Rider's first foray into LED strip lighting: Samsung H Series GEN3

[Rider509]

So is it proven the Emerson effect works best when the far red is on alone? I try to turn off all but the red lights for the last 20 or 30 mins of each I day. Guess I'm curious if I'm wasting my time...

The Emerson Effect is something that happens during lights on. It's a cyclical relationship between chloroplasts that enhances photosynthesis. Using a red 730nm light stimulates the photosystem that switches plant to night mode. I've read that it's most beneficial for just a short time, 5 minutes or so, just after lights out.

Search for "The Far Red Thread." It's a couple of years old now, but it's got good info and was from the time when even Growmau5 was figuring this stuff out.

 

[LEDXpert]

The Emerson Effect is something that happens during lights on. It's a cyclical relationship between chloroplasts that enhances photosynthesis. Using a red 730nm light stimulates the photosystem that switches plant to night mode. I've read that it's most beneficial for just a short time, 5 minutes or so, just after lights out.

Search for "The Far Red Thread." It's a couple of years old now, but it's got good info and was from the time when even Growmau5 was figuring this stuff out.

Interesting. Good stuff. You've figured a lot out. I wonder if the led has enough residual to do the same or microwave a rock and then put it out haha.

What sort of weight do you think you'll get out of that 4x4? Have THC concenctration been as good or better with your LED?

Also check out samsung Q series modules. Uses LM301B which I belive is the 2nd most efficient chip on the market right now. Can't drive as hard but much more efficient and a lower thermal resistance junction to die meaning they will last better at closer to the maxes and survive higher ambients since the chip is better at getting the heat away from that junction point.

 

[Rider509]

I'm not a commercial grower so having the weed assayed for THC content has never even crossed my mind. And weight would just be a wild guess. Probably more than I need. It sucks that I can't donate to people that need it but I have to stay inside the legal lines.
I saw that a few people are testing the Q Series but haven't followed up to see how it's working for them. The specs are def impressive on the Qs.

 

[Mayne]

I use GrowMau5 Puck, and i have to say it works that I can tell. I started a plant at 12/12 from seed, and it showed sex in 26 days from seed using the Puck. Pretty fast maturation I think. I also see great tric and frost. I have them still on a 13off, 11 on light cycle. I have it on 20mins after lights out.

Lookin awesome Rider

 

[Mountain Goat]

That's the configuration at present, but since each strip is on its own Al u-channel I can split them up and play with coverage patterns or add and remove strips to work with different drivers.

Hi Rider

If I was to do a DIY build using the Samsung strips.....which in your opinion should I order LT-HB22B or the LT- HB24B.....and are there any other strips that I should possibly be looking at?

 

[Rider509]

Hi Rider

If I was to do a DIY build using the Samsung strips.....which in your opinion should I order LT-HB22B or the LT- HB24B.....and are there any other strips that I should possibly be looking at?

Hands down it'd be the 24Bs. There isn't another strip I'd even consider at the present time.

 

[Mountain Goat]

Hands down it'd be the 24Bs. There isn't another strip I'd even consider at the present time.

OK.....the 24B's......is the strip with 2 lines of diodes.....bit easier for building.

Thanks

 

[SOG001]

The light in my head finally went on after reading through your journal again. Question on the 600 watt driver driving 4 of the HB24's did you have any trouble with the lights? Why don't you recommend driving them that hard?

 

[Rider509]

The light in my head finally went on after reading through your journal again. Question on the 600 watt driver driving 4 of the HB24's did you have any trouble with the lights? Why don't you recommend driving them that hard?

If you drive them hard they get hot! More energy is converted to heat than light so you get diminishing returns. I'm running the lights at the nominal setting right now so each strip is consuming about 100W. I bought four more HB24B strips so I can run six strips per driver but I'm afraid of trying to remove the lights from the grow to work on them. Dropping a light on the plants at this stage of the grow would be catastrophic!

 

[LEDXpert]

The light in my head finally went on after reading through your journal again. Question on the 600 watt driver driving 4 of the HB24's did you have any trouble with the lights? Why don't you recommend driving them that hard?

You have to look at the thermal condition of the LED. The modules will have what they call a Tc point. You'll want to hook up a thermocouple to this. Datasheet will tell you the limit of this. Some volt meters have this or there are $10 ones on ebay you can hook in to a laptop.

If you add 2 more modules in parallel and leave output current alone you will slightly reduce the power because the current remains the same and the LED voltage will go down since each chip is driven less hard. You will end up with slightly more light and slightly less power giving you a boost in efficiency as well as giving you better canopy spread. However you've now just added 50% of LED/Heatsink cost plus your time to wire. Cost/benefit ratio.

