Help with light please

[av8ersteve]

Hello all. First post here, and looking for advice. I have been growing for a few years now with an older Metal Halide and HPS system (both separate systems) and now my HPS ballast has quit. I have two Blue Dream girls in veg right now under two 400 watt MH systems side by side (800 watt light distribution) and am going to need an HPS pretty soon. With all the new tech out there I have been kinda left behind. Can someone help me choose a good HPS? I see now the digital ballasts and am just needing advice. Would like to stay around the 600 watt range. I have never used LCD's and have grown MASSIVE bud in the past without LCD but would consider switching. The Duo Lux 600 looks AWESOME but damn, the PRICE. Any suggestions before I purchase would be helpful. If my HPS ballast hadn't stopped working, I wouldn't even be asking, but, here we are. Thanks everyone.

 

[Scientific]

My .02 as someone who has been shopping and reading:

LED technology is advancing at an amazing pace, and my guess is that it will almost certainly replace gas discharge tubes within five years or so.

For the moment, though, it looks like HID still gives the best bang for the buck if you can live with the heat and the electric bill.

A digital ballast can do more than an old-fashioned "magnetic" ballast, like dimming and powering different bulb types. (However that may not matter to you.) Having done a lot of electronic work, the one thing that I would definitely advise is to avoid a cheap digital ballast. Manufacturers can keep the price of a device down by using lower quality components, but failure rates are higher, both at the beginning ("infant mortality") and as the device ages. It sounds like you have been at this for a while and will continue, so the extra cost of a better quality unit would amortize out. Plus HID is what you know and you seem happy with it.

In a nutshell, my .02 (going on .03 now...) would be to buy a good digital ballast now and then plan on an LED lamp for your next purchase in the years to come when the prices come down and the capabilities go up.

 

[av8ersteve]

My .02 as someone who has been shopping and reading:

LED technology is advancing at an amazing pace, and my guess is that it will almost certainly replace gas discharge tubes within five years or so.

For the moment, though, it looks like HID still gives the best bang for the buck if you can live with the heat and the electric bill.

A digital ballast can do more than an old-fashioned "magnetic" ballast, like dimming and powering different bulb types. (However that may not matter to you.) Having done a lot of electronic work, the one thing that I would definitely advise is to avoid a cheap digital ballast. Manufacturers can keep the price of a device down by using lower quality components, but failure rates are higher, both at the beginning ("infant mortality") and as the device ages. It sounds like you have been at this for a while and will continue, so the extra cost of a better quality unit would amortize out. Plus HID is what you know and you seem happy with it.

In a nutshell, my .02 (going on .03 now...) would be to buy a good digital ballast now and then plan on an LED lamp for your next purchase in the years to come when the prices come down and the capabilities go up.

Thank you for the info. Who makes a good digi ballast, name wise?

 

[Scientific]

Thank you for the info. Who makes a good digi ballast, name wise?

I have been focused on LED units because they are new and cool, but the price vs performance has driven me back to the HID world.

Vivosun and Apollo Horticulture seem to be name brands, but I'd be curious to hear from actual users.

 

[av8ersteve]

I'll look into both of those, and I know what you mean, I get huge flowers with my MH, then HPS. Just have to deal with the heat is all.

 

[Scientific]

I'll look into both of those, and I know what you mean, I get huge flowers with my MH, then HPS. Just have to deal with the heat is all.

The thing that excited me about LEDs (besides the novelty) was that the color of the light could be matched to the absorbance of the chlorophyll, so "blurple" lights that didn't waste electricity by making green and yellow light that the plant didn't use. Brilliant! Big increase in efficiency, even if it did make the grow room look otherworldly.

But now there seems to be a big backlash against that saying, no, white light is better. I'd like to run (or read about) some actual experiments comparing results per watt with different colors of light, but I don't have time and I don't see anyone doing that, so I'm waiting for the dust to settle...

If anyone knows of solid (i.e. not grower folklore) about this, I'd love to hear about it.

 

[Jedthedog]

I went from MH/HPS to LED and then back to MH/HPS.. To many issues for me with LED even tried supplementing LED with HPS in flower.. I will stick with my old methods as that is what works for me .

 

[Scientific]

I went from MH/HPS to LED and then back to MH/HPS.. To many issues for me with LED even tried supplementing LED with HPS in flower.. I will stick with my old methods as that is what works for me .

I'm curious about the details. Can you tell us more?

• How many watts MH/HPS versus how many watts LED (label and actual)?
• What kind of issues, exactly?
• Was heat less of an issue?

 

[Jedthedog]

I'm curious about the details. Can you tell us more?

• How many watts MH/HPS versus how many watts LED (label and actual)? Mh/HPs were 1000 watts each the LEDS were Mars Hydro Reflector 144 3 of these in a 5 x 5 Gorilla tent with the tall extension giving me an 8 foot ceiling.
• What kind of issues, exactly? I had been growing for years and had everything dialed in pretty good. I read about LED and said what the heck lets give it a try .. Veg was good but in flower noticed issues like cal/mag,and small buds..
• Was heat less of an issue? Heat was not an issue with either as tent was in a AC/ Heated room .. Biggest complaint small buds .

Happy Growing .

 

[Scientific]

Happy Growing .

Um... OK.

 

[Mayne]

 

[PurpleGunRack]

Used a Lucilux ballast and it was fine, many people I know have used Lumatek for years and love them, GIB ballasts look nice too

The thing that excited me about LEDs (besides the novelty) was that the color of the light could be matched to the absorbance of the chlorophyll, so "blurple" lights that didn't waste electricity by making green and yellow light that the plant didn't use. Brilliant! Big increase in efficiency, even if it did make the grow room look otherworldly.

But now there seems to be a big backlash against that saying, no, white light is better. I'd like to run (or read about) some actual experiments comparing results per watt with different colors of light, but I don't have time and I don't see anyone doing that, so I'm waiting for the dust to settle...

If anyone knows of solid (i.e. not grower folklore) about this, I'd love to hear about it.

Well, basically output beats spectrum, which is why white light LED's are beating blurples and everything else



@Jedthedog Sorry to hear you wasted money on LED lights. When was this? Do you remember if it was the 144x3 model or 144x5?

 

[Scientific]

Well, basically output beats spectrum, which is why white light LED's are beating blurples and everything else

Are you saying that white LEDs are more efficient (lumens/watt) than red or blue LEDs?

 

[PurpleGunRack]

Are you saying that white LEDs are more efficient (lumens/watt) than red or blue LEDs?

Yes.

Just to clarify; Lumen measures the amount of light visible to the human eye which is mostly in the green/yellow spectrum, and is utter useless for determining if a light is usable for plants, the unit we need to use is PPFD.

And yes a 3500K COB is a bit more efficient than than a 2700K or 5000K COB, nowadays the only merits mono diodes have are as supplemental lighting to COB's where a little IR and far red is good to add for Emerson effect and flower initiation.

I recently started a grow with 3000K Quantum Boards and so far I'm impressed, gonna start flowering soon and I'm very keen to see what they can do