Second Try: Soil Super Critical Auto Grow 2018

[Mr. Krip]

@AngryBird or @Mr. Krip Few pictures for update, some leaves started to show new symptoms. The rusty spots on one of better doing plants. Also, does the yellow leaves are normal looking? I mean the purple colour on them?

I don't really see anything to worry about. It looks like the yellowing is just the older growth dying off. The lighting isn't great in the pic, but it looks like the plant is healthy and the new growth seems OK. Those brown spots on the leaves may be a sign of a slight calcium deficiency, and I find that plants use more calcium during their first few weeks of flower, BUT, if I had to guess, those brown spots look more like you got some water/nute drops on those leaves and they got a little burn in those spots from the lights. The drops act like a magnifying glass and can cause burn on the leaves.

The run off water doesn't tell you the pH of the medium.
How long until harvest?
I see buds, can you post a close up on them please.

If he's PH'ing the solution first, assuming to about 6.5, and the run-off is 6.5, the medium is fine. While run-off doesn't tell you the PH of the medium, by measuring the starting PH of the solution, then measuring the run-off, it tells you what the medium is doing to the solution. If run-off PH was higher, the soil would have to have a higher PH and the opposite would be true if the run-off PH was lower.

 

[Martin1981]

The run off water doesn't tell you the pH of the medium.
How long until harvest?
I see buds, can you post a close up on them please.

Thanks for reply. I've no idea how long till harvest. Here's few photos of buds. Would you be able to tell how long have I left to go.

 

[AngryBird]

They need some more time... Beautiful buds

 

[Emilya Green]

Thanks for reply. I've no idea how long till harvest. Here's few photos of buds. Would you be able to tell how long have I left to go.

Get a way to look at the trichomes... 2% amber is the bare minimum before harvest...some like even more.

 

[Emilya Green]

From the supplier:

Super Critical Auto is 80% indica has a life-cycle from start to finish of 9 - 10 weeks. It is ideally suited to SoG indoors in order to maximise yields with 800 gr/m2

So if you started around Nov 1... I figure about Dec 27 or so

 

[MarkTHC]

Everyone comeing together to help, that is amazing. Great support I love this site.

 

[Mr. Krip]

From the supplier:
So if you started around Nov 1... I figure about Dec 27 or so

Yeah, but judging by those pistils, I'd say closer to a month left. I don't grow autos, so perhaps they'll mature much quicker than that. I know autos do mature quicker, but I thought the accelerated growth was predominantly in veg.

 

[Martin1981]

I didn't get a steady shot of trichomes, will try next time. @Mr. Krip The purple colour is not going away, it's getting worse. I forgot to say, that with the first grow attempt I had the same problem in flowering. The leaves were going purple and crispy. Should I try to give more nutes?

 

[Martin1981]

Another update. Things are getting worse. Leaves on all plants are going yellow redish and dying. The picture is of the plant which was the best. Growth is stunted and buds stopped growing.

 

[Emilya Green]

That sure looks like a hungry plant to me... you say this happens to all of your grows at about this point?

 

[Martin1981]

That sure looks like a hungry plant to me... you say this happens to all of your grows at about this point?

I see three other one the same and other three with very same early simptoms. I've measured EC of this, it was 1.8, when water was 1.2. Should I flush it? Would that be not risky, given that it's auto and couple weeks from harvest? Or what should I do now?

 

[Emilya Green]

OK Martin, lets figure this out. You are obviously making some sort of mistake, and we just need to figure out what it is. So first this EC business. We are both soil growers, and EC belongs in the hydro world. Let's please get on the same page. I need to know what nutes you are giving these plants. You stated a while back that you gave the plants nitrogen... in what form please? Are you working with a specific brand name of nutes? The EC thing makes me think that you might have gotten hold of some hydro nutes, and are trying to use that in soil. That could explain what we are seeing here. These plants are starving, and that yellowing is them sucking every bit of stored up nourishment that they have in those lower leaves, trying as hard as they can to keep the new growth happening, because paramount to this plant is to develop that bud, produce those seeds and keep the species going, even if it dies in the process.
For some reason the nourishment you are giving them is not making it home. I am not sure yet if you are simply giving the wrong nourishment or if something is wrong with the way it is being applied.
So you asked about flushing. Flushing is for removing from the soil any trace of nourishment, broken down organics or anything else that the plant could immediately use. Flushing is for a periodic cleaning of the soil and it is for emergencies when something needs to be removed, such as built up salt that could be blocking uptake into the roots. That is not what is happening here... flushing is not appropriate to solve this problem.
These plants need phosphorus and potassium and calcium in large amounts as soon as they hit flower, and especially during weeks 4-6 of flower, and they need much smaller amounts of nitrogen than they needed while in veg. Their nutrition needs have radically changed from simply needing nitrogen, and their needs have quadrupled. So tell me... what have you been feeding them?

