Helicopters!

Weedcrazyman said:
Hey guys need your advice helicopters keep going past my house getting a bit scetched out, can they/leo see whats going on??
Click to expand...

How many thousand watts of lights are you running?

Did you spend the carbon filtration allowance on a keg?

Did you recently beat the living daylights out of your old lady?

Have you told anyone about your grow?

Is the grow tent pushed up against a window so that you can hang the exhaust hose out of it on hot days?

Do you dispose of those 55-gallon drums of hydroponic nutrient by rolling them out to the curb on trash day?

It that "No dope until the August harvest!" sign in the front yard a little too large?

Are you economizing by putting that pair of sativas on the porch when it's sunny out?

Did you rip off the cop that you used to party with?

If so, then, yeah, they're up there right now taking pictures of you, Charlie.

Otherwise... lol.

Seriously, the FLIR device on the average LEO's helicopter can perceive a lot, especially if your house is completely uninsulated, has single-pane windows, you grow in your attic with the lights-on cycle at night, et cetera.

However... If you're not trying to grow enough to supply your entire town... If you don't leave a trail of breadcrumbs that a seven-year old can follow... If you run your lights during the day time when FLIR is far less effective (how much hotter do you think the shingles on your roof are on a sunny day than your grow room's exhaust, for example?)... If you don't tell people... If you do not "engage in a pattern of habitual criminal activity" or the like... If you do not give your spouse, girlfriend, mistress, or all of them reason to rat... If your neighbors don't smell your grow (or see odd illumination coming from your windows)...

I used to have an old stereo amplifier that'd heat the entire room it was in, in less time than it took to play "The Ballad of Hollis Brown" (as performed by Nazareth, not the original version) through four six-foot tall speakers. I never got hassled for growing cannabis (for rattling the neighbors' windows, sure).

The only reason a chopper would be in the air specifically to gather evidence against you would be if Johnny already knows you're growing cannabis.

We have helicopter overflights here. Sometimes they're medevac units. Once in a while, it's a civilian flight. Occasionally, they're out looking for an escapee or someone who is busy "fleeing and eluding." More often, they're looking for outdoor grows. The actual number of flights where they're actively looking for evidence of indoor grows is very, very small. And my house isn't the only one on the block, let alone in the entire town. So while I (very) occasionally feel the hair on the back of my neck stand up when I hear a helicopter fly overhead... I'm mostly just annoyed. My cat goes running for cover like a Vietnam vet with PTSD because she was an undersized outdoor stray in a neighborhood where cats have it pretty rough when I gave in and opened my home to her; she probably thinks the noise is either a thunderstorm or the sound of approaching combat.

By all means, be paranoid, just like me. That's how you survive long enough to become an old fart, lol (that and learning to throw the first punch when someone is still telling you how many ways they're going to kick your @ss instead of waiting around to see whether or not they can actually pull it off, and by remembering to aim for the Adam's Apple when you do).

But paranoia doesn't mean "Don't" - it just means "Be very careful when you do." Take the same precautions you'd take if you were concerned that your neighbors might not be best pleased if they discovered you were growing cannabis next door. Don't give anyone an reason to give LEO a call. Treat your partner(s) with respect. Mow your grass once in a while instead of waiting for the local pitchfork and torch committee to stop by and make the request. Do not direct the hot air outside (at least not directly), or resort to the old fake dryer vent trick (most folks clothes dryers do not operate 18 hours per day, every day for a couple of months, then drop to 12 hours/day for the next eight to 20 weeks :rolleyes3 ). You can purchase a cheap or used (radio) scanner and pick up unencrypted analog broadcasts. If one or more local LEO agencies use APCO-25 encoding (NOTE: This is NOT encryption and is legal to decode!), then you'll need a digital-capable scanner, and those cost more; the one I bought not long after they first became available was $500, lol, but even those are probably significantly cheaper now. They can be sources of both information about what is going on in your local world and sources of endless entertainment... There are many civilian broadcasts from businesses and individuals that can be comical, and I'll never forget the... Well, specifics probably shouldn't be discussed, lol, but in case you were wondering, don't allow (err... request?) your hooker to handcuff you to your bed and then lose the key when your wife is expected to return from her trip shortly. And if you do, don't try performing acrobatics, because some ceiling fans can, it turns out, cause injury to one's feet/ankles.

