Wonderland Grow

[Tony Urban]

If you haven’t yet, take a look for the fusion pro tents, as they are well built and cheaper than most. Grow lights Canada dot ca

Free shipping I think in Canada too.

I bought a cheap one and a heavy duty fusion and the difference is huge.

 

[AliceGG]

They certainly need light, but not a ton of it. I use a 60w led bulb that’s about 12” above my cubes. It works for me, and everyone has their method, but a source of light is important.

I also keep my seedlings under light for 24hrs until the second node, again others will do it differently but that’s my method.

Support is what this community was founded on, so I’m happy you feel supported!

I've read a lot, but somehow it was totally new for me that they need light even before they pop their heads. I don't have a separate light for this yet, but I turned on the main lighting in the room they're in, it's a 10W, ~900 lumen led and I also put a 20w regular desklamp over them. I guess it should be enough for now.

Be patient like blew and moss have said! All the magic is going on underneath right now... I’m not sure what the others will suggest but I always put my freshly planted seeds directly into the veg closet under the light on 18/6.. then I use a spray bottle on mist to keep the top of the soil damp and wait... and wait... and then the little seed will be growing you out of the tent before you know it! Lol

I’ll stick around to watch if you don’t mind

Welcome Pjs!
Sure, I'm happy to see everyone here. All I can do is learn from you, growers more experienced than me.
Sometimes I feel like, oh, I should water them probably, but then I go and check the cube, and it's like it's been watered 5 minutes ago. Even the top surface of the cube and the soil around it is visibly wet, I think I better not overwater them. I guess those halfcut plastic bottles were the main factors keeping the moisture in, but for tonight, I'm leaving them all open in the room to see if the water evaporates quicker.

If you haven’t yet, take a look for the fusion pro tents, as they are well built and cheaper than most. Grow lights Canada dot ca

Free shipping I think in Canada too.

I bought a cheap one and a heavy duty fusion and the difference is huge.

Hey UrbanAchiever, welcome!
I only found a link to led grow lights canada dot ca, I think that's what you meant. I don't know about other tent prices in Canada, but 400$ for the 4×4×6,6 seems incredibly expensive compared to what I pay here for a tent. A Secret Jardin Hydro Shoot with the exact same dimensions goes for ~143$ brand new.
Maybe I should be blissful for living in a poor country?
Anyways, thank you for the tip, but I'm sure if prices were lower, there would still be a quite noticable shipping cost from Canada to here, Central Europe.

 

[Tony Urban]

My bad I thought you were in Canada. I only suggest that tent for those in our country. The material is thicker (1680D) and the poles are metal and thicker than most.

When you said 4 plants, I assumed it was a legal Canadian grow

 

[AliceGG]

One of them is out!

 

[Pjs420]

One of them is out!

Glad to hear it!! Patience is key!

 

[AliceGG]

The little one, that was planted later, pushed herself out nicely. I hope she will drop her seedcap until this evening.
However, the other one is just sitting in the cube for 5 days now. I gently pulled the soil yesterday from above the hole she was put into, all I could see was the top of the seed, it is really close to the surface (like 2-3mm). I've put some soil back over her, and I'm trying to stay patient

 

[Pbass]

Hi @AliceGG congrats on the pop! I'm subbed. Out of the 12 germ'd seeds I've planted so far in my illustrious 38 day weed growing career, I think there was only one I didn't go in and root around to find if I didn't see it crack the surface after a day or two, and that's because it popped up too quick! Patience is not my strong suit. But I was gentle, and all but one came up eventually. Luck to you on the rest of yours! Cheers!

 

[AliceGG]

Hey Pbass!

Thank you for the support. I can't wait to get home and see if she has popped finally. I will definitely wait a few days yet to say goodbye to her, but what I mostly read here and there is that seeds should come to the surface in about 2-3 days, if you put them in cubes/soil after they germinated. I don't want to be negative at all, but I feel like I might have killed her with the plastic bottle that didn't let enough fresh air in.

 

[Pbass]

Hey Pbass!

Thank you for the support. I can't wait to get home and see if she has popped finally. I will definitely wait a few days yet to say goodbye to her, but what I mostly read here and there is that seeds should come to the surface in about 2-3 days, if you put them in cubes/soil after they germinated. I don't want to be negative at all, but I feel like I might have killed her with the plastic bottle that didn't let enough fresh air in.

Don't say goodbye without finding out what happened! I really was surprised on how long a few of mine took even after I gently dug around and located them in the soil with a tiny screwdriver or exacto knife or something. I only planted mine down a half inch or so, seemed like they dug themselves to various levels and took their own path (not always straight) up.

 

[AliceGG]

Don't say goodbye without finding out what happened!

Well, when it's time I give up on her, I'll get her out of the cube to possibly see what happened down there.

I only planted mine down a half inch or so, seemed like they dug themselves to various levels and took their own path (not always straight) up.

To be honest, I didn't pay particular attention to how deep I planted them, but for sure, it wasn't to deep as I only scratched the upper surface of the cube, I guess it was like a centimeter deep.

