Opioid Tapering With Cannabis: A Regimen

[SweetSue]

Hi folks.
This thread really blew my hair back.
I hope it stays open.
Of all the valuable resources on 420 this is by far the most important.
I want my first post here on 420 mag to say Thank You Sweet Sue!
You are a terrific hostess and you have just the right touch for the work you’ve done here. It’s been humbling to see.
Kiaora mo te aroha: thanks for the love.

My humble thanks for your appreciation of our efforts. I think I’m most proud of the help offered by this dedicated crew of members.

Welcome, DD. This is very important information and I thank Sue for posting it. "Most important" is a matter of perception but very important (vital) information here for many people. It is certainly important for my work as I learn more on how to incorporate this healing plant.

So much to learn, eh?

Sue is the best.

Awww.... we do this work for love. Without all of you the effort falls short. I’m here as chief cheerleader.

 

[Alafornia]

So much to learn, eh?

More than I ever imagined prior to beginning this particular journey. I have a newfound respect for both the plant and those who grow and use it. I've learned enough to give out a wee bit of "advice" regarding its use that have led to good results. And of course the results at home have been nothing short of remarkable. I'm excited to be a new part of this community as I learn to grow and heal with it.

 

[DonkeyDick]

Hi. Not long ago I put my first post on 420mag here to thank Sue and everyone who has been a part of this conversation. I might have forgotten that last bit the first time?
Today I just noticed this post will be 100 so I thought I’d come back to say thanks again.
It’s been, well...

...itchy to be welcomed here.
After decades of dark places, even geographically, I stupidly celebrated the end of years of abstemious hepatitis with a relapse. Go figure. One thing led to another as things do and that took me to precipitated withdrawal and similar reactions to other medical treatments.
Doctor rang yesterday to say I have pancreatitis and to look after myself. Could only grin at the irony - coz it hurts to laugh

Anyway, after checking in at supervision today I thought I’d share with the group. The best professional medical advice I can get, from psychiatrists, clinical psychologists, my GP, is to use cannabis. It does my head in to be living under political prohibition. Does nothing but reinforce that disjointed, disconnected feeling people with opiate disorders know so well.
So, with a huge amount of help from the kindest, most generous people I have met in a long time (that’s you, denizens of 420), my meds will be ready soon.
I can’t wait to try the topicals.
Love you, Sue! Xo

 

[SweetSue]

Hi. Not long ago I put my first post on 420mag here to thank Sue and everyone who has been a part of this conversation. I might have forgotten that last bit the first time?
Today I just noticed this post will be 100 so I thought I’d come back to say thanks again.
It’s been, well...

...itchy to be welcomed here.
After decades of dark places, even geographically, I stupidly celebrated the end of years of abstemious hepatitis with a relapse. Go figure. One thing led to another as things do and that took me to precipitated withdrawal and similar reactions to other medical treatments.
Doctor rang yesterday to say I have pancreatitis and to look after myself. Could only grin at the irony - coz it hurts to laugh

Anyway, after checking in at supervision today I thought I’d share with the group. The best professional medical advice I can get, from psychiatrists, clinical psychologists, my GP, is to use cannabis. It does my head in to be living under political prohibition. Does nothing but reinforce that disjointed, disconnected feeling people with opiate disorders know so well.
So, with a huge amount of help from the kindest, most generous people I have met in a long time (that’s you, denizens of 420), my meds will be ready soon.
I can’t wait to try the topicals.
Love you, Sue! Xo

Made me tear up DD. So... you discovered you were human. We’re OK with that. Glad you made it out, and welcome back.

I can’t wait to hear how topicals improve your life. Application to the DMR will surprise you in its effectiveness to calm the emotional storms. Have fun experimenting.

 

[Blazinjones]

Made me tear up DD. So... you discovered you were human. We’re OK with that. Glad you made it out, and welcome back.

I can’t wait to hear how topicals improve your life. Application to the DMR will surprise you in its effectiveness to calm the emotional storms. Have fun experimenting.

