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Thread: High Pressure Metal Halide - Is This For Real?

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    420 Member ReactiveLlama's Avatar
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    High Pressure Metal Halide - Is This For Real?

    Greetings,

    Browsing through ebay and came across a listing for a 450 watt High Pressure Metal Halide light.

    Plants need a properly balanced spectrum for growth. In particular, orange light HPS fixtures produce lankly growth with poor leaves. Reports are that this delays the flowering stage. Old fashion metal halide fixtures make a suitable white light, but their light output is low. Orange colored High Pressure Sodium is often used instead because it has higher light energy output needed for flowering.

    Now you don’t have to choose! Ultra Efficient High Pressure Metal Halide offers the best of both worlds with a light output similar to HPS, it makes 70% more light than a standard 400 watt metal halide bulb.
    And yet Googling High Pressure Metal Halide doesn't help me at all. So what do ya think? Sales gimmick?


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    Fallen Cannabis Warrior Medical Marijuana's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    Yes they are for real, and have only recently been patented. This is what I have found so far. I will add more once I get advice from the tech folks at the factory. They do work!

    High-pressure metal halide discharge lamp with a fill containing nickel halide

    Get related patents on CD
    United States Patent 5264760
    Link to this page High-pressure metal halide discharge lamp with a fill containing nickel halide - Patent Review 5264760
    Inventor(s) Genz; Andreas (Berlin, DE); Kiele; Walter (Munich, DE)
    Abstract To maintain a predetermined design color temperature throughout the lifet of a metal halide high-pressure discharge lamp, particularly suitable for illumination of theaters, film or television studios, the discharge vessel of the high-pressure lamp, typically made of quartz glass, contains a fill which, besides mercury, has a noble gas, cesium and dysprosium halide and a nickel halide. Optionally, gadolinium halide may be used. Per cubic centimeter of volume of the discharge vessel, 0.03 to 3 mg dysprosium, 0.002 to 0.5 mg nickel, and, optionally, 0.002 to 0.1 mg gadolinium are suitable. Suitable halogens for the halides are iodine and bromium, preferably in a mol relationship between 0.2 and 1.5. The metals, nickel and gadolinium limit the color temperature drop-off over the average lifetime of the lamp to at the most 1 K per operating hour of the lamp.


    Starting mechanisms for high pressure metal halide lamps
    Lay, B.; Cho, S.-H.; Kushner, M.J.
    Pulsed Power Plasma Science, 2001. IEEE Conference Record - Abstracts
    Volume , Issue , 2001 Page(s):244 -
    Digital Object Identifier 10.1109/PPPS.2001.960863
    Summary:Summary form only given. High pressure metal halide lamps typically have cold fills of a rare gas (usually Ar) of 10 Torr. Starting of the lamp involves applying a high voltage pulse to the electrodes, breaking down the gas, and upon heating produces a thermal arc. Lamps often include auxiliary electrodes to produce preionization, either by electron impact or by photoionization. To investigate these processes, a 2-dimensional lamp model has been developed. The model uses a conformal triangle-based mesh to resolve fine structures. Charged particle transport is based on a drift-diffusion formalism with Sharfetter-Gummel fluxes, solved implicitly coincident with Poisson's equation using a modified Newton's method. Neutral particle transport is separately implicitly solved using the method of successive -over-relaxation. Electron transport coefficients are obtained from either a local-field approximation or by solving the electron energy equation. Plasma properties during startup will be discussed for a selection of electrode geometries, voltage formats and impurity concentrations


    Abstract. In the development of high-pressure metal halide lamps there is a growing need for lamps with good color rendering properties. To meet these requirements rare-earth halides are added more often. Due to the multi-line atomic spectra of rare-earth species it is possible to fill the visible spectrum almost completely, which is the basis of the good color rendering properties of lamps containing rare-earth species. In order to support the development of such lamps numerical plasma models are being developed. These models and their verification require that good fundamental data is available for the radiative properties of the rare earth species. In this article an interpolation method is presented that can yield an indication of oscillator strengths of lines that are not known, based on a fit to a Boltzmann plot (log intensity against lower level energy), using oscillator strengths of lines that are already known to create the Boltzmann plot.

