Feds Threaten State Dispensaries Nationwide

[Jim Finnel]

Ok, now we're on the same page. I wish I could disagree with you, wouldn't that be nice. It was only the Nazi word that I disagreed about and not your points. I also am of an age that hopefully I won't see these things come to pass. But I fear for my children & grandchildren. I think there is still time for the people to wake up and change things but there remains less time with each passing day. The system is very good at what it does, mis-information, dividing and distracting us and even letting us make advances in our causes when it serves their purposes. To keep this on topic I'll add that one of the main things they fear about Cannabis is its ability to open minds and allow people to think in new ways.

 

[DTFuqua]

We are of the same mind as far as what a lot of the problems are and the despair that the future holds if people don't wake up . The biggest differences are the intensity of our feelings.
Another effect of cannabis is it generaly makes people nice. I have been fueled by pain and anger for the last few days as i was unable to find my medication. That is a big problem for many people that can't take chemical drugs without heavy and sometimes dangerous consequences. But, relief at last. But it gets harder and harder when I can't hardly leave the house being the sole caretaker for my wife. And theres no way I'ld grow anymore here in Fl.

 

[RollinBAC]

I would have to agree that comparing the DEA to Nazis is a little extreme considering 95% of people who smoke weed pretty much get away with it on a daily basis. And to bring a little comfort to this arguement you have to realize that growing cannabis is fairly easy to do and there is noway, not in a million years, that the DEA or any government agency can get rid of it. Cannabis is here to stay, plain and simple.
Now, I probaby am going to get crusified for this, but I agree with the War on Drugs. Having constant vigalance by our law enforcement people keeps many tons of the "really bad drugs" of the streets and out of the hands of our kids. What I disagree with is putting cannabis in that group. I mean if you are going to do that you technically have to do the same for alcohol. Alcohol is far more dangerous then cannabis will ever be, for obvious reasons, yet cannabis has this negative vibe around it that people can't seem to get over.
I don't know what the solution is. All I know is that we have to keep up the fight and continue to educate people and one day we will win.

Hell, if I had it my way. I would ban alcohol outright and legaize cannabis. You would be suprised how much better this world would get along.

 

[Jim Finnel]

.....The biggest differences are the intensity of our feelings....

I doubt it. I try to hold back the intensity of my feelings and many of my personal political and social beliefs due to my position on the staff here. Its not my personal soapbox. In some ways the members have more freedom to speak their minds than I do. I also have a number of medical issues that would better be treated by Cannabis than the poisonous legal rx's I'm forced to resort to. I could easily pass a drug test right now, I wouldn't even give taking one a second thought. I'm sure many people would think that being on staff here I'm just rollin' in the grass. If only that were true.

I've enjoyed discussing all this with you comrade

 

[Jim Finnel]

@ RollinBAC

While I agree with you feelings about alcohol and other substances I don't agree with the war on drugs (war on people). I don't believe its the job of government or anyone else to tell anyone what they can and can't put into their own bodies except for parents and their children. If the truth was freely told about Cannabis and other substances, if drug education were honest and parents were not so ignorant of the truth and could move beyond their fears much of the drug problems could be solved.

"The truth will set you free."

 

[RollinBAC]

I don't believe its the job of government or anyone else to tell anyone what they can and can't put into their own bodies except for parents and their children.

While I do agree that the government shouldn't be able to tell you how to live your life or what you can or cannot put into your body, your statement assumes that all parents are "good" parents. It also doesn't take into fact how powerful peer pressure is.
If there were no such agency as the DEA, or for that matter, lets say, law inforcement agencies, and left everything to the teachings of our parents and peers this country would be in total chaos.
These entities are necessary for the continued growth of this country and our way of life. They are a necessary evil. Now, granted these agencies have a "God" complex and think they can do as they please, and yes, they need oversight just like every government agency does. Wether they get this oversight, or proper oversight is for a different thread.
I guess the point I am trying to make is we need to find a balance between security and safety, and being able to do as we please( as long as it doesn't hurt someone else.)
Honestly, lets face it, if people were "allowed" to do whatever the hell they wanted, this country would not exist as we all know it. It truely would be a scary place.