Hey super sue how have things been going for u and the garden? Good I hope. I had a question about trying to get the rest of the way off my opiates. One I was wondering what are good strains for pain was it higher cbd or thc I forgot which one to look for lol. The main strains I've been using are seeming to not work as gud anymore or sumthn. Idk but now it feels like I keep needing more to cover my pain but it jus knocks me out but then I wake up shortly after tossing am turning an having muscle spasms. An then I start getting restless leg syndrome but in my arms it really fukn sux. But yea any strains that can help with those issues would be greatly appreciated man. An since I lost my other critical cure cbd seeds I went an got another strain of cbd an got it going in docs kit soil rite now.

This is the oil I made last nite out of 3.3 ounces of Pineapple Chunk into 2 cups organic non gmo coconuts oil. So hopefully this stuff helps me get to sleep an dont keep me up lol.

Pineapple Chunk oil used 3.3 oz

• Blazinjones
• Jul 20, 2019

Pineapple Chunk oil used 3.3 oz to make

• Blazinjones
• Jul 20, 2019

 

[BeemerBill]

Blazenjones high cbd strains seem to be showing more and more positive results for a lot of things. My wife has a lot of neck pain so we needed to find relief without a lot of high for day time. ACDC works wonders. Almost no thc with a lot of pain relief. Then there's Aliens on Moonshine which is a 5/1 cbd/thc strain that works great also. Smoking or oil puts you in a good place. This is just my opinion but they do work.
Bill

 

[SweetSue]

Thanks Bill.

Jones, if Pineapple Chunk doesn't fit the bill for sleep I'd suggest GG#4. @Grandpa Tokin has been doing a bang-up job growing it, and @beez0404 has great success with GG Auto. I'd tap their brains if you went that way.

Are you using a topical, and if so, in what ways and under what conditions? Back at the beginning of this thread there's a recipe for a non-cannabis cream that's been successfully used for relief of restless leg and the spasms that accompany withdrawal. I can't think of a reason it wouldn't work on your arms.

What dose are you taking now, if I may be so bold? It may take much higher doses of CBD to get the rest of the way off, although few if any have much real experience at this method. Using CBD in higher doses to help the body break the dependence of opiates isn't something I'm finding elsewhere. Bill makes a good point about ACDC. There are others who echo his experience, and I trust Bill. There's always isolate CBD powders that can supplement high THC buds to reach a balance.

I'm watching a seminar right now that includes coverage of this very matter, if my reading is correct. I'll be alert for any new developments.

Jones, we're gonna keep at this relentlessly. The authorities in the field suggest that a percentage of patients won't be able to break the addiction, and find as much relief as possible through other medicines - cannabis included - to keep the opiate dose as low as possible.

I expect to see you be one of the ones that make it. There's a way. You'll find it.

 

[Blazinjones]

Thanks Bill.

Jones, if Pineapple Chunk doesn't fit the bill for sleep I'd suggest GG#4. @Grandpa Tokin has been doing a bang-up job growing it, and @beez0404 has great success with GG Auto. I'd tap their brains if you went that way.

Are you using a topical, and if so, in what ways and under what conditions? Back at the beginning of this thread there's a recipe for a non-cannabis cream that's been successfully used for relief of restless leg and the spasms that accompany withdrawal. I can't think of a reason it wouldn't work on your arms.

What dose are you taking now, if I may be so bold? It may take much higher doses of CBD to get the rest of the way off, although few if any have much real experience at this method. Using CBD in higher doses to help the body break the dependence of opiates isn't something I'm finding elsewhere. Bill makes a good point about ACDC. There are others who echo his experience, and I trust Bill. There's always isolate CBD powders that can supplement high THC buds to reach a balance.

I'm watching a seminar right now that includes coverage of this very matter, if my reading is correct. I'll be alert for any new developments.

Jones, we're gonna keep at this relentlessly. The authorities in the field suggest that a percentage of patients won't be able to break the addiction, and find as much relief as possible through other medicines - cannabis included - to keep the opiate dose as low as possible.

I expect to see you be one of the ones that make it. There's a way. You'll find it.

