How To Make Concentrated Cannabis Oil

[DudeDurban]

I'm sure this has been addressed somewhere but I couldn't find it using the search function, maybe because I'm not using the right words. If I wanted to take freshly picked buds, freeze them and then do a LabRat type extraction where you reduce the alcohols temp to freezing and combine it with the frozen fresh buds and let it sit for 24h in the freezer, would that create an acceptable extraction? I just want to skip the drying step and maybe pick up any extra terpenes lost in the drying process. If anybody has a link to somebody discussing a process like that or could maybe clue me in on the correct terminology so I can do a proper search I would be very grateful.

 

[KingstonRabbi]

I think you would preserve more terpenes in the oil but at the cost of a much lower yield in oil. Even if you do extract more terpenes initially much will be lost in the cook down and decarb steps. I'm trying GrowGoddess' natural decarb method plus cool evaporation to try to keep those terpenes in the oil. I haven't tested that batch yet, but I'll post results when I do.

From Lab Rat's thread:

I like the sound of this method, will have to try it next time around. Thanks for posting.

There's a member (PsyCro) who is doing a fresh/wet bud extraction with olive oil: Olive oil extract update. The idea is that there are more terpenes in fresh buds (and so more healing in the final oil).

How do you think your method Lab Rat would go with fresh, frozen buds?

The person which shared this method with me, emphasized that the bud needed to be dry in order to freeze or lock the chlorophyll and plant waxes in place. I'm not an organic chemist although dad is a chemist and he thinks that a frozen fresh bud would actually yield very little because the whole bud would be a block of ice.

I don't do the whole recreational thing, before I got sick I was a pilot and an aeronautical engineer but if I had access to green bud I would just make bud pesto and eat it. Salt, olive oil, parsley, a good amount of garlic and 4 buds in a food processor.

Juicing just takes too much plant matter, this seems like a good option.

JUICING > OIL > VAPING > SMOKING

 

[SweetSue]

I'm sure this has been addressed somewhere but I couldn't find it using the search function, maybe because I'm not using the right words. If I wanted to take freshly picked buds, freeze them and then do a LabRat type extraction where you reduce the alcohols temp to freezing and combine it with the frozen fresh buds and let it sit for 24h in the freezer, would that create an acceptable extraction? I just want to skip the drying step and maybe pick up any extra terpenes lost in the drying process. If anybody has a link to somebody discussing a process like that or could maybe clue me in on the correct terminology so I can do a proper search I would be very grateful.

This is a link to a discussion at the Study Hall when we were informed that LabRat abandoned this process. It was explained to him by an extraction professional that the increased pulls were because he was getting waxes and chlorophyll.

SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall

If preserving the terpenes is a primary concern I'd also recommend GrowGoddess's technique. She dries and then vacuum-seals until she has the volume she needs for an oil run. No heat and naturally decarbed over months create a superior oil.

Your other option is a fresh-harvest infused oil, but no one's had any tested so we don't know yet exactly what we're getting with that technique, other than it works therapeutically. The theory is that more terpenes are captured in the oil. There's heat involved in this process, so degradation of terpenes are inevitable.

May I ask why you're trying to avoid the drying process?

 

[DudeDurban]

This is a link to a discussion at the Study Hall when we were informed that LabRat abandoned this process. It was explained to him by an extraction professional that the increased pulls were because he was getting waxes and chlorophyll.

SweetSue's Cannabis Oil Study Hall

If preserving the terpenes is a primary concern I'd also recommend GrowGoddess's technique. She dries and then vacuum-seals until she has the volume she needs for an oil run. No heat and naturally decarbed over months create a superior oil.

Your other option is a fresh-harvest infused oil, but no one's had any tested so we don't know yet exactly what we're getting with that technique, other than it works therapeutically. The theory is that more terpenes are captured in the oil. There's heat involved in this process, so degradation of terpenes are inevitable.

May I ask why you're trying to avoid the drying process?

