The Truth About LED Lights

Hey folks , I'm a newbie here at "420" and pretty much a newbie to cultivation . I just got my MMC and will now start growing after some major reading and planning . I'd like to do an inside grow to augment my O/D grow for when winter hits . I keep reading about LED's vs. HPS /SH . The price of a "true" LED system is "puckering" for my wallet since I live on a small fixed pension . What I can gather the lights on Amazon etc. are pretty much trash , yes ? I want to grow the legal amount (12 babies) in an area of 12' x 8' . What do you think would be a bare minimum of lighting I'd need for a good crop . I don't have my strains or a source decided upon yet . Being "stateside" and finding a secure source is daunting (I'd loose my pension for a federal charge) so I hope you can understand my position and possibly weigh in on my options . Thanks very much !
 
Since your posting in a LED thread I will suggest you look into MARS HYDRO LED"S and see if its a light for you.

Read up in some peoples Journals here on the site and see first hand what others are using.

For HPS lighting requirements for your space I suggest you Visit the Grow Journal of Dutty Panty here on the site , read his work and ask him questions if you want tips from a Pro with that lighting.
 
Thanks "Bud" . There is so much out here on lighting and conflicting opinions that it's hard for a "junior farmer" to get focused on what is right for a certain situation . After a few hours my eyes start bleeding , hands shake making it damn near impossible to spark a Bic Lighter . My intention is to skip HPS/MH for LED . Initial cost is a "dog" but savings and hopefully a good crop will offset that . I was reading on this thread early this AM and it turned into a "slinging" match . That was when I quit and posted here . So again thanks for replying . The Desert Rat ......
 
There's a lot of conflicting reports because it's still new and there's a lot of bad products on the market that say they do something but then turn out to be lying. If you buy LEDs through the normal means of buying from a hydro store or reseller, then you can expect to pay a pretty penny with the markup but most growers here actually want to buy straight from the source (China) which is where all the discrepancy starts happening.
 
Hey guys I'm new here and relatively new to growing! I'm using 2 x 1000watt bossled 2 led lights, 1 x 125watt full spec CFL for vegging (5weeks) 18/6 light in a 1.2m x 1.2m x 2m tent and ive added 2 x 125 red spectrum for flowering (1st week) 12/12 light. Temp 30c, humidity 55%, using plagron light mix with Canna flores, bcuzz bloom booster and I've got canna pk 13/14 and hammerhead pk 4/10 which is "supposedly" better for indoor cultivation?! Any advice on my grow method/equipment and which pk would be best?
 
Desertrat60 said:
Thanks "Bud" . There is so much out here on lighting and conflicting opinions that it's hard for a "junior farmer" to get focused on what is right for a certain situation . After a few hours my eyes start bleeding , hands shake making it damn near impossible to spark a Bic Lighter . My intention is to skip HPS/MH for LED . Initial cost is a "dog" but savings and hopefully a good crop will offset that . I was reading on this thread early this AM and it turned into a "slinging" match . That was when I quit and posted here . So again thanks for replying . The Desert Rat ......
Click to expand...

Hello Desertrat60... Putting aside the "slinging" lol, I suggest that you only consider buying from a seller who willingly offers REAL performance data. Yes, surrogates may provide images/video of a 'Test Grow', but in order to make a fully informed decision, performance data is critical. I wish you luck in sourcing an appropriate LED solution.
 
Red49 said:
Hey guys I'm new here and relatively new to growing! I'm using 2 x 1000watt bossled 2 led lights, 1 x 125watt full spec CFL for vegging (5weeks) 18/6 light in a 1.2m x 1.2m x 2m tent and ive added 2 x 125 red spectrum for flowering (1st week) 12/12 light. Temp 30c, humidity 55%, using plagron light mix with Canna flores, bcuzz bloom booster and I've got canna pk 13/14 and hammerhead pk 4/10 which is "supposedly" better for indoor cultivation?! Any advice on my grow method/equipment and which pk would be best?
��
Click to expand...

Hello Red49, re LED lighting... If you have selected a good quality LED grow light, you need not use CFL or add a red light for flowering. The best LED grow lights (typically a good quality high-powered COB) can take your seedling/clone all the way to full maturity.

I quickly visited bossled (not sure if I was at the right site) and it is a chinese online storefront. Thats not necessarily a bad thing, but chinese marketing is notorious for offering deceptive information and NOT providing real performance data. Assuming I was at the correct site, I quickly looked at 3 different lights (different product lines) and the descriptions of all are completely devoid of performance data. A lumens measurement of 41,000lm was provided for one of the lights, but lumens is NOT appropriate grow light data, because it does not measure the full PAR spectrum.

Aside: An LED grow light that is advertised as a 1,000 watt unit likely consumes about 500 watts. Also, an LED light that emits 41,000 lumens probably has a similar intensity to a 400 watt HID, but again, lumens measurements are deceptive.

