Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180 - Multiple Strains - NFT Grow 4.0

[OldMedMan]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Yo Yo.

Had kind of a crazy day in the garden yesterday.....I'll post pictures of the changes I made soon. But yeah it probably didn't help that I ate a brownie before working on my garden but yeah, I managed to drop a bucket with 3 gallons of water in it, splashed the shit out of me and my apartment-luckily it was in the kitchen when it happened and not the garden...THEN! I was mounting some hooks to my ceiling in the bloom room and when I stepped down from my chair the stupid thing fell over and in one clean swoop the back rest of the chair perfectly knocked off the ribbed part of one of the bulk heads that holds on the 1/2 inch hose which leads to an on off valve for draining.

Oh it gets better. So Water starts gushing luckly I had a bucket near me so ever so slowly I had to empty the system of water before finding out that I didn't havn't another bulk head laying around that matched the size of the one that got smashed (of coarse it was the older one that broke) So THEN I had to try and bust surgery on it with my drill trying to widen the whole which then cracked the plastic AHHH!

Bad day. Whats the lesson here? Don't eat brownies and work on your grow room! Unless its minor stuff!!
going to the hydro store today to buy a new bucket....

-Hydro

Man, that's awful !

We all do it though. I know you been telling yourself...I knew better!

At least it didn't ruin everything.

 

[OldMedMan]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Hi Stevehman.
That was cool four girls from reg seeds. You must live right. I see that as a good reason to get the second tent bought and installed.
Saying your busy is an understatement. If someone doesn't nominate you next month for MOTH I will!

 

[SteveHman]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Hi Stevehman.
That was cool four girls from reg seeds. You must live right. I see that as a good reason to get the second tent bought and installed.
Saying your busy is an understatement. If someone doesn't nominate you next month for MOTH I will!

OMM,
Not sure if it's living right or just dumb luck. Either way I'm going to buy some Lotto tickets today for sure.

I'd be very honored if you nominated me next month. I missed out last month, and there is no way I would compete this month, since I am voting for you. I think you definitely deserve it. I think 420 needs a Member Hall of Fame and you should be the first inductee.

 

[OldMedMan]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

OMM,
Not sure if it's living right or just dumb luck. Either way I'm going to buy some Lotto tickets today for sure.

I'd be very honored if you nominated me next month. I missed out last month, and there is no way I would compete this month, since I am voting for you. I think you definitely deserve it. I think 420 needs a Member Hall of Fame and you should be the first inductee.

I'd be buying lottery tickets too!

We'll get you in there next month for sure. What your doing is amazing and more people should see it. Just reading your journal is an education about our hobby and our medications.

I think we have a Hall of Fame already....our staff!

 

[Crower619]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Hey Steve thought I'd pull up a chair an give some fellow So-Cal love an support brother, I just caught up on your grow an very interested not only with the hydro but also the led lights I've been doing lots of looking around with these Led's lots to decide after this grow..good work so far cant wait to see the turn out on them

 

[Vaporeyes]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

@Vapor,
I think the coverage area is accurate, just that the light is way more intense in the center (core coverage) and starts to diminish as you get towards the edges. I would try to keep everything in the core area as much as possible. My plan is to buy two 4x8 tents later this summer and put 2 of these lights in each and utilize a 3x6 foot print.

How are your light oriented? -- -- or | | ? I also like the idea of using a mover on these, just to move it a few inches to spread out the coverage of the light spectrum. I used one on my first grow and it made a difference, although that was with the single 180 in a 2x4 space moving 10 inches. I found a good mover on ebay for about $100, a little cheaper than buying a 3rd light and it may actually improve the yield by spreading the love a little more evenly. Just have it travel 8-12 inches and that should be more than enough to do the trick.

Hey Vaporeyes,
So you got the new lights in that's great. I going to have to agree with you on 2 of these 360's covering a 4x8 area very well. My core footprint right now with these 2 lights is 2.5x6 and if it was not for the light mover I don't think it would cover it as well. Kyle did say that the coverage with 2 of these lights will cover a 4 x8 footprint no matter what orientation you have them in ( | | ) or ( -- -- ) as long as they are 4 feet center to center. I have my lights about 3 feet center to center and with the mover the coverage seems great. For my next grow my footprint will be 3 x 6 with 18 plants!!!!!

I have them set up like this -- --, im debating on the mover in my head. I know it will help but even with the mover im not sure id be where I want. my original plan was both 360s in 4x4 and keep one of the 1000w in for the other half but the more i thought about it the more i really want the hps completely gone .

