Understanding PPMs

[thebinapt23]

48x48x80 Tent
2 LEDs - 1000, 1500
1 floor fan, 2 smaller fans
Earthpots - 5-3gal, 2-7gal
Advanced Nutrients pH Perfect Sensi Grow and Bloom Coco Parts A+B
Canna Coco Brick
Crop King Seeds - Candy Cane (AF); Afghani (R), under 24/7 CFLs

Hi,

I'm about a week away from harvesting my last soil crop, and have already germinated and planted my seedlings in plastic cups filled with Coco, saturated with diluted nutrients and seaweed (1/4mL of both in one gal water) a few days ago. The pH is 5.6.
I'd like to try and keep a journal, so I'll put up photos sometime next week.

Question:

Can someone help me to understand how to deal with PPMs? I tested my water - 388. I then tested my water after adding 1/4mL of liquid seaweed, and again after adding the AN nutrients. Total = 439ppms. I was told that I had to be between 440 and 450, so I figured this was okay.
After watering the soil, I tested the runoff and got a whopping 970ppms. What should I do to get this down, and does this mean I really need to get an RO system setup?

tbinapt23

 

[goofyfoot]

Hey TB23.... I am in the same boat. I am using Coco and soil at a 50/50 mix and the soil has a shit ton of perlite. I have a EC / TDS meter on the way and I understand it (and maybe wrong!!) is if you use tap water. That has sat out 24hr or air bubbled over night, regardless. It will have something in it before any nuit`s are added.
So if I followed Fox Farms mix for example. To get a seedling/starter solution of 445 and my tap water has 195 ppm before mixing. **These numbers are just to set an example** Would the total amount be 640, the sum of the two combined??

Or if I used R/O water it would be striped down to nothing (0 value) and the solution ( teaspoons of nuit`s / per gallon) should equal~ 445 if I followed the measurements correctly??

That is my take on this and I have a grocery store close by with the R/O dispenser out front, @ 35cents a gallon. I am getting a gallon a seeing what it is before adding, then add the amount/teaspoons from chart. I would ASSUME it should give a value close to what that chart lists as the value the nuit`s should register.

Then see what happens with tap water, this is my first time with coco or even using a meter of this type. I only used soil/perlite and PH`ed 2 day old tap water (6.25) and chart amount for the plants week. I would all was pre-mix this and take .75 of a quart of it and add .25 plain tap water at 6.25, so I was always under the suggested amount all the way through to flower. I also FLUSH every 5 weeks regardless, this is why I added the coco to lighten up the mix.

Amazon said delivery by Wednesday so I will find out soon. Don't know if this help or makes things worst but I am seeing the difference in the two water samples and deciding after that. Anything you can add I have an ear to as I am not a new grower. New to coco and EC/TDS in mixtures...Peace.....

 

[goofyfoot]

to add I don't know what the run-off should be, or if your number is high. I have only tested run-off from my soil mix with the PH meter as I was using a lot of peat/sphagnum in the mix. This makes the soil acidic as it decomposes, pushing the 6.25 PH`ed in water feed supply to 5.8 to 5.65 on the drained tested run-out water.
Making more of a hydro environment then soil recommended numbers / levels for absorption. This is why trying coco, but hear it likes to hold salts and un-used nuit's also......
...Peace.....

 

[thebinapt23]

Hey TB23.... I am in the same boat. I am using Coco and soil at a 50/50 mix and the soil has a shit ton of perlite. I have a EC / TDS meter on the way and I understand it (and maybe wrong!!) is if you use tap water. That has sat out 24hr or air bubbled over night, regardless. It will have something in it before any nuit`s are added.
So if I followed Fox Farms mix for example. To get a seedling/starter solution of 445 and my tap water has 195 ppm before mixing. **These numbers are just to set an example** Would the total amount be 640, the sum of the two combined??

Or if I used R/O water it would be striped down to nothing (0 value) and the solution ( teaspoons of nuit`s / per gallon) should equal~ 445 if I followed the measurements correctly??

That is my take on this and I have a grocery store close by with the R/O dispenser out front, @ 35cents a gallon. I am getting a gallon a seeing what it is before adding, then add the amount/teaspoons from chart. I would ASSUME it should give a value close to what that chart lists as the value the nuit`s should register.

Then see what happens with tap water, this is my first time with coco or even using a meter of this type. I only used soil/perlite and PH`ed 2 day old tap water (6.25) and chart amount for the plants week. I would all was pre-mix this and take .75 of a quart of it and add .25 plain tap water at 6.25, so I was always under the suggested amount all the way through to flower. I also FLUSH every 5 weeks regardless, this is why I added the coco to lighten up the mix.

