The Side By Side Soil Comparison!

[PlugJug]

AFTER HEARING A LOT OF DIFFERENT CHOICES PEOPLE HAVE ABOUT ALL THE DIFFERENT TYPES OF SOIL AVAILABLE TO GROWERS TODAY. I DECIDED TO DO A SIDE BY SIDE COMPARISON GROW..

SO TONIGHT I TOOK SIX IDENTICAL CLONES. THE SAME AGE THE SAME SIZE AND THE SAME STRAIN OFF THE SAME MOTHER. (train wreck)
ROOTED IN ROCK WOOL PLUGS AND PLANTED THEM IN THE SAME SIZE 1 GALLON POTS..

BUT THE BIG DIFFERENCE IS THAT THEY ARE ALL IN DIFFERENT SOIL..

PLANT #1 FOX FARM OCEAN FOREST ORGANIC SOIL MIX..

PLANT #2 MIRACLE-GRO POTTING MIX..

PLANT #3 MIRACLE-GRO ORGANIC POTTING SOIL..

PLANT #4 PRO MIX #4..

PLANT #5 CHEAP POTTING SOIL FROM TRUE VALUE HARDWARE..

PLANT #6 DIRT RIGHT OUT OF MY BACK YARD.. (NOTHING ADDED)

ALL SIX PLANTS WILL BE GROWING IN A 8' X 8' ROOM UNDER A 1000W MH WITH A NEW EYE BLUE HORTILUX LAMP..

THE ROOM WILL BE KEEP AT 78f AND 55%rh AND I WILL NOT BE USEING CO2 IN THIS TEST ROOM BUT CO2 IS IN USE IN THE REST OF THE ROOMS IN THE SAME GREEN HOUSE..

ALL SIX TEST PLANTS WILL BE GIVEN THE SAME EXACT AMOUNT OF WATER ON THE EXACT SAME DAYS. WITCH WILL BE A CHALANG DO TO THE SOILS DRYING OUT AT DIFFERENT TIMES. (not shure at this time how i will do this)
I MAY WATER EACH PLANT ONLY WHEN THE MOISTURE LEVEL REACHES THE SAME POINT ON THE METER..

THE TEST PLANTS WILL ONLY BE GIVEN NUTRIENTS EVERY TEN DAYS.
AND THE NUTRIENTS WILL BE MIXED IN A FIVE GALLON BUCKET AND ALL TEST PLANTS WILL BE GIVEN THE EXACT SAME AMOUNTS OF THE EXACT SAME MIX ON THE EXACT SAME DAYS..

A LOG WILL BE KEEPT EVERY DAY AT THE SAME TIME AND I WILL RECORD THE PH LEVEL THE MOISTURE LEVEL AND THE TEMP. OF THE SOIL.
I WILL ALSO RECORD THE SIZE OF EACH PLANT WEEKLEY..

WHEN THE FIRST PLANT NEEDS TO BE TRANSPLANTED I WILL TRANSPLANT ALL SIX INTO FIVE GALLON POTS AT THE SAME TIME..

ALL SIX TEST PLANTS WILL BE IN VEG FOR FORE WEEKS AND THEN PUT INTO BUD READY OR NOT ON THE FIFTH WEEK..

ALL SIX TEST PLANTS WILL BUD FOR EIGHT WEEKS AND BE HARVESTED ON THE NINETH WEEK AND DRYED IN THE SAME DRYING ROOM AT THE SAME TEMP. FOR 12 DAYS..

ON DAY 13 ALL PLANTS WILL HAVE THER HOLE WEIGHT RECORDED AND THEN ALL THE BUDS WEIGHT WILL BE RECORDED..

ALL INFO FROM THE LOG. ALONG WITH PHOTOS OF EACH PLANT. AND PHOTOS OF ALL PLANTS SIDE BY SIDE WILL BE POSTED IN THIS THREAD EVERY FRIDAY NIGHT 10:00pm..