If you can move your grow to an interior location instead of one that has one or more exterior walls, that probably wouldn't hurt. If you cannot, and you have leaky and/or single-pane windows, you can purchase those "window insulation kits" (a piece of clear heat-shrinkable and a roll of double-sided tape) for next to nothing, and all it takes to install one is a razor blade or other trimming tool, a hair dryer, and a willingness to curse. If you are growing in a hot upstairs bedroom, well, upstairs bedrooms tend to BE hot - so buy an air conditioner and stick it in the window. A light that is consuming 600 watts is producing 2,047.8 BTU/hour of heat. A 1kW HPS will produce 3,413 BTU/hour of heat. Et cetera. Simply add that to your calculations when sizing your A/C needs, just like you'd add in the theoretical need for a space of that size, the hit you take if it's an uninsulated/leaky space, the additional BTU of heat produced per person/pet, the additional BTU of heat the tower computer produces, etc. IOW, if you calculate that you need just shy of 6K BTU of cooling and then park your 600-watt HPS in there, then order the 8,000 BTU A/C instead. You could insulate your grow room/tent with cheap rigid (foam?) insulation and use insulated ducts (or wrap plain ductwork with insulation) if you are excessively paranoid. As long as you have adequate airflow, I don't see where it would harm the grow. Necessary? Well, I can think of a few countries where I'd definitely take those steps, but apparently the United States isn't one of them, because I haven't bothered....
 
TorturedSoul said:
How many thousand watts of lights are you running?

Did you spend the carbon filtration allowance on a keg?

Did you recently beat the living daylights out of your old lady?

Have you told anyone about your grow?

Is the grow tent pushed up against a window so that you can hang the exhaust hose out of it on hot days?

Do you dispose of those 55-gallon drums of hydroponic nutrient by rolling them out to the curb on trash day?

It that "No dope until the August harvest!" sign in the front yard a little too large?

Are you economizing by putting that pair of sativas on the porch when it's sunny out?

Did you rip off the cop that you used to party with?

If so, then, yeah, they're up there right now taking pictures of you, Charlie.

Otherwise... lol.

Seriously, the FLIR device on the average LEO's helicopter can perceive a lot, especially if your house is completely uninsulated, has single-pane windows, you grow in your attic with the lights-on cycle at night, et cetera.

However... If you're not trying to grow enough to supply your entire town... If you don't leave a trail of breadcrumbs that a seven-year old can follow... If you run your lights during the day time when FLIR is far less effective (how much hotter do you think the shingles on your roof are on a sunny day than your grow room's exhaust, for example?)... If you don't tell people... If you do not "engage in a pattern of habitual criminal activity" or the like... If you do not give your spouse, girlfriend, mistress, or all of them reason to rat... If your neighbors don't smell your grow (or see odd illumination coming from your windows)...

I used to have an old stereo amplifier that'd heat the entire room it was in, in less time than it took to play "The Ballad of Hollis Brown" (as performed by Nazareth, not the original version) through four six-foot tall speakers. I never got hassled for growing cannabis (for rattling the neighbors' windows, sure).

The only reason a chopper would be in the air specifically to gather evidence against you would be if Johnny already knows you're growing cannabis.

We have helicopter overflights here. Sometimes they're medevac units. Once in a while, it's a civilian flight. Occasionally, they're out looking for an escapee or someone who is busy "fleeing and eluding." More often, they're looking for outdoor grows. The actual number of flights where they're actively looking for evidence of indoor grows is very, very small. And my house isn't the only one on the block, let alone in the entire town. So while I (very) occasionally feel the hair on the back of my neck stand up when I hear a helicopter fly overhead... I'm mostly just annoyed. My cat goes running for cover like a Vietnam vet with PTSD because she was an undersized outdoor stray in a neighborhood where cats have it pretty rough when I gave in and opened my home to her; she probably thinks the noise is either a thunderstorm or the sound of approaching combat.

By all means, be paranoid, just like me. That's how you survive long enough to become an old fart, lol (that and learning to throw the first punch when someone is still telling you how many ways they're going to kick your @ss instead of waiting around to see whether or not they can actually pull it off, and by remembering to aim for the Adam's Apple when you do).

