Opioid Tapering With Cannabis: A Regimen

[Canyon]

I am now down to two doses a day of the Norco 5-325. I was able to completely drop the morning dose, then shuffle the noon dose to morning and space out the remaining dose to late in the afternoon.
So yesterday I took one full dose at 8 AM and one at about 4 PM, with no withdrawal effects. What I am still grappling with is the pain itself. I have a lot of it. I am still on the 250mg , 5:1 formula, and I am up to 1 mL doses 3 times a day. The dose itself works fairly well on the pain (bolstered by copious hits of Gorilla Glue, which makes me sleepy but I've learned to like it anyway), but it doesn't have staying power. I'm going to put in an order for the 1000mg formula.

LA,
What I observed with my wife was that pain and edginess would increase each time she reduced what she was taking. It was not bad while she was on larger doses. As she progressed it became rather severe.

Her approach was to stay on a dose until the pain and other symptoms dropped to near where they were before the reduction. Then she would continue with that dose for a while to get somewhat comfortable with it. Then she would lower the dose again.

Chocolate actually helps.

Best

 

[LadyAshwynn]

Chocolate actually helps.

I have noticed that myself Trying not to overdo that! I don't process sugar very well due to a gastric bypass surgery years ago.

 

[sierrahiker]

I am almost with you Lady Ashlynn. Taking 2.5 mg of percocet twice daily along with tincture and topical. Plus gabapentin, 200 mg at night. I have taken many meds for 30+ years due to surgeries following accident. Back and TMJ were the worst. It is a battle to keep pain within levels that are tolerated. Working part time is helpful to keep my mind focused but limits how much tincture I can use daily and still function mentally. It is a balance for me. I have slowly reduced meds over a long time. Cannabis is only about 1 1/2 year.

Canyon, will increase chocolate

Info here has helped me greatly.

 

[SweetSue]

I like the sound of “find relief, stay there for a while and rest in that for a spell before taking another jump.” Thank you Canyon.

The chocolate... milk, semi-sweet, or dark? Please, tell me it doesn’t matter. Lol!

sierrahiker, may I ask what chemovar you’re using and the cannabinoid ratio THC:CBD if you know it? Is it possible to increase the CBD value of your meds? That may make it easier to get through the days with a bit more tincture.

At its core an effective cannabis medicine is high CBD with as much THC as you find comfortable.

I was walking by on my way to bed and they were questions that insisted on being asked before I said goodnight.

Working with you all keeps me in line. Lol! I can get incredibly myopic. This room makes that impossible.

I recently took part in a two week research project for the University of Pittsburgh, responding to questionnaires that came in four times a day. A regular series asked what my level of pain was and every day I responded “none.”

It wasn’t until the last two days of my participation that I realized I live with constant pain, the residual effects of an injury while caring for my late husband. It’s slowly healing, but after four years and regular Callanetics practice I don’t often identify it as pain, and when I do I reach for my oil bottle and roll some on.

As I considered why I’d ignored this during those daily inquiries it came down to two things; I was always deeply and actively engaged in something when the phone chirped with the incoming questionnaire, and pain wasn’t on my mind at all.

Also, I keep watch over here to offer what assistance I can. This room knows pain. What I have is a little discomfort.

You keep my focus and perspective in line. I’m indebted to you. I’m goin’ to bed now. See you all tomorrow.

 

[Canyon]

....The chocolate... milk, semi-sweet, or dark? Please, tell me it doesn’t matter. Lol!

My first thoughts were to make light of it. However, there is probably a 'need to know' to the question for some. Chris perfers milk and semi-sweet to the very dark. I think the dark would have more kick.

sierrahiker, may I ask what chemovar you’re using and the cannabinoid ratio THC:CBD if you know it? Is it possible to increase the CBD value of your meds? That may make it easier to get through the days with a bit more tincture.

At its core an effective cannabis medicine is high CBD with as much THC as you find comfortable.

You can add CBD to a tincture or take it separately.

Best

 

[SweetSue]

My first thoughts were to make light of it. However, there is probably a 'need to know' to the question for some. Chris perfers milk and semi-sweet to the very dark. I think the dark would have more kick.

It’s the dark that assists the endocannabinoid system, 80% or higher in cocoa concentrations. Milk chocolate tastes soooo much better. Lol!

You can add CBD to a tincture or take it separately.

