and so far only one of those is still hanging on, but it's rooting incredibly slowly.

With the seeds, I sewed them directly into coco, but I think I planted them a little too deep. After the 7th day they still hadn't sprouted, so I dug them up to get their cotyledons above ground. They didn't really do much after that, and since I thought I had been underwatering the clones, I started watering them every day with plain water pH'd to 6.0. Finally today one of them started yellowing on the cotyledons, and so I dug them up and they really hadn't done anything since germinating. The taproots were only about 1" long and had browned off and died. Meanwhile, I think I might have over watered them, because I noticed what looked like mold on one of the seeds. Was real fuzzy looking, so I thought maybe it could have been root fibers forming, but I don't think so because it was kind of concentrated at a weird section and the rest of the root looked dead so I'm pretty sure it was mold.

I also was sure to rinse the coco off really well. I tested some of the run-off tonight and it's only at 40 PPM so I don't think it being salty is the culprit. It's EarthJuice brand ProCoir if anyone has any experience with it.

I'm not really sure what I should try differently with seeds. Maybe planting shallower? Germinating in paper towel and then planting in the coco? I usually sew directly into soil pretty shallow and have great results, but this seems like a different animal. I have rockwool cubes too if I can germ in those, wait til they're pretty well rooted, and plant. But I kind of hate using humidity domes--I get mold real easy for some reason.

As far as my clones, I'm kind of suspecting that I just didn't have a strong enough root system established. I've planted clones with only a single 1" long root into soil and they do well, but I think soil has more water-holding than coco? I'm not really sure what could have made the difference there. I have one clone left that seems to be alive, but hardly thriving. I had flushed out the pot pretty well with plain water after worrying I burned them with the precharge, so I'm thinking perhaps 220 PPM could have been too much to start with too. This cut is from a very light-feeding sativa.

Here's what my roots look like before I transplant. Usually works in soil, but not gonna cut it in coco?

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• TheFertilizer
• Mar 15, 2019

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• TheFertilizer
• Feb 20, 2019

First roots

I have a few more unknown seeds to try with, and some plants veg'ing that I might be able to get more clones off soon to try again. But I'd like some tips before giving it another shot.

 

[Old Salt]

I don't know about the clones, as I have no room for a mother and her daughter plants.

With seed, I soak until they sink, and then they go between damp paper towels. When the tap root is about 10mm (3/8") long, I put them into the coco/perlite substrate. They go in tap root down, with about 6-8 mm above the seed case. The water I soak the seeds in is from my RO, has 0.3ml/l CALiMAGic added, and is pH adjusted to 5.8. I use that same formulation until the second set of leaves appear. Once the seeds are in coco/perlite, they get roughly 30ml (2 tbsp) of the nutrient solution per day.

Every seed that germinated, and been started this way, has made it through to harvest.

I mix expanded Canna Coco Bricks and perlite in a 70/30 ratio. The mix is flushed with pH 5.8 water until the run off is below pH 6.5. I then add 0.3ml/l CALiMAGic to the water, and water with 1/4 - 1/3 the volume of the substrate. I let it drain for several hours before planting the germinated seed.

I hope this helps. All I can say is that I've enjoyed success with this method.

 

[TheFertilizer]

I don't know about the clones, as I have no room for a mother and her daughter plants.

With seed, I soak until they sink, and then they go between damp paper towels. When the tap root is about 10mm (3/8") long, I put them into the coco/perlite substrate. They go in tap root down, with about 6-8 mm above the seed case. The water I soak the seeds in is from my RO, has 0.3ml/l CALiMAGic added, and is pH adjusted to 5.8. I use that same formulation until the second set of leaves appear. Once the seeds are in coco/perlite, they get roughly 30ml (2 tbsp) of the nutrient solution per day.

Every seed that germinated, and been started this way, has made it through to harvest.

I mix expanded Canna Coco Bricks and perlite in a 70/30 ratio. The mix is flushed with pH 5.8 water until the run off is below pH 6.5. I then add 0.3ml/l CALiMAGic to the water, and water with 1/4 - 1/3 the volume of the substrate. I let it drain for several hours before planting the germinated seed.

I hope this helps. All I can say is that I've enjoyed success with this method.

When I rinsed it, I used mostly tap water without pH adjusting it. 10 gallons. Then with the final 5 gallons I pH'd it to 6.

How often do you water? I've heard people say it's impossible to over-water with coco, but I feel like the seedling with mold on it kind of begs the differ.

 

[Old Salt]

Every other day until the seed breaks ground, then daily. As long as your containers are well drained it is hard to over water.

 

[MickFoster]

May I suggest Rapid Rooters for both seeds and clones? They are foolproof - I've been using them for over 25 years with great results.

