Utopian Submarine - 2000W, Indoor, Perpetual

[Green Utopia]

Hi PapaGreen!

Excellent summary of your grow! I can relate on many levels with your summary.
I have a bad back and arthritic hands so the LSTs and SCROG type gardens seem to be too much maintence for me. My goal is to basically get my garden as close to being on autopilot as possible.
One of my biggest problems with a young prodigy I'm working with is trying to hammer home to him that his garden needs to operate according to what the plants need, not what he wants. It got to be so frustrating that I went ahead and let him run the garden according to what he's "heard" and how he wants it to "look". After a dismal harvest he finally came to me with his tail between his legs seeking advice.
I basically told him that I'm taking him back to the beginning and he's going to have scrap most of his mythilogical ideas on how to grow good pot and get back to learning the fundamentals of cannabis cultivation. He's now about 4 weeks away from his best harvest ever and has a better understanding of what to do rather than letting his head get scrambled with rumors and myths.

Every now and then he comes up with hairbrain idea that he's heard and asks me about it before he does it. I just tell him to focus on what we're doing and block out what you think somebody else may be doing. Every garden is different.
I think his kookiest idea was to use very small pots with soil and when the roots came out of the bottom, they could dangle down into a tray of a hydroponic nutrient solution. Somebody told him that's how they do it in Cali!

I have a friend like that. He has a pretty good grip on things, but just doesn't understand how you have to be pro-active in your care and stay focused on your plants. I have done a LOT of experimenting lately, and now its a real pleasure to settle in. Looking forward to really getting the gals fundamentally sound.

 

[Green Utopia]

What a great harvest papa plus repps fo sho those buds and that scrog are pristine man and great strains to that AK-47 short pheno looked really good i have two ak seeds that both are on the first node from cotyledon so i'll hope for the short phenogreat work dude i'll be tuned in on your next journal fo sho

Thanks!

I think most folks prefer the short. It flowers faster and definitely has more of an Indica high. I like the tall as well. It takes two or three weeks longer to finish but has a nice high. A little more Sativa mixed in. Both are about the same yield I think, perhaps a little more from the tall, but remember the longer flowering time. Both are super great smokes and super hearty plants.

 

[IrishBoy]

Both are right. I think there's a smidge more to each equation. Also, before I make excuses, not only are both right - but those are exactly the things I've been trying to improve.

Now then - the excuses...

As far as number of plants and crowding and veg time - they all go together. The only real goal is to fill the scrog as densely as possible with tops. Buds that are woven are good, but its really the tops that are the key. So if you wanna do fewer or more plants, whatever combination you want for size of individual tops, vs faster veg time with more plants.

So that's why that scrog and harvest in the pic are so good. And, BTW - that is STELLAR!! He got all his tops up above the scrog. That was what I didn't do so well on the last. Was horizontally as dense as possible, but not great vertically. Also, that strain is notorious for small nugs and a lower yield and when you see what the clones from those plants look like you will see why they didn't get better colas. Very very healthy, but just the same small nug all over the plant.

Now - wait til you see the current Barneys scrog. I believe it will demonstrate what I'm talking about. Not only is it as dense as the other, but it is growing about 18" ABOVE the scrog. I would show a pic but I'm saving them for the new journal. Should be tonight or tomorrow.


Great questions and comments guys. I really like it when folks call me on the details. + Reps to both.

he veges his plants for 10 days with MH then flowers them with the screen 20" and they stretch threw the screen that tall. the whole key to his success and allot of grows who have great yield is that they learn their strain. he has been growing the same strain for 3yrs. that is what i am doing right now between my XJ-13 and Hindu skunk, looking for the best strain out of these two and just devote my time on learning that one strain and make it grow the best it can. IMO thats the key to success when growing with a good strain and having a great environment, i dont believe u need 20 different nutes to make a good crop and yield. but anyways u cant tell me you have some nice bud pics and tell me i need to wait a day or two, ur killing me bro. i waana see!!! shit send a pm of the pics to me if you dont want to post them.lol

 

[usul]

Hey folks, just wanted to say how much I'm enjoying and learning from the discussion here. Please keep it up!! More than anything, I appreciate talk of how tuning the grow technique can make a huge difference in yield.

I've just started my second grow using the same strain as my first so, irishboy - I totally agree with your point about focusing on one strain and learning how to grow it best. And orangeblood, your post about focusing on the basics and letting the plants tell me what to do is right on. I'm beginning to embrace a new way of thinking about this: find the strain you like the most then figure out what growing technique works best for that plant. It might be SOG or ScrOG or LST or something else or a wild combination of them all.

Of course, only having one grow under my belt I have no idea what strain to choose - the choices are endless. It could take years. Then, once I choose a strain, I'll have to craft the best grow strategy for those plants. It could take years...