TTFN :)
 
Hi SuperFunker
Thanks for the info bud. My lights are advertised as double chip 10w x 100 led's and are "supposed" to use about 200watt actual power consumption! So far the results are awesome and according to reviews on these lights my yield should be great (only time will tell) I have 3 fem northern lights 1 week into 12/12 and 1 La Diva auto 1 week left before the chop! I am using light training using 12" pipe cleaners (works fine and reusable).
How far should my lights be from crop?
Also I was using a Mars hydro 300watt led before but my yield was small and my inexperience didn't help lol, so I upgraded
 
Red49 said:
Hi SuperFunker
Thanks for the info bud. My lights are advertised as double chip 10w x 100 led's and are "supposed" to use about 200watt actual power consumption! So far the results are awesome and according to reviews on these lights my yield should be great (only time will tell) I have 3 fem northern lights 1 week into 12/12 and 1 La Diva auto 1 week left before the chop! I am using light training using 12" pipe cleaners (works fine and reusable).
How far should my lights be from crop?
Also I was using a Mars hydro 300watt led before but my yield was small and my inexperience didn't help lol, so I upgraded
Click to expand...

Hello Red49... Found your unit and it does say it uses 200 to 240 watts. Seems like a decent bargain.

Without performance data, its difficult to say how close the lights should be. A reasonable estimate would be to try to bathe your plants with 600 to 1100 PPFD. Generally, I would never allow my LED units to get closer than 12 inches. You might try about 18 inches, allow the plants to stretch to the lights, then pull the lights away as needed. For a more powerful lights like those at Zenith, a full 2 feet would be about right. But again, without PPFD, Im just guessing. Regardless, youre close to harvest and you seem happy with progress, so maybe just keep doing what youre doing.

Note: My knowledge is more about LED lights, so maybe another reader can offer suggestions re finishing the grow?

Re posting pics: Theres an insert image function on the tool bar.
 
Zoidberg13 said:
Dude, are you still in business? My COB LED guy is moving on to another project. Looking for a solid lighting system for a 5 by 5. One of my Associates swears by Spectrum King, but I am very open. Looking to grow top tier produce.
Full Spectrum LED Grow Lights | Spectrum King LED
Click to expand...

Hey Zoidberg13...
I am still in business. I am currently in transition. I am testing significantly more powerful COB platforms which outperform Spider and Blackdog. I have not been able to directly compare Spectrum King to my new systems, but I just visited their site and examined their current offerings.

I expect SK600 (their most powerful unit) may be effective, but they have omitted some information and exaggerated.
1) Omission: Their Coverage Area graphic provides PPFD numbers, but it does not specify if the measurements are peak/on-center or average/area readings.
2) Exaggeration: The SK600 may be powerful, but suggesting it can effectively cover 8ft x 8ft is a stretch. Essentially, they rely on primary lensing of 120 degrees. Although they do allude to a reduction in intensity as you move away from your target, they do not mention the fact light intensity rapidly falls off as you approach the limits/edges of coverage. So, if you're talking about special flowers, 120 degree primary lensing likely has an 'effective' coverage of about 90 degrees. The limits/edges of 8ft x 8ft coverage would be OK for tomatoes, but less so when talking about fancy buds... even during vegging.

Aside 1: If you pump gas, 1 SK600 at 3ft high (whether their data is peak or average) does not provide enough intensity to rationalize using gas. Perhaps at 2 to 2.5ft gas would be prudent, but you must also consider coverage is reduced as you move closer to your target.

Aside 2: I have been following a REAL university researcher who maintains test crops at an average of 700 PPFD at the canopy. 700 PPFD is his veg and flower intensity.

Let me know if I have helped and/or if you have more queries.
 
Hosebomber said:
Ace, there are a number of reasons that most people still use HPS (and other lighting options). The first is the high initial cost of LEDs. Second is the new tech aspect. Many people still think that LEDs are the crap product that all the cheap producers where making 3-10 years back that did not have enough power or the right spectra. Now there are actual reputable companies that have done the research and tested their produce before putting it on the market. CFL's and T5/T12 lights will grow plants but there are not efficient enough for larger grows.

Sum it up, large cost up front and lack of knowledge.
Click to expand...
Exactly well said. But I feel the lack of knowledge lies with the majority of led grow light manufacturers.
Those sticking to hps usually tried the switch & weren't down to make all the unnatural adjustments needed to optimize the results of using Non-Hortictural spectrums, deployed as lasers. Hence all the Fluence SPD Knock-Offs, Bruce Buggbee followers & customer Guinea Pig operations going on. Each one proudly admits it too. Then there's the even lower form of manufacturers imho but smarter. Those are the ones that follow a company who actually is a leader in "Results" & copies their spectrum/s while claiming to have done R+D to achieve it. The only R+D they did was see the Leading company win every Side-by-side. Redic.
These Non-Horticultural spectrums will & do outperform hps at half the watts but for many its Hell trying to get there.
 
Hosebomber said:
Ace, there are a number of reasons that most people still use HPS (and other lighting options). The first is the high initial cost of LEDs. Second is the new tech aspect. Many people still think that LEDs are the crap product that all the cheap producers where making 3-10 years back that did not have enough power or the right spectra. Now there are actual reputable companies that have done the research and tested their produce before putting it on the market. CFL's and T5/T12 lights will grow plants but there are not efficient enough for larger grows.

Sum it up, large cost up front and lack of knowledge.
Click to expand...
Exactly well said. But I think it's the majority of manufacturers doing the miss-leading.
 

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