 

[Martin1981]

OK Martin, lets figure this out. You are obviously making some sort of mistake, and we just need to figure out what it is. So first this EC business. We are both soil growers, and EC belongs in the hydro world. Let's please get on the same page. I need to know what nutes you are giving these plants. You stated a while back that you gave the plants nitrogen... in what form please? Are you working with a specific brand name of nutes? The EC thing makes me think that you might have gotten hold of some hydro nutes, and are trying to use that in soil. That could explain what we are seeing here. These plants are starving, and that yellowing is them sucking every bit of stored up nourishment that they have in those lower leaves, trying as hard as they can to keep the new growth happening, because paramount to this plant is to develop that bud, produce those seeds and keep the species going, even if it dies in the process.
For some reason the nourishment you are giving them is not making it home. I am not sure yet if you are simply giving the wrong nourishment or if something is wrong with the way it is being applied.
So you asked about flushing. Flushing is for removing from the soil any trace of nourishment, broken down organics or anything else that the plant could immediately use. Flushing is for a periodic cleaning of the soil and it is for emergencies when something needs to be removed, such as built up salt that could be blocking uptake into the roots. That is not what is happening here... flushing is not appropriate to solve this problem.
These plants need phosphorus and potassium and calcium in large amounts as soon as they hit flower, and especially during weeks 4-6 of flower, and they need much smaller amounts of nitrogen than they needed while in veg. Their nutrition needs have radically changed from simply needing nitrogen, and their needs have quadrupled. So tell me... what have you been feeding them?

I'm using GH Flora trio. Plus adding 1ml per litre of calmag. Plus silica 1ml per litre, 1 drop of superthrive per litre, 1ml per 5 litres of white orca. When I've tried to add nitrogen, it was liquid form and 1ml per litre. Flora trio series, O was putting 1/3 of recommended dose, thats 0.3ml per litre of micro and bloom and I stopped giving grow part when saw flowers developing, now I raised the dosw to half of recommended dose, 0.5 ml per litre of macro and bloom. Also I've added bloom stimulator "monster bloom", according to instructions. I was afraid to give bigger dose to cause nutrient burn, because I saw light nutrient burn on two plants. I know that it's lacking nutrients, just can't figure out which ones and how much should I give. Thanks for your help.

 

[Emilya Green]

ok, so you are using hydro nutes... and they do claim at GH that it can work in soil... so what pH are you adjusting this to? And why 1/3 dosage??? Where were you advised to do that? And why did you stop giving Grow? The chart shows to give it all through the grow.

 

[Martin1981]

ok, so you are using hydro nutes... and they do claim at GH that it can work in soil... so what pH are you adjusting this to? And why 1/3 dosage??? Where were you advised to do that? And why did you stop giving Grow? The chart shows to give it all through the grow.

The water is ph'ed to 6.5. I cut out the grow part, because read and saw few videos, where guys were using just two parts with autos, and they grew fine. Now I think it was a mistake. I starter with 1/3 not to burn the plants, because I saw some tipa burning on two of the plants with that dose. So I assumed it was the right dose. Should I go for full amount then? Cos I've read that with autos there should be smaller dose of nutrients.

 

[Emilya Green]

The water is ph'ed to 6.5. I cut out the grow part, because read and saw few videos, where guys were using just two parts with autos, and they grew fine. Now I think it was a mistake. I starter with 1/3 not to burn the plants, because I saw some tipa burning on two of the plants with that dose. So I assumed it was the right dose. Should I go for full amount then? Cos I've read that with autos there should be smaller dose of nutrients.

