DIY Aerocloner First Test Run - Please Help!

[THConnoisseur]

shovit, no ive never tried that method. i know thats some really old school shit tho, which means it has to work lol but my dilemma here is what mixture to put in the res as well as how long to have the sprayers cycle for. i attribute the first attempts failure due to a pH of 5.0 which was reccommend by several grower who have success with it. now im in tap water at 5.8 pH with the sprayers on 24/7 for this batch, now that sounds damn similar to putting a cutting in a cup of water!

PetFlora, im not using a bubble cloner, its an aerocloner. i have pics of the spray manifold i made with pvc in the first post of this thread but yea, essentially my hanging stems are being showered 24/7 with pH adjusted tap water (5.8). there is an airstone in the bucket as well so the water is nice and aerated but thats it for this trial, my last attempt with root hormone and pH of 5.0 didnt workout too well....

 

[THConnoisseur]

DAY 2 UPDATE

cuttings are perky and lookin good. i will lightly mist the cuttings once a day for the first 3 days with tap water just to be sure its not a humidity issue that caused th last girls to die but ill stop misting on day 4, and by day 5 i should have some root bumps forming (PLEASE GOD!!)

 

[Bandit420]

They're looking much better this go around THC!

I've been messing with these things for a year or two now. I've worked with diys, Botanicare, & most recent I ran my first ez cloner....

Your plan & machine are sound.
The problem with the first batch may have just been the chemical mix since they look better with the plain water. Maybe go as light as possible the next time you mix the nutes.
PH is good. You can be anywhere between 5.5 & 6.5 and still get good root development.
I would'nt worry about a dome. They're rarely used in aerocloning. I dont use them because I dont see the benefits. In fact my clones root slower and were more stressed when I did use a dome.
I think I would make only one change to your machine if it was mine...
Since you dont use a medium, the cage part of the net cup is not needed. You're only using the net cup to act as a cradle for the neoprene right?
If so I would cut away the net part of the net cup to open up the strike zone for the sprayers. Then when the drops of water shoot towards the stem they wont be deflected by net cup and they'll have a clear path to the stem.

 

[THConnoisseur]

so your saying to cut the net cup shorter than i have already? i cut the bottom 1/2" off of the cups and the stems do hang down a bit lower than the bottom of the cup, check the pic below.

theyre definitely getting drenched tho, the stems are always dripping water when i pick em up to check their progress. but other than that, do you think ill have some roots in a few days!? im really feelin lucky on this trial

 

[Bandit420]

I missed that pic, sorry about that!
Taking out the bottom is probably good enough, especially if you see that the stems are being saturated.

Cloning can be tricky sometimes. I've found that some strains will root in as little as 5 days. But take this OG Kush I have now, she can be stubborn as a mule taking 14-20 days using the same machine & solution as the clones that rooted in 5 days.

As long as they stay green & perky for the most part they should take root generaly within a 6-14 day time frame.

What type of lighting are you using in case I missed that too?
For a bucket cloner I like about a 25-30 watt cfl plant & reptile light but any 6500K cfl up to 30 watts or about 40 watts of T5HO will fit the bill. I also like to keep the light about 12" above the clones

 

[THConnoisseur]

TRIAL 2 - DAY 3

cuttings are still green as ever and are perky pH has crept up to 6.1, so ill add a few drops later and bring it down to 5.8, but temps are still perfect.

Bandit, thats a very interesting point you bring up. I know ive heard that before, that some strains take longer than others, but ive never factored it in with my garden. I guess looking back over the last 18 months since ive begun cloning ive worked with nearly a dozen different strains, and the purple kush and master bubba genetics i had were certainly the fastest to root while the others were much more stubborn... i have cloned this same green crack mom with decent success (5 of 9 rooted) in about 8-10 days in rapid rooters so i know an aerocloner should be about a week. the og that i have is new and ive never cloned or flowered it yet but its supposed to be off the chain

ALSO, i included a pic below of my light, its a sun system 2ft 2-bulb T5 florescent w/ the warm/cool bulb combo that ive used to clone and veg for about a year, its a beast and more than enough for the 2x4 closet. but i keep the clones off center of the light so its not as strong and direct and the bulb is 12-14" inches above the clones...