Ok guys so that oil I made last night sure seemed to help when I woke up. I try to sleep threw a withdrawal so that I can have time to try an drop my tolerance but when I wake up I'm in full blown withdrawal am usually very nauseous an have to smoke some herb jus to get it to go away n I hope to God I dnt start puking cause once I start I can stop an usually end up in the hospital. But today my withdrawal wasnt tht bad. Well I still had it but no nausea compared to normally. An my skin kinda felt tight an my hands felt swollen or the muscle kinda felt alil crampy but over all it was way way less then normall. I normally get all that but way more intensely and on top of it nausea plus massive back pain. So over all this oil works pretty good now I'm guna try making some biobombs with this stuff an I bet I could substitute a full dose of my opiates with one of those once I turn it into a biobomb. But yea thanx every1 for the kind words an help along the way it really does help havn some1 to talk with about this stuff. Plus jus being able 2 show ur plants off in the place is great I know I never wana show people or tell any1 bout my garden but dam is it hard when ur smoking with sum1 an they r like dam this is some fire lol. I always catch myself about to be like yup I grew tht lol. But yea havn this place you guys rock. And super sue thank you as well for creating this thread to help all us addicts out there that want help an to use this amazing ass plant in getting off shit. U guys are my home away from home lmao.

 

[DonkeyDick]

That oil looks and sounds the shizzit, Blaze. Well done! It’s clearly making a difference. Hoon into it hard for a day or two. Stay strong, Blaze. Keep free.

 

[Blazinjones]

Thanks Bill.

Jones, if Pineapple Chunk doesn't fit the bill for sleep I'd suggest GG#4. @Grandpa Tokin has been doing a bang-up job growing it, and @beez0404 has great success with GG Auto. I'd tap their brains if you went that way.

Are you using a topical, and if so, in what ways and under what conditions? Back at the beginning of this thread there's a recipe for a non-cannabis cream that's been successfully used for relief of restless leg and the spasms that accompany withdrawal. I can't think of a reason it wouldn't work on your arms.

What dose are you taking now, if I may be so bold? It may take much higher doses of CBD to get the rest of the way off, although few if any have much real experience at this method. Using CBD in higher doses to help the body break the dependence of opiates isn't something I'm finding elsewhere. Bill makes a good point about ACDC. There are others who echo his experience, and I trust Bill. There's always isolate CBD powders that can supplement high THC buds to reach a balance.

I'm watching a seminar right now that includes coverage of this very matter, if my reading is correct. I'll be alert for any new developments.

Jones, we're gonna keep at this relentlessly. The authorities in the field suggest that a percentage of patients won't be able to break the addiction, and find as much relief as possible through other medicines - cannabis included - to keep the opiate dose as low as possible.

I expect to see you be one of the ones that make it. There's a way. You'll find it.

Oh I also forgot to mention about the cream no I havnt made that type of stuff yet altho I'm down to try lol. The main thing I'm tryn to drop now is the fentanyl I was on oxycodone 15mg 8 a day and the fentanyl 100mcg one patch every 2days. Now I'm down to only one 100mcg patch every 3 days instead of 2 and then 1 or 2 oxy a day. An I keep tryn to lower it an it will start off good but by the third day my whole back is burning with pain an by then I'm getting the spasms super super bad. One time I it got so bad while I was asleep my ex said my jerking around woke her up. I guess my arms were jerkin around n I accidentally punched her in the face in my sleep. I didnt even know what was going on wen she hit me I jus woke up like what's going on. An then I jus started feeling worse n worse n noticed I was twitching an then realized I was in full blown withdrawal. An that's when I smoke the most is waiting for my meds to kick in I sit an smoke a bowl or joint if I got one already rolled. Otherwise I'm twitching so bad I wud never be able 2 roll one. But yea this is where I'm stuck now an it really sux cause I hoped to be off this shit by now but it's so hard. Plus it's like a mind game or sum shit cause I hate these but I obviously still want them or sumthn idk I jus hate needing/wanting something I really wish I didnt. I know that sounds kinda dumb n weird but thts the bubble I'm stuck in right now lol. Altho I do know once I find sumthn to use as a pain reliever other then opiates then I'll have a way easier time. and the oil does help but it's more help in the way of makeing withdrawal not as bad when I wake up. But I still need sumthn for the day wen I'm awake. So thts y I've been growing this wild lettuce. An its finally ready to harvest some an then do an extraction to try it out I'm very excited lol. Anything that can help me get off this stuff excites me now lol. But yea is there a thread on here on how to make the creams u mentioned?

