Transitioning Outdoor to Indoor

[wilhoitorwhatever]

I'm in between grows and have a general question about transitioning between outdoor to indoor mid-grow. I've got a few Auto CBD Cheese seeds I'm wanting to start next week. I'm in a deep southern US state in a rural area, and due to family coming to stay with me at certain times through the year I have to be strategic with the timing of my grows. It's hotter'n hell in my garage, which is the only place I can put my tent. Even with a humidifier filled with ice water, an exhaust and intake fan and an interior oscillating fan my tent stays above 90f. I've started indoors and moved outdoors successfully on two grows with no problems, but can the same be done going from outdoor to indoor? I figure I can match the light cycle easily enough, I'll be growing autos so not sure how much that matters anyway as long as I didn't drastically change. But do ya'll think going from an intense full spectrum light of sun to an indoor light would cause problems? I could try to finish outdoors I guess, but I'll be going out of town a few days about a week before my plants would finish and don't like the idea of leaving them unattended outdoors. By that time the daytime temps will have cooled enough that I should be able to move them to the tent with no temperature issues.

 

[TorturedSoul]

Biggest possible issues would be making 100% certain that you don't inadvertently bring any critters in with the plants, and ensuring that your garden space stays at or below about 88°F if at all possible (and lower still if the plants are not receiving all the light-energy that they're capable of processing at that temperature and average ambient CO₂ level. They're obviously not going to fall over dead if it gets hotter than that, but their metabolism will slow down. They'll also need to access even more water so they can transpire more in order to self-cool, and you'll need to be even more vigilant (increase the airflow through the canopy, and watch for trapped moisture as that can be a place for mold to grow).

I always automatically assumed that every plant I wanted to bring inside had some level of insect population on it and/or on or in the top surface of the media the plant was growing in. Or even crawling on the outside of the container (I'm talking about YOU, red spider mites!). Give them a good, strong shower from the garden hose, at the very least, shake what water off that you can, and consider some kind of drench with Safer's soap (or something else). I'd try to avoid bringing one in after the first part of the flowering phase. But if you can't, you can't. In which case, don't use anything that doesn't explicitly state that you can use it close to harvest ("safe to use up to the day of harvest" would be best). If you do have to use something late in flower, don't be afraid to carry the plant to the bathroom and give it a real good rinse in the shower. It rains outside . Get the thing dry, afterwards, though; got an old hair dryer that no longer heats, or one that you wouldn't mind sacrificing by disconnecting the heating element? Possibly consider some sort of "natural" solution (although some of those can be somewhat unpleasant, too).

Can you install an air conditioner in your garage, at least temporarily? Is there a window that you could place a window unit in? Or could you install a through-wall unit, if you don't mind a more permanent installation? (Or a mini-split, if you're rich, lol?) That will also help deal with the increased humidity that you'll get from moving mature plants into the space and running strong lighting over them. Plants don't start to feel miserable at 70°F (like me, lol), so you wouldn't have to set its thermostat quite as low as you would for one in your bedroom, for example. And it need not be a glaring "Cannabis plants HERE" sign either... Many people ("husbands" ) have found that it's not a bad idea to park outside so that they can install an air conditioner, a couch and television to watch the game on, a table to play poker on, a weight bench to use the (sometimes noisy) weights on, et cetera. Now... I'm not suggesting it, mind you - but some people have probably managed to convince their spouse that one or more of those things are actually necessary in order to provide proper "camouflage" for their in-garage gardening activity. . . .

 

[wilhoitorwhatever]

Biggest possible issues would be making 100% certain that you don't inadvertently bring any critters in with the plants, and ensuring that your garden space stays at or below about 88°F if at all possible (and lower still if the plants are not receiving all the light-energy that they're capable of processing at that temperature and average ambient CO₂ level. They're obviously not going to fall over dead if it gets hotter than that, but their metabolism will slow down. They'll also need to access even more water so they can transpire more in order to self-cool, and you'll need to be even more vigilant (increase the airflow through the canopy, and watch for trapped moisture as that can be a place for mold to grow).

I always automatically assumed that every plant I wanted to bring inside had some level of insect population on it and/or on or in the top surface of the media the plant was growing in. Or even crawling on the outside of the container (I'm talking about YOU, red spider mites!). Give them a good, strong shower from the garden hose, at the very least, shake what water off that you can, and consider some kind of drench with Safer's soap (or something else). I'd try to avoid bringing one in after the first part of the flowering phase. But if you can't, you can't. In which case, don't use anything that doesn't explicitly state that you can use it close to harvest ("safe to use up to the day of harvest" would be best). If you do have to use something late in flower, don't be afraid to carry the plant to the bathroom and give it a real good rinse in the shower. It rains outside . Get the thing dry, afterwards, though; got an old hair dryer that no longer heats, or one that you wouldn't mind sacrificing by disconnecting the heating element? Possibly consider some sort of "natural" solution (although some of those can be somewhat unpleasant, too).

