White Flies

[Rodrigo]

Hello, Community.

Some time ago I noticed that every now and then I saw a small fly flying around the flowering tent, very small and thought that since it was small it was going to get sucked out eventually. Today I noticed that there were about 5 of them flying around near the stems, I managed to kill two of them (not much of a difference in the big picture maybe) and thus I was able to identify they were white flies.
I read that they reproduce more easily when the soil is wet. I grow in an E&F system with clay pellets as a medium, and when the pump is on the water always stays about two inches below the surface. The pellets are like peas, all rounded and about the same size.

The thing is that I grow organically so I don't want to spray chemicals on the girls, what kind of solution is there besides spraying chemicals or soaps(more chemicals)? will those sticky taps work? It's not an issue yet, there's not even a trace of damage in the leaves, and I'd like to keep it that way.
The girls need about 10 more days to mature.

After this harvest I'm changing all the equipment so it'll be a couple of days before I put new girls in there, will the flies go in that time? What kind of early countermeasures can I implement?

Thanks all for any and all contributions!

 

[RoadLizard]

Sticky traps are a good thing to try. Hopefully they do the trick. They work great on fungus gnats but not sure on white flies. Try them and find out. If not, there are some natural sprays you can make up that have like cayenne pepper sauce and garlic in them. Stuff like that. Hopefully you won't have to. Take care of it now though, they'll reproduce like insects.

 

[GigaGrew]

if they hide in the soil you can probably burn them with h202 like a fungus gnat infestation.
hydrogen peroxide (h2o2) may sound all very industrial and chemical, but its my honest belief that on that which it works, its the most planet friendly pesticide there is.

if the dose is high enough it will kill all manner of critters in the soil and as long as you dont exceed the top limits, the plant considers it nothing more than a refreshing oxygen drink as h202 breaks down into harmless water and oxygen.

it also helps dechlorinate tap water and can be used as a complete replacement for bubblers if needed (and affordable).

hope this helps =)

 

[GigaGrew]

straight from wiki

Non-chemical means Biological methods have also been proposed to control whitefly infestation, and may be paired with chemical methods. Washing the plant, especially the underneath of leaves may help reduce the number of the pests on the plants and make their management by other methods more effective. Spraying the leaves using Safer-Soap following manufacturer instructions is one option. Whiteflies are also attracted by the color yellow so yellow sticky paper can serve as traps to monitor infestations. Dead leaves or leaves that have been mostly eaten by whiteflies can be removed and burned or carefully placed in closed bins to avoid reinfestation and spreading of the disease.
Early detection in combination with hosing or vacuuming of diseased portions as well as removal of any section that is heavily infested. Pesticide use is not ideal in the case of controlling whitefly and widespread contamination can be costly; it is best to avoid this problem with aggressive preventive measures.
Several predators and parasitoids may be effective in controlling whitefly infestations. These predators include green lacewings, ladybirds, minute pirate bugs, big-eyed bugs, and damsel bugs.^[8]
Integrated management of whitefly can as well be done using Biopesticides based on microbials such Beauveria bassiana (effective on nymphs and adults) or Paecilomyces fumosoroseus.
Green lacewing larvae have a voracious appetite. They will attack whiteflies as well as other pests including aphids, mealybugs, spider mites, leafhopper nymphs, moth eggs, scales and thrips. They also can attack other insects including caterpillars. They are available in the form of eggs from commercial insectaries and will stay in a larval stage after they hatch for one to three weeks. The adult insects can fly and will feed only on pollen, honey and nectar to reproduce. Repeated application may be necessary and the eggs could be eaten before they hatch by their natural predators, such as ants or mature green lacewings.
Ladybirds are also used. They eat mostly insect eggs, but will also feed on beetle larvae, aphids, scale insects and young caterpillars. Adults are often collected when in a dormant state in the wild and shipped for use in pest control, however, they may not stay in the location where they are released. They do live for about a year and will continuously lay eggs and reproduce. Spraying the bug's wings with a sticky substance before release may hinder their ability to fly.

 

[Rodrigo]

if they hide in the soil.....

I grow in a hydroponic system, E&F. No soil.


Ok great! thanks all for your input, I'll get some sticky paper later, I've only seen a couple so it's definitely not a problem for now and hopefully the traps will get the few that are in there.

Thanks!!

 

[GigaGrew]

i should have said 'if they hide in the rootzone' to be more clear, things like fungus gnats and other soil burrowers are more than at home in hydroton or perlite e.t.c =)

 

[Rodrigo]

i should have said 'if they hide in the rootzone' to be more clear, things like fungus gnats and other soil burrowers are more than at home in hydroton or perlite e.t.c =)

Luckily so far I've noticed a few white flies (no idea how they may have gotten in there)and no other bugs, will the h2o2 help with them?
I was thinking about just going at it in the least invasive way with sticky paper, it's cheap and available and it seems to work.