SO I HOPE THAT YOU WILL FIND SUM ENTERTAINMENT IN THIS LONG DRAWN OUT PERSONAL QUEST INTO DIRT...


FIRST PICS.WILL BE POSTED ON TUESDAY 06/06/06...

 

[JohnnyBlazed]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

Good idea PJ. Im interested to see how different they turn out!!! Keep us updated.

 

[GreenThumbsUp]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

The only thing you are missing here is replication, for a true statistical test. (For a true statistical test you need an average and a variance, for both of those, you need at least 2 of each # you listed). That is because the math behind these tests depends on "error", in many cases that's the distance each replicate is from it's group mean...argh...don't want to glaze your eyes over....

Anyway, if you can possibly do it, double your plants so you have a replicate of each soil type, and I can help you do some means tests. It will help you control, for example, interactions between the plant and the soil type as measured through Ph. (Yes, Ph can be a dependent variable of soil AND an exogenous variable to say, bud density or skunk factor, or anything you want to measure).

The key is replication. Otherwise man, you've done a fab job of controlling for exogenous variables! You could even publish this in a peer reviewed journal if you replicate at least twice. Of course, more reps are always better, but even science has to follow a budget.

LOL I got my master's in statistics and love it. A bowl and hypergeometry (used in statistics) is as cool as getting stoned and doing yoga

 

[PlugJug]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

Wow.. Say That One More Time Real S-l-o-w.... LOL..

OK.... I THINK I GOT IT....

IM GOING TO PUT THIS ON HOLD FOR ONE WEEK.. 06 /13 /06
I WILL KILL OFF THE SIX TEST PLANTS. AND START OVER..

I WILL DO THE SAME THING BUT THIS TIME I WILL HAVE 18 TEST PLANTS..

PLANT #1 A, B, C.
PLANT #2 A, B, C.
PLANT #3 A, B, C.
PLANT #4 A, B, C.
PLANT #5 A, B, C.
PLANT #6 A, B, C.

I WILL HAVE THE STARTS READY TO PLANT ON 06/13/06

24 CLOANS I GOT TODAY AT THE CLUB THAT I HAVE NEVER TRYED.. THEY ARE CALLED DURBAN POISON...

I WAS TOLD DURBAN POISON IS A GOOD MED. STRAIN..
SO I WILL HAVE 18 OF THEM READY TO GO IN A WEEK..

THANKS FOR THE HELP GREEN THUMBS UP AND IF YOU CAN THINK OF ANY THING MORE LET ME KNOW..

THIS HAS GOT TO BE DONE RIGHT AND IT NEEDS TO BE DONE RIGHT THE FIRST TIME (must be done by sepetember 4th)

SEE YA...........

 

[GreenThumbsUp]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

whoah dude, right on. 3 replicates is very nice!

Looks like you got everything well in hand.

Looks like you have a damn good knack for experiments already, so just follow that intuition and you'll be fine.

keep measurements and as your plants grow and you measure their progress, publish the numbers and we'll see if we can't get some statistical differences.

 

[Serpico]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

interesting, cant wait to see how this comes out.

 

[PlugJug]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

OK..ONE MORE TIME....

THIS IS A UPDATE TO THE LIST OF SOILS I WILL BE USEING FOR THE SIDE BY SIDE SOIL COMPARISON TEST GROW...

PLANT'S #1 a,b,c, MIRACLE-GRO (POTTING MIX)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 1.0 cu. ft bag $6.99

PLANT'S #2 a,b,c, MIRACLE-GRO (ORGANIC CHOICE)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 1.0 cu. ft bag $8.99

PLANT'S #3 a,b,c, FOX FARM (OCEAN FOREST)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 1.5 cu. ft bag $20.95

PLANT'S #4 a,b,c, MASTER NURSERY (GARDENERS CHOICE)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 1.0 cu. ft bag $12.99

PLANT'S #5 a,b,c,MASTER NURSERY (GARDENERS GOLD)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 1.0 cu. ft bag $17.99

PLANT'S #6 a,b,c, GREEN ALL. (truevalue hardware) (ORGINAC POTTING SOIL)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 2.0 cu. ft bag $9.89

PLANT'S #7 a,b,c, SUNGRO (SUNSHINE #4)..
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 3.8 cu. ft bag $49.99

PLANT'S #8 a,b,c, DIRT OUT OF MY BACK YARD.. NOTHING ADDED (DIRT)
SUGG. RETAIL PRICE. 1.0 cu. ft bag $0.00
NO PHOTO..

