Smart pot watering needs - Hot environment

[stilgar11]

I have three outdoor plants, located on a deck built above my garage. I've covered the railing on the two sides with ground cloth mostly intended as a windbreak, but also to be discreet. I keep them low enough to where my two neighbors can't see any part of the plants. Albeit, in a month or so when their odor becomes more prominent, it won't be hard to figure out what I've been doing.

This is my first outdoor grow and I'm using smart pots made of cloth material. It was confusing because everything I read kept telling me not to water more than once every other day, if even that. And yet the soil always felt dry in the smart pots, and I've been watering them daily, and have now begun doing it twice daily.

So I wanted to advise caution to anyone who is planning on using the smart pots outdoors. Don't get me wrong, they're not a bad thing. You should just research the pros and cons first about outdoor use and make an educated decision.

I give my plants a gallon of water at each watering. But until recently I was giving them much less . Now I've noticed as I probed with my finger to check if the soil is dry, I find there's a lot of spiderweb type roots from the plant all throughout the top of the soil. I assume that only the surface soil was getting substantially wet and the roots came up to find the water.

I'm worried about the plants. I live in the Central Valley part of California, and it can get super hot during the summer. Today was 106°F. So I'm not sure if the plants are droopy because they're not getting enough water, or because it's so damn hot on the patio, especially due to the additional reflective heat. I've read covering the smart pots with burlap will help prevent the soil from getting too warm. So I'm going to try that. Moving the plants is something I really don't want to do. I'm wondering if anybody else has any experience of growing in similar conditions were the temperature can really spike, sometimes more then 5 days, before it drops back down to healthier temperatures. Are my plants in any serious jeopardy.

Also, I cut off a fairly substantial amount of yellow and yellowing leaves from each plant, All primary fan leaves mostly near the bottom of the plant, bit also up as high as the midpoint of the branches leading to the developing colas. It's too early for the yellowing leaves so I'm thinking nitrogen deficiency. I've just started adding a little grow big liquid plant food in hopes the added nitrogen will stop the leaves from yellowing. Any other thoughts or suggestions?

Hopefully I'll figure out how to add a photo to this post so you can see my plants. Despite being a little droopy now and then, the plants look fairly healthy.... But I'm a little ignorant and a more experience outdoor grower might see something that I should take action with.

Any advice or comments very much appreciated.

 

[stilgar11]

 

[improvise]

nice looking plants.

i have no experience outside growing. think i would give them a drink regardless.

not sure if this would help rig up a couple of garden parasol's 1 for each plant and shade them on those hot days, and if its not windy a big fan blowing them about cant harm.

regards

 

[JuanCarlos]

I have no experience but I personally would drench the plants. I would get some saucers large enough for them to sit in and I would water from the top and the bottom, absolutely drench them. Then I would let them dry out. Rinse and repeat. They are getting much more light and much more heat than plants that are grown indoors, so I believe it's only logical that they would require more water.

 

[stilgar11]

Didn't think of an umbrella. Sometimes it's the most obvious answer you look right past. Another frequent message you hear in this forum is that you can never give your plants too much sun. Maybe that's why the idea of shape didn't occur to me. I actually did put a fan out there with the plants today. Just seem to be blowing the hot air across the plants but I left it on anyways. My wife came home from the beach today with a new beach umbrella.... Just might be able to put it to good use tomorrow.

 

[madsdad4ever]

Hey how's it going bro. Alright I grow both indoor and outdoor. I have a few in five gallon with my own organic soil mix. Half organic store bought garden soil. (No added nutes) one part perlite one part coco coir and half part mg water crystals. I really like these crystals. I bought them from Home Depot. They really hold some water. Anyway. I have a four foot tall Indy growing in a five gallon bucket . I have to water it two gallons a day. I water it with one gallon at 7am then by 3 or 4 pm it drooping I then water it with another gallon of water. An hour later it's standing up at attention again. I have a grow cabinet grow goin that I have the Same soil mix in and I am using smart bags in it. Now the temps stay between 80 and 90 degrees witch is a little warm sometimes. I have a 1/3 horse power squirrel cage fan blowing directly on the smart bags. I have to water those a half gallon of water everyday. Now these r In a scrog and have nowhere near the amount of bulk the outside plants have. I guess what I saying is if they look thirsty water them. A little thirsty won't hurt anything it actually helps. It's called water stressing it makes ur roots grow more and faster. But be warned it a thin line between water stressing and drying out ur roots and killing ur plant. Outside growing in earth is different from outside growing in buckets/bags and outside growing is. A completely different beast from inside growing. Heck if u have the time to water it smaller amounts more times a day that would help control the heat a bit too

 

[stilgar11]

Thanks Juan Carlos, Improvise and Madsdad4ever, I appreciate the feedback on everything.