 

[Jim Finnel]

Your right, not all parents are good parents. Its a complex issue and if I had all of the answers I'd deserve a Phd or even be made ruler of the world (sounds good to me). Maybe we need to fall into chaos before we can rebuild. The consequences of not changing our society might be worse than a period of chaos. These are just personal thoughts and don't represent any sort of 420Mag opinion

 

[DTFuqua]

I would have to agree that comparing the DEA to Nazis is a little extreme considering 95% of people who smoke weed pretty much get away with it on a daily basis. And to bring a little comfort to this arguement you have to realize that growing cannabis is fairly easy to do and there is noway, not in a million years, that the DEA or any government agency can get rid of it. Cannabis is here to stay, plain and simple.
Now, I probaby am going to get crusified for this, but I agree with the War on Drugs. Having constant vigalance by our law enforcement people keeps many tons of the "really bad drugs" of the streets and out of the hands of our kids.

Not as extreme as what the DEA is doing to our freedoms. I compare them to Nazis in the sence that they are prepared to comit any voilent act against people for a plant that, like you said, they can never stamp out. Cannabis is just a numbers game for LEOs to keep their arrest and interdiction numbers up. Its job security. Look at the FBI's own numbers. Cannabis arrests are ever increasing in numbers and the lie that no one goes to jail over cannabis can be disproven easily.
Yes, you should be crusified for that stance. The war on drugs at any level is a war on humanity. It nhas been proven, on the US mainland, that taking an addict and getting them a place to stay and food to eat and letting them have the means to get small jobs to help pay for their drugs and leting them have them without retribution,was less costly and more effective at getting them at least semi clean and become productive while the majority of the people in the test groups turned their lives compleatly around with out making victims of all the family and friends that they, the addicts, have. There should not be a drug war or any war in our streats. The law enforcment comunity are all liars to one degree or another. and would rather be proud warriors and beat their chests with all their power than get re-educated and actualy help people that have made bad decisions get past their mistakes and become better human beings. Drugs aren't bad unto themselves but wars under any pretense except freedom is a very bad thing. And a war, by any other name is still a war.

 

[DTFuqua]

I doubt it. I try to hold back the intensity of my feelings and many of my personal political and social beliefs due to my position on the staff here. Its not my personal soapbox. In some ways the members have more freedom to speak their minds than I do. I also have a number of medical issues that would better be treated by Cannabis than the poisonous legal rx's I'm forced to resort to. I could easily pass a drug test right now, I wouldn't even give taking one a second thought. I'm sure many people would think that being on staff here I'm just rollin' in the grass. If only that were true.

I've enjoyed discussing all this with you comrade

I owe you an appology. I can understand the need to keep a fairly low profile to protect your family and position. I had the impression that you were a very moderate liberal. while that is not a bad thing, but right now, we need very vocal radical liberals to get peoples attention focused on what is happening to our freedoms before we have to look to the ones that are willing to actualy start fighting back with the same fervor and violence that the drug warriors use.

 

[RollinBAC]

It nhas been proven, on the US mainland, that taking an addict and getting them a place to stay and food to eat and letting them have the means to get small jobs to help pay for their drugs and leting them have them without retribution,was less costly and more effective at getting them at least semi clean and become productive while the majority of the people in the test groups turned their lives compleatly around with out making victims of all the family and friends that they, the addicts, have.


I don't agree with your statement and I can't really respond because as is this thread is going off topic..sort of, and we are really not allowed to talk about other drugs.
However, I will say this. The key to legalizing cannabis and defeating the DEA and/or government is education, not just the individual but society as a whole.

 

[DTFuqua]

I don't believe its the job of government or anyone else to tell anyone what they can and can't put into their own bodies except for parents and their children.

While I do agree that the government shouldn't be able to tell you how to live your life or what you can or cannot put into your body, your statement assumes that all parents are "good" parents. It also doesn't take into fact how powerful peer pressure is.
If there were no such agency as the DEA, or for that matter, lets say, law inforcement agencies, and left everything to the teachings of our parents and peers this country would be in total chaos.
These entities are necessary for the continued growth of this country and our way of life. They are a necessary evil. Now, granted these agencies have a "God" complex and think they can do as they please, and yes, they need oversight just like every government agency does. Wether they get this oversight, or proper oversight is for a different thread.
I guess the point I am trying to make is we need to find a balance between security and safety, and being able to do as we please( as long as it doesn't hurt someone else.)
Honestly, lets face it, if people were "allowed" to do whatever the hell they wanted, this country would not exist as we all know it. It truely would be a scary place.

