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ScienceGrow's Bag Seed Sativa - Alpha Clones - Soil - LED/CFL - Grow


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The new light is doing good, at 18 inches currently.

Plants are doing their thing; they'll need a feeding tomorrow or the next day. I've been tucking and moving branches to get the best light. I think I'll end up needing to support any large buds that form unless these stems thicken up.

Here's some pics.

Not much to see yet, but the show should be coming soon.


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Fed the two inside heavily last night. Full feeding of the fox farm trio, as well as two new products the local hydro shop owner gave me (store samples,) Thrive Alive B1 Red, and Vegetable and Fruit Yield Enhancer. Both are mostly for general plant health and resilience, but the yield enhancer had some microbial life in it and humic acid and will hopefully make for even happier plants. Man, that yield enhancer smells like raw sewage. Must be good, haha.

I fed 1700ppm at 5.8 pH in aerated, dechlorinated water at 68F last night. Just enough before there was much runoff. Runoff pH and PPMs looked good.

Flowering very nicely, and those twiggy branches have really thickened in the last week. They're still growing up a bit, but it looks to be slowing. Lots of excellent budsites, I've been tucking and exposing, minimal trimming at the bottom.

The girl outside is fine, but the cold is definitely slowing her down. Buds are growing, but slowly. I may give her a heater at night, but, what would be the effect of her being warmer at night and colder during the day? Because that's basically what would be happening.

The mother is fine, but I think Im gonna take a cutting from her and start a new one. I need more room in my veg cabinet. I may convert the top of my grow storage cabinet to be a permanent mother cabinet in the future.

Finally, I started designing the database for the Journaling app. To start I'm just using Access and VB.net to throw together a prototype. Local hydro shop owner is also a software developer and may help out, and has 30 years experience gardening, so should be a helpful asset and tester.


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Woo -- those indoors really are filling that cab :)

IIRC warmer temps in lights out (vs lights on) will reduce the amount your plants stretch.. I believe some professionals actually do this on purpose for that reason.

I've used the Thrive Alive B1, but only the green bottle... I like it; especially since it didn't have any impact to my PPMs so my regime didn't need to account for those numbers... No idea on the red tho.

You already started on that app? Damn, you are serious! If you need an alpha tester let me know -- I'm really good at breaking shit!


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Okay, will need to look into that, good to know others do it too. Though preventing stretch isn't much of an issue. I need to get picks of the outdoor girl, she's a funny looking little bush. All light is hitting her from one side so she kind of cascades flowers down the front and the back is now bare, because the back stretched up higher.

The red is about the same, just not all organic. Barely raised PPMs, maybe 50-75. Will see if I notice a difference. Need to experiment next time and only give to one plant.

Yep, most of the obvious primary tables are built, plus a bunch of the lookup tables. I'll probably finish the initial DB design tonight and start on the interface. I'm going for flexible but easy to use. I found Grow Buddy to be frustratingly simplistic and buggy, and Grow Assistant to be just ugly, annoying to work with, frustating.

Will also include some utilities for DIY grow spaces, like tuning your ventilation, CO2, setting light heights, anything that would be helpful to have calculated for you.

My degree is actually in Multimedia, so I'm hoping to eventually have a plant simulator that represents your plants in 3D, based on genetics(sativa, indica), height, width, training style, etc. Would then programmatically build a plant based on those factors. Future plans, way off for now.


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Quick update:

Everything is perfect! Fed and trimmed out some of the spindly lower growth las night. Canopy looks the same, just cleaned up down below. The trim was quite smelly and sticky so I'm going to try to extract what I can from it. A good bit of trim came off.

Not a single bit of nute burn, amazingly. I'm at full dose on these plants, following the soil schedule. Also have 3ml CalMag+, 4ml Thrive Alive, 5ml Yield Enhancer, and I inoculated the water with yield enhancer and molasses, and bubbled it for 48 hours. Total PPM in was 1400.

Buds are really starting to grow up, I think I'll have a really nice harvest on these. I'm projecting harvest a week or two before XMas, which will be a nice present.

Considering upping my CO2. I'm not sealed, but my air intake is below the canopy, and the thick canopy fills the cabinet, so I figure CO2 filtering through the canopy with the ventilation pressure would be useful, especially with stomata being concentrated on the bottom of leaves. I plan to use a bagged CO2, like Exhale. Any input on this? With all that light and nutrients, I feel like more CO2 would maximize performance. Those CO2 bags are pretty cheap for how long they're supposed to last. I wonder which produces more per dollar, these bags, or fermenting.

As I understand it, atmospheric CO2, while more than capable of growing incredible plants, isn't quite optimal. Both Jorge and Ed even recommend enriching air outdoors with extra CO2, by planting around a compost pile.



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Haha, funny story. I went to the hydro shop to get that filter(which I got, Phresh 150), and the owner was telling someone about the Exhale CO2 bags. He answered my question without my having to ask it. So, for $20 I've got extra CO2 for about 6 months. He told the guy that, with ventilation and a canopy that takes up the whole space, just put the bag under the canopy. Literally what I was gonna ask him.

He also gave me another free bottle of stuff. This time it's an Amino Acid and vitamin supplement. I think he really wants me to go organic. I'll be doing a side by side Organic vs. Synthetic vs. Hybrid regimen on my next grow. To see what I like most. Hi Brix looks very interesting to me too.


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Got some big colas building on these two, plus a bunch of slightly smaller ones. Been tucking and bending and rearranging for best light. Cut a few big leaves that weren't able to be moved well, but only three of them.

The larger colas emerged right after the CO2 addition, but I also added the microbes and vitamins around the same time, so who knows what caused the increased growth. I'll play with these in the future to determine efficacy, right now I just want as good a harvest as is possible, to carry me through future experimenting.