But paranoia doesn't mean "Don't" - it just means "Be very careful when you do." Take the same precautions you'd take if you were concerned that your neighbors might not be best pleased if they discovered you were growing cannabis next door. Don't give anyone an reason to give LEO a call. Treat your partner(s) with respect. Mow your grass once in a while instead of waiting for the local pitchfork and torch committee to stop by and make the request. Do not direct the hot air outside (at least not directly), or resort to the old fake dryer vent trick (most folks clothes dryers do not operate 18 hours per day, every day for a couple of months, then drop to 12 hours/day for the next eight to 20 weeks :rolleyes3 ). You can purchase a cheap or used (radio) scanner and pick up unencrypted analog broadcasts. If one or more local LEO agencies use APCO-25 encoding (NOTE: This is NOT encryption and is legal to decode!), then you'll need a digital-capable scanner, and those cost more; the one I bought not long after they first became available was $500, lol, but even those are probably significantly cheaper now. They can be sources of both information about what is going on in your local world and sources of endless entertainment... There are many civilian broadcasts from businesses and individuals that can be comical, and I'll never forget the... Well, specifics probably shouldn't be discussed, lol, but in case you were wondering, don't allow (err... request?) your hooker to handcuff you to your bed and then lose the key when your wife is expected to return from her trip shortly. And if you do, don't try performing acrobatics, because some ceiling fans can, it turns out, cause injury to one's feet/ankles.

If you can move your grow to an interior location instead of one that has one or more exterior walls, that probably wouldn't hurt. If you cannot, and you have leaky and/or single-pane windows, you can purchase those "window insulation kits" (a piece of clear heat-shrinkable and a roll of double-sided tape) for next to nothing, and all it takes to install one is a razor blade or other trimming tool, a hair dryer, and a willingness to curse. If you are growing in a hot upstairs bedroom, well, upstairs bedrooms tend to BE hot - so buy an air conditioner and stick it in the window. A light that is consuming 600 watts is producing 2,047.8 BTU/hour of heat. A 1kW HPS will produce 3,413 BTU/hour of heat. Et cetera. Simply add that to your calculations when sizing your A/C needs, just like you'd add in the theoretical need for a space of that size, the hit you take if it's an uninsulated/leaky space, the additional BTU of heat produced per person/pet, the additional BTU of heat the tower computer produces, etc. IOW, if you calculate that you need just shy of 6K BTU of cooling and then park your 600-watt HPS in there, then order the 8,000 BTU A/C instead. You could insulate your grow room/tent with cheap rigid (foam?) insulation and use insulated ducts (or wrap plain ductwork with insulation) if you are excessively paranoid. As long as you have adequate airflow, I don't see where it would harm the grow. Necessary? Well, I can think of a few countries where I'd definitely take those steps, but apparently the United States isn't one of them, because I haven't bothered....
Click to expand...
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I have 2 600 watt hps lights in one tent & 2 1000 watt leds in another tent? Roofs insulated also not sure about walls?
 
Weedcrazyman said:
I have 2 600 watt hps lights in one tent & 2 1000 watt leds in another tent? Roofs insulated also not sure about walls?
Click to expand...

Well, the HPS combine to give you a heat burden of 4,095.6 BTU/hour. Are those LEDs actually consuming 1,000 watts each, or are they the ones that you have pictured, lol? If they're not consuming 1,000 watts each, you can multiply their actual power consumption (in watts) by 3.413 to determine their approximate heat production.

If you're not actually dumping all of the heat produced into the same room, then you will not need to account for all of it when sizing your air conditioner, of course.

I can see why you're paranoid. You've got, what, somewhere in the neighborhood of 50 plants?

Stick a good stout A/C in the window and two or three powerful oscillating fans to move the cool (and warm) air every which way, constantly. Send some of that cool air over the top of your tents, too. Think of the (pseudo-)randomly moving air of various temperatures like you would woodland camouflage or a ghillie suit; the person wearing the outfit is still there, still technically in view - he just doesn't get noticed because he is, in effect, covered by "visual noise" (so to speak). And yes, I'd buy some of those window kits. Actually (makes note to self), I'd put them on every window in your house that you don't open regularly. It's Summer and hot out, and I'd rather be sitting in a cool air conditioned room than sweating by an open window.
 
What do you mean by window kits? I have cool air coming from roof through the hps lights and running down the floor under the house. Whats your tgoughts on that?
Also the tents are always closed?
 