Yes, we need a justice system but not necessairly a "legal" system. There was a time, between prohibitions, when most law enforcment officers were actualy doing the job because of the need to PROTECT and SERVE our comunities. There are always gonna be people that want something without earning it and some of them are willing to be voilent to get it. But the drug war has perverted almost all of our justice institutions and the people working there. Government statistics show that a larger proportion of our law enforcment officers have commited crimes, that were prosecuted and not counting the ones that were commited "in the line of duty" than the general public at large. In other words there is a larger proportion of cops that are murders, thieves and drug dealers than there are amongst regular people.

 

[Jim Finnel]

......I had the impression that you were a very moderate liberal. ....

if i leaned any more left i'd fall over

 

[Gothmog]

I'm so weary of Nazi/SS/Gestapo metaphors. To compare Cannabis users to the Jewish population of Germany in the 30's is a big stretch if not absurd. These comparisons have been done to death. The wrongs and evils of law enforcement, the DEA and the federal government can stand on their own. In my opinion to go 'Nazi' on them is to rob credibility of our arguments in the minds of many.

I don't think it's completely absurd though. The Nazi government identified the Jewish people, along with a few other significant minorities of one kind or another as the disease, if you will, that was festering in German society and would eventually bring it to ruin if something wasn't done. Is it not arguable that the more extreme end of the anti-drug movement identifies drugs and their recreational users in a similar light? The festering boil on modern society that will bring about its doom, if the selfish habitues are not caught and punished, and made to "pay" for their crimes? Any time a politician or bureaucrat starts off on the "evils of drugs" before addressing more fundamental issues of fairness and justice--it's a bit of Nazi-like propoganda at work. For a hundred years now our various federal and local governments have been hammering home message that cannabis is evil, and if you hammer down that message long enough, people start to believe it generally. That was the classic M.O. of the Nazis, too.

I don't want to trivialize all drug abuse, nor fail to acknowledge that drugs can be dangerous and need to be used appropriately. Nor would I trivialize the history of Nazi Germany, either, but I do assert there's a similar political strategy in both sets of circumstances.

 

[DTFuqua]

I don't think it's completely absurd though. The Nazi government identified the Jewish people, along with a few other significant minorities of one kind or another as the disease, if you will, that was festering in German society and would eventually bring it to ruin if something wasn't done. Is it not arguable that the more extreme end of the anti-drug movement identifies drugs and their recreational users in a similar light? The festering boil on modern society that will bring about its doom, if the selfish habitues are not caught and punished, and made to "pay" for their crimes? Any time a politician or bureaucrat starts off on the "evils of drugs" before addressing more fundamental issues of fairness and justice--it's a bit of Nazi-like propoganda at work. For a hundred years now our various federal and local governments have been hammering home message that cannabis is evil, and if you hammer down that message long enough, people start to believe it generally. That was the classic M.O. of the Nazis, too.

I don't want to trivialize all drug abuse, nor fail to acknowledge that drugs can be dangerous and need to be used appropriately. Nor would I trivialize the history of Nazi Germany, either, but I do assert there's a similar political strategy in both sets of circumstances.

Thank you for someone that is looking hard enough to see the truth and is articulate enough to put it into more understandable language.

 

[Captain Kronic]

Shite ain't that hard ro figure out here... the Gov is not going to allow States to overturn federal law just because they want to... the feds are the bullies here and they are pissed that the lil wimpy kids are starting to join forces and fight back... I guarantee you this is just the start... IMO
The other reason I see, and this may be the bigger of the 2... the Gov. isn't making any money on this whole MMJ deal... you know damn good and well they aren't going to willfully allow anything like this that doesn't put cash in the coffers... come on... wake up!

Of course this is just what I think and has no bearing on reality!

 

[Julie Gardener]

I have so enjoyed reading everyones opinions. Very well done! I am also having a hard time with Big Pharma being giving the right to use cannabis to make pills for medical use while the DEA is raiding legal dispensaries and choking out the people who have a right to use it. It is very contradictory and absurd. I just pray this issue can stay in a positive direction for those seeking the right to bear cannabis. It just boggles my mind how cannabis, a non-addictive medicinal healer, is still not accepted while tobacco, full of carcinogens, is still ok. Why can't they go fight to get that off the streets, big money I guess!?!? In fact, considering cannabis to other federally outlawed drugs, as well as legal drugs such as alcohol and tobacco, it is very clear imo that cannabis is the least harmful and most healing of them all. It doesn't rocket science to see that. What to do!?!? In Cannabis we trust..