 

[Bandit420]

Nice & clean set up Bro!
I've used that exact same light for cloning with outstanding success! I dont see any reason why these cuttings should'nt take root.
It might take a few runs to finally get the solution dialed. After that, that cloner should be spitting out clones at a 100% success rate every time you fire it up!

 

[THConnoisseur]

SWEET!! thanks for the support man, i also feel optimistic about this second trial. the pH adjusted tap water seems to be keeping the cuttings in better shape than when i had root hormone at 5.0pH in the res. its funny how often the simpler methods works over the "high-tech" ones... the next 48hrs will be the real deciding factor tho, by day 5 last time i knew it was getting bad lol hopefully these will look as healthy as they do now in two days.

also, im the proud new parent of 3 lovely girls!! 1 DJ Short Blueberry (back) and 2 Hawaiian OG's (side by side in front) that i was able to get from a friend and have begun vegging due to this clone dilemma im experiencing. i will veg these 3 girls for two weeks under the T5, then i will top them (for 3 clones) and take one branch from each (for another 3 clones) then will get them into flowering. by then hopefully all of this cloning bullshit will be figured out and i will be able to confidently clone for years to come

all i do for vegging is transplant the clones into 4" rockwool and put them in a propagation tray on a bed of hydroton so there is a gap of air between the rw cubes and the bottom of the tray. i hand feed/water every 2-3 days, basically like soil, then when theyre nice and fat with roots exploding out the bottom (2-3wks) i stick em in an 8" net pot with hydroton and place under a 400w hps in a flood table... DONE

 

[THConnoisseur]

DAY 4 UPDATE

cuttings are still perky and very green, tho a few leaves have begun to curl up a bit along the edges, any thoughts? The stems in the cloner are still green and do not look soggy and show no signs of rotting. in 48hrs i better have something going on down there!!! lol

(the few spots on the other leaf in the picture are just water marks from the two times i misted them with plain tap water)

 

[BlazinUSA]

im telling you dude roots grow when they have to go out and search for the water, give them a bit of a rest from that water from time to time, also have you considered the power of your nozzles are they spraying in there or misting? Have you even noticed like small pale knots on your stems?? this is where the roots will come from and is the accordingly the pre-cursor to your roots, when you see that knot starting to form you know your getting somewhere

 

[Bandit420]

You're fine running the pump 24/7.
My first run with this Ez Cloner has been done by the book according to the machine's instructions which say to run both pumps 24/7
The best way to describe the spray action of this machine is violent.
The vicious action of the machine running 24/7 is what gets the job done so fast and it's why I prefer aerocloning over any other method.

Be patient and keep the machine on until you either have little rooted plants or you know they're dead.

 

[THConnoisseur]

Blazin, unfortunately I have to agree with Bandit. ive read the EZ-Clone instructions online (pdf) and have seen many other successful DIY cloners who run the pumps 24/7, so i am damn near certain that the pump needs to run non-stop lol as far as im aware the ONLY reason to cycle the pump is if you cant keep res temps below 75 with the pump on 24/7, but i dont have a temp issue so 24/7 it is!

Bandit, i didnt know you had the EZ-Cloner! the sprayers that i bought from the hydro store are the red, 360deg sprayers that are in the EZ-Clone machine. i used 1/2" pvc cuz the EZ-cloner has 1/2" vinyl tubing, and i have a 360gph pump that i used. the force of the water is pretty "violent", the stems are definitely getting showered relentlessly lol

QUESTIONS:
WHAT GPH PUMP DOES THE EZ-CLONE COME WITH?
WHAT DO YOU PUT IN THE RES?
WILL THE MY STEMS GET SOGGY BEFORE ROOTS START TO FORM, OR IS THAT A BAD SIGN?

thanks dude!