    Color temperature

    Metal halide lamps were initially preferred to mercury vapor lamps in instances where natural light was desired because of the whiter light generated (mercury vapor lamps generating light that was much bluer). However the distinction today is not as great. Some metal halide lamps can deliver very clean "white" light that has a color-rendering index (CRI) in the 80's. With the introduction of specialized metal halide mixtures, metal halide lamps are now available that can have a correlated color temperature as low as 3000 K (very yellow) to 20,000 K (very blue). Some specialized lamps have been created specifically for the spectral absorption needs of plants (indoor gardening) or animals (indoor aquariums). Perhaps the most important point to keep in mind is that, due to tolerances in the manufacturing process, color temperature can vary slightly from lamp to lamp, and the color properties of metal halide bulbs cannot be predicted with 100% accuracy. Moreover, per ANSI standards the color specifications of metal halide bulbs are measured after the bulb has been burned for 100 hours (seasoned). The color characteristics of a metal halide lamp will not conform to specifications until the bulb has been properly seasoned. Color temperature variance is seen greatest in "probe start" technology lamps (±300 kelvins). Newer metal halide technology, referred to as "pulse start," has improved color rendering and a more controlled kelvin variance (±100 to 200 kelvins). The color temperature of a metal halide lamp can also be affected by the electrical characteristics of the electrical system powering the bulb and manufacturing variances in the bulb itself. If a metal halide bulb is underpowered it will have a lower physical temperature and its light output will be 'cooler' (more blue, or very similar to that of a mercury vapor lamp). This is because the lower arc temperature will not completely vaporize and ionize the halide salts which are primarily responsible for the warmer colors (reds, yellows), thus the more-readily ionized mercury will dominate the light output. This phenomenon is also seen during warmup, when the arc tube has not yet reached full operating temperature and the halides have not fully vaporized. The inverse is true for an overpowered bulb, but this condition can be hazardous, leading possibly to arc-tube rupture due to overheating and overpressure. Moreover, the color properties of metal halide lamps often change over the lifetime of the bulb. Often, in large installations of MH lamps, particularly of the quartz arc-tube variety, it will be seen that no two are exactly alike in color.

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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    THE ENERGY BALANCE OF MODERN HIGH PRESSURE METAL HALIDE LAMPS

    M. Haverlag
    Philips Lighting, Central Development Lamps, P.O. Box 80020, 5600 JM Eindhoven, The Netherlands; and Eindhoven University of Technology, Department of Applied Physics, P.O.Box 513, DenDolech 2, Eindhoven, the Netherlands


    ABSTRACT

    In the market of High Intensity Discharge (HID) lamps there is a gradual shift from traditional high-pressure plasma light sources based on single-metal emitters (e.g. high pressure sodium and high pressure mercury lamps) towards high-pressure plasma light sources with multiple plasma components, hi the last group especially metal-halide lamps with improved energy efficiency and light-technical properties are becoming increasingly important. Since these plasmas are more complex in terms of the plasma chemistry and physics, an improved understanding is needed. In this article a model will be presented for the energy balance of metal-halide lamps. The model includes several submodels, including radiation models for optically thick and optically thin radiation, 2-D radiation transport, a model for the chemical equilibrium reactions between the different components in the plasma, heat conductivity and electrical conductivity, and a 1-D numerical solution of the Elenbaas-Heller equation. As an example model calculations in comparison to experimental results will be shown for high pressure sodium-iodide lamps.

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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    High pressure metal halide lamp
    Document Type and Number:
    United States Patent 5844365

    Abstract:
    A light transmitting discharge vessel encloses a discharge space, sealed in a gas-tight manner, in which electrodes connected to current conductors which extend to the exterior are disposed. A filling in the discharge vessel comprises a rare gas, a buffer gas and at least one transition metal halide chosen from the halides of hafnium, zirconium and tantalum. Each of the electrodes comprises an electrode part containing a carbide chosen from the carbides of hafnium, zirconium and tantalum. As a result diffusion of transition metal from the plasma into the electrode is strongly suppressed so that the lamp keeps very good color rendering properties throughout its operation.

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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    these bulbs are like putting the sun in ya cupboard
    fookin pukka

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    Cannabis Connoisseur Boss's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    They are from 75 to $140.00 dollars and have a pretty short life. But I hear they work really well.

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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    I've asked one of our sponsors to check it out.

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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    What kinda ballast do you need? Just curious if anybody knows.... if not, no worries.

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    420 Member HeadMed's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    From the Philips site, it looks like they are designing these to work in standard ballasts at standard wattage, they even have and bulb that draws 360 on a 400 (I wanna see how that works... do you need a digital ballast?) It seems though that with the Hybrid bulbs, your still not going to run as efficiently (lummens per watt) as with the straight HPS. I have no idea if the added spectrum makes up for that though.

