Pot size for autos

[MassMedMan]

Just a little follow up from what I was saying yesterday about pot size. Two pics below of the same strain auto, planted same time, one on left a three gallon, on right a seven. I use milk crates and things to keep my tops level.

I wasn't able to get a better side by side due to room limitations so I took two pics. The tops are level. The three gallon on the left is about ten to twelve inches shorter, and not the same bush as the seven.

Use big pots if you're able Big pots, big roots, big roots,, big buds

 

[Papageno]

So we are clear my thread here is about Autos and what is the size of a pot after which it doesn't really mater.


Obviously bigger pots mean bigger plants. Everyone knows that. The issue is a lot of people say a 3 gallon pot is big enough to get max potential out of an Auto. I do not believe that is true.

As I started the thread with I use 15 gallon fabric pots for my grows. I was a bit concerned that a 15 gallon pot would be a bit much for a 10 week grow. So I started this thread asking if 15 was overkill for an auto.

At some point a pot is overkill and wont help. What I am trying to find is what that point is for an auto.

But everyone knows a bigger pot for normal plants is better that is just basic common knowledge.


thanks!

 

[Emilya Green]

So we are clear my thread here is about Autos and what is the size of a pot after which it doesn't really mater.


Obviously bigger pots mean bigger plants. Everyone knows that. The issue is a lot of people say a 3 gallon pot is big enough to get max potential out of an Auto. I do not believe that is true.

As I started the thread with I use 15 gallon fabric pots for my grows. I was a bit concerned that a 15 gallon pot would be a bit much for a 10 week grow. So I started this thread asking if 15 was overkill for an auto.

At some point a pot is overkill and wont help. What I am trying to find is what that point is for an auto.

But everyone knows a bigger pot for normal plants is better that is just basic common knowledge.


thanks!

The problem with autos is you have about 5 weeks before they start to flower, and then maybe a week after that to finish the development of your rootball, and then it is on to concentrating on the buds. Generally with an auto, there is not enough time to fill out a 3 gallon rootball.

If I were to grow an auto I would not abandon what I know about successive up-potting... I would just know that I have to do it much more agressively with an auto. Within that 5 weeks I would go through several stages of pots, from solo cup to 1 gallon and then probably on to the 3 gallon. I know that transplanting is not stressful and actually provides a boost to most plants. I just don't think that in the time available with an auto, you will be able to take much advantage of anything over 3 gallon, and at the end of the grow when you can examine the roots, you will find approximately a 3 gallon sized rootball, no matter how big of a container you put them in.

 

[MassMedMan]

Hey man that is cool,.your original post you said you never grown an auto, and wanted to know if size of can matters. I think I gave you good side by side comparison, no?

Can't help you with the fifteen part, I run sevens,, go try it, let us know.

Any way, hope I answered that for you, happy growing. Good luck with your tests, let us know when you harvest.

 

[Emilya Green]

Hey man that is cool,.your original post you said you never grown an auto, and wanted to know if size of can matters. I think I gave you good side by side comparison, no?

Can't help you with the fifteen part, I run sevens,, go try it, let us know.

Any way, hope I answered that for you, happy growing. Good luck with your tests, let us know when you harvest.

you make a good counter argument for sure... curious how you accomplish this. Do you start out in the larger containers or rapidly up-pot to get to them?

I am going to have to try a few autos soon, just to see how this works in practice with these genetically superior weeds.

 

[Papageno]

I have been growing a long time. What you gave me was not bad data just irrelevant. That is off topic...related but not what this is about. And again common knowledge. Not something that needs to be shared. Everyone knows that.

I finished my grow and still do not have an answer to the question. It is surprising to me that no one on this site has ever cared to understand this.

I totally agree with you Emy...I too have many opinions about this. What I have not seen is good data on what size is too big.