Improvise, you left out one thing about the parasol idea.....gotta make sure it's well anchored! I put up a beach umbrella and a fan this morning (it was supposed to be 102 degrees today) and they worked nicely. I checked them around 3pm and they looked fine, no droopy leaves....well, not many anyways. I went and hung out downstairs for about an hour....but when I noticed the wind starting to pick up outside as it always does in the afternoons here, I went up to take down the umbrella, but the wind had already done that for me......right on top of one of my plants, breaking two fairly good sized branches. I just came back from tying them back into place with twine and tape. I should know by tomorrow if I'm going to loose either branch....if the leaves stay green until then it should turn out OK. These plants are pretty sturdy and take a beating....guess they don't call it weed for nothing.

Thanks, madsdad4ever, for reinforcing for me that I'm not over watering. These smart pots do require that you water more frequently. My only worry now is the yellowing of the primary fan leaves that seems to be continuing. On each of the past two waterings I included a dose of nitrogen rich plant food. Not planning on using any more until I know it's of benefit. I'ver only used bat guano for fertilizer. The nutes I added yesterday and today are the first these plants have seen.

Thanks again!

 

[madsdad4ever]

i was thinking this time of year yellow leaves r kinda expected in outside plants we r over the hump of summer and staring the downhill ride to winter and leaves do turn yellow and fall off as they r used up by ur plant

 

[stilgar11]

I'm sure you are probably right. I keep posting questions because my growing experience never seems to jive with the stuff I read on-line. In this case, I keep reading that the yellowing of some lower primary fan leaves is expected, but at this early stage of flowering / cola development the yellowing fan leaves shouldn't be climbing up the branches toward the colas. (The photo I posted was after I'd clipped off the yellowing leaves.) But like you said, outdoor growing is a very different experience than indoor growing. Perhaps an increased rate of yellowing is normal for outdoor growing? Despite the yellowing primary leaves, my plants appear to look healthy in all other respects.

I've grown them thus far with very few nutes. I use Foxfarm Ocean Forest potting soil with additional perlite mixed in. During their veg period I occasionally added some nitrogen rich plant food, but rarely, maybe just 3 or 4 times total, and even then just half the recommended dose. The only thing I've been regularly adding to the water is Foxfarm's Big Bloom, a bat guano based fertilizer. I add some once a week or so. If I am experiencing an N2 deficiency, I'm hoping a dose or two of the nitrogen rich plant food will show noticeable results....I'm in wait and see mode now.

FYI - I've used that axiom many many times but I've never heard it repeated back to me. "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." is the way I've always said it.

 

[Desertrat60]

Interesting ! Finally someone growing in extreme heat as well , I'm east of you. We have a lot of wind (violent breezes) here and NO humidity , we're at 7% at 11pm. My plants leaves yellowed early , and like mentioned it 's normal . I tried 30% shade cloth from Amazon , it is tough but not tough enough for our winds . One thing that IS working great is a water misting system . I'm growing inside a 10x10x6 dog kennel and I "zip-tied" the 50' system to it . It comes with 5 , 0.8gl ph heads . , "all in" it was 20.00+tax . I turn them on about 12-1pm. until sunset . Turn it off before sunset and you'll fry your babies . I got mine at a KAL Ranch store company is www.dig.com . Keeping them misted like that will cut down on watering , the plants are fighting for every drop in these temps . Hope this helps , good luck . I'm almost ready for winter over "The Hill" here .

 

[stilgar11]

I like the idea of the dog kennel. It's able to be locked and I could keep it in my backyard and position it to receive the most sun. Only problem is on the side of the house with the southern exposure (where I grew these plants for 8 weeks before moving them to the deck) it's a narrow part of our lawn with only 5 yards between the fence and the house. The fence runs along the side of a busy residential sidewalk. The plants would become very noticeable once they started smelling strong, and easily seen if you take the time to find a crack in the fence to look through. On the upstairs deck, the prevailing winds will take their odor over the house and hopefully it will dissipate before it becomes too noticeable to any neighbors across the street. And even if it's still noticeable, those who smell it won't be able to determine where it's coming from.

Unfortunately they get less direct sun on the deck. They are in direct sunlight for about 9 hours, with about 4 hours or so in daytime shade due to the neighbors trees and such. They would get about 12 hours of direct sun if I felt comfortable leaving them on the south facing side of the house.

It's all about security vs. better growing environment. I asked myself, if 100 criminally inclined people walk by and notice that I had plants growing along the side of the house, how many would be willing to take the chance of hopping over the fence (or go through a nearby gate) at harvest time to steal the plants? It would be an easy grab and run taking all of 30 seconds if they came prepared. I think the probability that they would be stolen before I was ready to harvest would be pretty high. But with the plants up on my deck and unable to be seen (except by my two neighbors) how many of that 100 would be brazen enough enter our back yard to explore where the odor was coming from, and then be willing to climb up onto the deck to steal them when there is a sliding glass door leading out to the deck from an occupied upstairs bedroom?