 

[Bandit420]

Blazin, unfortunately I have to agree with Bandit. ive read the EZ-Clone instructions online (pdf) and have seen many other successful DIY cloners who run the pumps 24/7, so i am damn near certain that the pump needs to run non-stop lol as far as im aware the ONLY reason to cycle the pump is if you cant keep res temps below 75 with the pump on 24/7, but i dont have a temp issue so 24/7 it is!

Bandit, i didnt know you had the EZ-Cloner! the sprayers that i bought from the hydro store are the red, 360deg sprayers that are in the EZ-Clone machine. i used 1/2" pvc cuz the EZ-cloner has 1/2" vinyl tubing, and i have a 360gph pump that i used. the force of the water is pretty "violent", the stems are definitely getting showered relentlessly lol

QUESTIONS:
WHAT GPH PUMP DOES THE EZ-CLONE COME WITH?
WHAT DO YOU PUT IN THE RES?
WILL THE MY STEMS GET SOGGY BEFORE ROOTS START TO FORM, OR IS THAT A BAD SIGN?

thanks dude!

Good choice going with the 1/2" pvc. The ones that use 3/4" or 1" seem to lack the power so they make up for it with a bigger pump which in turn leads to the heat problems.

Yeah I could'nt resist the temptation to get an ez cloner when I found one marked down half off. I had been using an 8 site bucket cloner just like you up until a few weeks ago. I needed something with at least twelve sites, I had a little extra cash, so i made the jump.
My machine is the 30 site model and it came with the Ez Clone 750 mag pump. I cant find the gph anywhere but I can tell you it's not 750gph. It's probably around 350gph. I have a 750 gph pump and that thing runs like a fire hose compared to the ez clone pump.

For this batch I ran my usual concoction...
40 mls of Clonex per gallon of tap water. My tap water & Clonex settle in at a 5.8-6.1 ph so I dont ever adjust it.
I use VitaGrow dip to dip the stem before I put in the machine and that's it.
My light is a 4 bulb T5HO but it has dual switches so I just run two of the bulbs for cloning and I only run it 18/6. I would run the light 24/7 but this OG Kush like to take a little nap each day. Otherwise she gets real cranky on me and goes droopy.

After these clones go to veg tommorow I want to take some more practice clones with other solutions. I want to try out the cheap stuff from Home Depot. Clonex is very pricey so if I can get good results using the Green Light Rooting Solution from Home Depot I'll make the move.

EDIT: The stem usually stays rather firm. They turn a little brown, get a lot of white bumps all over an then start setting roots. The stem should never be mushy or liquidy

 

[THConnoisseur]

right on dude, and is it usually around day 4 or 5 that you begin to see the white bumps? i definitely know what root development looks like as ive torn open rapid rooter plugs for educational purposes at different stages of the rooting cycle and know what the calloused, bumpy ends look like before rooting. so my stems should look the same way in the aerocloner? they should swell and get bulbous, then knobby, then spikey beginnings of roots which lengthen into mature roots? cuz my stems now at day 4 show no signs of swelling or turning calloused and white... hmmm... well see in 48hrs!!

 

[Bandit420]

Sometimes the white bumps will show up within hours, sometimes it might take a week. I think it mostly depends on the strain and from what part of the mother the clone came from.
Typically the natural mojo that makes roots happen is in the lower part of the mother plant, close to the original root ball. Check out the trunk of the mama and you'll see those white bumps everywhere.
Taking a cutting from that area of the mother will result in the fastest rooting clones. The further away from the original root ball the cutting, the more diffcult it will be for the cutting to take root and subsequently will take more time to root.