Thanks for clearing that up. I read some of the posts and threads by LabRat but didn't fully understand the timeline for when and what process he abandoned.

I read about GrowGoddess's technique and that sounds like something that is easy to do, although I don't have 200 proof ethanol, only 190. The downside to her method besides the time for the natural decarb is that I don't know of any way to reclaim that alcohol.

Is this the olive oil extraction you were talking about?

I wanted to skip drying and curing for 2 reasons, it bypasses the labor of one or two steps and the need for an extra room/shed for drying and curing. I'm not really set on anything just yet, still reading and learning. Is there any info on the bioavailability of tacking vs. suppository? I'm gonna start reading more on the olive oil extraction and thank you Sue and Rabbi for responding to my question.

 

[SweetSue]

Thanks for clearing that up. I read some of the posts and threads by LabRat but didn't fully understand the timeline for when and what process he abandoned.

I read about GrowGoddess's technique and that sounds like something that is easy to do, although I don't have 200 proof ethanol, only 190. The downside to her method besides the time for the natural decarb is that I don't know of any way to reclaim that alcohol.

Is this the olive oil extraction you were talking about?

I wanted to skip drying and curing for 2 reasons, it bypasses the labor of one or two steps and the need for an extra room/shed for drying and curing. I'm not really set on anything just yet, still reading and learning. Is there any info on the bioavailability of tacking vs. suppository? I'm gonna start reading more on the olive oil extraction and thank you Sue and Rabbi for responding to my question.

That is indeed PsyCro's thread. I have a blog with the technique summarized.

PsyCro's Olive Oil Extraction

I recommend you read his thread. It'll give you insight you won't gain any other way. I just made two batches of brownies made with the oil I produced using the olive oil extraction, but with coconut oil instead. Brownies taste odd with the olive oil, so I avoid it unless it's necessary.

These are incredibly potent. I'm known for the potency of my brownies. I use techniques we developed with CajunCelt's help that maximize potency and greatly expand the therapeutic window. As I type this, having done nothing more than lick the chopsticks used to stir the oils before measuring and eating the crumbs from the cutting and wrapping process I'm so high I can't believe it.

Those around here that know me will smile at that.

I'd have to say PsyCro's claims were well-founded. I'd love to get this tested. I know from my experience right now that this is a superior product from my other infused oils. It wouldn't surprise me to discover it was as potent medicinally as he hopes and suspects. I bet this would make great suppositories.

Tomorrow I'll be testing the potency of the brownies. Nothing formal, just substituting one of the ones I baked tonight for what I typically bake. I'll be cutting these down into smaller doses.

Whew! I need to go stretch.

 

[DudeDurban]

Since I have to wait for some fresh flower to try PsyCro's olive oil extract and also wait 90-120 days to try the GrowGoddess natural decarb, I figured I should just make some regular CCO... but my brain loves to complicate or "optimize" things, so I was trying to find an ideal distiller for reclaiming alcohol. I did a search and found many of the main brains here talking about a variety of options.

Seems like a lot of oilers were using The Green Oil Machine type units that you can also find on ebay for 50% less. Then there is ExtractCraft's The Source Turbo which seems like the ideal unit except its $600, would take about 20-25 extractions to pay for itself, and isn't really necessary if you're not making concentrates for smoking, a true luxury item. There are also units on ebay that are just your basic distillers. I was wondering if anybody could chime in on what they are using, for how long, and if they are happy with their distiller. The best option I can find right now are the Green Oil Machine clones on ebay or the Laboy glass distillation kits on Amazon.

 

[SweetSue]

Since I have to wait for some fresh flower to try PsyCro's olive oil extract and also wait 90-120 days to try the GrowGoddess natural decarb, I figured I should just make some regular CCO... but my brain loves to complicate or "optimize" things, so I was trying to find an ideal distiller for reclaiming alcohol. I did a search and found many of the main brains here talking about a variety of options.