I like this job

Very much looking forward to your next journal Papa.

 

[IrishBoy]

Hey folks, just wanted to say how much I'm enjoying and learning from the discussion here. Please keep it up!! More than anything, I appreciate talk of how tuning the grow technique can make a huge difference in yield.

I've just started my second grow using the same strain as my first so, irishboy - I totally agree with your point about focusing on one strain and learning how to grow it best. And orangeblood, your post about focusing on the basics and letting the plants tell me what to do is right on. I'm beginning to embrace a new way of thinking about this: find the strain you like the most then figure out what growing technique works best for that plant. It might be SOG or ScrOG or LST or something else or a wild combination of them all.

Of course, only having one grow under my belt I have no idea what strain to choose - the choices are endless. It could take years. Then, once I choose a strain, I'll have to craft the best grow strategy for those plants. It could take years...

I like this job

Very much looking forward to your next journal Papa.

yes i can take a long time, just look for a strain that u like the high and how it yields, then try different ways of growing it. on my last grow i had a Hindu skunk and really really liked the high and taste, the yield wasn't to bad, so this next round i got two more of these strains and tried some LST on them and it seems ti be a big hit. i also got a other strain that i like to smoke and so i wanted to see how the yield was and then pick witch one performs the best? then i will stick with that strain and learn it, them once i mastered it ill try something els and master that, them i will have my own collection of good strains for me that i know like the back of my hand. u just need to learn how to look at ur plant and see what it needs, u will learn over time and know what to do. be best advice for you is to use the K.I.S.S. method. (keep it simple stupid) dont feed them all kinds of stuff, just try new things as u go and learn how they work and if their worth the money. The strain and environment is the key to a great yield and crop! not $300 in nutes

 

[Green Utopia]

Wow. 10 day veg and that nice a plant. That's great solid consistent fast growth from start to finish to hit that. I still get slowdowns. Hoping to improve. We'll see in the next journal.

I also agree completely with tuning one plant. I am on my 3rd or 4th generation on some here and only 1st and 2nd with the Barneys.

As far as $ on nutes. A beginner should get some kind of well balanced cheap nute. Unless they already have other growing experience and want to make their own fert.

Next should focus on technique and atmosphere. Better pruning and training increases yield far more than extra $ on nutes at the beginning. And the extra $ can be used to make your environment perfect. There's really no point in dumping a bunch of $ into nutes, then have your plants fry the first time the temps outside go above 95.

Also, and I think this is important - proper nutes and any comparison of nutes requires a baseline. If you have not grown a strain at least once, and if you do not have the environment dialed in 100% then you won't know if you're doing things right or not. Every time I think I've gotten what I can get from a strain I get better the next time - without changing nutes.

Good Convo.

 

[Green Utopia]

subscribed

Heheh - was just flipping through and saw the sig. Reminded me of a story. Philosophy exam. Students walk in the room. Teacher puts a chair on the table. The only question on the exam - "Prove the chair exists."

One student writes for 3 seconds and hands in the paper. Walks out. On the paper was written - "What Chair?"

He got the only A.

 

[Green Utopia]

Re: Cloning Technique

Well Folks, whaddya know. I actually have an update on my cloning experiments.

I am pleased to report that the results clearly demonstrate that using the 2x4 tray as a DWC/Flood area works like a champ for both Clones and Veg. 7 Clones all from the same Montana plant and from approx same type sites. The results were conclusive. 4/4 straight into clay and nutes have roots or bumps. All 3 of the others failed. Rockwool x2 and neoprene x1. The cool thing is all I did was dip them in clone gel, and diluted down (read re-used) the nutes from a 2 week old veg cycle. They got 900 ppm from the beginning and 15 on 15 off water. And the plant below was growing on the other side of the tray the entire time as a test. So, in other words - total extra expenditure for cloning hardware and medium if this continues to work: $0. Extra space required: 0 sq ft. Extra lights: 0.









P.S. - I am mere hours from the new journal....

 

[StinkFinger]

<ding...ding...another round>



SF

 

[IrishBoy]

I also agree completely with tuning one plant. I am on my 3rd or 4th generation on some here and only 1st and 2nd with the Barneys.

As far as $ on nutes. A beginner should get some kind of well balanced cheap nute. Unless they already have other growing experience and want to make their own fert.

Next should focus on technique and atmosphere. Better pruning and training increases yield far more than extra $ on nutes at the beginning. And the extra $ can be used to make your environment perfect. There's really no point in dumping a bunch of $ into nutes, then have your plants fry the first time the temps outside go above 95.