Best

I’m starting to explore this concept a little closer Canyon. I’m moving to New Orleans and I may need to use an isolate to balance ratios for my daughter. I’m tearing down for the second time in six months to make this move and it’s run me ridiculously short in high CBD oils.

She can’t fall back to who she was before the regimen of 1:2 CBD dominance. An isolate’ll help me get through to the next CBD CC harvest, now almost six months out.

 

[sierrahiker]

SweetSue & Canyon, I buy a balanced 1:1 RSO and make tincture. I have a CBD isolate that I mixed into a separate tincture. Since the THC tincture seems to be most effective on pain sometimes I forget about the CBD tincture. Thanks for the reminder. Any thoughts on timing of the tinctures. I have heard Maria Gordon say to use the CBD at different time of day. Any thoughts? Recently told to try hemp seed oil instead of coconut oil for tincture. The medium may also play a part. Will try different oils & see which my body prefers.

Chocolate needs little excuse to be added to my day.... prefer the dark.

SweetSue, I made a topical after your encouragement. It helps more than I expected.

Appreciate everyone's help here!

 

[SweetSue]

SweetSue & Canyon, I buy a balanced 1:1 RSO and make tincture. I have a CBD isolate that I mixed into a separate tincture. Since the THC tincture seems to be most effective on pain sometimes I forget about the CBD tincture. Thanks for the reminder. Any thoughts on timing of the tinctures. I have heard Maria Gordon say to use the CBD at different time of day. Any thoughts? Recently told to try hemp seed oil instead of coconut oil for tincture. The medium may also play a part. Will try different oils & see which my body prefers.

Chocolate needs little excuse to be added to my day.... prefer the dark.

SweetSue, I made a topical after your encouragement. It helps more than I expected.

Appreciate everyone's help here!

And we appreciate the willingness to be so open about the regimen. I'm getting ready to try the CBD isolate for the first time very soon here. I'm moving to New Orleans to live in one of Tead's rentals and I'm running out of CBD plants to make oils for my daughter. My second tear-down in 6 months is playing havoc with my production schedule. Lol! The move was unexpected, but too good to pass up.

May I ask, what potency do you mix the CBD tincture?

Mara and her dedicated team have data that strongly supports taking your CBD-dominant medicines at least two hours apart from the high THC medicines. They've found they can reduce dose concentrations by following this simple rule.

Her dosing pattern appears to be low THC at the start of the day, the CBD meds split between two daytime doses beginning two hours after the morning THC, and closing out the day with the major THC dose.

It's a sensible approach to dosing. I figure it goes something like
* AM - low THC (enough to counter the pain)
* 2 hrs later - CBD meds
* late afternoon - CBD meds
* bedtime - high THC
* vaping when necessary or desirable (that last one was my thought )

The CBD meds always have some THC and vice-versa. They play too well together to use alone.
When necessary high CBD doses can be formulated with higher THC by increasing the CBD ratio, but most chronic pain patients seem to be responding to a 1:1 at doses much lower than I expected. That works well for you, hiker?

Your social obligations will pretty much determine how comfortable you are with euphoria.

I'm thrilled the topical helped. Gosh.......that just makes my day. Now I can call it a night and go to bed.

 

[Derbybud]

Hope the move goes well for ya Sue.

 

[SweetSue]

Hope the move goes well for ya Sue.

Thanks Derbybud. I can’t see how it could go otherwise.

 

[sierrahiker]

And we appreciate the willingness to be so open about the regimen. I'm getting ready to try the CBD isolate for the first time very soon here. I'm moving to New Orleans to live in one of Tead's rentals and I'm running out of CBD plants to make oils for my daughter. My second tear-down in 6 months is playing havoc with my production schedule. Lol! The move was unexpected, but too good to pass up.

May I ask, what potency do you mix the CBD tincture?

Mara and her dedicated team have data that strongly supports taking your CBD-dominant medicines at least two hours apart from the high THC medicines. They've found they can reduce dose concentrations by following this simple rule.

Her dosing pattern appears to be low THC at the start of the day, the CBD meds split between two daytime doses beginning two hours after the morning THC, and closing out the day with the major THC dose.