I followed the advice of "improvise" and put up a beach umbrella on the really hot days. It made a big difference and the plants looked much better than they had the day before. I've increased my watering to a gallon for each plant, twice a day. Right now they look great. This is only my second grow. My first was indoor (garage) under lights. It didn't go too well because I tried to grow the plants in the dead of winter and the garage has no temp control. It was a very expensive attempt (utility bill wise / cost of lights, etc.) and I only got about 5oz from the three plants. The quality was pretty crappy and the buds were really loose. The final product hardly even looked like pot....but it worked. In the end, I got enough out of it to justify the expense.

But I'm excited about his grow because the plants look so healthy and I'm sure the quality and yield will be much better. A misting system would be a nice add on. I'll have to check it out. Same with a lockable kennel (for next years grow). Albeit, I think even in a locked kennel the probably of theft would still be high if I left them on the side of the house. I'm learning more with each growth attempt.

 

[Desertrat60]

Stilgar , Those dog Kennels are $299.00 at Lowes . They have a good bracing system with a bar 1/2 way up . The come in 5' panels and are bolted together with clamps with the chain link already installed . The cheaper ones $269.00 are POS . You have to stretch the chain link and the frame is like paper and rips in high winds . So the ones with panels , horizontal braces and fencing preinstalled is the way to go . BEST PART ,,,, They can be reconfigured , ie: 5' deep by (I think) 30' long (albeit) opened at the back and one end . I put up 2x4 welded wire fencing along the back and corner in case someone tried to come through our fence (lot's of tweakers around our area) . So if you have a corner and can still get the sun you're golden .

 

[Desertrat60]

Stilgar , I'll post more about my kennel setup tonight . Daylight's burning so I gotta go . But I have a few ideas for security you may be able to expand upon .
Later

 

[stilgar11]

Feel free to offer whatever info and experience you have that think would be helpful. Learning from someone else's experience is always better than gaining experience via my own mistakes. Such input is always appreciated.

The plants will stay where they are for this grow. They are too big and far along for my wife to put up with moving them through the house and back into the yard. She begrudgingly accepts that I got my medical recommendation and my resulting grow efforts, but she's not a happy camper with it. So I'm trying to be as low key with her as I can as far as the time, effort and expense I put into it. Plus, I'm interested in seeing how significant the outside odor issues become with this placement. If the odor issues are minimal (as I'm hoping), and the product I yield is satisfactory in quality and quantity....growing them close to a public sidewalk in order to gain a couple of hours of direct sunlight may not be the highest priority for me.

FYI - these plants I'd said looked so healthy yesterday morning....later that afternoon I found a cluster of white spots on some of the lower inner leaves under the canopy of my indica dominant plant. With a quick internet search, I discovered I have a powdery mildew problem. I cut out as many leaves and affected branches as I could see and gave them a dose of neem oil spray. (Next time I'll do a better job of keeping to a consistent schedule of preventative spraying....I'd only used neem oil twice before last night.) Most of what I've read on-line seems to indicate that a 100% cure is unlikely, and that I'll have to keep a close eye on the plants and battle to keep the powdery mildew under control and away from the buds until harvest. I need to give the plants further separation as well. Hopefully I won't be in for a rough ride with the mildew issue causing significant product loss. Time will tell...so far the impact is negligible, but I still have two months to go till harvest....I may be singing a different tune later.

 

[Desertrat60]

Hope you can ride out the "invasion" till harvest . Mine are not so good , period . This is my first grow as well . Probably lost at least a month with late cloning . So this round will be weak . I'm doing up a "from seed" and a small indoor trial for winter. Cloning has not worked well so far .
As for the kennel I hear you . I'll wait to reset mine to the 5x30 until I yank my plants out . The kennel is nice , keeps most critters out . The birds pay no attention . My plans are to do the 5x30 , with an open back and 1 wall , then backed in a corner of the fence that as I mentioned lined with wire fencing . Luckily we're on an acre so I can get away with metal T-posts at the ends and corner tied down through the frame and to the T-posts with 6" hose clamps , after that it should survive the winds (nothing to see 70mph. gust out here) . Next a 50' roll of 6' chain link over the top for those wannabe monkeys climbing over the top .Tie that down with hose clamps too (making sure the screw heads are pointed in and down at an angle) . It won't be "bullet proof" but it may run off some that don't want to work for their thievery . Put a couple of those cast iron bells you see on porches to the yard side of the kennel and hope you don't hear them . They are NOISEY !!! looks like you going to have a very good harvest !