 

[Alafornia]

Hey, @Blazinjones . I hope you don't mind me interjecting my 2 cents.

You've been on some pretty high opiate doses so tapering slowly is a must. It will take more time than you want. If your health care provider is not involved get them involved. You'll have to decide if you can tell them now about the cannabis use. At this point you may want to consider instead of removing entire doses of oxycodone just reduce the dose slowly even if you have to add one additional dose into the mix (like going from 15mg twice a day to 10 mg three times a day then every 1-2 weeks reducing ONE of those doses by 5 mg for a couple of weeks). It might look like this:

10/10/10 for two weeks
10/5/10 for two weeks
5/5/10 for two weeks
5/5/5 for two weeks
5/0/5 for two weeks
0/0/5 for two weeks
then take one every two days for two weeks, then every third day for two weeks then stop

You may want to slowly reduce the fentanyl FIRST in a similar manner, slowly moving down from 100 mcg to 75, them 50, then 25 in 2 week increments. You may even need to TEMPORARILY increase the oxycodone once you stop the fentanyl to make up for not being able to taper in the same way since it is a transdermal patch and it is either on or it's off.

The reason I suggest more frequent, if lower, doses of oxycodone is so that it never gets completely out of your system while you do this and thus reduces the withdrawal symptoms greatly for some people.

All of this should be done with your health care provider's knowledge and help as far as the tapering goes. If they are worth their salt they will work with you and your desire to taper down and off.

As for cannabis strains, there are several. You've already gotten some solid advice from some knowledgeable people, like @SweetSue . In my readings and conversations with people and their experiences the following strains have popped up as good for pain time and again:

Northern Lights: pain, spasms, sleep - I prefer the pyramid seeds strain that has, according to True North Seedbank, 1.7% CBD, which is the highest I've found for this strain.
White Russian: Pain, relaxation, sleep
White Widow: More daytime for pain.
Blue Dream: Pain and spasms

You have some oil already and it's likely a CBD: THC ratio of 1:1 or 2:1 is likely to be a good starting point to take 3-4 four times a day, possibly more. You can always supplement this with a vape or smoke when you need something to act fast. Your dose is likely to be higher than average to be effective.

I wish you luck and we are here to help however we can.

 

[Blazinjones]

Hey, @Blazinjones . I hope you don't mind me interjecting my 2 cents.

You've been on some pretty high opiate doses so tapering slowly is a must. It will take more time than you want. If your health care provider is not involved get them involved. You'll have to decide if you can tell them now about the cannabis use. At this point you may want to consider instead of removing entire doses of oxycodone just reduce the dose slowly even if you have to add one additional dose into the mix (like going from 15mg twice a day to 10 mg three times a day then every 1-2 weeks reducing ONE of those doses by 5 mg for a couple of weeks). It might look like this:

10/10/10 for two weeks
10/5/10 for two weeks
5/5/10 for two weeks
5/5/5 for two weeks
5/0/5 for two weeks
0/0/5 for two weeks
then take one every two days for two weeks, then every third day for two weeks then stop

You may want to slowly reduce the fentanyl FIRST in a similar manner, slowly moving down from 100 mcg to 75, them 50, then 25 in 2 week increments. You may even need to TEMPORARILY increase the oxycodone once you stop the fentanyl to make up for not being able to taper in the same way since it is a transdermal patch and it is either on or it's off.

The reason I suggest more frequent, if lower, doses of oxycodone is so that it never gets completely out of your system while you do this and thus reduces the withdrawal symptoms greatly for some people.

All of this should be done with your health care provider's knowledge and help as far as the tapering goes. If they are worth their salt they will work with you and your desire to taper down and off.

As for cannabis strains, there are several. You've already gotten some solid advice from some knowledgeable people, like @SweetSue . In my readings and conversations with people and their experiences the following strains have popped up as good for pain time and again:

Northern Lights: pain, spasms, sleep - I prefer the pyramid seeds strain that has, according to True North Seedbank, 1.7% CBD, which is the highest I've found for this strain.
White Russian: Pain, relaxation, sleep
White Widow: More daytime for pain.
Blue Dream: Pain and spasms

You have some oil already and it's likely a CBD: THC ratio of 1:1 or 2:1 is likely to be a good starting point to take 3-4 four times a day, possibly more. You can always supplement this with a vape or smoke when you need something to act fast. Your dose is likely to be higher than average to be effective.