Also, and I think this is important - proper nutes and any comparison of nutes requires a baseline. If you have not grown a strain at least once, and if you do not have the environment dialed in 100% then you won't know if you're doing things right or not. Every time I think I've gotten what I can get from a strain I get better the next time - without changing nutes.

Good Convo.

I AGREE 100%. nicely spoken.

 

[OldMedUser]

doesn't cut it. This is a freakin' great thread and I kick myself in the ass for not hanging around here more!

I'm almost ready to flip my ScroG into 12/12 and fill what little space is left with the stretch. So far I'm quite confident that the one plant will produce as much as the 14 plants that last grew in that tub.

I primed the tub with 40ml Bloom and 20ml Micro and plan to flip in a week. I'll take a few clones then as the big clone/plant is going to be my seed producer from the pollen I saved from the Kali male.

The four seedlings from an old strain from BC crossed with NL are surviving and will be involved in my little breeding program. I didn't want to have too much heat producing stuff going on with summer starting.

I'm really liking this ScroG thing and may set up a monthly cycle. This KaliMist takes about 12 weeks to finish so if I started a new ScroG every month I might get a half pound a month with three tubs.

I decided early that I wouldn't weave the branches under the screen and it's all tied above the screen. Seems to be working as I have no branches binding anywhere and tons of bud sites.

I'm dying to see what it looks like 10 weeks into flower. I hope I end up with a plant like the pic Irishboy posted!

I only read the last couple of pages here and need to go way back to really get all the goo. Time is of the essence lately and I'm glad I spent some here.

 

[COmmjDude]

Hours away hell yah i'm excited for the next round dude and totally agreed on the nutes and dialing in I'm still at the learning to grow phase as i am only on my second... my only nute regiment is age old bloom and growth with blackjack gigantamo spray in bloom and mollasses in bloom and so far everything is pretty great def not 100% were i'd like it to be but def about 75% there...aldo i would love to grow a strain for 3+ years that would make everything so much easier on everyone during the grow cuz then if a problem comes up time to fix not figure it out... my favorite bud locally is actually some marley's collie that this 60+ lady has been growin for 10+ years and the colors smells and high are all so very perfect this a great journal though papa count me in for the next one looks like i can learn a lot here

 

[Green Utopia]

doesn't cut it. This is a freakin' great thread and I kick myself in the ass for not hanging around here more!

I'm almost ready to flip my ScroG into 12/12 and fill what little space is left with the stretch. So far I'm quite confident that the one plant will produce as much as the 14 plants that last grew in that tub.

I primed the tub with 40ml Bloom and 20ml Micro and plan to flip in a week. I'll take a few clones then as the big clone/plant is going to be my seed producer from the pollen I saved from the Kali male.

The four seedlings from an old strain from BC crossed with NL are surviving and will be involved in my little breeding program. I didn't want to have too much heat producing stuff going on with summer starting.

I'm really liking this ScroG thing and may set up a monthly cycle. This KaliMist takes about 12 weeks to finish so if I started a new ScroG every month I might get a half pound a month with three tubs.

I decided early that I wouldn't weave the branches under the screen and it's all tied above the screen. Seems to be working as I have no branches binding anywhere and tons of bud sites.

I'm dying to see what it looks like 10 weeks into flower. I hope I end up with a plant like the pic Irishboy posted!

I only read the last couple of pages here and need to go way back to really get all the goo. Time is of the essence lately and I'm glad I spent some here.

Thanks. That's a real compliment - I know how busy you are, not to mention how good your thread is. I am lovin that you are enjoying the scrog. I knew you would be a natural.



I'm gonna keep this short - I just wanted to poke in and let everyone know I really am wrapping up. I found a few last minute things I wanted to take care of. I am gonna take a few bong hits - collect my head - then go take clones.

I will take some clones of each Barney's strain so we have plants to follow from start to finish. Everything else will just be gravy.

The room is as ready as its gonna get before starting the new journal.

So clones, clean, pics, post a new journal. That's the agenda for tonight.

Thanks for good vibes.

 

[COmmjDude]

nice dude may your roots grow large and new growth be plentiful tokin one up waitin for the new journal man best wishes

 

[Green Utopia]

nice dude may your roots grow large and new growth be plentiful tokin one up waitin for the new journal man best wishes

Thanks! And on that fine note - we'll consider this journal officially closed! I hope to see everyone in the new Sub:

Papa Green's Utopian Sub v2 - You, Me, and Barney's Farm makes 3 - Perpetual 2000w
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THANKS EVERYONE!

​

 

[PotPie]

Hey PG, Well done! Sorry I haven't been around much. My personal life has been getting in the way of my weed education here lately.!

I just subscribed to the new journal and I'm already 6 pages behind! Talk to you soon. Thanks for a great journal.