If you add 2 and increase the current or add 2 in series depending on your power supply conditions you've now added more light. More light = more better even if it is at reduced efficiency because at the end it is still more light. You just have to make sure you have safe conditions both from failure and fire.

The cooler you run them the closer you can get it to your plants, the warmer you run them the more far red (infrared/heat) you will get because of the inefficiency. again trade off.

 

[Rider509]

I've got four more FB24Bs mounted up and ready to go. My initial thought was to add two strips to each 600h-48a system for a total of six strips each. Now I'm thinking I'll just order another driver so I have three identical Samsung systems. Lord knows I don't need it! Between the existing eight FB24Bs and the sixteen Cree CXB3590s I have the ability to max out a 20A circuit at 2400W. But more point sources of light at lower power is good for the plants, gentle on the system, and reduces the thermal load in the grow room.

 

[Mountain Goat]

Couple of questions:

I am looking at building a light with 10 x 1120 mm FB24b strips over a 4 x 4 flower canopy and will want to run them softly......should be sufficient.....light structure wise, how many Cobs would this be equivalent to?

Also looking at building lights for early and late veg stages and mothers.......will these FB24b strips work in different configurations?

 

[Rider509]

Couple of questions:

I am looking at building a light with 10 x 1120 mm FB24b strips over a 4 x 4 flower canopy and will want to run them softly......should be sufficient.....light structure wise, how many Cobs would this be equivalent to?

Also looking at building lights for early and late veg stages and mothers.......will these FB24b strips work in different configurations?

Depends on which COBs. I'm running groups of four CXB3590s per HLG-320H-C2100B driver. Max output is about 300W but I'm running them softly at about 200W per system. The Samsung FB24Bs are a nominal 100W device, so two FB24Bs is equivalent to four CXB3590 COBs.

With COBs the ideal is one COB per square foot. With the Samsungs you can get away with fewer equivalent units because of the more diffuse coverage. You should get by with 3500K for both veg and flower.

 

[Mountain Goat]

Depends on which COBs. I'm running groups of four CXB3590s per HLG-320H-C2100B driver. Max output is about 300W but I'm running them softly at about 200W per system. The Samsung FB24Bs are a nominal 100W device, so two FB24Bs is equivalent to four CXB3590 COBs.

With COBs the ideal is one COB per square foot. With the Samsungs you can get away with fewer equivalent units because of the more diffuse coverage. You should get by with 3500K for both veg and flower.

Many thanks.....helps with my thoughts.

 

[SOG001]

You have to look at the thermal condition of the LED. The modules will have what they call a Tc point. You'll want to hook up a thermocouple to this. Datasheet will tell you the limit of this. Some volt meters have this or there are $10 ones on ebay you can hook in to a laptop.

If you add 2 more modules in parallel and leave output current alone you will slightly reduce the power because the current remains the same and the LED voltage will go down since each chip is driven less hard. You will end up with slightly more light and slightly less power giving you a boost in efficiency as well as giving you better canopy spread. However you've now just added 50% of LED/Heatsink cost plus your time to wire. Cost/benefit ratio.

If you add 2 and increase the current or add 2 in series depending on your power supply conditions you've now added more light. More light = more better even if it is at reduced efficiency because at the end it is still more light. You just have to make sure you have safe conditions both from failure and fire.

The cooler you run them the closer you can get it to your plants, the warmer you run them the more far red (infrared/heat) you will get because of the inefficiency. again trade off.

OK my plan is to add 2 FB24B strips to my current light fixture and replace the SS400's (the burple ones) I wont be able to run the lights very close to the plants because of the intensity of the Vero 29's being run at 50 watts each . What's your opinion?

My current grow

 

[Rider509]

OK my plan is to add 2 FB24B strips to my current light fixture

Anything that gets rid of blurple lights is good. LOL. Which driver will you use?

 

[SOG001]

Not sure at the moment I'm looking at the HLG-240H-C2100B I need to drive the FB24B's pretty hard. For me I found that more umoles the better.

 

[Mountain Goat]

What size canopy is your grow?....4x4?

 

[SOG001]

What size canopy is your grow?....4x4?

I'm growing in a 4' x 6' grow space and I've out grown the space check out my journal by clicking on the link below and you can see more pictures of how well white light works

 

[Rider509]

Not sure at the moment I'm looking at the HLG-240H-C2100B I need to drive the FB24B's pretty hard. For me I found that more umoles the better.

If you want to drive them hard you'll need a different driver. The FB24Bs have a nominal current rating of 2280mA to hit the 100W mark, and a max of 3600mA. The C2100B will drive them less than the nominal, i.e., less than 100W each. A 480H-48A with its 6.7A output will drive them fully to over 150W each. They'll run hot but that's what fans are for, right?

You might be able to squeeze them onto a 320H-C3500B running in series, but it'd be pushing the limits of that driver.