You're right about how the transformation from a cut stem to a root ball happens. Whether it's Rapid Rooters or aerocloning, it happens the same. The only difference is that with aerocloning it usually happens faster with a more explosive root mass and there's no battles with algae, stagnent water, bacterias, or any other nasties that can come with cloning.
Just high perfomance root development

 

[THConnoisseur]

DAY 5 UPDATE

slightly more curling/wilting happening on the leaves but still overall looking far better than the first run, i posted a pic of both trials for comparison.

so thats the top, now for the bottom... the stems still look like the day i cut them lol im not sure if the slightly white/yellow ridge around where i took the cut is the calloused end forming or just from the water. theyre definitely not soggy, and show no signs of brown/rot yet so wtf....

Bandit, all of these cutting were taken from the top of the green crack mother, and the one og cut is from topping my new og mother lol i am starting to consider a few things that i didnt before though based on what you said. the VERY FIRST TIME i ever cloned i was still growing in soil and was experimenting with the LST bending technique (you may be aware of this...) where you tie the tops of the new growth down to the side of the pot which reroutes growth hormones equally throughout the plant creating not only a very unique looking garden but also massive yields it was from those LST'd plants (while in veg) that i took my first cuttings from... how big of a role do you think this made in my cloning success?? cuz essentially every branch on an LST'd plant is the "bottom" branch lol im honestly about to go start training this og mom before its too late!! cant hurt

 

[Bandit420]

Yeah those stems still look green and fresh. Good that there's no rot but being such fresh young cuttings I would bet that these will take at least two weeks to root. Young plant matter like that will have little if any of the natural root hormones so using a good solution and a dip will help expedite the process.

Your ideas about lst & cloning success is very interesting. I've been wanting to lst a mama for canopy control but the idea of keeping the bottom most branches going is a heck of an idea! I've always had the best clones come from bottom branches....lst here I come!

 

[THConnoisseur]

lol i already bent the shit outta my holygrail og mom!

NEW YEARS RESOLUTION: start to LST moms and clone with damn near 100% success!!

also, what you said about my cuttings looking like they were so young and that that plays a role in rooting time raises another question, do thicker cuttings typically root faster? i know theres a limit, a 1/4 inch thick branch with bark forming on it probably isnt the best bet lol but still, are larger stems more likely to root than thinner ones?

peace man, happy new year!

 

[Bandit420]

lol i already bent the shit outta my holygrail og mom!

NEW YEARS RESOLUTION: start to LST moms and clone with damn near 100% success!!

also, what you said about my cuttings looking like they were so young and that that plays a role in rooting time raises another question, do thicker cuttings typically root faster? i know theres a limit, a 1/4 inch thick branch with bark forming on it probably isnt the best bet lol but still, are larger stems more likely to root than thinner ones?

peace man, happy new year!

lol I dont know if thickness has much to do with anything. I know I like mine to have a little meat on their bones but no so much they wear out my scissors trying to snip them off a mama

I've cloned big fatties and real skinny twigs. Each had their issues. The fatties would shock really bad because they've been used to gorging on nutes and then all of a sudden the well runs dry and then the skinny ones tend to root and be spindly plants needing extra veg time to be ready in my sog.
Somewhere in the middle is the ideal clone for me

Happy New Years to you and yours Buddy!

 

[THConnoisseur]

DAY 6 UPDATE

well, im starting to loose hope... pH and temps were perfect all week but i have absolutely no signs of any root formation whatsoever, and quite a few of the leaves are starting to curl up and become discolored... FUCK! im giving these girls 2 or 3 more days at the most (if they even make it) to see if there is some miracle root development but i doubt it... this shit is really depressing!!

also, i started to LST my og mom because im really interested to see how the clones i take from that plant root compared to the untrained moms ive worked with in the past. since i am in absolute DESPERATE need of clones i will be reverting to the dome and rapid rooter method because i know i can at least get a couple to root that way and my garden is really suffering because of this fucking clone issue...

^^ LST'd OG mother ^^