 

[Brett2theMax]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

There are a few things. Even though you are going to do everything at the same time, wont this affect the coutcome even more? Due to some plants being ready to be transplanted, or some plants needing more water than others. Actually each plant will be different from the beginning if you are using seeds. Can I suggest cloning off a plant and doing it? I feel like this would produce much better results since with clones they all have the EXACT same genetic structure and you won't end up with a runt or with a super strong plant. With clones there will be more of a controll. Thats all I really cought that could make it a more accurate reading, because essentialy you are using all of the same plant.

 

[PlugJug]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

There are a few things. Even though you are going to do everything at the same time, wont this affect the coutcome even more? Due to some plants being ready to be transplanted, or some plants needing more water than others. Actually each plant will be different from the beginning if you are using seeds. Can I suggest cloning off a plant and doing it? I feel like this would produce much better results since with clones they all have the EXACT same genetic structure and you won't end up with a runt or with a super strong plant. With clones there will be more of a controll. Thats all I really cought that could make it a more accurate reading, because essentialy you are using all of the same plant.

HAY BRO..

I WILL BE DOING THIS THE WAY I DESCRIBED IN THE FIRST POST..

I NEVER USE SEEDS EXCEPT FOR IN MY BREEDING PROGRAM..

I WAS USEING CLONES THAT WER READY. BUT NOW I NEED 24 (8 typs of soil x 3 of each)

SO I GOT 25 NEW STARTS (CLONES) THEY ARE CALLED (DURBAN POISON).
BUT THEY ARE IN THE QUARANTINE. AND CAN NOT GO DOWN INTO THE GREENHOUSE FOR A WEEK.. SO THAT IS OK IT GIVES ME TIME TO GET THIS READY TO GO...

AND LIKE IT SAYS IN MY POST ABOUT THE WATERING. THEY WILL GET WATERD AT THE SAME POINT ON THE MOISTURE METER..

GO TO THE FIRST POST AT THE TOP OF THIS THREAD AND I THINK YOU WILL UNDERSTAND WHAT IM TRYING TO SAY...

SO AS SOON AS I GET THE DURBAN POISON'S OUT OF QUARANTINE ON
06/13/06 I WILL GET THIS PARTY STARTED.. AND GET PICS.

SEE YA..

 

[Brett2theMax]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

Sorry, I must have missed the clone part. OHH same moisture point on the meter, I thought you mean same time as in day. LOL, I guess I was only half ass reading, sorry.

 

[GreenThumbsUp]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

There are a few things. Even though you are going to do everything at the same time, wont this affect the coutcome even more? Due to some plants being ready to be transplanted, or some plants needing more water than others. Actually each plant will be different from the beginning if you are using seeds. Can I suggest cloning off a plant and doing it? I feel like this would produce much better results since with clones they all have the EXACT same genetic structure and you won't end up with a runt or with a super strong plant. With clones there will be more of a controll. Thats all I really cought that could make it a more accurate reading, because essentialy you are using all of the same plant.

Brett, you are exactly right in much of this. HOwever, there is no way to ensure absolute control of all factors, that is why statistics uses replication and error. Because of the nature of replication and use of error, these variations are accounted for in statistical tests. Thest tests dont only look at the middle of things (the average) but use the spread around the averages as well.