I really think its going to take 1000w (actual draw led 1000w ) to get the 4x8 where it needs to be so im leaning on tossing one or two more in now and bi-passing the mover.

 

[SteveHman]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Starting to debate if using beneficials in this setup is a good thing or not. I had to remove the sponge filter from the pumps because they were getting clogged up with growth. It looks like a mushroom-esque growth. If you've ever seen or grown kombucha before, it looked very similar. No smell, just a fleshy consistency. It is also growing around the media and on the roots, which is what the beneficial fungi is supposed to do, I just didn't expect it in this magnitude. Since I am using spray lines this grow and not an open pipe like last grow, the concern is that it may clog up the lines. I have the pump feeding the system in a filter bag to keep the chunks from making their way towards the lines. I am considering removing the end plugs on the laser lines to allow an open free-flow of nutes so that it would be similar to last grow and keep thing moving faster. I may do that tonight when the lights come back on.

I am still having a bit of nute burn showing on some of the plants and a little chlorosis on some of the older leaves. The new growth looks healthy green, so I am hoping the issue is a carry over from the time in the cloner. I will be keeping an eye on the pH and PPM readings. If things don't pick up in the next few days, I will do a flush with H2O2 and completely change the res.

The issues may also be from an elevated pH level. I had added some pH up the other day trying to hit my target of 5.8 and the solution spiked up to 6.4 overnight. It is now adjusted down to 5.63. The only times I've ever had an issue with pH is when I've tried to adjust it to hit a specific number. From now on, I am mixing the nutes and not going to stress a specific number. I contacted CES and here is what they said:

Having a fluctuation within a range is much more beneficial for plants than having a static number (which is near impossible to regulate without fertigation systems). The reason behind this is because different elements are available at different levels. For example; Phosphorus is more available at lower pH (4.2-5.6), while Nitrogen is more available at a higher pH (6-7), and micronutrients can vary from 5-6 as well. By having a slight shift, which is typically from lower pH to higher, then brought down again, you can have one set of elements more available one day, and then the plant can utilize others the next. In all reality it is more beneficial to have a slightly higher pH in veg (5.5-6.5) for Nitrogen, and lower in Bloom (4.8-5.8) for Phosphorus. Just a little food for thought, though I always stress to people not to be obsessed with pH, as long as you are in range you are typically okay, it is when people start using up and down to try and pinpoint numbers that things get screwed up.

So I will more or less fire-and-forget on the pH adjustments as long as I'm in the range, which is the approach I took last grow.

Today's numbers are:
pH: 5.63 (adjusted down)
PPM: 1053
Res temp: 66
Cab Temp: 78
RH: 45

Here are some updated photos. You can see the areas are separated with very little chance for light spill-over.

The 6 girls under the Advanced 180w:

The 6 under the 200w mystery light:

The 6 + 2 under the Advanced 360:

A shot of the top of the partitions, they go right up to the lights so there is no light from the other lights hitting the plants.

And here are three of the surplus clones that I put into hempy buckets with OC+ under a T5HO light. They are 18/6, so still in veg stage, these will be the new moms and I will flower out the other moms as soon as I pick up a tent for them:

So far the Pineapple Chunks are stretching the most, The Gigabuds are stacking up but are staying fairly short and the Twilight are in the middle. I may need to put a screen in there to keep the canopy level, I don't want the P-chunk to crowd out the Gigabuds.

 

[SteveHman]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

I didn't color correct the pics so that you can get an idea of the color of the lights. The 180 and 360 have a pinker cast to them, the 200 is more white than the others.

 

[Jozo-sha]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Wicked.

 

[OldMedMan]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Hey Buddy I was surprised that your lights were so different in color. You can sure see the difference.
I'm glad I don't have to worry about fleshy substances in lines. I wouldn't have clue on how to fix it. You just take it stride like it's nothing. That's what I'm impressed with.

 

[surfinstoned]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Great update! The girls still all look pretty good to me, I’m sure that they will snap out of it. Looks like you have everything under control. Nice work on the light wall by the way.

 

[SteveHman]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

@Surfin,
Thanks, I wanted to make sure that the girls were completely segregated from each other (light-wise). They are still getting the same nutes and CO2 so this should be a pretty fair comparison between the lights.

I took a few shots of the roots so everyone could see what I was talking about. THe dark stuff on the roots isn't slimy, has no odor and when "pulled off" the roots don't slough off like the would with pythium. The resulting material in my finger is almost like an algae (possibly brown algae?). I have hit it with an extra dose of h2O2, and a few cap fulls of Hygrozyme. The new growth is looking very nice though.

