T5 or HID

[Hosebomber]

You too, Hosebomber? I received my 96x3-watt reflector yesterday and like you I am waiting on my next grow to see how it performs. What kind and size did you get?

I purchased two of the 96x3 reflector series lights. One is their standard panel that I have already received and the other is a custom panel with a totally different spectrum and ratio than they currently use. I was informed last night it has already shipped (in less than a week). The one thing I can say is that Sara has been super fast to respond to all of my emails, provided me with all of the information I requested, and a true pleasure to work with.

As for the amount of power, in general I say 2/3rds or 35 watts per square foot vis 50 per square foot with HID lighting.

 

[David Bowman]

As for the amount of power, in general I say 2/3rds or 35 watts per square foot vis 50 per square foot with HID lighting.

OK, so when comparing LEDs with HIDs at the most basic level, total wattages are an accurate measure. Let's say you have a 1000w HID and a 1000w LED. The HID draws 1000 watts, while the LED, being driven at a percentage of full power (typically 65%-75%), draws 700 watts. Taking into account the ratios above, the HID and LED can both cover the same area, 200 sq. ft. So a straight up total wattage comparison between HID and LED is valid to the extent that one is comparing lights with similar coverages regardless of the wattage consumed.

 

[David Bowman]

This might be obvious but I'm trying to catch up on current LED technology so.. to replace a 1000 HPS would I use a comparable wattage LED (Mars II LED Grow Light 900w, flower spectrum, for example) ?

I think the answer is yes. Based on my previous post, in general a 1000w HID is similar in coverage to a 1000w LED, even though the LED consumes less power to achieve the same coverage.

 

[Tugafox]

Hello Hosebomber, I came across some of your posts while looking for lights info. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, much appreciated. I´m looking to buy more lights because i think that maybe I don´t have enough. This week I asked a quote from TopLED for a Mars ii, got a very fast reponse but didn´t place my order yet. You wrote above that you ordered a "custom panel with a totally different spectrum and ratio than they currently use". IYO is there anything wrong with the current spectrum they use? If so, why? Could you disclose your favorite spectrum and ratio?

 

[PeytonManning]

I think in their site they offer a veg only panel, a flower only panel, and the regular that gets used through whole grow. Unless of course he had them do a true custom panel. I think it's a few bucks extra for the veg/flower only models

 

[Hosebomber]

There is nothing wrong with their current spectrum at all and there are a large number of grows that prove their spectrum works well. I've been working on my own custom panels for years. This is the first time I've had a panel made for me. There are a number of reasons for this but it's really hard to beat the prices they offer. The custom panel is a little different than my normal hand built version due to the different diodes current and thermal management system that a factory made panel uses. That and I think I am close to my goal... therefore I need to test my system with something that can be mass produced and against something that already is. I've seen other peoples grows with these panels and I have comparison for my growth and not just against another plant of my own.

As for the reasoning of why, I look at things from a holistic growing view. I feel that there are things we can do a little better if follow the science of growth but don't discount those things that we are yet aware of.

I will not be disclosing my spectra because as I have said, this is a different than nearly every panel I have ever made with the exception of the first 2 or 3 when I was starting out. Needless to say, my design and ratios have changed countless times, and may continue to change after this test.

 

[Hosebomber]

I think in their site they offer a veg only panel, a flower only panel, and the regular that gets used through whole grow. Unless of course he had them do a true custom panel. I think it's a few bucks extra for the veg/flower only models

Yes it is a completely different spectra that TopLED is making for me.

 

[PeytonManning]

Well I'd keep it under wraps that's for sure. If not I'm sure we'll be seeing topled sell a "hosebomber spectrum" light.

 

[Hosebomber]

You very well may see that in the future. They have my layout and ratios, but I told Sara this is a test panel and sometimes things don't work out the way the theory does. I should be getting the second (the customized one) light in a week or so. Depending on the timing, testing will start shortly after that.

 

[PeytonManning]

I'll be sure to get subbed up to that journal! Wait, do you do journals with your test lights?

 

[Hosebomber]

Not generally, but I do keep detail logs. I may do a post after the fact and just post it all at once.

 

[PeytonManning]

Looking forward to hopefully seeing what you can do with the new lights.

 

[Tugafox]

I understand, you´re only testing and you´re totally right about the sometimes existing gap between theory/practice.

I am currently testing one 135 w LED ( 48x 3w) from another company with 6 bands: Red: 630, 660nm, Blue: 455nm, Infrared: 730nm, Violet 430nm, Orange 610nm.
I´m not sure if it´s good enough as this is my first experience with LEDs and i´m a recent grower too. I bought it before I came across the info in this forum.
I´ve been reading icemud growing journal and that´s where I came across the Mars ii. I saw it works, thus my interest in it. My growing space is a tent with 1 meter x 1 meter x 2 meters high but i only have 3 plants. I also have a total of 150 w CFLs. I think i need more light as I really don´t know how much the LED can do...
Any advice?