Amazon said delivery by Wednesday so I will find out soon. Don't know if this help or makes things worst but I am seeing the difference in the two water samples and deciding after that. Anything you can add I have an ear to as I am not a new grower. New to coco and EC/TDS in mixtures...Peace.....

Thanks for responding! I'm surprised at the little response to my question, especially with all encouragement behind switching to Coco. I did mix my Coco with 50% Perlite (which I'll add to my description at top), for drainage, and will be adding a layer of sand at the bottom of my 3 gal pots as well as an inch of sand on the top to prevent anything "gnatty" from happening. I've got you're basic blue EC/TDS stick from Amazon ( I think it was 16.00), which is easy enough to read, thankfully.

I'm also checking out the CropKing Seeds discussion board on this, because right now, the money I've spent on seeds and adding to my set up (another LeD, filter, etc.) will cause holy heck in my house if I don't work this out!
Seriously though, hubby was perfectly content with soil use (a little more expensive, but the outcome made it acceptable), and we're not really interested in growing the "Greatest" crop, with the "Bestest" yield, but we want to produce results that fit our medicinal needs.

Anyway, I'm heading over to YouTube to catch a few AN nutrient videos, to see what others have done and are doing. I'll post or send a link to you!
Not losing faith. I believe Coco is worth it, but I damn sure could use some more instructions!

 

[goofyfoot]

One thing I did see trolling around here was that using ONLY coco made it more specific, requiring this kind of meter. As if it were more in-line with hydro, in monitoring your nuit`s and run-out. My only need to check the run-out with all soil/perlite was the PH of what ran out. As I never really soak them except to flush. I was using peat moss that is acidic when it decomposes.
So giving them a double dose of straight 6.25 water, with nothing added. By the 4th week the run-off would be down to 5.6 to 5.5, great for hydro but for soil is the cut off for the micro nuit's and metals to be absorbed. So I would water with 3 gallons for the flush. I would apply the first 2 gallons over an 12 hour period set to 7~7.5 PH. The next 1/2 gallon set to 6.5 and when I PH`ed that run-out it would be showing 6.10 to 6.15. So there is build up even in soil so I can image that coco will hang onto these as well. The last 1/2 gallon had some molasses and mycorrhizae set to 6.25 to help build the environment back up. I never was to concerned with nuit`s as I cut the base level amount by .25% to prevent issues. And the plant does not miss having the amount missing. Hope it all turns out OK for you and I only added the coco to fluff the soil mixture up, not be a total coco grow. I don't mind dirty finger nails..... best to you and ...Peace.....

 

[thebinapt23]

One thing I did see trolling around here was that using ONLY coco made it more specific, requiring this kind of meter. As if it were more in-line with hydro, in monitoring your nuit`s and run-out. My only need to check the run-out with all soil/perlite was the PH of what ran out. As I never really soak them except to flush. I was using peat moss that is acidic when it decomposes.
So giving them a double dose of straight 6.25 water, with nothing added. By the 4th week the run-off would be down to 5.6 to 5.5, great for hydro but for soil is the cut off for the micro nuit's and metals to be absorbed. So I would water with 3 gallons for the flush. I would apply the first 2 gallons over an 12 hour period set to 7~7.5 PH. The next 1/2 gallon set to 6.5 and when I PH`ed that run-out it would be showing 6.10 to 6.15. So there is build up even in soil so I can image that coco will hang onto these as well. The last 1/2 gallon had some molasses and mycorrhizae set to 6.25 to help build the environment back up. I never was to concerned with nuit`s as I cut the base level amount by .25% to prevent issues. And the plant does not miss having the amount missing. Hope it all turns out OK for you and I only added the coco to fluff the soil mixture up, not be a total coco grow. I don't mind dirty finger nails..... best to you and ...Peace.....

Thanks for the info. I think I'll try that this weekend. My seedlings are thriving, but from all the other coco grows, it seems like my seeds should be looking better than they do. I'm using 1/2 coco 1/2 perlite. I'll work on this with the flushing and give it another week. I just don't have the funds to experiment and lose Candy cane and afghani. If nothing else, I'll go back to soil, and learn to grow in coco with less expensive seeds.
Thanks again.

Either way

 

[goofyfoot]

good call...as I don't mind paying 10 to 15 dollars for a seed being I have spent 300 on 2 LED`s. Working with budget seeds to iron out the issues, or acquire the correct info is the smart move. Plus you will PROFIT on all your future grows from the investment. If you have the room in your grow for a "Guinea pig plant"..... I don't like to get out of my comfort zone and like to focus on what I know. Or found out by screwing things up the first time!