Can you install an air conditioner in your garage, at least temporarily? Is there a window that you could place a window unit in? Or could you install a through-wall unit, if you don't mind a more permanent installation? (Or a mini-split, if you're rich, lol?) That will also help deal with the increased humidity that you'll get from moving mature plants into the space and running strong lighting over them. Plants don't start to feel miserable at 70°F (like me, lol), so you wouldn't have to set its thermostat quite as low as you would for one in your bedroom, for example. And it need not be a glaring "Cannabis plants HERE" sign either... Many people ("husbands" ) have found that it's not a bad idea to park outside so that they can install an air conditioner, a couch and television to watch the game on, a table to play poker on, a weight bench to use the (sometimes noisy) weights on, et cetera. Now... I'm not suggesting it, mind you - but some people have probably managed to convince their spouse that one or more of those things are actually necessary in order to provide proper "camouflage" for their in-garage gardening activity. . .

Thanks for your reply, I hadn't really considered bringing pests inside although that should have been the first thing I thought about. That gives me a lot to think about, I'll definitely have a plan to rid my ladies of any insects if I have to bring them inside. In a normal year, the daytime temps will have fallen enough by around the first of September to make my garage suitable to keep my tent in the mid to upper 80 degree range, so maybe that wouldn't go past beginning of flowering or at least I can try to time it so it works out that way since you mention that would be a factor you would consider.

I've definitely thought about putting some sort of AC in my garage. I couldn't swing any type of split unit but maybe one of those portable deals might work. Honestly when I was thinking about doing that the cost of the unit wasn't as much a factor as what it would do to my power bill, but you make another good point that it's not like I'd need to keep it 70 degrees, just cool enough to keep my tent reasonable.

Thanks again for all the input, I'm gonna give this some thought and put together a plan and give it a shot.

 

[SmokingWings]

I'll definitely have a plan to rid my ladies of any insects if I have to bring them inside.

If you know for sure that you are bringing the plants inside, even if it is into your garage, it probably is better to start getting rid of the insects a couple of weeks ahead of time. Especially so as far as the mites are concerned.

Most likely any outdoor plant already has some mites on it but we do not notice them because of natural repellents that keep most of them looking elsewhere. Plus there are many other insects that will be predators and are eating the mites and then moving to another plant. The predators do not seem to hang around more than a day or two but they keep coming back often enough that the mite population does not get out of control.

Something else to watch out for is mildews, especially Powdery Mildew. Some sort of thing. Bring the plant inside and it will seem like the mildew suddenly pops up everywhere and is next to impossible to get rid of. While there are no predators for the mildew it rarely gets as bad on our plants while they are outside. Bring them inside, even a garage set-up and one morning it can seem like it is on every leaf. I think it is the sunshine and way the winds blow around plus the constant change in humidity outside the keeps the mildew under control.

Right now, in my little corner of the US, the mildews are starting to show on various plants. Even though I do not intend to bring the outdoor plants inside I have already started a schedule of spraying for Powdery Mildew and will be starting for mites this week. Never know if I will have to bring them inside before the flowering period is finished. It might not get rid of the insect or mildew problem but should make it easier to keep under control until I can get rid of it inside.

 

[wilhoitorwhatever]

If you know for sure that you are bringing the plants inside, even if it is into your garage, it probably is better to start getting rid of the insects a couple of weeks ahead of time. Especially so as far as the mites are concerned.

Most likely any outdoor plant already has some mites on it but we do not notice them because of natural repellents that keep most of them looking elsewhere. Plus there are many other insects that will be predators and are eating the mites and then moving to another plant. The predators do not seem to hang around more than a day or two but they keep coming back often enough that the mite population does not get out of control.

Something else to watch out for is mildews, especially Powdery Mildew. Some sort of thing. Bring the plant inside and it will seem like the mildew suddenly pops up everywhere and is next to impossible to get rid of. While there are no predators for the mildew it rarely gets as bad on our plants while they are outside. Bring them inside, even a garage set-up and one morning it can seem like it is on every leaf. I think it is the sunshine and way the winds blow around plus the constant change in humidity outside the keeps the mildew under control.