Seems like a lot of oilers were using The Green Oil Machine type units that you can also find on ebay for 50% less. Then there is ExtractCraft's The Source Turbo which seems like the ideal unit except its $600, would take about 20-25 extractions to pay for itself, and isn't really necessary if you're not making concentrates for smoking, a true luxury item. There are also units on ebay that are just your basic distillers. I was wondering if anybody could chime in on what they are using, for how long, and if they are happy with their distiller. The best option I can find right now are the Green Oil Machine clones on ebay or the Laboy glass distillation kits on Amazon.

So many options. I can tell you the water distiller that Cajun got (which I believe he modified in his cajun way) and which many others of us purchased has served him well under pressure, reclaiming solvent. He puts that machine through its paces and sings its praises when he thinks of it.

I have no experience with any of them making oil. I do smaller batches of CCO for the most part, and have a preference for infused oils. Making the ND oil I won't be reclaiming the solvent either. Makes me wish I knew a moonshiner. Lol!

 

[New B]

So I was watching a show on Viceland,they vacuum sealed a bag to decarb it in boiling water. That got me thinking about using my vacuum sealers bottle attachment or marinating container to cold infuse liquids!?
Anyone tried this process? Works really good to marinate food why not cannabis into other liquids.
Also would one be able to do vacuum infusion with fresh bud?

 

[New B]

Testing my theory today. But won't be using the oil till next week when I have time to experiment and bake something. Might try a shot to see if it works tonight. Lol. Test amount is 1/2cup olive oil to 3.5g of bud.

 

[SweetSue]

So I was watching a show on Viceland,they vacuum sealed a bag to decarb it in boiling water. That got me thinking about using my vacuum sealers bottle attachment or marinating container to cold infuse liquids!?
Anyone tried this process? Works really good to marinate food why not cannabis into other liquids.
Also would one be able to do vacuum infusion with fresh bud?

The idea is to open the trichomes and release the oil, and then bond the cannabis oil to the olive oil. Will the olive oil on its own, in a vacuum, be enough to get the trichomes to release their stores? Agitation is usually incorporated into the process, in theory to get the trichomes opened.

I'd probably go with 7 grams to the 1/2 cup of olive. This is a pretty standard amount in my infused oils.

Kuddos on the experimental nature. I'll be watching for the results.

 

[New B]

I am going to open and re vacuum seal several times to attempt to agitate. Removing air and adding air opens the cells of meat and veggies so why not oil and cannabis. Will share results asap. Only used 3.5 because supply is low and payday is Thursday lol. Maybe I'll drag out the infusion into Thursday and add another 3.5. Hmm

 

[SweetSue]

I am going to open and re vacuum seal several times to attempt to agitate. Removing air and adding air opens the cells of meat and veggies so why not oil and cannabis. Will share results asap. Only used 3.5 because supply is low and payday is Thursday lol. Maybe I'll drag out the infusion into Thursday and add another 3.5. Hmm

Ahhhh...... Life. I understand. Since you're vacuum sealing, could you simply cut the oil volume in half?

 

[New B]

Wanted 1/2 cup for brownies

 

[SweetSue]

Wanted 1/2 cup for brownies

I understand completely. My brownies are made with 8 grams and the pan's cut into 16 pieces. Makes dosing a breeze. Will you be adding lecithen? Forgive me if I missed that.

 

[New B]

Not this time. Will be getting some thursday as well. Just watched a video where they infuse thyme into oil by putting the oil and thyme into the vacuum bag and heat to 55°c water for 3 hours. I imagine higher temp for less time will work as well.

 

[New B]

Well to put this to topic. My apologies. Do you think we could do vacuum sealers with 190 proof in bottles, then cook it off . Maybe more potent? Do you see this as possible or a reason to try this?

 

[Radogast]

Not this time. Will be getting some thursday as well. Just watched a video where they infuse thyme into oil by putting the oil and thyme into the vacuum bag and heat to 55°c water for 3 hours. I imagine higher temp for less time will work as well.