Thanks!!

 

[GigaGrew]

the yellow stickies are the first line of defence really, h202 is just an optional if it gets bad =)

 

[JJ Bones]

SNS-209 is what I'd go with, natural and no nasty chemicals. Can add to your reservoir with nutrients, simple and easy.

 

[Rodrigo]

Seems like a product I would use. I'll weigh the choices and see what's best.

Thanks all for your help!

 

[Rodrigo]

I uploaded some pics of the flower setup as it sits today, I'm harvesting sometime next week and then I'll make the upgrades, which is basically starting from scratch since I'm only keeping the pump, all other components are being replaced, i.e. res, flood tray, hoses, valves, etc.

@GigaBane (or anyone who knows)
Do you know the best way to clean and sterilize (not sure if this is absolutely necessary) the hydroton pellets? I've tried different ways after each harvest but it's all a pain in the ass, removing all the roots left behind so they don't rot when the new plants go in, or killing anything that may be hiding in there.
Would a bath in a rich h2o2 solution help?
I've tried a chlorine bath but it is so difficult to get rid of (wash off) afterward that it is too damn impractical. In the oven they take way too long, and removing the roots with a strainer is too much of a hassle.
So any help in this regard will be very appreciated!

 

[GigaGrew]

for hydroton cleaning i refer your to our fellow Alaskan1 =)

How to clean Hydroton.

 

[Rodrigo]

for hydroton cleaning i refer your to our fellow Alaskan1 =)

How to clean Hydroton.

It seems too much of a hassle too. I only work with a small amount of hydroton, I think maybe around 7 gallons of it, so a cement mixer might be a little too much for me. I think I'll go with the h2o2 to make them float and skim the surface, that seems to be the easy way and for me the more practical.

Thanks, Giga!

 

[GigaGrew]

of course my friend. obviously that set up is for a bigger scale. its the processes to cleaning that count and you can make your own method based on the scale you need

when only doing a small amount, you can often do by hand what you would want machines for on a bigger scale =)

 

[Rodrigo]

Yeah I think the h2o2 was the step that I was missing, I tried making the roots float but it didn't work so I ended up using a long fork (for the bbq grill) to clean the roots from the clay but it was a slow and somewhat inefficient process.
So i'll put them in a big container and use h2o2 and see how that goes.

Thanks for everything, I'm only a few days away from harvest (I think Wednesday is the day) so I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[GigaGrew]

i wonder how well hydroton would take to an oven, isnt it already baked? just half hour on high might make all root material dry and brittle and come away with just a little agitation. just a thought

 

[Rodrigo]

Tried it already, the problem is that you have to put on a small layer to make it work so then you have to put several loads in to bake everything which means having the oven working for several hours. If you put a couple of layers then the middle doesn't get dry for hours, they hold so much water than it takes a while for it to evaporate from everything.
The roots do get dry and brittle but you still have to get them out of there and dry is harder than wet because they don't stick to anything. Sure, they break into dust but that dust has to be removed somehow, if you put water back in without removing them then it was all for nothing.

But well, luckily I use a small amount of clay and it's only a once every two months maintenance operation so I guess it's not such a big deal. I'm learning to live with the fact that cleaning the stuff is a PITA right off the back.

 

[GigaGrew]

hmm. i want to try...lol
im thinking baking trays, de-turf a strip of garden and get a couple sacks of coal/coke and make a runway like firewalkers use.
lay out all the water washed hydroton onto the baking trays and cook on the coal for an hour, then you need a makeshift panning tray you can agitate in, if the holes are small enough to prevent the hydroton falling through i reckon a shopping cart may be perfect. run round the block on a rough road, that will vibrate the root dust off
then just give a spartan rinse with pure hydroton to kill any organisms and let dry naturally.

 

[Rodrigo]

then just give a spartan rinse with pure hydroton to kill any organisms and let dry naturally.

You mean pure h2o2?

Hahahaha yeah the coal runway may work, but THAT'S the very definition of overkill. Plus, I live in a part of the city where the houses are very close to one another so I don't really have a big yard I couldn't get away with a coal runway without drawing attention. In my case the shopping cart wouldn't work because my hydroton pellets are like peas, almost the same size and all round, the only other option was the bigger version and those are too big, like a big olive probably.

You have a nice imagination so kudos for that and thank you for the laugh!

 

[GigaGrew]

haha your welcome =)

its definatly a puzzle i would have liked to crack, but alas i think hydroton isnt being made any more so it would be a waste of my creative juices =(

ah well, maybe one day we will all just be growing in a gravity drum, where the plant just hovers in mid air and the enviroment is enriched with all its needs.