I added some humic acids last weeks and that tends to darken the roots up too (that and the great white may have caused the growth). It doesn't seem to be affecting the plants, they are all looking pretty healthy so far, and I will keep an eye on them to see if they take a dip.

For those that are curious, here is the nutrient line I am using. Once I change my res on Monday, there will be nothing but CES in the system (except the Great White).

I picked up the pump top at a local store called Smart and Final, if you're in the S.D. area you can find them next to the coffee syrups (you know, for lattes; caramel, vanilla etc...). They are about $2 ea and I picked up one to see if it works. For the 1 qt bottles you have to trim off about 1.5 inches to make them fit. Also, make sure you remove about an ounce of fluid BEFORE you place the pump in a new bottle, that is how much it will displace and if the bottle is filled to the top, you will get spillage. They also carry the pumps for 1 gallon bottles as well.

 

[SuKaFr33]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

roots are lookin good for sure, and i never seen that product line before, bottles look cool though, i'll have to look into it, even though i have enough nutrients to last me a couple grows, but it never hurts to study other products for sure.. but again lookin good bro!!! i just posted some more pics come check me out..

 

[SteveHman]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

As promised earlier in the thread, I would be doing some upgrades throughout the grow. The first one I have planned is to replace the two pumps in the res (1 for chiller, 1 for nutes-NFT) with an external pump. The reasons I wnat to do this are:
- Remove anything that is not necessary from the res, after this upgrade I will only have an airstone and nothing else in there.
- Two pumps in the res must add some heat, even if only a little.
- Two electric devices in the res must have some effect, not sure what, but out they go.
- The two pumps in the res have surface area that stuff can grow on, plus the power cords etc... It also makes for quite a tangle of hoses and cords.
- Replace 2 pumps for one that uses about the same wattage but has more capacity.

The pump I chose is an Ecoplus 1056, using 70 watts and providing 1056 gph. I chose this pump because it has an inline option, most submersible pumps do not. All of the fitting that I used can be found at HD and are pretty cheap. Here is a quick snap shot or three of the setup before it goes in:

The manifold has three valves. One goes to the chiller, one goes to the NFT and the third will go back to the res for now (if I need to reduce pressure I can bypass the other two and send the nutes back to the res). If I need to add a chillbox later on, I will hook it up to the third valve. The third valve also allows me to shut down the feed line while I clean the filter and reroute the pressure back tot the res while I do that.

One thing I wanted to accomplish was to increase the flow/pressure to the feed lines to create more splashing/aeration in the root zone. Also the faster things are flowing the less chance for things to grow/clog lines (the holes in the laserline are fairly large compared to spray heads, more flow=better).

I currently have a pair of pumps in the 360 gph range (two different models), I will have enough flow to drive the system and then some. I would like to almost double the flow on the NFT side and this should do it.

I'll be doing another DIY upgrade next week. It involves using a PC power supply and several PC fans to create airflow and some cooling.

 

[SuKaFr33]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

you did a good job at strappin that thing up man, good job!!! definitely got this shit down packed!!!

 

[lbezphil2005]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

have you thought about wrapping the fenceposts with aluminum tape or mylar? I'm not certain but there may be a little luminocity thru the white materiel of the fencepost, letting a slight glow into the root chamber could be the cause? I know you've been running these things for a while, just a thought.

 

[SteveHman]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

I could wrap them with the reflective film I have (one side is diamond foil, the other is white PVC). I'm sure there is some light making it's way into the chamber so I may just cover the top of them for now. Part of my plan to keep the box cool is to place four 120mm case fans along the bottom between the posts. I figure since they are filled with 66 deg nute solution, the air passing over them will cool off a bit and then lower the overall temp in the box (and keep keep the CO2 moving). If it keeps it cool enough, I may be able to turn down, or turn off the exhaust fan.

 

[SuKaFr33]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

you could also get a piece of ply board, attach the diamond foil some how, that way you can put it up and take it down without wasting the foil and it could be used at a later time maybe for another grow maybe in another area, but thats just my opinion though..

 

[lbezphil2005]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

Many different ways to skin a cat, most important is to keep light off the water, any at all even if it is cool and aeriated well will still cause just what you are seeing there. Priors with that.

 

[SuKaFr33]

Re: Stevehman's Advanced LED 360 vs. 180, multiple strains, NFT Grow 4.0

lol you got that rite, you could also try a couple different ways to see which one works best with you area..but im sure you'll figure somethin good out..