This is my third grow with Auto`s and 2nd with LED as the source // but the 18 years of outdoor growing I have. Does give me a idea of "what to possibly expect" or an idea on what the plants should do...keep them green and...Peace.....

These two are from yesterday, and today is day 14 from germination // soil-coco-perlite // Fox Farm-CalMag-B1 and mycorrhizae w/ 1 teaspoon of molasses.

CANT WAIT TO SEE THEM IN 60 MORE DAYS!!

THE LAST SHOT IS THE Mexican (SATIVA) showing pistils at 13 days old!! I am falling in love with Auto`s grown indoors. Instead of waiting 150 days for them outside!! If they survive at all, outdoors have so many factors YOU JUST HAVE LEARN TO DEAL WITH, indoors you are more hands on.

 

[thebinapt23]

good call...as I don't mind paying 10 to 15 dollars for a seed being I have spent 300 on 2 LED`s. Working with budget seeds to iron out the issues, or acquire the correct info is the smart move. Plus you will PROFIT on all your future grows from the investment. If you have the room in your grow for a "Guinea pig plant"..... I don't like to get out of my comfort zone and like to focus on what I know. Or found out by screwing things up the first time!

Okay, so I got up Saturday morning, poured a cup of coffee, opened up my tents, sat down and thought about this Coco grow. I decided to go ahead and put my flushed soil plants in darkness for harvest this weekend, closing that door and getting ready for Christmas. So I froze five trays of molasses+ice, and on Sunday I spread them around my plants and turned off the lights.

A month ago, this plant was hit by too much heat, and so it fluffed out and foxtailed. I did some reading, and decided to "TOP" the tops of the foxtails, and the colas swelled, and filled out

So now, after cleaning out my 4x4x80, I decided to keep going with the Coco. My drip kit came on Saturday, My RO system will be here on Wednesday, and I getting 2-5 gal paint buckets from Lowe's to set up a gravity drip of water and nutrients. By Friday, I'll have my iPower 4in filter setup. I put the 6-3gal pots in the tent, watered w/ nutes (1/2mL per liter, per pot)that morning, and 1/4mL per liter that afternoon. The results were immediate and amazing! I'm going get pictures posted this afternoon. Never would have believed what I'm seeing.

Also had a great talk with the guys at AN. They've got a hotline now, so I'm going to ask as many questions as I can, until they go the way of some stores that charge for information. I still believe the first week nutes should be 1/4 of what's written, but he did give some really good insight.
So, I guess I'm back on the Coco train!

 

[SOG001]

Hi Binapt I have a couple of questions for you Is your run off water brown if so your high ppm readings could be from coco dust being washed from your pots IMO . Secondly which AN are you using ? If you are using the ph perfect for coco a&b you may want to call the help line and ask about the buffering and the need to follow the feeding schedule to the letter . I was using AN's ph perfect for coco and had some issues with being unable to control the ph I was told that it was because of the formulation and that ph adjusting was not required and the plants would be able to use all the nutrients available because of this I was also told to follow the feeding instructions to the letter . When I did as instructed my plants started to look better and better. I really recommend callin the help line they are an invalueable sour of information

 

[thebinapt23]

Hi Binapt I have a couple of questions for you Is your run off water brown if so your high ppm readings could be from coco dust being washed from your pots IMO . Secondly which AN are you using ? If you are using the ph perfect for coco a&b you may want to call the help line and ask about the buffering and the need to follow the feeding schedule to the letter . I was using AN's ph perfect for coco and had some issues with being unable to control the ph I was told that it was because of the formulation and that ph adjusting was not required and the plants would be able to use all the nutrients available because of this I was also told to follow the feeding instructions to the letter . When I did as instructed my plants started to look better and better. I really recommend callin the help line they are an invalueable sour of information

Hi,

I thought it was coco dust, too, and could have been, but I did rinse before planting - against what the manufacturer's recommendation. It just seemed common sense over wasting nute solution in unprepared growing medium. I've decided to move slowly into the AN instruction and hopefully with my pay raise, I'll be able to stay on top it!
By the end of this week, I'll be feeding the plants with a 3mL of nutes per liter once a day, and for the second feeding, I'm giving 1mL of nutes, adding a tablespoon of seaweed and molasses to a gal.

AN suggested the solution should be at least 70 degrees (Probably to ensure its solubility), so to be on the safe side, I pour a liter of water in each plant before adding the nutes, to 1) Let them know it's feeding time, and 2) In earthbags, solution tends to soak and runoff the sides before going all the way down. This helps to direct the second pour.

Tomorrow the RO system gets here, and Friday my Visosun inline filter system. I was thinking about the automated drip gosystem, but I'm going with the gravity drip for now.

Will be getting my new phone today, so I can start taking pictures.