Right now, in my little corner of the US, the mildews are starting to show on various plants. Even though I do not intend to bring the outdoor plants inside I have already started a schedule of spraying for Powdery Mildew and will be starting for mites this week. Never know if I will have to bring them inside before the flowering period is finished. It might not get rid of the insect or mildew problem but should make it easier to keep under control until I can get rid of it inside.

Thanks, the mildew is something else I hadn't considered in terms of not presenting outside but showing when I bring them inside. I deal with it every year in my vegetable garden, if I do this I will plan to work it out so that I bring them inside right as they begin to flower and treat them with some neem oil a week or two ahead of time. The idea of getting a portable AC in my garage is one that is growing on my though, I may just try to control my garage environment a little better and keep things indoor. Still very undecided though. Thanks for you reply and input.

 

[TorturedSoul]

If you're thinking about getting one of those standalone ac units that are (generally) on wheels and have a hose that goes to a window opening, try to get a dual-hose model. Also be aware that they're inefficient; the compressor/etc. is inside the space that you are trying to cool... producing heat. And the manufacturers/sellers must use the same kind of "creative" (aka lying) method of counting that those who produce the cheap Chinese LED grow light products . I did some painting with a guy for a while, and he decided to get one to use in the rooms/houses that weren't air conditioned, when the outside temperature was in the 90s. He ended up buying three, in succession, before he got one that seemed like it was worth bringing to a job site and using. It was labeled as a 14,000 BTU device - and we estimated that it did about as much as an 8,000 BTU window unit. It did seem to be an okay product, though. It was a Whynter (brand) 14,000 BTU dual-hose model. I... suppose you can consider that to be a recommendation, lol. We'd been in houses where the owner would happily roll in a 6,000 to 12,000 (rated) BTU single hose unit and tell us we could use it to "stay cool," and they produced more noise than cold air. YMMV, of course. But I can remember, several times, unplugging them, opening a window and setting a fan in it, and feeling more comfortable (even on a hotter day).

It'd be best, IMHO, (if you cannot drill a 3" hole through a wall and install a mini-split unit in your garage, or in that plus one to four additional rooms in your house) to get a window or thru-wall unit. They're more efficient (cheaper to run for a given amount of cooling), often higher quality, more durable, last longer, you shouldn't have to worry about them filling with water and shutting off until you drain them (can be an issue in higher humidity locations), and seem to generally work better. Also, they're available in more cooling BTU "sizes," from 5,000 BTU to 28,000 BTU (and possibly higher), although some 12,000 BTU units and all of the higher-capacity ones I've seen required a 230V outlet instead of a 120V one. Also, some of them - like mini-splits - also have a heat function (which may or may not be of use to you). And some of the newer ones use a variable speed compressor instead of the simple off/on type, which tends to make them even more efficient and prevents that extra load that sometimes causes lights to temporarily dim in the house when an older air conditioner compressor kicks on, because instead of cooling to the set temperature, shutting the compressor off, the room warming up several degrees past the set temperature, the compressor kicking back on, rinse/lather/repeat - they reach the set temperature and then reduce the electricity going to the compressor until it is merely doing enough work to keep the space at the set temperature. Some newer microwave oven appliances operate in the same manner, meaning that if you set one at 60% it actually constantly outputs 60% of its maximum rated energy instead of operating at 100% for six seconds, not operating the magnetron for four seconds, and endlessly repeating the cycle until the time has elapsed (if your hearing isn't shot, you can stand beside an older one and listen - it'll go "HUM... hum... HUM... hum... HUM..." if you're not running it at 100%.

Regardless, if you decide to artificially cool your garage space, be sure to seal up any leaks around windows and doors (a RPITA if you plan to continue to park a vehicle in it, but that would be a bad idea, anyway, because not only are you basically removing a significant portion of a wall each time you raise the vehicle door, when you drive a vehicle inside, you've just added a substantial (thousands of pounds) mass of hot metal.

 

[wilhoitorwhatever]

If you're thinking about getting one of those standalone ac units that are (generally) on wheels and have a hose that goes to a window opening, try to get a dual-hose model. Also be aware that they're inefficient; the compressor/etc. is inside the space that you are trying to cool... producing heat. And the manufacturers/sellers must use the same kind of "creative" (aka lying) method of counting that those who produce the cheap Chinese LED grow light products . I did some painting with a guy for a while, and he decided to get one to use in the rooms/houses that weren't air conditioned, when the outside temperature was in the 90s. He ended up buying three, in succession, before he got one that seemed like it was worth bringing to a job site and using. It was labeled as a 14,000 BTU device - and we estimated that it did about as much as an 8,000 BTU window unit. It did seem to be an okay product, though. It was a Whynter (brand) 14,000 BTU dual-hose model. I... suppose you can consider that to be a recommendation, lol. We'd been in houses where the owner would happily roll in a 6,000 to 12,000 (rated) BTU single hose unit and tell us we could use it to "stay cool," and they produced more noise than cold air. YMMV, of course. But I can remember, several times, unplugging them, opening a window and setting a fan in it, and feeling more comfortable (even on a hotter day).