 

[AliceGG]

Tomorrow I will order the tent, and probably the exhaust fan and carbon filter too.
I think I'm going to stick with the Secret Jardin HS80 tent, it is 80×80×160cm. Since I don't smoke a lot and currently have no plans to go on a commercial way with it (though if I did, I guess one simple grow with 3-4 plants would easily cover the cost of the whole setup), I won't be disappointed if I only make like 80-100 grams first. Given that my led draws almost 200w, as far as I know, 0,4-0,5g/watt with an led is nowhere near expectional. I smoke somewhere between 10-15g a month if I have the stuff in my hand, so even only 80g would be enough for ~4 months, and I could share a bit with my friends too. Well, these are theoretical numbers, but a theory is still more than nothing

So doing a bit of math; the tent is 160cm tall. My 15l fabric pots take away 25cm. If I put the carbon filter above my led, I think it takes about 15-20cm with the space between them, though I could also put them next to each other. The light is about 8-10cm thick, I didn't measure it. So I am left with 105-110cm for the plants to grow. Take away 12-18 inches (as suggested mostly everywhere) or 30-45cm for the distance between the light and the canopy.
According to Royal Queen Seeds' datasheet, this Royal AK grows 60-70cm tall indoors. I know that it's only an estimation, but I imagine it could provide a decent base to build my thoughts up on. I very much hope that these numbers are meant to be an estimation for an untrained plant. I will definitely try to do some LST, so given all the above information, I'm not really worried about this 160cm not being enough for my first grow.

Moving to the exhaust fan and the carbon filter. There's this table I found on Secret Jardin's website:

It's for the 2.0 version of their Hydro Shoot tents, but the only significant difference for me is that here the HS80 is 180cm tall. I think the one that's available for me must be the 1.0 version.
For the HS80 with led lighting, they suggest 70m3/h exhausting. For anyone, who's more familiar with CFM, doing a bit of math, it equals to 41,2CFM if I'm not mistaken. (70×35,3/60) Well, it sounds like a quite low number, but it's what they suggest on their official site. Probably it only considers exhausting heat, and not much about sucking fresh CO2 into the tent, I don't know.
This inline fan below (VKO 125) is quite cheap and it can extract 185m3/h. That's about 2,5 times the recommended value. Do/did any of you, dear 420ers, use this kind of cheap inline fans? What can I expect from it?


There's also this one, called Vents TT inline fan (100 or 125mm):

It obviously looks cooler ( ), and must be a better quality unit. It has a two-speed motor and other fancy stuff, but the TT 100 model has a 145/187 m3/h airflow, while the TT125 has 220/280 m3/h. So looking at the naked numbers, it is not that much stronger. The TT100 is 3 times, the TT125 is 4 times as much money to spend as the cheap VKO125 above.
Would the extra things and (probable) build quality justify the cost?

I'm not going into carbon filters now, I'm in the office and have to leave in 10 minutes, but I'll have a post or two on them too.

I guess today evening is a great time to upload new photos of my babies too.

 

[Old Salt]

I got 141gm/5oz from a 300w COB (LED) in a 2' x 4' x 5' tent for my first grow, so your guesstimate is reasonable.

I bought a cheap inline fan for my first grow, and was unable to use it as it was too noisy. I bought a better fan earlier this year, more like the second one you mentioned, a 6" Atmosphere Vortex S-Line rated at 347 CFM. I also got a silencer for the ducts. This combination works for me. The fan is oversized so I can run it at a slower (quieter) speed.

If you are looking for 6" Personal Desk Fan, with Clips to use inside the tent, Home Hardware is the cheapest place in Canada to get them at $12.99 each. They last about 2 years with constant use.

 

[Pjs420]

@Van Stank suggested the AC infinity cloud line T4... I believe he uses two of them.... can be found on amazon! It will be one of my next purchases for my tent

I’m in a 4’x4’x8’ tent with a cheap led off of amazon and right now I just have a clip fan at the top vent and temps are holding relatively steady at 25-28celsius with RH from 40-50% depending on the day.

I just let my plants grow... the recommended distance for the light I’m using is 15-23”... the top colas didn’t stop stretching until they were within 8-10” of the light and I have yet to see any adverse side effects.

Listen to your plants, sounds crazy, but if ya pay close attention they really do tell you what they like/don’t like. And we are all here to help you along the way!

 

[bobrown14]

I use a 12W LED light bulb 3K warm white and a 5K cool white on seedlings.

The seeds know which way "up" is they can sense gravity under/in the soil.

The light is good tho its a source of warmth as well as light once the pop thru the soil.

AUTO I pop the seeds in peat pellets then right into final container 12L is good I use #3 nursery pots.

As Blew said the more the merrier you're not gonna run out of space with AUTOs.

GL with the little ones.

You will be harvesting before you know it, and wondering why you didn't start growing sooner!

 

[AliceGG]

I got 141gm/5oz from a 300w COB (LED) in a 2' x 4' x 5' tent for my first grow, so your guesstimate is reasonable.

I bought a cheap inline fan for my first grow, and was unable to use it as it was too noisy. I bought a better fan earlier this year, more like the second one you mentioned, a 6" Atmosphere Vortex S-Line rated at 347 CFM. I also got a silencer for the ducts. This combination works for me. The fan is oversized so I can run it at a slower (quieter) speed.