Weedcrazyman said:
What do you mean by window kits?
Click to expand...

077578018485.jpg
I

They're most commonly used in Winter to help stop heat loss through one's windows, but many people use them in Summer, too, to help ensure that their air conditioner is not trying to cool the great outdoors along with the house. They're not really noticeable from outside, they can help lower your cooling costs, especially if you place them on every window (that you do not plan on opening regularly, obviously), and if your windows are reasonably airtight in the first place, they can provide... not a vacuum of course, but sort of a dead-air space between the window and the plastic. They seem to attenuate some noises slightly, which may serve to lower the noise that passes through the window ever so slightly, IDK. They're fairly inexpensive (at least until you realize that the product probably cost all of a dime to manufacture), and a person can sometimes find them in the warmer months selling at a steep discount at a store such as Big Lots (if you have such a store in your area) or other seller of overstocked/unsold goods. I once saw Mom carefully remove one and put it away for the season, so I know that can be done - but Mom was born into a very, very poor (and, ironically, very large) family almost eight decades ago so her "budget / savings" attitude is a bit extreme; I once saw her place a TV dinner on the top of her basement stairs to thaw out so that she could microwave it for less time than instructed so that she could save a few cents. Most folks, if they do not leave them permanently installed, just remove them and throw them away.

Weedcrazyman said:
have cool air coming from roof through the hps lights and running down the floor under the house. Whats your tgoughts on that?
Click to expand...

You appear to be venting the "tent plus lights" as a unit, which is not my preferred recommendation, but will work as long as you do not have a carbon filter failure while you are away. If those lights are well sealed, and you were to modify the duct run so that, instead of pulling air from the tent to cool those lights, you brought air from outside (of the tent) for the purpose, then it shouldn't smell like cannabis even if there is an issue with your filter at some point in the future. Generally - but not always - you'd still need to run ventilation (along with the carbon filter) for the tent, itself, but the temperature in the grow room might be low enough at that point that you can do so at a significantly lower fan speed, by placing that fan on a timer instead of running it constantly, or if you have some form of air conditioning, only running that fan sporadically as needed. There are even "insulated reflector covers" available for many common air-cooled reflectors to help facilitate this by helping to keep the heat produced by the lights from transferring into the rest of the grow space. They don't have an R-100 insulating value, lol, but they can be helpful as part of an overall plan.

Pushing heated air under the house? Is it heated humidified air? Is that likely to encourage mold growth down there? Aside from that, if you're feeling really paranoid, lol... Lots of people have lots of devices that produce heat in their homes. If I had to guess, my guess would be that most of them don't move that heat in the same direction that you are <SHRUGS> . I don't currently have one, but a house I once lived in had a "whole house ventilation fan." It was in the upstairs hallway (specifically, the ceiling). That house did NOT have any kind of air conditioning. One opened a window (at least partially) in every room that one wished to make more comfortable, then turned on the exhaust fan. It moved a LOT of air - enough to pull a breeze through the opened windows, through the rooms, and eventually out the exhaust fan's vent... on the roof. Kind of the opposite direction from your air movement. With the increasing use of central air, these whole-house exhaust fan setups now seem to be every bit as common as well-made products at WalMart :rolleyes3 , but some people still use them. If one is a (tobacco) smoker, it's probably a much healthier alternative than central air with the windows closed (and instead of getting a nasty buildup of sticky brown nicotine/tar residue on every wall / surface / piece of furniture in the house in a day, it'll probably take, IDK, a day and a half (lol) with whole-house ventilation). IDK what these things cost new. Lots, probably. But I saw one on Craigslist a few months ago for $35. Still kicking myself for not having $35 at the time....
 
TorturedSoul said:
077578018485.jpg
I

They're most commonly used in Winter to help stop heat loss through one's windows, but many people use them in Summer, too, to help ensure that their air conditioner is not trying to cool the great outdoors along with the house. They're not really noticeable from outside, they can help lower your cooling costs, especially if you place them on every window (that you do not plan on opening regularly, obviously), and if your windows are reasonably airtight in the first place, they can provide... not a vacuum of course, but sort of a dead-air space between the window and the plastic. They seem to attenuate some noises slightly, which may serve to lower the noise that passes through the window ever so slightly, IDK. They're fairly inexpensive (at least until you realize that the product probably cost all of a dime to manufacture), and a person can sometimes find them in the warmer months selling at a steep discount at a store such as Big Lots (if you have such a store in your area) or other seller of overstocked/unsold goods. I once saw Mom carefully remove one and put it away for the season, so I know that can be done - but Mom was born into a very, very poor (and, ironically, very large) family almost eight decades ago so her "budget / savings" attitude is a bit extreme; I once saw her place a TV dinner on the top of her basement stairs to thaw out so that she could microwave it for less time than instructed so that she could save a few cents. Most folks, if they do not leave them permanently installed, just remove them and throw them away.