It'd be best, IMHO, (if you cannot drill a 3" hole through a wall and install a mini-split unit in your garage, or in that plus one to four additional rooms in your house) to get a window or thru-wall unit. They're more efficient (cheaper to run for a given amount of cooling), often higher quality, more durable, last longer, you shouldn't have to worry about them filling with water and shutting off until you drain them (can be an issue in higher humidity locations), and seem to generally work better. Also, they're available in more cooling BTU "sizes," from 5,000 BTU to 28,000 BTU (and possibly higher), although some 12,000 BTU units and all of the higher-capacity ones I've seen required a 230V outlet instead of a 120V one. Also, some of them - like mini-splits - also have a heat function (which may or may not be of use to you). And some of the newer ones use a variable speed compressor instead of the simple off/on type, which tends to make them even more efficient and prevents that extra load that sometimes causes lights to temporarily dim in the house when an older air conditioner compressor kicks on, because instead of cooling to the set temperature, shutting the compressor off, the room warming up several degrees past the set temperature, the compressor kicking back on, rinse/lather/repeat - they reach the set temperature and then reduce the electricity going to the compressor until it is merely doing enough work to keep the space at the set temperature. Some newer microwave oven appliances operate in the same manner, meaning that if you set one at 60% it actually constantly outputs 60% of its maximum rated energy instead of operating at 100% for six seconds, not operating the magnetron for four seconds, and endlessly repeating the cycle until the time has elapsed (if your hearing isn't shot, you can stand beside an older one and listen - it'll go "HUM... hum... HUM... hum... HUM..." if you're not running it at 100%.

Regardless, if you decide to artificially cool your garage space, be sure to seal up any leaks around windows and doors (a RPITA if you plan to continue to park a vehicle in it, but that would be a bad idea, anyway, because not only are you basically removing a significant portion of a wall each time you raise the vehicle door, when you drive a vehicle inside, you've just added a substantial (thousands of pounds) mass of hot metal.

Thanks @TorturedSoul you make some great points and suggestions. If I go the AC route I will definitely be sealing some areas around my garage door, and we don't use this garage for parking so that also will not be a factor. For the unit itself, the inefficiency of a portable unit is definitely a factor on whether I end up going this route at all. A friend of mine uses them, has had a few over the last 5 or 6 years, and while they work I agree completely that they don't work nearly as well as a window unit. In my situation, it would have to be either a window unit or portable, going through a wall would not be an option for my garage. And for the widow unit, the two windows in my garage are in the direct front of my house sitting over my wife's flower garden. I was talking the possibility of cooling the garage yesterday, her mind went to window units (I was thinking portable cause I figured it would look horrible with an AC hanging off the front of the house) and she immediately started giving me the stink eye lmao.

I've definitely got some thinking and deciding to do and I need to make up my mind pretty quickly. I would only use the AC in the garage for like 2, 3 at most months of the year. During winter the garage stays warm enough and I've had no issues growing in there through the coldest months.

 

[wilhoitorwhatever]

I'm gonna try something before I do anything big. I just bought one of these and am going to try to use it inside my tent to see if it will help with the extreme temps

I mentioned before I'd already tried a humidifier with ice water, but that humidifier just barely puts out a mist. At first I thought maybe this was a good thing because I didn't want to deal with too much humidity, but even with using that the humidity still remained very low, like around 40%. I'm gonna try this on the lowest setting and work from there to see if I can maintain a temp around 80 and tolerable humidity. The product info says it can run up to 10 hours on one tank of water at the lowest setting so maybe this will be a work around until I can do something better next year. And of course if anyone sees a major flaw in my thinking please let me know, if I'm pulling a bone headed move I can cancel my order or send it back before I open it once it arrives.

 

[TorturedSoul]

Those things (at least large ones) work really well when the relative humidity is very low and the ambient temperature is really high. Like Tempe, AZ - where it's currently 102°F, with 15% RH. With high humidity, not so much. 40% is borderline, IMHO (but not, apparently, in the opinion of the companies that sell them, so...).