It's a sensible approach to dosing. I figure it goes something like
* AM - low THC (enough to counter the pain)
* 2 hrs later - CBD meds
* late afternoon - CBD meds
* bedtime - high THC
* vaping when necessary or desirable (that last one was my thought )

The CBD meds always have some THC and vice-versa. They play too well together to use alone.
When necessary high CBD doses can be formulated with higher THC by increasing the CBD ratio, but most chronic pain patients seem to be responding to a 1:1 at doses much lower than I expected. That works well for you, hiker?

Your social obligations will pretty much determine how comfortable you are with euphoria.

I'm thrilled the topical helped. Gosh.......that just makes my day. Now I can call it a night and go to bed.

SweetSue, Interesting your schedule of dosing is close to mine.

Currently I use:
*1:1 upon waking, if working only 2 drops (mixed tincture to be a little more than 1mg of THC & CBC per drop)
*CBD tincture before work but this dose sometimes forget, usually 5-10 drops
*1:1 as soon as home, 2-3 drops, more as needed after waiting 1 hr or longer
*1:1 during evening, 3+ drops depending on pain; plus chocolate with 1:1 if pain is strong

2.5 mg of Percocet is taken an hour after first tincture dose and early afternoon while at work. Soon a free week, so will experiment with a new RSO from a friend. Trying to get details of this one. During weekends & free time I up the tincture a bit.

CBD tincture I used MCT oil, almost 1 oz. Was trying to stay at 1 mg per drop for easy math. (Roughly 550 drops of MCT to about the same mg of CBD.) It has very little THC but does have some. I warmed MCT in water bath and added the CBD isolate. It instantly dissolved. I have this in my purse and use as needed. There are other tinctures here to buy, but felt this might be stronger and less expensive.

I was very surprised that the topical helped me as pain is very deep. But, gladly I do get relief and quickly. Interesting, I put the oil on a keratosis spot on my face and it is gone!! Took a while but works. Sweet Almond oil infused with recipe here.

 

[SweetSue]

SweetSue, Interesting your schedule of dosing is close to mine.

Currently I use:
*1:1 upon waking, if working only 2 drops (mixed tincture to be a little more than 1mg of THC & CBC per drop)
*CBD tincture before work but this dose sometimes forget, usually 5-10 drops
*1:1 as soon as home, 2-3 drops, more as needed after waiting 1 hr or longer
*1:1 during evening, 3+ drops depending on pain; plus chocolate with 1:1 if pain is strong

2.5 mg of Percocet is taken an hour after first tincture dose and early afternoon while at work. Soon a free week, so will experiment with a new RSO from a friend. Trying to get details of this one. During weekends & free time I up the tincture a bit.

CBD tincture I used MCT oil, almost 1 oz. Was trying to stay at 1 mg per drop for easy math. (Roughly 550 drops of MCT to about the same mg of CBD.) It has very little THC but does have some. I warmed MCT in water bath and added the CBD isolate. It instantly dissolved. I have this in my purse and use as needed. There are other tinctures here to buy, but felt this might be stronger and less expensive.

I was very surprised that the topical helped me as pain is very deep. But, gladly I do get relief and quickly. Interesting, I put the oil on a keratosis spot on my face and it is gone!! Took a while but works. Sweet Almond oil infused with recipe here.

Ooo.... I love the smell of almond oil. I have some but haven’t infused it with anything yet. Once I get settled in New Orleans I’ll get some isolate powder and make a small batch for myself. I’ll be sure to add a touch of THC for potentiation.

I’m pretty sure high CBD is what my body’s waiting for to get the scalp psoriasis under control.

I have a jar of my cream to Hash Hound for pain relief and he used it on some questionable spots on his head and watched them fade away to nothing over a month or so.

These are powerful medicine that do so much more than relieve pain, but relieve pain they do. Are you applying your topical to the DMR?

I keep thinking of a community thread on personal regimens. Sooner or later it’ll show up and I’d hope to see yours listed there.

 

[sierrahiker]

Ooo.... I love the smell of almond oil. I have some but haven’t infused it with anything yet. Once I get settled in New Orleans I’ll get some isolate powder and make a small batch for myself. I’ll be sure to add a touch of THC for potentiation.

I’m pretty sure high CBD is what my body’s waiting for to get the scalp psoriasis under control.

I have a jar of my cream to Hash Hound for pain relief and he used it on some questionable spots on his head and watched them fade away to nothing over a month or so.

These are powerful medicine that do so much more than relieve pain, but relieve pain they do. Are you applying your topical to the DMR?