Resin is starting to build up. Plants are healthy as can be, a first for me haha. They're taking the 700W LED at about 14" without a problem, so that's good. Almost all of the red I had before has gone. Still red on upper petioles, but everything else is green again.

I'm very near a root bound state I think. Hopefully it won't be a problem. What I'm seeing is much diminished drainage. Suppose it could just be compacted from months of watering, and I'm just being paranoid. Hopefully.

Outdoor plant is still fine. Slow growth in the cold but flowering. Really no idea how that'll turn out, but I'll just let her grow.

Pics tonight.


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I lied again. Pics tonight. Promise.

Man, this is gonna be a hell of a harvest. Things are looking awesome, big colas all over, fairly even canopy, resin is building up. Still about 4 weeks till harvest I'd say, so I'm very, very excited by the potential. Need to keep a close eye on them here, this is about when their mother went downhill.

Provided all goes well, I see a HUGE harvest in store. Huge for me at least. I'd say six dry zips, minimum, with confidence. I think more, just based on what I got from their mom, and what she looked like compared to them.

Once these get chopped I'll be moving some flowering autos into their cabinet, and will have a nice rotation going after that.

Tonight. Seriously! Pics. They look so good.


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Had some concern I'd be root bound, but after seeing the root structure of my autos and how well they did in the air pruning pots, I'm much less concerned. Man, I've never seen a soil root ball that didn't have masses of roots wrapping around it.

So, probably about a month or a little less, should be good to go. I've bumped my CalMag back up after dropping it and seeing some deficiency last week. These bastards love the stuff I guess, was worried I was giving too much.

Smell likely to begin soon, time to install the filter.


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Thanks lazyfish! The day after those photos, the buds were visibly, significantly bigger.

Took some leaves off that were in the way and not just tuckable. Removed maybe 8 total, tucked a bunch. Water this weekend. About halfway through flower, probably. Maybe a little under. I still predict a December harvest.


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Quick question guys, before I ask elsewhere. Just got a 150W metal halide for my veg cabinet(2' x 2') and I've got five small seedlings it'll be going over.

How far would you say I need to place the light for seedlings, considering the space and wattage given? Ventilation is not an issue, I have that handled, just not sure about how much light I should give them.


New Member
Ok, news!

Both indoor plants are flowering like mad. Slight Calcium deficiency in the larger one, bumped calmag back up to 3ml / gallon. I've been feeding full doses of the fox farm, no issues.

I've got several rather large buds, and a ton of medium sized buds. The bigger ones are nice and long, and really starting to fill out in girth.

They're staring to get frosty now, and the smell has kicked up. It's an earthy/spicy scent. My best description is it smells like wet, toasted, salted, sunflower seeds with the shells on.

Outdoor plant is getting pummeled by cold weather. I may need to just harvest what there is. She gets no attention, I even stopped putting her inside at night.

Mother needs more light. I may just take some cuttings and start fresh in a smaller container. I kind of want to make a hanging basket for the mothers, keep them under the HID but out of the way. Or convert my drying room to a mother room.

I flush the two indoor plants tomorrow and will then give a full feeding. I don't seem to have much salt buildup, ppms out are spot on, plants doing well and I've been feeding full dose with every watering the past three weeks. But, to be sure, they're getting flushed.

Go check out my new grow, should be a good one.


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Little update here.

I've got my filter securely in place and doing it's job well. These guys got very stinky very fast. Not like last time when I burned all the smell out of them. They're getting more and more resiny, and fattening up. Will get some resin pics in another week, for now, here's how the buds are looking.


Can't wait to get these harvested!


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I know I just did some pics, but here's some more. They needed water, fed them their last full dose of nutrients. Probably a half dose next feeding and then nothing but water.

Here's the spread. Lots of nice big buds in there, and some are a good deal larger than others but I'm pretty happy with the canopy that basically built itself.

The flowers are really bulking up and packing on resin now. The smell is intense, very earthy, maybe sort of skunky, or cheesy, or something. Yay for carbon filters!

I didn't show it in the medium shots but there was one bud that had stretched all the way from the lowest node and was struggling to get some light. A lost cause, and, being the smallest bud on the plant, I decided to trim it off and have a VERY early sample.

On the plant



The chunk missing from the post trim was caused by an equipment malfunction. New eyes are on order.

Oh yeah, macros!


Damn, we may be nearing done on some of the top colas. I need to sample more trichomes on the other buds.

Oh yeah, someone had suggested backbuilding. I've been doing a whole lot of reading, and backbuilding may have some science to it. Just as there are root and shoot meristems, there are also inflorescent meristems. Both root and shoot meristems suppress axillary root and shoot growth. Cutting the tip of the meristem breaks apical dominance and allows the axillary buds to grow.

Doing the same on a floral meristem might have a similar effect, and would appear as a girthier, shorter bud, just as the plant as a whole looks when you top. I may give it a shot in my new grow, on the photoperiods.


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Hopefully someone sees this before later.

I was reading Ed Rosenthals grow guide and he says to harvest just as trichomes start going cloudy for peak THC.

Ive read this elsewhere, forget where, but the consensus almost everywhere else is harvest at mostly cloudy for peak THC.

Anyone got a third opinion? If not, and further reading doesn't change my mind, I harvest tonight , at least the top colas. Some lower growth definitely needs some extra time.

UPDATE: I'm holding off for now. I haven't seen what I'd call a final swell, which everyone says is the last two weeks. I was actually expecting another two weeks to harvest, so yeah, gonna wait it out and just watch the trichomes don't go too amber, and hope for a final swell.
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