 

[Hosebomber]

You have to look at the area you are actually growing in. One square meter is roughly 10 square feet. For that area, you would want at least 350 watts of LED, 500 watts of HID or 650 watts of CFL lighting. So if you are filling the whole area with plant matter you are grossly underpowered. Chances are, your 135 watt LED panel is actually only pulling about 100 watts or maybe even less. If you are only using a corner of grow tent thats 1.5'x1.5' then that would cover it, otherwise... not so much

 

[Tugafox]

Hello, good Sunday
Sorry, yesterday i got a bit "lost" reading journals here and didn´t notice you answered me so fast ~thanks! i´m still learning how to use this website. Newbie here in many senses...Also i apologize to danknessdude for "invading" this post with my questions.
Right, I wasn´t very clear. My growing space is 1x1x2 meters but my 3 plants (now in 3rd week of flowering counting from when i flipped to 12/12) use a bit less than half the tent´s floor space (i will measure the space they´re using tonight when the lights turn on). I´m using big pots (smaller one is 3 gallons) but if i put the plants close to each other i can see that the lights cover them. I use the LED on top and some cfls on the lower parts of the plants.
I had some questions about the LED i´m using (distance from plants and what happens if one led stops working) and sent an e-mail to the manufacter, they promptly answered me. They also manufacter costum LEDs and if i knew the "right" spectrum they could make me a light. Their price for this LED, shipment and fast response to my e-mail made me gain some trust, plus the LED hasn´t killed any of my plants (so far, lol) I don´t have a watts meter so i can´t tell for sure how much this LED is actually drawing...my fault not checking that before buying. I´m affraid of being underlight but i also have some budget limitations for watts (monthly bill) and more lights as i recently set up the tent and paid for all i already have. I was looking to get a 150w hps system to complement the LED and CFLs as it would cost me 60.00 euros but summer will start soon in my part of the world and some days we have 35 or more º Celsiums and the heat (i´ve read) a hps lamp puts out kind of worries me. I have one TT Vents 105 cfm´s in-line fan for extraction right next to the room window, passive intake and a small fan blowing inside the tent, no AC.
Maybe i should start a journal with all this..but i´m already in flowering and the journals i´ve seen so far start from the begining.
I would really like to have another LED but the quote i had for the Mars ii is a bit out my budget right now. Not sure what to do but my gut says more light wouldn´t hurt for bud production.
A peaceful day to all

 

[David Bowman]

to

Have you checked out the reflector series, Tugafox? They have 3-watt diodes as compared to the 5-watt diodes of the Mars II but they are cheaper than the Mars II and might be within your budget. I don't think going with HID is a good idea if you have 35°C summers, you would need to invest in a comprehensive ventilation system just to handle the heat and that would negate any benefits of the HID, which IMHO aren't many when comparing it against LED.

 

[Tugafox]

Hello ColoradoHigh, thanks for the welcome, idem
You mean, the reflector series from the same manufacters as Mars ii? No, I haven´t...only asked a quote for the Mars ii (400 w, smaller one i think).
Yeah! 35ºC and somedays more! South europe close to Mediterranean Sea and North Africa. Right now it´s Spring, we´re getting 15ºC minumum and 25ºC máx. I run the tent at night time and with the lights i have it´s in the 25º/26ºC range which is good but i don´t know what I will get when summer temps hit us.
I also think that LEDs are the way to go that´s why I bought the LED as first light instead of getting a hps. In my previous 2 grows i used nature´s natural cycles: sunlight and a closed balcony. It´s my first time with the tent.
Maybe i should e-mail LG LEDs for a quote of all the smaller LEDs they have but as investment aren´t the 5 watts the way to go?

 

[David Bowman]

Yes, the reflector series from Top LED, the same manufacturer as the Mars II, you can check them out at Top LED Reflector Grow Light. They are a sponsor of 420 Magazine and their 420 Rep - SmokeSara maintains an almost daily presence here at Top LED Grow Light Discount. With regard to 5-watt vs. 3-watt diodes, it all depends on your grow environment, mostly as it relates to height. 5-watt diodes are quite intense and cannot be placed as close to the canopy as 3-watt diodes. In my 4'x2'x5' grow box, there is no way I could run a 5-watt diode LED grow light as the height is too low to accomdate their required distance from canopy.

 

[PeytonManning]

I've got the 400 watt Mars II and I keep it about ten to twelve inches from the canopy. Haven't had any bleaching yet, but they're just starting to really bud up. Aside from possible bleaching, are there any other adverse side effects from that being too close?

 

[David Bowman]

Reflectors can have an issue where the plants are not receiving the full spectrum of the grow light due to too close proximity. I've also read where the plants exhibit stunted growth from lights being too close. My understanding of LED technology make me think the best approach to using LEDs is start at the manufacturer's recommendations, or further away if above young seedlings, and move down from there.