Hydrosalts and Organic Soil - Bad Practice or Perpetuated Rumor?

[Graytail]

Ah, I see, yes.

It's the same effect as adding sugars to the soil - the biota use that and neglect the root exudates.



I know that most soils are unsuitable for high brix methods because of the typical excess of potassium.

 

[blunt master]

i really did not feel like reading all that.. i heard that organic ph up and down is good but very weak. when i say good i mean it wont harm your mycrrohizae.. not sure but i think it has citric acid and something else for a ph down and at only 15% active ingredients, i also heard that normal ph up and down will kill the micro organisms in your soil, and mycrrohizea is not cheap so we dont want to kill them, i am trying to find out if lemon juice will kill the mycrrohizae in the soil, if not than i believe that lemon juice will be one of the best ph down solutions i can get, maybe you can ask one of the biochemists for me??

 

[canabinerd]

I think you missed the point. All that crap about killing soil biota with pH adjustment is mostly wivestales. But, it is not absolutely necessary if you have a water source with a reliable pH within the range mentioned.

 

[blunt master]

my water source is ph 8.0, and i want to drop it to 6.0,?? so what your telling me is that its a lie that the soil microbes will die off if i use ph down???... i dont want to be an ass or anything but i really do think that it will harm them, im pretty sure im living proof...

 

[canabinerd]

Really, well tell me about it.

 

[canabinerd]

And yes, that's pretty much what I'm telling you.

 

[blunt master]

i started organically growing using aurora roots organics 5ml pro pack, and the roots organics soil, growing good, added my mycorrhizae and was buffering my ph, supposedly my roots and the plants are to take very well to mycorrizae, but it didnt and it slowed rapidly, and one of my babies died after about a month of stress, i dont believe it was the mycorrhizae because my neighbor uses the exact same set up without the ph down, and he is growing huge plants

 

[canabinerd]

So what makes you believe it was your pH buffering solution?

 

[blunt master]

because when me and my neighbor are using the same set up just diferent strains, he is using ro water i use tap with bufering solution

 

[canabinerd]

I use a purple polkadotted water can, better get one or your plants will die.

Seriously I can tell you that pH adjusting your water probably had nothing to do with it unless you're over adjusting a whole lot. But, if you want to use lemon juice, that's fine too. What kind of soil are you using cause 6.0 is on the low side for most organic soils.

 

[blunt master]

aurora roots organics, what does a watering can have to do with anything?

 

[blunt master]

aurora roots organics, what does a watering can have to do with anything?

 

[canabinerd]

I was being a smart ass. So I would shoot for 6.5, but you don't have to be on the button.

I suspect that you were doing a lot of other things differently than your friend and one of those things is what got you before.

 

[blunt master]

lol well im not gonna argue, and thanks for the help

 

[canabinerd]

No skin off my nose, just trying to give advice based on fact rather than supposition and rumor.

 

[Bud Grant]

If you feel compelled to add a ph up or down product, maybe add the dosage to some water first, then put the diluted mixture into your formula ?
Personally, if I am adding something acidic like guanos or molasses to my teas, I throw a handful of greensand in. Greensand isn't alkaline or acidic, it is neutralizing.

 

[Marzbadrock]

Although it makes no sense ive been preaching about pH and foxfarm dirt. Dont do it. I'm no expert but you can't argue with results. Try taking one plant in NEW dirt and grow it without pH'ing your water. You may see a deficiency still but its not from lockout, its because your plants can finally eat and they want more. Usually you dont see major issues until flower then its everything, nitro, phosphorus, mag deficiency. It seems crazy but it will work

 

[trichomes]

Re: "Hydrosalts" and Organic Soil, Bad Practice or Perpetuated Rumor?

Allright, I think I finally have an answer I am happy with after speaking to GH, and I think some of the people who have been aggravating me will be happy with it too. So here's what they said....

Hello,



This is a bone of contention that is somewhat of a moot point. I say this because if you are growing in organic soil that has healthy colonies of beneficial bacteria, the pH of your nutrient solution is not relevant unless it is either very acidic or very alkaline. pH is regulated in the root zone by the bacteria and the plants own root exudates. If your nutrient solution has a pH between 5 and 7 then it is fine. Unlike Hydroponic cultivation which the nutrients are only available within a certain pH range, soil grown plants are able to take up the nutrients as needed and in a wider pH range.

But, to answer your question directly, no,

pH up and down when used in proper amounts will not damage the micro biology.

REPS to you! cana for your tenacity within this thread, AWESOME share,

I was shaking my head & about to dump my current "org tea", until, I read further and saw this! phew!

i'll keep reading the rest now.

 

[ataxian]

Re: "Hydrosalts" and Organic Soil, Bad Practice or Perpetuated Rumor?

I never check my pH or TDS however I know the valves and importants very well.
GH ingredients and RO water I use.

My harvest is not the best however my next grow with BENEFICIAL TEA will be even better.
I like your logic and respect your option.

I'm careful not to listen to all the narcissistic content on the WEB.
As long as your jars are full!

Rookie grower always learning!

 

[Srilania]

I see a lot of wild claims, and some insane theories. Fox Farms says "I'm no scientist, but the Ph will cause the bacteria to die if you change it too rapidly" Other tel you the solutions leave salts that cause problems. So, what's the truth?

Well, you're adding in materials that literally break down to create more nutrients. So, right there, I think I've debunked the "it creates microsalts (never heard of that one before today) that can cause problems. Now, for the bacterial? Well, imagine carrying 300 pounds on your shoulders, and made to keep on your feet or die. Suddenly, someone just lifts that weight off your shoulders. Or like for any extreme environment, anything that doesn't kill you often can be recovered from.

Usually, bacteria can grow well. Granted, if you adjust it too radically, you could have problems. But, even if half the bacteria are killed off, it's bacteria. 1 bacterium can multiply to trillions within hours. And to be honest, adjusting the PH to the usual grow ranges, all you're going to see is the bacteria you want finding a friendlier environment, and recovering quickly. It's like lifting all that weight off someone's shoulders. They'll catch their breath, wipe their head, and go on, recover, and be ready to kick some.

The moment someone makes grandiose or off the wall scientific sounding babble, stop and ask questions. do some research. ask for their facts sources, or research data. Otherwise, you'll wind up chasing your tail. I've heard wild claims from Colloidal silver activating some kind of quantum field, or that jackhammering your feet will cure psoriasis, or vitamin c or aspirin curing cancer.

I speak more from microbiology and science, since the facts are easy to look up, just burred in a huge pile of useless nonsense and even dangerous ideas recommended as just fine and safe