You appear to be venting the "tent plus lights" as a unit, which is not my preferred recommendation, but will work as long as you do not have a carbon filter failure while you are away. If those lights are well sealed, and you were to modify the duct run so that, instead of pulling air from the tent to cool those lights, you brought air from outside (of the tent) for the purpose, then it shouldn't smell like cannabis even if there is an issue with your filter at some point in the future. Generally - but not always - you'd still need to run ventilation (along with the carbon filter) for the tent, itself, but the temperature in the grow room might be low enough at that point that you can do so at a significantly lower fan speed, by placing that fan on a timer instead of running it constantly, or if you have some form of air conditioning, only running that fan sporadically as needed. There are even "insulated reflector covers" available for many common air-cooled reflectors to help facilitate this by helping to keep the heat produced by the lights from transferring into the rest of the grow space. They don't have an R-100 insulating value, lol, but they can be helpful as part of an overall plan.

Pushing heated air under the house? Is it heated humidified air? Is that likely to encourage mold growth down there? Aside from that, if you're feeling really paranoid, lol... Lots of people have lots of devices that produce heat in their homes. If I had to guess, my guess would be that most of them don't move that heat in the same direction that you are <SHRUGS> . I don't currently have one, but a house I once lived in had a "whole house ventilation fan." It was in the upstairs hallway (specifically, the ceiling). That house did NOT have any kind of air conditioning. One opened a window (at least partially) in every room that one wished to make more comfortable, then turned on the exhaust fan. It moved a LOT of air - enough to pull a breeze through the opened windows, through the rooms, and eventually out the exhaust fan's vent... on the roof. Kind of the opposite direction from your air movement. With the increasing use of central air, these whole-house exhaust fan setups now seem to be every bit as common as well-made products at WalMart :rolleyes3 , but some people still use them. If one is a (tobacco) smoker, it's probably a much healthier alternative than central air with the windows closed (and instead of getting a nasty buildup of sticky brown nicotine/tar residue on every wall / surface / piece of furniture in the house in a day, it'll probably take, IDK, a day and a half (lol) with whole-house ventilation). IDK what these things cost new. Lots, probably. But I saw one on Craigslist a few months ago for $35. Still kicking myself for not having $35 at the time....
Click to expand...
Awesome thanks so much for your help.
Ive just purchased some mylar thermal blankets to put on top of tents. Whats your thoughts?
 
Weedcrazyman said:
Ive just purchased some mylar thermal blankets to put on top of tents. Whats your thoughts?
Click to expand...

Thin, easy to tear, easy to crease, shiny, not at all tasty, developed in the '60s for the United States space program... That's about it, really. Maybe someone who uses the stuff will have more thoughts. I'll hunt up a couple of general information webpages for you that may help.
Space blanket - Wikipedia
Can mylar space blankets (MPET) be used as home insulation? - Quora
 
I think it's almost daylight and I didn't get any sleep at all last... err... I mean Saturday night, either, so my opinion wouldn't be worth the virtual paper that it'd be written on right now :rolleyes3 . I only dropped back because I forgot to add one other link that I found. Take a look at number... I don't remember, but one of them mentioned evading thermal imaging. Anyway, here's the link:
How to use mylar for survival (correctly)

On the "too many plants?" question, I actually - and rather naively - thought there was no such thing for about the first five minutes of my first ever grow. I've since learned otherwise, of course. One thing I can say from looking at the pictures is DO YOU WANT TO TRADE SETUPS? err, I mean it doesn't look like there's anywhere for your plants to grow except straight up. Which can be fine, depending... If one shoots up and the rest don't, you'll either have to raise your lights to deal with that one plant (causing them to not be as effective on the remainder) or do a little guillotine impression ("Off with its head!" lol). Not likely to become an issue if you're running all clones from the same mother, but if you aren't then you might wish you had the space to bend a taller plant or two over. The same might be true if they're "stretchy." I've read that indicas tend to stretch 2x and sativas 3x, but that's either a generalization or I read it wrong, because I once initiated flowering on a plant that was just under a foot tall and it finished the stretch at (IIRC) just under 6' tall. Probably a pretty extreme example, but... Also, if your plants shoot up, will your lights be able to penetrate through a (hopefully) thick canopy? But that isn't really an issue, because undergrowth can always be removed.