I wish you luck and we are here to help however we can.

That was awesome of u to write up the list of strains an everything I really appreciate that. And good u mentioned white widow well that was used in a cross I'm running right now so hopefully that will lean more towards the white widow side and I have some bluedream auto beans I can also use I've noticed that oil really helps alot. But yea thank you so much for the help and I really appreciate every1 else for chiming in an helpn out to thanx every1.

 

[Blazinjones]

Oh an I also got from th seeds there L.A S.A.G.E CBD it's supposed to have higher then ur average amount of cbd in it so I'm hoping that will make some good oil as well. Specially since it says from the breeders discription its supposed to be covered in resin so is great for extractions. So I'm guessing that it should yield some good oil as well atleast let's hope so right lol.

 

[DonkeyDick]

It’s hard, what you’re doing. And it’s hard going it alone.
Al knows what he’s talking about, Blaze. Help’s here, and good on you for reaching for it.
Sue’s pictorial how-to on the topical:

Basic Body Butter: A SweetSue Picture Tutorial

There are instructions for making an easy basic infused oil here: Instant Pot Cannabis Oil: A SweetSue Picture Tutorial Once the oil is made gather your materials. Equipment: * Pyrex measuring cups * clean jars for storage * microwave Supplies: * 1 cup infused cannabis grape seed oil * 100...

www.420magazine.com

I’ll be interested to try it soon, too!
And good news on the medical strains - it’s all going the right way.

 

[Alafornia]

That was awesome of u to write up the list of strains an everything I really appreciate that. And good u mentioned white widow well that was used in a cross I'm running right now so hopefully that will lean more towards the white widow side and I have some bluedream auto beans I can also use I've noticed that oil really helps alot. But yea thank you so much for the help and I really appreciate every1 else for chiming in an helpn out to thanx every1.

You're either lucky as hell or you've done your research. I feel like the latter (you've done your research).

I highly recommend getting a Northern Lights for bedtime at some point. I've not met a single person yet who was disappointed, though my experience is limited.

What you're doing is hard and it feels that way because it is. If it were easy then everyone would do it and succeed. But you've got this. You have all the help we can give you. I hope you consider the good health entourage effect (similar to the one cannabis gives) of physical, mental, spiritual/emotional, and medicinal help and supports for yourself. This will take all your efforts and all those supports to succeed, but it is doable if you have the discipline, persistence, and commitment. Considering what you've already accomplished all the elements are there.

Good luck to you and please come here often. I'd love to see a grow journal from you where you can get both grow and other support and encouragement. See you around.

 

[Blazinjones]

You're either lucky as hell or you've done your research. I feel like the latter (you've done your research).

I highly recommend getting a Northern Lights for bedtime at some point. I've not met a single person yet who was disappointed, though my experience is limited.

What you're doing is hard and it feels that way because it is. If it were easy then everyone would do it and succeed. But you've got this. You have all the help we can give you. I hope you consider the good health entourage effect (similar to the one cannabis gives) of physical, mental, spiritual/emotional, and medicinal help and supports for yourself. This will take all your efforts and all those supports to succeed, but it is doable if you have the discipline, persistence, and commitment. Considering what you've already accomplished all the elements are there.

Good luck to you and please come here often. I'd love to see a grow journal from you where you can get both grow and other support and encouragement. See you around.

Man ur getn me all emotional an shit lol. I've been trying to clean up my life alot lately emotionally spiritually mentally and physically cause ur right it will take all tht. So I've been trying to clean up around the house inside an out. Plus been doing walks/light runs with the dogs to help me stay on track an stay busy when I'm at hme doing nuthn. An plus I've been tryn to stay positive about it all but my family isnt like that they are not gud support mostly because all of them are junkies an drunks and fake faith believers lol. They pretty much jus tell me how much I'm guna fail or how I'll fuck it all up so might as well jus go to a pain clinic an get on sumthn for life an I'm like r u for real right now. But either way I'm not doing this for all of them I'm doing it cause I want it so what they think jus drives me all the more to succeed lol. Also I'll be starting a new journal but that's cause I'm sponsored by fast buds for my next auto run. So as soon as the seeds arrive I'll be running a smoothie, and a stardawg autoflower. And since I'll be starting a new journal for that I was thinking about starting a new perpetual one as well that will have the rest of my upgraded garden n will only be for HB plants now that I got everything switched over to HB well all but 2 plants still lol. But for now they are in my sig I'm in the top 2 the rest r done an finished.