 

[PE636]

I plant directly in coco or coco/perlite. 1/2 inch deep.. People do well with the paper towel and I have used it with success too, nothing against it but I realized out of a couple dozen things I grow, veggies and whatnot, well no paper towel needed for anything else soooo why would cannabis need that method? It seems like an extra step that just slows things down. If the seed is gonna germ its gonna do so regardless of being in paper towels or the medium.. I prepare my coco very much like @Old Salt, plant 1/2 inch deep, position irrelevant, she knows what to do.. Cover with plastic wrap, place in warm closet on top of the water heater for 2-3 days and enjoy. I don't water/feed till the original moistness is substantially gone, then gradually work up from a few mls to full runoffs by about 7 days above ground. This is in a solo cup btw. Good luck!

 

[TheFertilizer]

I plant directly in coco or coco/perlite. 1/2 inch deep.. People do well with the paper towel and I have used it with success too, nothing against it but I realized out of a couple dozen things I grow, veggies and whatnot, well no paper towel needed for anything else soooo why would cannabis need that method? It seems like an extra step that just slows things down. If the seed is gonna germ its gonna do so regardless of being in paper towels or the medium.. I prepare my coco very much like @Old Salt, plant 1/2 inch deep, position irrelevant, she knows what to do.. Cover with plastic wrap, place in warm closet on top of the water heater for 2-3 days and enjoy. I don't water/feed till the original moistness is substantially gone, then gradually work up from a few mls to full runoffs by about 7 days above ground. This is in a solo cup btw. Good luck!

This is pretty much exactly what I did (aside from pre-charing with calmag), but 7 days and they still hadn't broke above ground. That's when I dug them out, and then I started watering them before they had really dried out so I'm leaning toward over-watering.

I've germinated and sprouted lots of seeds in soil with no problem. Part of me just wanted to say it was a problem with coco except that plenty of people use it with success.

 

[PE636]

This is pretty much exactly what I did (aside from pre-charing with calmag), but 7 days and they still hadn't broke above ground. That's when I dug them out, and then I started watering them before they had really dried out so I'm leaning toward over-watering.

I've germinated and sprouted lots of seeds in soil with no problem. Part of me just wanted to say it was a problem with coco except that plenty of people use it with success.

You had them on a fairly warm surface? I find that makes a huge difference. 7 days is long though. They were sprouted when you dug them up? Could have damaged the root pretty easy at that stage if they got moved at all. Sounds like a little too deep or just really slow germinating. Ya I let them dry out fairly well the first few days before watering. Then start with like 5ml amounts from a syringe a couple times a day if there is a fan on them. Probably double that amount every two days til you're getting runoff is how I do it in solo cups.

 

[Barney86]

May I suggest Rapid Rooters for both seeds and clones? They are foolproof - I've been using them for over 25 years with great results.

Was just about to say the same thing. I wouldn't start a plant any other way. 100% full proof. I don't even water them to crack my seeds. They come wet enough anyway.

 

[gr865]

Every other day until the seed breaks ground, then daily. As long as your containers are well drained it is hard to over water.

May I add that with either seeds or clones, that using Great White and SubCulture II every watering will definitely be to your advantage. I grow in Smart Pots and even when the roots begin growing from the sides I still add both of those products every watering till I am ready to start flowering. Drop the SubCulture at that point but continue the GW weekly.

 

[TheFertilizer]

You had them on a fairly warm surface? I find that makes a huge difference. 7 days is long though. They were sprouted when you dug them up? Could have damaged the root pretty easy at that stage if they got moved at all. Sounds like a little too deep or just really slow germinating. Ya I let them dry out fairly well the first few days before watering. Then start with like 5ml amounts from a syringe a couple times a day if there is a fan on them. Probably double that amount every two days til you're getting runoff is how I do it in solo cups.

Ok sounds like I am giving then way too much water at one time as well. I was watering then to run-off from the start. I am in 2L soda-bottle Hempy so that equals like half a liter.

I will bust out the heating pad as well. I usually germinate on one but I think I decided that the 2L pots would be too big to heat. Maybe I will try something smaller and transplant later.

Was just about to say the same thing. I wouldn't start a plant any other way. 100% full proof. I don't even water them to crack my seeds. They come wet enough anyway.

Yeah I keep meaning to try them but always forget to buy any before I start planting. I might pick some up this time and put them in my clone dome on top of a heat mat.

May I add that with either seeds or clones, that using Great White and SubCulture II every watering will definitely be to your advantage. I grow in Smart Pots and even when the roots begin growing from the sides I still add both of those products every watering till I am ready to start flowering. Drop the SubCulture at that point but continue the GW weekly.

Great white is pretty much just mycorrhizae right? I have some Xtreme Gardening Mykos that is similar, but it's more of a powder you're supposed to dust in their roots.

I have some superthrive too I'd anyone thinks that might help?

Also are Jiffy peat pellets much different than rapid rooters? They're much less expensive at least. I do still have rockwool cubes. I can only find rapid rooters for like 20 bucks and that's a little steep since I already had to spend so much on a new ph meter.