However, to the degree possible these things should be done in a way to control the variability between clones, etc. The way you do that is randomly assign clones to treatments, you have then randomly spread the differences across your soil treatments, and are less likely to get bias in any given treatment group because of an individual clone's inherent characteristics.

Doh, I could go further on this (heh gimme another bowl and I'll get REALLY bad!)...but basically, he's doing ok with his methodology and if there are significant differences, his method is strong enough to detect them statistically.

 

[kaotiksplashman]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

so it's the 4th of July now, has the project been started?

 

[PlugJug]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

I HAD TO START ALL OVER ON THIS..

THE CLONES I WAS GETING READY FOR THIS TEST WER NOT GROWING UNIFORMLY.. THEY ARE A NEW STRAIN THAT I HAVE NEVER TRYED TO GROW,AND I DON'T KNOW THER GROWING HABITTS..

SO IM DOING THIS WITH WHITE WIDOWS. A PLANT I'V GROWN FOR YEARS AND KNOW HOW THIS PLANT GROWS.
THIS WAY ALL PLANTS WILL BE THE SAME SIZE ON THE DAY I START THIS GROW.. I HAVE 25 THAT ARE STARTING RIGHT NOW. AND ARE ALMOST READY TO GO. ABOUT 6-8 DAYS.

IM HARVESTING A ROOM TODAY SO I WILL BE WITHIN MY LEAGL AMOUNT OF PLANTS.

THIS IS A LOOK AT THE CLONES I WILL BE USEING FOR THIS SIDE BY SIDE TEST...

 

[GreenThumbsUp]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

Cool, looking good PJ. Keep us updated.

 

[RooRman]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

I'm thinking the Fox Farm is going to be the best.

 

[RangerDanger]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

It's going to be hard to reach valid conclusions because if you use the same amt. of nutrients for plants in each of those soils, you'll be overdosing on some (like the chem-amended miracle grow) or underfeeding the unamended soils.
And if you use chem nutrients on the Fox Farms soil, you'll kill the mychorrizae.

I've never done a side-by-side test, but in my 40 years of mj growing I've used, at different times, all the different soils mentioned except the last 2.
Fox Farms, hands down.
I now use Power Flower, an Ocean Forest knock-off that has the same ingredients in the same ratio but is cheaper.

 

[PlugJug]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

I Don't Care If They All Die.. This Is A Study For Personal Benefits That I Thought Peopel Would Enjoy Look In On..

If I Do See A Plant Starting To Show Signs Of Nute. Burn, I Will Back Off On The Nutrients... All Nutrients Will Be Organic

One Of The Benefits To Growing For Many Years Is Being Able To Watch,look And Listen To Your Plants. Plants Will Tell You What They Need Or Don't Need., Food,light,heat,water,co2,ect.

Get Ready This Party Is Just About To Start......

A New Thread I Will Be Starting In The Next Day Or Two Will Be The. Side By Side Nutrient Grow.. Done With Two Aerojet Systems.

I Will Be Puting Fox Farm Up Against Botanicare,pure Blend Pro-grow And Botanicare,pure Blend Pro-bloom..

I Will Be Postintg Pics. Of The Cleaning , Disinfecting And Seting Up Of The Aerojet System That I Harvested Last Night..

And I Will Be Geting It Ready For The Test To Start This Weekend.

The Clones Are The Ones In Rockwool That I Posted The Photo Of.
They All Have Roots And Are Ready To Go..

 

[kaotiksplash]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

Very cool. I'm glad that you're doing this test. I have a 1 plant growing, as a test run, under a 400w MH, in Maricle Grow soil. I guess this will show me how much of a difference soil makes. Well done PJ! I think I have a new mentor!

 

[Brett2theMax]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

Any updates PJ?

 

[cement head]

Re: The Side By Side Soil Comparison !!!

hey plug jug this is great iam doing a little test of my own i wold really be interested in seeing the differance between the two miracle grow products i have a couple in the mg potting mix hoping to flush but i will be paying close attention to the organic product keep up the great work and thanks