 

[DonkeyDick]

You’re right to stop trying to please those folk, Blaze. You likely never will and that isn’t entirely on you.
People don’t like change. They’ll get scared and confused when they see yours.
Fuck’em if they can’t take a joke, I say.
Got no further family advice sorry mate families happen to other people. Better that way, for my health. Just saying because - it’s not so bad. It’s not so bad getting well and doing it for yourself and doing what it takes to get there.

 

[Alafornia]

Man ur getn me all emotional an shit lol. I've been trying to clean up my life alot lately emotionally spiritually mentally and physically cause ur right it will take all tht. So I've been trying to clean up around the house inside an out. Plus been doing walks/light runs with the dogs to help me stay on track an stay busy when I'm at hme doing nuthn. An plus I've been tryn to stay positive about it all but my family isnt like that they are not gud support mostly because all of them are junkies an drunks and fake faith believers lol. They pretty much jus tell me how much I'm guna fail or how I'll fuck it all up so might as well jus go to a pain clinic an get on sumthn for life an I'm like r u for real right now. But either way I'm not doing this for all of them I'm doing it cause I want it so what they think jus drives me all the more to succeed lol. Also I'll be starting a new journal but that's cause I'm sponsored by fast buds for my next auto run. So as soon as the seeds arrive I'll be running a smoothie, and a stardawg autoflower. And since I'll be starting a new journal for that I was thinking about starting a new perpetual one as well that will have the rest of my upgraded garden n will only be for HB plants now that I got everything switched over to HB well all but 2 plants still lol. But for now they are in my sig I'm in the top 2 the rest r done an finished.

See, you are doing all the right things. I would add one more: put some distance - your choice how much distance - between you and those who are actively discouraging you and offering temptation instead of support. It is perfectly OK to do whether they are acquaintances, friends, or especially family. You may miss out on the summer BBQ but you will gain so much more and it's part of taking care of yourself. You'll get guilt trips if you keep limited contact but it's worth it for your well-being. Those who woller in their own shit can't stand to see someone else get clean. They will drag you down into the muck just to make excuses for themselves. It is a vicious and cruel thing.

Awesome of the sponsorship and that you'll be making your own journal. Count me in!

 

[SweetSue]

You guys make me so proud to be part of this.

That was awesome of u to write up the list of strains an everything I really appreciate that. And good u mentioned white widow well that was used in a cross I'm running right now so hopefully that will lean more towards the white widow side and I have some bluedream auto beans I can also use I've noticed that oil really helps alot. But yea thank you so much for the help and I really appreciate every1 else for chiming in an helpn out to thanx every1.

I’m thinking a strong sativa-dominant may be your ticket for days Jones. I like that Carnival I’m so fond of because it gives a clearheaded high with lots of creative motivation, and everyone I gave it to for pain really appreciated the relief they found. They all called it “the good stuff.”

I agree with Al on the Northern Lights too because I too have yet to meet a consumer of the buds that wasn’t pleased with results and slept well.

I’ve been on the end of flailing arms. Make the cream Jones. That’s a frightening thing to have to watch out for when you’re the sleeping spouse.

And please..... look over the tapering schedule Al offered and notice how effective it could be. Tapering off Fentanyl is a s-l-o-w process for a reason. You spoke of the frustration of feeling like you’re fighting yourself with wanting to let go and yet being tied to the need. This, pure and simple, is the physical addiction phase of the drug, and why it’s necessary to taper off so slowly. You can’t stop the addiction. Instead we train the body to need less and less with a long, drawn out, s-l-o-w taper until the addiction is a faint memory of past history.

Is your pain doctor on board with what you’re attempting? Have they given you any guidelines on reducing your doses?

 

[Alafornia]

And forgive me @Blazinjones . I just noticed how long you've been here and your links in the sig. That's what I get for posting when tired. Haha! Carry on!