I usually over do pots because I want the roots to never feel constrained and to grow as fast and happy as possible. I don't care about the soil as I re-compost it all. I used to do re-potting and found a way around it so I don't need to do that anymore so I usually pot it in the final pot after sprouting and just let them grow. Plus I SCROG so none of it matters anyway. I grow in a big pot until the plant is the size I want and then I bloom and I have no worries or hassles. I am in no hurry so I do just fine. And my soil is nice enough I can sprout directly in a large pot and the sprout comes right up and doesn't slow down because the tap root is digging its way down. Re-potting has benefits that don't impact me and takes effort so I avoid it.

But all of that is for a normal grow. For a 10 week grow I am looking for data. And since the genetics are so messed up I don't even know that the root growth rate is the same.


But Emy did hit the point I am driving at. The root ball will not have the opportunity to develop normally. So both the soil and the pot conditions should change. As I previously stated I did not adjust the soil appropriately so I will be changing that. But now that I have done 2 I feel it would take me a while to dial in a great auto soil and really don't know that I care to run them anymore. And the soil and pot size are related especially if you run a super soil compost in the bottom.

So as previously stated (unless someone has some data on this that I can go with) I am going to lighten up the soil and if my next 3 sprout reasonably close I will do a 15,10,5 challenge and if Emy is correct since I am over the 3 Gal requirement I should see no difference. Unless I screw it up and over-water one.

Maybe in the year it takes before I do this someone will find this and give us some data to go with.

 

[goofyfoot]

Howdy All,
I am waiting on a friend to ship some Auto beans as his email today said All Systems are GO!! This will be my first attempt at Auto's also. Many moons with outdoor and indoor feminized so not totally lost!! I reasoned it out to 1week for Autos is @ 1 month for full photo-phases. I have in my pasted indoor grows, for a space saver in my box. Started to use the square plastic letter/legal file box's. To add, this has nothing to do with material but size and root ball.

You have a time issue with Auto's and cant afford recovery from transplant shock. I have read others just germinating in rock wool or peat pots. Then when the seed pops, plant straight into a 5 gal or bigger container, usually a 5 gallon bucket. The one in photo is 15"long X 12"deep X 10" high it will hold 5.75 gallons of soil mix. It needs a few drain wholes and I set 2 pavers inside the supplied lid turned upside down as a catch pan. You are not supposed to flood Autos so your in. For non auto's place pavers inside a empty one the same size...done. Big space thing is it is not a round peg in a square grow box, 3 will fit in a 32"X32" box. If you LST yours the 15" of travel is awesome and being clear you will see what it does for your root ball. The runners will bottom out really fast in the only 10"s. Forced to go horizontally WITH NO STRESS and the feeders will follow in a sense you create a root mat instead of a ball. When you feed it, all the goodness it has to pass through it, there is no other option. Instead of a majority flowing passed the ball that is not filling the container. See what I mean? They will climb as they fill the container spiraling up. But you create more exposure, surface area as every drop contacts the root system. I will be doing this in the next week, and I have done this with a number of indoor non-auto feminized. It is like watching an ant farm as the clear plastic shows the progress day to day of the roots growth. I did it with two of them that the containers were only 7" tall and 12"X12". The first one I used an Exact-o knife to perforate the bottom with 3 inch round holes. This allowed two separate soils, one veg and the other flower. When the roots filled the first one. I pulled out the circle and just stacked the whole thing on the second one. In 5 days the runners had gotten half way down into the second container. So the main root system never gets exposed or shocked and you just doubled your pot size. Plus have a fresh supply of nuit's for it next cycle of growth!! VERY COOL, inexpensive, space saver and no shock or down time to your babies. Think about it!! ...Peace.....

 

[Papageno]

Yeah I have a number of issues with that method so I will stick to the plan. Thanks though. Good luck with that. Should work great and give you good results!

 

[Foxtrot2112]

Don't they say that autos should start and finish in the same pot to avoid stress ?

 

[Emilya Green]

Don't they say that autos should start and finish in the same pot to avoid stress ?

they do, but i dont stress plants when I repot, so I reject what "they" say... and just who are "they" anyway? There are lots of myths and rumors about autos it seems... and in my mind that is one of them.

 

[Papageno]

Yeah the info on autos is inconsistent and not very reliable.