I keep thinking of a community thread on personal regimens. Sooner or later it’ll show up and I’d hope to see yours listed there.

I forgot about using the topical on DMR, will apply today. I do use on many areas of pain. Try to cover the area above and below painful spots. Much of my body has pain so am applying after showers to most of my body. Might be easier to bathe with infused oil.

New Orleans sounds fun, enjoy!

 

[Ganjagrowergu]

Wife has been back on Depakote, Abilify, and a Hydroxizine prn for anxiety. She is crazy without her meds, but the meds don't work without her system being saturated. These meds have horrible side effects (overall lack of emotion, sexual side effects, weight gain, other unpleasant stuff) , but are the only ones that truly helped after the med chasing began.

Is there some kind of regimen that could taper someone off of this poison? And then replace it? Bi-Polar disorder with psychosis is Hell. She really doesn't want to be on this stuff, I want her to be healthy and safe. I am purely in the research phase of this possible endeavor.

Idk....

 

[SweetSue]

Wife has been back on Depakote, Abilify, and a Hydroxizine prn for anxiety. She is crazy without her meds, but the meds don't work without her system being saturated. These meds have horrible side effects (overall lack of emotion, sexual side effects, weight gain, other unpleasant stuff) , but are the only ones that truly helped after the med chasing began.

Is there some kind of regimen that could taper someone off of this poison? And then replace it? Bi-Polar disorder with psychosis is Hell. She really doesn't want to be on this stuff, I want her to be healthy and safe. I am purely in the research phase of this possible endeavor.

Idk....

I believe it’s possible to taper off any medication. You’ll need her doctors on board to get smaller doses prescribed so you can start the taper.

How is she using cannabis at the moment?

 

[Ganjagrowergu]

We make edibles with coconut oil or butter. We vape some flower, use prefilled CO2 oil cartridges to vape that, we smoke doobies all day. She requires heavy indica's, although great pure sativas seem to work as well.

The CBD stuff in our stores are shotty at best. When WA made the big switch they pretty much liquidated the established medical community that I was involved with. Forced everybody without $100,000 fee, to go underground. The many affordable medical strains are lost and now available at the local shops for around double the price and half the quality.

I am looking at cbd rich strains and did find a seedbank relatively close by that carries many. I always think she should eat more pot, and go back to tinctures... Getting her doctor on board likely won't happen as it has been stated that she believes cannabis to be a dangerous substance.... Many docs that accept obamacare share this false belief, imagine that

 

[Ganjagrowergu]

She has tried to taper without a regimen and results are nearly catastrophic every single time

 

[Oldbear]

Wife has been back on Depakote, Abilify, and a Hydroxizine prn for anxiety. She is crazy without her meds, but the meds don't work without her system being saturated. These meds have horrible side effects (overall lack of emotion, sexual side effects, weight gain, other unpleasant stuff) , but are the only ones that truly helped after the med chasing began.

Is there some kind of regimen that could taper someone off of this poison? And then replace it? Bi-Polar disorder with psychosis is Hell. She really doesn't want to be on this stuff, I want her to be healthy and safe. I am purely in the research phase of this possible endeavor.

Idk....

There are a couple of articles here - scroll down to Section on Depression Bipolar: The Healing Properties Of Cannabis | 420 MAGAZINE ®

I have a fam member who has this. Her only medication is cannabis and she is very stable.

 

[Ganjagrowergu]

Idk, I worry about how well this will work with our extreme tolerance for cannabis.

Considering making FECO or RSO. I just have a feeling that there is more inside my plants that is worth getting, yet I often throw it all in the trash.

All things considered, it's not quite time to start tapering, I have only begun the research. . We just got over a non regimental tapering episode. Bipolar is painful as are it's chemical treatments.

 

[SweetSue]

Idk, I worry about how well this will work with our extreme tolerance for cannabis.

Considering making FECO or RSO. I just have a feeling that there is more inside my plants that is worth getting, yet I often throw it all in the trash.

All things considered, it's not quite time to start tapering, I have only begun the research. . We just got over a non regimental tapering episode. Bipolar is painful as are it's chemical treatments.

We can learn together. I’d start with successful cannabis treatment of bipolar. I’m headed out, but when I get back I’ll see if I have anything in my files and do some looking around. I have some decent materials to look through.

Be back in a bit.