All in all, I'd happily trade you setups. I wouldn't want your electrical bill (and couldn't support your electrical usage with my ancient electrical system), but that goes with the territory, I suppose. One thing about grow tents that I've never understood is why someone doesn't come up with a way to remove all the "slack" in the walls, so that the reflective surface is FLAT. But that appears to be a universal problem. My cat wouldn't like it, because there doesn't look to be any room for her to hide ;) . But since she has never eaten a plant or crapped in the medium, I'd be willing to toss a plant (yes, I typed it) so she'd have a convenient corner. I noticed the chair. Spend time just existing in the grow room? Yeah... I hope you're not smoking in there. Nicotine/tar can and will coat pretty much anything more solid than air, which will degrade the chlorplasts' effectiveness and also clog the stoma that the plants' use to transpire moisture. I have no reason to doubt that cannabis smoke would do the same thing (without the inherent danger of possibly infecting your plants with TMV (tobacco mosaic virus) if you handle the tobacco and then the plants. Not common but definitely possible.

IDK how useful my opinion is right now. I have to go flat for an hour, because I actually have a little work today.
 
TorturedSoul said:
I think it's almost daylight and I didn't get any sleep at all last... err... I mean Saturday night, either, so my opinion wouldn't be worth the virtual paper that it'd be written on right now :rolleyes3 . I only dropped back because I forgot to add one other link that I found. Take a look at number... I don't remember, but one of them mentioned evading thermal imaging. Anyway, here's the link:
How to use mylar for survival (correctly)

On the "too many plants?" question, I actually - and rather naively - thought there was no such thing for about the first five minutes of my first ever grow. I've since learned otherwise, of course. One thing I can say from looking at the pictures is DO YOU WANT TO TRADE SETUPS? err, I mean it doesn't look like there's anywhere for your plants to grow except straight up. Which can be fine, depending... If one shoots up and the rest don't, you'll either have to raise your lights to deal with that one plant (causing them to not be as effective on the remainder) or do a little guillotine impression ("Off with its head!" lol). Not likely to become an issue if you're running all clones from the same mother, but if you aren't then you might wish you had the space to bend a taller plant or two over. The same might be true if they're "stretchy." I've read that indicas tend to stretch 2x and sativas 3x, but that's either a generalization or I read it wrong, because I once initiated flowering on a plant that was just under a foot tall and it finished the stretch at (IIRC) just under 6' tall. Probably a pretty extreme example, but... Also, if your plants shoot up, will your lights be able to penetrate through a (hopefully) thick canopy? But that isn't really an issue, because undergrowth can always be removed.

All in all, I'd happily trade you setups. I wouldn't want your electrical bill (and couldn't support your electrical usage with my ancient electrical system), but that goes with the territory, I suppose. One thing about grow tents that I've never understood is why someone doesn't come up with a way to remove all the "slack" in the walls, so that the reflective surface is FLAT. But that appears to be a universal problem. My cat wouldn't like it, because there doesn't look to be any room for her to hide ;) . But since she has never eaten a plant or crapped in the medium, I'd be willing to toss a plant (yes, I typed it) so she'd have a convenient corner. I noticed the chair. Spend time just existing in the grow room? Yeah... I hope you're not smoking in there. Nicotine/tar can and will coat pretty much anything more solid than air, which will degrade the chlorplasts' effectiveness and also clog the stoma that the plants' use to transpire moisture. I have no reason to doubt that cannabis smoke would do the same thing (without the inherent danger of possibly infecting your plants with TMV (tobacco mosaic virus) if you handle the tobacco and then the plants. Not common but definitely possible.

IDK how useful my opinion is right now. I have to go flat for an hour, because I actually have a little work today.
Click to expand...
Thanks for your advice in regards to the plants they are mainlined/manifolded so 8 main colas would that make a difference?
 

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