The darn genetics are seriously messed up to be honest. Then you mostly read about Femed autos which are even worse genetics.


I have seen lots of people who run them regularly and get great results. So they are not bad just kinda whack is all. But what we don't have from what I can tell is a lot of concrete data on properly done experiments growing them.

Most advanced growers wont touch these things other than to mess around. They are a novelty and if you have a decent size grow they are a waste of time. There is a limited segment of the market that Autos are really good for and in that segment you have almost no professionals. Not to say there aren't great hobby home growers. But most people growing indoor with a lot of experience are not growing autos. Those who do are not really experimenting with them from what I can tell. They are dialing in stuff because the grow is so fast and intense. To be honest the more I look into this I think the problem I had with this one is going to be a common thing. The genetics are so whack that you can get stuff all over the map. So it is hard to really do valid experimentation.

I know people running these for years...people who have been growing like 30 total...they shake their head at me when I ask complicated questions about these things.

There is another thread live right now on "Autos that don't auto"... and a guy in there who has been growing them a while claimed "autos are like a box of chocolates..."

If you throw into the mix an F1 auto (which many are) you have no chance of doing this correct at all without running 30-50 of them at a time.


And Emmy is correct when done correctly the stress of replanting wont hurt. I think one problem is many people don't know how to do it correctly.

We may never get real data just opinions on this. I wont probably ever buy enough autos to have a strong opinion. I do think 5 gallon for sure should be good enough. The real question is about a 3 gallon I think. since I have tons of 5s and 7s I guess I will never really know.


I do like the idea of measuring the root mass when done. that is about the only definitive thing we can do. we need to run a bunch of the same type and do a great job on them to see full stunted root masses. Unfortunately that means no re-potting in the first few rounds of experimentation. After knowing the base line of what is the min size to use you can do some re-potting experiments.

 

[Jamesnns]

Its been over a month since anyone posted here....
Im a new grower and have some probs along the way with my first grow. Shes finally coming along good and is flowering now and seems I have her under control. Ive learned a LOT and am still learning
I choose to do an auto fem for a couple of reason.
1. The timing is perfect and the light sched as well. I can finish my reg plant and the auto about the same time.
2. When both these plants are 'done' the weather will be start to be better here and I can control my envroment better then.
3. Why not. With the time constraints I hope to get some yeild as compared to none.

Im rebuilding my grow area soon, enough to go from 2 plants max to 6 plants.
So sometime near the end of this March or early April I plan on running 4 reg fem seeds and 2 more autos.
Right now Im running my auto in a 5 gallon pot.
The next time I'll run one each. One in a 5 gallon as Im doing now and the other I'll use a solo, 1 qt, then final by transplanting.
I'll make notes of the differences.

 

[Amauulu]

Posted 30 Jan 2018:
COMPARISON BETWEEN ROOT PRUNING POT TYPES? FABRIC FOLDABLE or/versus RIGID-SIDED PLASTIC AIR PRUNER?
I chose those bumpy looking rigid sided air pruning pots for my very first experience growing this species. Thru process of elimination, I chose popular & reputedly "easy for beginners" strains White Widow-auto and Northern Lights-auto (ordered from Seedsman.com in the UK; seeds arrived 12 days after the order was completed). As with many overly enthusiastic novices, I got carried away...much slimmer wallet, too many seeds. So I will limit my first grow to 4-5 plants & keep the other seeds (got several freebies w/ my order) stored for future use. Plants will be germinated in Root Riot plugs then transplanted directly with their starter Root Riot small house into their forever home 5 gal size MaXX Yield "Power Pots", (these MaXX pots are cheaper than other brands I've seen online; they also come in 12.5 gal size). My choice of this type pot is based on following article about root pruning pots ,

Please Google article, ARE ALL ROOT PRUNING CONTAINERS THE SAME AND WHY SHOULD WE USE THEM? I posted the online link to that article but it was erased for security purposes. It's a very informative article, that talks about how and why roots grow certain ways and how pot type, pot size and pot shape affects their formation and growth patterns and growth densities.