That's like cooking a turkey at twice the heat to cook faster - this is a recipe for delicate (thyme) terpenes that might break down under higher heat.

Well to put this to topic. My apologies. Do you think we could do vacuum sealers with 190 proof in bottles, then cook it off . Maybe more potent? Do you see this as possible or a reason to try this?

I would want to know more about heat, and the flash point of alcohol (when it literally explodes into flame) under pressure. If it goes wrong, this is a potentially fatal chemistry experiment.

 

[New B]

I didn't mean cook it off under pressure. I don't have a vacuum chamber but a bottle stopper that allows me to vacuum out the air. Then I would transfer to rice cooker or slow cooker or something other then a pressurized system.

 

[dadums]

I have a vacuum pump what about using a vacuum desiccator?

 

[KingstonRabbi]

Update on natural decarbing experiment

Oil has been decarbing for 3 months. Time to sample. The oil was hard and glassy at room temp, so I dissolved it in alcohol first, then mixed into biobombs at 25 mg per capsule. I planned to just make a few for testing, but I was sitting at kitchen counter waiting for another batch in the still and I just kept going until I had 150 made. Didn't quite think that through.

I did vape tests of dry herb last fall so I know about how strong it should have been. Not there yet, maybe not quite half way. It was very relaxing, moderate body buzz and clear headed high, but not nearly as strong as I expected. Also interfered with my sleep which I'd forgotten about BCS. Overall subtle differences from vaped possibly due to THCA. I'll keep experimenting with a few and researching to see if it's maybe worth continuing to use as is or to make other batches intentionally with THCA.

So the oil still needs more time. Which brings us back to the part I didn't think through. The THCA should keep decarbing, which means it will be producing CO2 inside the capsules. Quick math estimates that about 1/2 gram of gas will be produced per capsule. Don't know what volume that is, but I may have capsules popping open as they continue aging.

I'll update again in month or so.

Back to the kitchen laboratory.

I took the process I documented a few weeks ago 1 step further, maybe 2, in quest to make CCO with NO heating to make naturally decarbed oil. Can't call it SAP like Gigi's, small batch turned out much thicker than prior large batch.

Changes from last time:
>buds were not decarbed in oven first
>1st wash processed without still so temp never above 71 degrees.

Started with 39 gr of Black Cherry Soda that's been curing for over 3 months.

I did 3 washes this time and processed each separately. Color doesn't show well in photo, but 1st wash (left jar) is golden, 2nd and 3rd washes very green. Each wash was 750 ml. First 2 with chilled alcohol, 3rd with room temp. 3rd was unplanned, but inspecting buds after 2nd wash I still saw little bits of trichomes, so added 3rd wash. After 3rd wash I still found stubs that may have contained more oil, but I doubt there was much medicine in them. Trichs are made of cell like any other part of plant, just clear so it looks like pure oil. I would expect there to be a remnant of cells and that's what I think I saw. Also, according to what I've read the medicine is produced in the heads. The heads were all gone after 1st wash, so I think most of the good stuff was in 1st wash also.

1st wash chilled overnight to 5 degrees and filtered 2 more times to remove waxes. Did that for other washes too. They got clearer but no less green.

1 fifth of everclear about to go up to the angels. Other 2 washes were processed in still to reclaim most of solvent, but 1st wash all went into evaporator without heat. Still heated others to about 170 degrees, 1st wash stayed at 71 degrees throughout 8 hours 'cooking' down.

Almost done, CCO starting to separate out.

Final yields from each wash in order: 4 gr, 1+gr, <1 gr. That's more than I expected for 3rd wash, but as I explained above I don't think it has same concentration of cannabinoids or terpenoids. We'll find out in a few months when decarbing is done.

p.s.: I have been searching for published data on natural decarb rates at room temp. Can't find any other than with heat. If you see anything please share. Thanks.