If you are looking for 6" Personal Desk Fan, with Clips to use inside the tent, Home Hardware is the cheapest place in Canada to get them at $12.99 each. They last about 2 years with constant use.

I'm feeling I'll get the more expensive one, it may be enough for a bit larger tent as well later.
How many clippable oscillating fans do you use for the 2×4 tent? I thought I should get 1 or 2. The cheapest ones are about the same prize here, 12-15$.
It's funny, you're already the second person thinking I live in Canada. Maybe Alice is a popular name there, I have no clue

@Van Stank suggested the AC infinity cloud line T4... I believe he uses two of them.... can be found on amazon! It will be one of my next purchases for my tent

I’m in a 4’x4’x8’ tent with a cheap led off of amazon and right now I just have a clip fan at the top vent and temps are holding relatively steady at 25-28celsius with RH from 40-50% depending on the day.

I just let my plants grow... the recommended distance for the light I’m using is 15-23”... the top colas didn’t stop stretching until they were within 8-10” of the light and I have yet to see any adverse side effects.

Listen to your plants, sounds crazy, but if ya pay close attention they really do tell you what they like/don’t like. And we are all here to help you along the way!

So you grow without any intake and extraction? Isn't it necessary to refresh the air to get CO2 in for photosynthesis? It's what I thought so far.

I use a 12W LED light bulb 3K warm white and a 5K cool white on seedlings.

The seeds know which way "up" is they can sense gravity under/in the soil.

The light is good tho its a source of warmth as well as light once the pop thru the soil.

AUTO I pop the seeds in peat pellets then right into final container 12L is good I use #3 nursery pots.

As Blew said the more the merrier you're not gonna run out of space with AUTOs.

GL with the little ones.

You will be harvesting before you know it, and wondering why you didn't start growing sooner!

Hey bobrown!

Lights are now running 24/0, I really should have known it sooner. I'm going to skip the 4l pots, and use their final 15l ones in a few days.
I've put my Jack Herer Auto in paper towels when I got home today afternoon, since I don't really believe the AK that was planted first will pop up anymore. I'll still keep her in the cube until the next week, giving her chance if she has any life left in her.

 

[Old Salt]

I'm feeling I'll get the more expensive one, it may be enough for a bit larger tent as well later.
How many clippable oscillating fans do you use for the 2×4 tent? I thought I should get 1 or 2. The cheapest ones are about the same prize here, 12-15$.
It's funny, you're already the second person thinking I live in Canada. Maybe Alice is a popular name there, I have no clue

I've only been using one. I had one tie-wrapped to a 7" - 6" reducer working as my exhaust fan for the first few grows.

I live in Canada, so when I mention pricing, I tend to use Canadian or American currency. If I find better prices locally than on Amazon or eBay I'll mention that as well. It's a reflection of where I live rather than where I think someone resides.

 

[bobrown14]

For seeds I put them in a small glass container (cleaned of course) add about 5-10ml of Hydrogen Peroxide (to kill bacteria from your hands) into about a cup of water or so.

Let the seeds sit in that water for a few days until a tap root shows. Once a tap root then I fish that seed out with tweezers and into a peat pellet. Usually I have a heat mat running cause I'm cloning so I will put the glass with seeds on the heat mat - don't want it too warm ~26C is good not much warmer so a little warmer than room temps.

Wait for the tap root.

Lots of paper towels are treated with anti-fungals and anti-microbials not to mention the chemicals to make them white. The paper towel thing is from "stoner science" class goes all the way back to the early 70's. I think cannabis is the only plant that gets sprouted this way.

I can remember popping seeds when I was a teenager with a glass of water with about an 3cm water in the btm, a wet paper towel folded and made to fit around the inside of the glass and put the seeds between the paper towel and the glass so you could see the tap root forming. I think we learned how to pop beans that way in the 60s in kindergarden glass. I got A+ in the bean stalk class. Should have taken that as a sign. lol
edit:
We use the exhaust fan with a filter to kill the smell. You flat gets decent enough air exchange plus you breathe CO2 and plants breath CO2 and oxygen so they won't suffer. The smell will get pretty intense without a filer once they are in flower.

 

[Old Salt]

For seeds I put them in a small glass container (cleaned of course) add about 5-10ml of Hydrogen Peroxide (to kill bacteria from your hands) into about a cup of water or so.

I use shot glasses with water from my RO, and a bit of CALiMAGic until they sink, and then send them to a paper towel between two saucers. When the tap root is 1-2cm, or 3/8 - 3/4" long, they go into a 10cm or 4" nursery pot filled with my coco/perlite medium. All of this is on a seedling mat until I top them.

 

[bobrown14]

Thats another good way. The little bit of heat really speeds things along.


I'm popping some older seeds I've had laying around.

It's really an art form if you get into it. I like cloning. Sooo much cheaper lol.

 

[Old Salt]

Cloning is great if you have the room for mothers. Since I don't, this summer will be a 3-4 strain seed run.