 

[Aroxol]

I always start in 1.5” RW cubes for everything (seeds/ clones) and run both RDWC and coco. I just transplant the entire well rooted RW cube into solo cups of coco/ perlite and then pot up from there. Haven’t tried clones or seeds direct into coco, but RW into coco works stellar. Hope that helps.

 

[gr865]

Also are Jiffy peat pellets much different than rapid rooters? They're much less expensive at least. I do still have rockwool cubes. I can only find rapid rooters for like 20 bucks and that's a little steep since I already had to spend so much on a new ph meter.

I used Rapid Rooters for a while till I began using straight coco. You have to watch the salt level in peat pellets, so I have read.

 

[TheFertilizer]

Okay lots of great tips guys. I think I'm going to try to do some in rockwool, and maybe some rapid rooters later on down the line if I remember to buy some. I'm gonna try to do-over planting them straight into coco like I would with soil as well, and see if I just need a mulligan with that method. A little side-by-side action should sort things out. I've got some odd-ball seeds out of my outdoor from last year I don't mind dedicating to the purpose, just hoping to figure things out fast so I don't waste more weeks germinating garbage before I get my good stuff planted.

Anyway, only trying will tell now so, time to plant something. Thanks everyone

 

[Rich 3033]

Okay lots of great tips guys. I think I'm going to try to do some in rockwool, and maybe some rapid rooters later on down the line if I remember to buy some. I'm gonna try to do-over planting them straight into coco like I would with soil as well, and see if I just need a mulligan with that method. A little side-by-side action should sort things out. I've got some odd-ball seeds out of my outdoor from last year I don't mind dedicating to the purpose, just hoping to figure things out fast so I don't waste more weeks germinating garbage before I get my good stuff planted.

Anyway, only trying will tell now so, time to plant something. Thanks everyone

Hi, i hope it goes well for you the next round. I've had lots of success with seeds in coco and transplanting rockwool cubes into the coco.

For the seeds i always start them in a petri dish folded inside a damp paper cloth. This way you know a seed has developed a taproot 100% before it goes into coco (saves space too) . You can also place a sprouted seed into a rockwool cube and transplant this into the coco once the roots come out the sides.

With the watering i don't do it everyday. Let's say i transplant a germinated seed into dry coco, i place the root into the substrate and push lightly on the seed. Cover with a little bit of coco and water it to run off with a ph 5.5 - 5.9 nutrient solution and the E.C is 0.2. If i can see the seed head after then I cover it again.

I will next water it once the pot feels lighter. With coco i feed a nutrient solution every time. I find that mature plants will need a drink every 3 days, sometimes 2.

You won't kill a seedling by under watering unless the coco looks really light brown and the pot feels light as a feather. As long as you give them a drink before the pots are too light, you won't have a problem.

Edit- i forgot to mention I've only used canna coco professional plus, and now biobizz coco. Also i haven't done cuttings directly into the coco, i feel it a waste of time and space compared to the simplicity of rockwool cubes.

 

[Lowrider72]

Straight into Coco for the win.
Seeds in drink cups, no more than 1" down, water with root excelorator and water... No nutes, burns fresh tap roots.
put on drain tray, over tray filled with water on heatmat, under 6500k led house globes. Takes 3-7 days to sprout.

Clones- nute mix, 1/2 strength, water once as above. Cut from plant and Straight away into water, no wait, cells get damaged. Use razor.
Important to cut branches on clones with clean razor flush with stem and cut a long angle on main stem.
Straight into rooting gel, straight into coco, water. Leave. Do not water and put in humidity dome, spray every 3 days with foliar spray, weak.

100% clone success.
90-100% seed success depending on viability of seeds.

Hope that helps.

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• Lowrider72
• Apr 3, 2019
• 1

LR72

 

[TheFertilizer]

I went with the rockwool approach... So far 1 sprout in 3 days. Now I've heard I'm supposed to wait until I see the roots coming out of the sides of the cube to plant? I'm keeping it in a dome at about 70-80% humidity and 78-85F.

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• TheFertilizer
• Apr 7, 2019

 

[MickFoster]

I plant mine as soon as the taproot shows itself out the bottom.

 

[Barney86]

It's not a necessity to root them up like mad mate. Once there's a dozen or so decent roots poking out the bottom they're good to go.
I let them go as long as I can be bothered with. Current lot are getting about 5 weeks but just cos I had the time. Usually 2-3 weeks from seed. Not a necessary process for planting in pots but my NFT plants would really struggle if I didn't do it for them.

 

[Aroxol]

You definitely don’t have to, but I’ve found humidity helps and keep mine in until a fair amount of roots set. If you transplanted them, no biggie as I’m sure they’ll do fine, but for example, I still have these sitting in a dome.