Page not found - The Atrium

Also watched YOUTUBE video entitled, ROOT SYSTEMS BASICS taught & narrated by Dr. Whitcomb. Video runs 17:26 minutes....Be patient. It's like sitting through a dry but exceptionally informative college lecture.

Above cited article comparing root pruning types of pots explains why Dr. Carl Whitcomb chose to find an alternative to fabric pots. Talks about the importance of roots and root ball sizes, as well as choosing optimal size and shape (tall & narrower vs. shorter sided & squat) of pots. The information above applies to all plant species (and children and puppies). Once you understand your roots, you will expose yourself to much less heartache and loss from mishandling precious (each seeds averaging $10 price) cannabis plants.

BE CAREFUL WITH THAT JUNCTION BETWEEN STEM AND ROOTS....Dr. Whitcomb emphasizes protecting the junction-collar between the above ground stem and the roots growing out from the bottom of the stem. Junction between root and stem extremely vulnerable; damage to that junction may have very bad consequences for the rest of your plant's life.

PROTECTION WITH OUTDOOR GREENHOUSE MADE FROM DOG KENNEL: To protect plants outdoors, I purchased two dog kennels: (Lucky Dog Kennels from Home Depot free shipping); protect grow from boistrous, garden-marauding veggie-devouring gourmands Mastiff and Staffie. I got the large 4' wide x 8 ft long x 6.5 ft high and the smaller 4 ft W x 4' ft L x 6.5 ft H which gives me more choice on where to place them in my garden. Having two kennels also affords me the option of keeping different strains separate for more efficient tending. Kennel is black painted metal w/ an easy-to-open door you can padlock.

Plants can be protected against rainfall by throwing transparent plastic greenhouse sheeting over kennel roof.

Roof of kennel is sturdy enough to support some hanging grow lights, fans, etc.

Plus I got Light Weight Protective Garden Fabric (0.55 oz) to temporarily protect plants against seasonal infestation of moth caterpillars.

Summer temps here are becoming hotter each year; my dog kennels allow unfettered air flow thru top & all sides. In comparison, sturdy greenhouses are several hundreds of dollars more expensive than these metal dog kennels. IDEA FOR ENCLOSED GROW SPACE OUTDOORS: Cattle Panel Greenhouse (50 in. x 16 ft) to make a quonset shaped nursery shelter (for plants, chickens, other animals....and your childrren). Look on Youtube about how to construct a Cattle Panel Greenhouse for less than $200 in materials. You will need a 6 ft bed truck cuz most sellers of cattle panels do not deliver just 1 or 2 panels.

DIRECT PLANTING...of SEED IN ROOT RIOT PLUG for germination, then ROOT RIOT PLUG CONTAINING SEEDLING is planted DIRECTLY INTO 5 GALLON Air Pruning POT: Because so many experienced growers advice is to have as few transplantings as possible (no more than twice) in order to prevent damaging the plant's root system; damage which may lead to possibility of opportunistic pests & diseases infesting a plant weakened by injury. Also, a damaged plant results in prolonging the time for plant to recover which delays your anticipated harvest.

KEEP YOUR HANDS CLEAN & DO NOT TOUCH SEEDS WITH BARE FINGERS cuz you may put disease-causing organisms on seed which may adversely affect it emerging seedling when it cracks through its seed coat. Inexpensive and always useful Blue Nitrile Exam Gloves should be in your grow tool kit.

ANOTHER USEFUL-FOR-BEGINNER-OUTDOOR-GROWERS... Youtube video:

TIME LAPSE OUTDOOR NORTHERN LIGHTS CANNABIS PLANT FROM SEED TO HARVEST. Runs for 16:10 minutes, posted by Weed In A Pot about 7 months ago. This videao was very reassuring; this video gave me the confidence to try my hand at growing my own medicine. The narrator wisely excluded personal images in the video, saving me from needlessly wasting time watching someone strutting about, smoking a joint, speaking in disjointed slurred speech while attempting to educate others on how to grow weed. The narrator in this video is well-spoken and succinct in his step by step explanatory instructions.

Succinct, I am not.