The reason you've had difficulty increasing the (relative) humidity in your garden space is because - I assume - you run an exhaust tent. Which is roughly comparable to having a bedroom with three windows, installing a window ac unit in one - then opening the other two windows and setting a fan in one of them to constantly pull fresh air through the space. Assuming the greater space that the garden "container" is in is reasonably well sealed, and that you're merely recycling the air (pulling air in from that space, exhausting air to the space), it is entirely possible to increase the humidity of the entire volume of air. But it might take weeks (months?) to do if a person sizes the device for just the actual garden volume - which can often be a small fraction of the actual total volume. And if the space is not well sealed, the slow but steady air exchange might further handicap the operation.

Best to not consider the tent separately, for this. If you (for example) increase the relative humidity of your garage to 85%, that's the air that your exhaust fan will be pulling into the tent. "Spot heating" by the grow lighting will increase the temperature somewhat (amount depends on airflow rate), which will slightly lower the measured RH (because it is relative ) in the tent. Put a hygrometer in a clear box, completely seal it... heat it up, and you'll see the RH fall; cool it down, and you'll see the RH rise - cut a hole in each side and install a fan in one of those holes, and you'll see the RH equalize to the room it's in (again, with some variance depending on any temperature imbalance).

I'm just rambling.

 

[wilhoitorwhatever]

Those things (at least large ones) work really well when the relative humidity is very low and the ambient temperature is really high. Like Tempe, AZ - where it's currently 102°F, with 15% RH. With high humidity, not so much. 40% is borderline, IMHO (but not, apparently, in the opinion of the companies that sell them, so...).

The reason you've had difficulty increasing the (relative) humidity in your garden space is because - I assume - you run an exhaust tent. Which is roughly comparable to having a bedroom with three windows, installing a window ac unit in one - then opening the other two windows and setting a fan in one of them to constantly pull fresh air through the space. Assuming the greater space that the garden "container" is in is reasonably well sealed, and that you're merely recycling the air (pulling air in from that space, exhausting air to the space), it is entirely possible to increase the humidity of the entire volume of air. But it might take weeks (months?) to do if a person sizes the device for just the actual garden volume - which can often be a small fraction of the actual total volume. And if the space is not well sealed, the slow but steady air exchange might further handicap the operation.

Best to not consider the tent separately, for this. If you (for example) increase the relative humidity of your garage to 85%, that's the air that your exhaust fan will be pulling into the tent. "Spot heating" by the grow lighting will increase the temperature somewhat (amount depends on airflow rate), which will slightly lower the measured RH (because it is relative ) in the tent. Put a hygrometer in a clear box, completely seal it... heat it up, and you'll see the RH fall; cool it down, and you'll see the RH rise - cut a hole in each side and install a fan in one of those holes, and you'll see the RH equalize to the room it's in (again, with some variance depending on any temperature imbalance).

I'm just rambling.

No not rambling at all, I appreciate your input on it. I'm not totally clear headed right now but I think what you're explaining is something I was thinking about earlier today sort of in theory but wasn't sure how it would work out in practice. I was basically concerned getting a small evaporation cooling device like that might make it way too humid in my tent, but on the other hand was thinking that with an intake fan and exhaust fan maybe it would keep it cleared out so it wouldn't get too high inside the tent. But then taking that a step further I was thinking based on that idea would it even cool the tent at all or am I just turning my tent into a crappy air conditioner for the whole garage that wouldn't make a dent in the garage temp but also wouldn't keep my tent cool because the garage would siphon out any cool or moist air.

I thought myself in circles and then said to hell with it and just bought the device. So what you said makes sense, if I'm understanding what you're saying, and now I'm rambling lol.

 

[wilhoitorwhatever]

I got that little "AC" in and was able to experiment with it a little today. I think this may work for my immediate needs so I'll be starting a journal in the next day or so.

My tent started out at 92f at 11am before I put the little ac fan in there. After an hour it had the temp at 85f and humidity at 65. I checked it 2 hours later and it was about the same, so I went ahead and moved my little seedling to my tent. I've checked a few more times later in the afternoon and the temp and humidity has been stable. One thing that I've noticed is that my exhaust fan is a fixed speed but my intake is variable, and I can tweak the temp and humidity a bit by slowing down or speeding up the intake.

If I can keep those numbers stable for a month the daytime temps will be dropping enough that I don't think this will be an issue. Humidity around mid 60's will work through veg and by the time they flower I can take out the ac device and the humidity will drop down to around 50 while temps would probably remain in the mid 80's.

I'm starting a Trainwreck Auto from CKS and a Lemon Star from Gas Reaper (yea I know...). I was glad to see the Lemon Star popped immediately and has jumped out the dirt pretty fast. I just finished soaking the TWA and put in the paper tower so once that's broken soil I'll start the journal.