You can't believe everything you read my friend, especially on online forums. At some point you need to experiment on your own and figure out who is blowing smoke at you and who is telling you the truth. It also helps to check out those who are giving you advice and see if they are capable of keeping a live grow journal going... proof is in the pudding as they say.
At 6.5 pH, you have broken your nutes. Bingo! At 6.5 pH, they don't work for very long because the soil is drifting the pH up. This is your major mistake. PH adjust to the lower end of the scale that GH recommends for their nutes in soil, I suggest 5.8 pH.
Mistake 2, trusting two guys who claim to have a better way. Follow the instructions given by the nute manufacturer. If they say to give 3 parts in certain ratios at certain times during the grow... that is probably the advice you need to follow... not two guys who might just be trying to make themselves sound somehow more knowledgeable than the folks who made the stuff.
Mistake 3, and we are all guilty of this one over and over in our lives... you assumed. You saw some tip burning or magnesium deficiency or something, and assumed that you were giving too much. I know, I know... you read that Auto's need less. If you have one of those little bitty autos that some folks end up growing [I am actually watching a 3" auto growing on this forum], they don't need many nutes. If you are trying to grow a big Auto... feed it big. Makes sense, yes? Give a plant a bigger light, it needs more nutes.... more soil... more nutes...

Contradictions do not exist. Whenever you think you are facing a contradiction, check your premises. You will find that one of them is wrong. ---Ayn Rand

 

[Martin1981]

You can't believe everything you read my friend, especially on online forums. At some point you need to experiment on your own and figure out who is blowing smoke at you and who is telling you the truth. It also helps to check out those who are giving you advice and see if they are capable of keeping a live grow journal going... proof is in the pudding as they say.
At 6.5 pH, you have broken your nutes. Bingo! At 6.5 pH, they don't work for very long because the soil is drifting the pH up. This is your major mistake. PH adjust to the lower end of the scale that GH recommends for their nutes in soil, I suggest 5.8 pH.
Mistake 2, trusting two guys who claim to have a better way. Follow the instructions given by the nute manufacturer. If they say to give 3 parts in certain ratios at certain times during the grow... that is probably the advice you need to follow... not two guys who might just be trying to make themselves sound somehow more knowledgeable than the folks who made the stuff.
Mistake 3, and we are all guilty of this one over and over in our lives... you assumed. You saw some tip burning or magnesium deficiency or something, and assumed that you were giving too much. I know, I know... you read that Auto's need less. If you have one of those little bitty autos that some folks end up growing [I am actually watching a 3" auto growing on this forum], they don't need many nutes. If you are trying to grow a big Auto... feed it big. Makes sense, yes? Give a plant a bigger light, it needs more nutes.... more soil... more nutes...

Ok. I got it. I'll tru ph it to 5.8 next watering and see what happens. Thanks for advice and I'll post the progress after couple of days.

 

[Emilya Green]

good luck... it is near the end of this grow so it is going to be hard to see a lot of improvement before the end... but I have a feeling that your next run is going to go much better.

 

[Martin1981]

good luck... it is near the end of this grow so it is going to be hard to see a lot of improvement before the end... but I have a feeling that your next run is going to go much better.

Looks like you were right. I have checked the soil's ph and it was around 7, if not above.
What would cause th ph of soil to go up? I've watered yesterday with water ph 5.8 and it's still that high. What would cause the soil's ph to go up?

 

[Emilya Green]

The soil is designed to be at the high end of the pH range of 6.3-6.8 and this is totally normal. The soil pH didn't "go up" to that reading... the base pH of the soil is purposely set to that value so as to cause a drift. This is normal and desired. Someone using normal soil nutrients would pH their liquids to 6.3 and the natural drift of the soil to the high end of the range would allow their nutrients to go through that entire 6.3-6.8 range as the soil dried out.
You however are using hydroponic nutes, and they need the lower pH in order to unlock the salt bonds that holds the stuff together until your plants need it. You need to continue to water at the 5.8 value, so as to unlock the nutes that you are supplying.
Lastly, how did you measure the soil pH? Did you do a slurry test with an equal amount of soil weight to distilled water weight? If you did not, you do not know your soil pH. Sticking a probe in the soil is not how its done and any reading you get that way is extremely inaccurate.