  10. #10
    420 Member POTential's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    ^ I believe it does, the CRI value of HPMH are supposed to be greater than HPS. I think regular MH have a greater CRI than HPS to begin with.

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    420 Member Racefan's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    THe CRI of a metal halide is about 80 to 85. The CRI of a HPS is about 20 to 25. BUT CRI is and has only been a small part of the equation. Light color has always played a lrge part hence blue light fpor veg and orange/red light for flower. Angle of light also plays a roile believe it or not.
    As for standard ballast...which one? A MH ballast set up has no ignitor. A HPS ballast set up has a ignitor. Which ballast will run the HPMH? If it's digital add another $100.00 to the ballast set up cost compared to a standard ballast set up.

  12. #12
    420 Member POTential's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    This is from a website called Life Light Technologies


    SunPulse HPMH


    * Available 100 / 150 / 250 / 400 watts

    * The best of MH and HPS light in one lamp!!!

    * The latest lamp technology available

    * One lamp for all stages of the plant life

    * Not for use on high-frequency electronic ballasts


    * For use on S51 HPS magnetic ballasts or
    * Life Light Digimax ballasts, and Sun Spinner systems


    I'm not quite sure what a HPS magnetic ballast is but Digimax is definitely digital.

  13. #13
    420 Member ReactiveLlama's Avatar
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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    All I know is that the bulb offered in the auction is by a outfit called Venture Lighting. Been to their website so that part is legit. So is HPMH the same as Ceramic MH? If the ballast is a regular 400 Watt MH ballast then I might go for it since I like the reflector and the bulb mounts vertical which I also like. If the HPMH bulb doesn't last and is to expensive to replace going with a standard MH bulb is a fine alternate for me...


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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    I just received this message from our sponsor, Cheap Grow Lights

    Hey Mark,

    I hope all is well with you. I wanted to touch base with you about the question that was presented. I am actually speaking to my rep at Hortilux. They are getting back to me hopefully by tomorrow. I am really so sorry it has taken so long for someone to get back to me. I didn’t want you to think that I have forgotten about you. By the way I have a new Do-It-Yourself Kit to make your own “STEALTH” grow light system. Everything you need to make your own system minus the PC Tower to save on shipping prices. Let me know what you think if the package needs something it’s lacking or whatever.
    Thank you so much for the support!

    John V. Hanna

    Welcome to Cheap Grow Lights!


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    Re: High Pressure Metal Halide.. Is this for real?

    I just heard back from John. Here is the answer from Hortilux.

    Dear Mark,
    I have your answer better explained by Mr. Anderson of EYE Lighting, who is my rep for Hortilux.
    If you ever need anything else, please feel free to contact me and I will do my very best in getting you the correct answer.
    Thanks again Mark!

    John V. Hanna

    Welcome to Cheap Grow Lights!



    From: Mike Anderson [mailto:mike.anderson@eyelighting.com]
    Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 10:38 AM
    To: info@cheapgrowlights.com
    Cc: Doreen Langa
    Subject: RE: Dual Arc HPS - MH Bulb - Hortilux

    Hello John,

    The output of our Super Blue (dual arc) lamp is 110,000 lumens and consumes 1100 watts with a suggested retail price of $219.95.

    Considering that you only need one system to operate this lamp (1000W HPS System) we believe it makes economic sense versus buying two systems and two lamps.

    The output of a Hortilux Blue lamp (400W) is 29,000 lumens, suggested retail price of $99.95

    The output of a Hortilux HPS lamp (600W) is 88,000 lumens, suggested retail price of $117.95

    Using two systems (400 Metal halide and 600 HPS), they consume roughly 1100 watts of energy and deliver 117,000 lumens (88K + 29K).

    Overall, the light output and spectral quality is very similar, however the blending of the light is far superior with our Super Blue (dual arc) lamp.

    I hope this helps you.

    Best Regards,

    Michael A. Anderson, LC

    Specialty Lighting Sales Manager

    EYE Lighting International of North America, Inc.

    A subsidiary of Iwasaki Electric Co., Ltd.

    9150 Hendricks Rd.

    Mentor, Ohio 44060

    Phone: 440-392-3626

    Cell: 440-463-0853

    Fax: 440-350-7001

    Customer Service: 888-665-2677

    Website: EYE Lighting International of North America, Inc.

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