LED vs. HPS

Thanks for this quick reply Sir

Heres more info i found on the UFO its different from the cheap Ebay LED lights as most of them are cheap knock offs

Heres the info i found from my hydroponics store website.. mind the spelling had to google translate it.

LED - grow light UFO 90W Tri band. Red, blue and white.

PAR:
90 W LED - a plant light to light equivalent to about 400 W High pressure sodium light. Suurpainenatriumvalaisimen light the plant can use only 8 - 12% of the whole amount of light. LEDs - the wavelength of light is optimized for plants used by the wavelengths of. LED - plant light consumes electricity only a quarter of year-over-pressure sodium lamps. LED - light does not heat up, so it can be used indoors in the summer.

PAR:
5cm: 1527 umol
15cm: 599.5 umol
30cm: 194.35 umol
60cm: 54.82 umol

- Produces plants important to 630-660 nm wavelengths of light. The light fixture is also added to the 450-460 nm wave length of light the plant to support the healthy growth and development. Also, a little white light is added. - Long life: 50,000 hours - 1 year warranty. High quality and durable construction, and LED - technology ensures long life durability. - Reply to the light output of 400 W High Pressure Sodium - the lamp. - No heat, max. temperature of about 60 degrees.

the Fans are pretty quiet just imagine a slightly louder then normal computer.. and thats pretty much the same.
Hanging was simple this one i didnt need to connect any hangers or anything the wires for hanging are built into it and it has a real easy ( rock climbing harnest ) clip

This one was RRP 170e in the store
 
Some more info, thx mate.
The only thing i am wondering about now, is how could I attach the light close to the ceiling. The wire mechanism seems to take up a lot of height, and where i am planning to make my grow doesnt have much of that.
 
Hey Sir

Yeah the wire mechanism is really easy to adjust you can work the wires to your height preference, just undo the clip un-wined your string or make it tighter .. my wires are coming from inside my UFO so theres only the plug in the back that would really take up about a inch and a half of space from the ceiling. if you fashioned a hook from your ceiling then you could easily wined the wires around that then lock it in place with the clip... but saying that these lights give of barley any heat so yo can almost have them touching your plants.
 
This is my first ever post to 420. I've read the rules and etiquette but please bear with me if I get anything wrong like the links. I am now on my second grow cycle using 90W UFO lamps. The first attempt used a single lamp over one Easy Kush plant. It went well but it could have gone better if I had known what I was doing. For instance, I didn't appreciate how important it was not to allow any light on the plant during the flowering stage and I probably put back the harvest by several weeks by peeking at it during the dark phase. Despite that I managed to crop nearly 2 ounces dried weight of very strong weed. The whole grow cycle took more than four months (and more patience than you can imagine). But it was well worth the effort and for a total cost of £110 it produced £400 worth of weed, and made for a very cheap and enjoyable Christmas.
Since then I have bought another of the lamps from eBay and I have three plants coming into bloom.
p1020184v.jpg

I expect to get 10 ounces or more from them. Total outlay so far is about £300 including the lamps, grow tent, seeds, nutes, and electricity. Then I am going to shut down production until I have four or five ounces left and do it all again. It's all for me: it's not for sale. With all the capital costs covered by my first single plant, I am expecting the current crop to work out at less than £5 per ounce. That's one heck of an improvement on the £230 my (ex) dealer charges.
I have been using a 2012 Prakasa® 5 Band 90w UFO LED Grow Light with 50 x 3w LEDs = 150w. Except that my is last year's model which only has 3W LEDs.
I have a friend who is an expert on lighting who designs shop displays and his advice has been invaluable, as well as the use of his professional light meter. The Prakasa lights draw exactly 90 watts from the mains but the total wattage of the LEDs is 150 watts (50 X 3W). I understand this discrepancy is because the LEDs are not run at full power. The light output per lamp is 10,000 lux at half a metre distance, dropping to about 5.000 lux at one metre. This is about the equivalent of indirect sunlight on a sunny day. (One lux equals one lumen over an area of one square metre, and is the measure of the light received, whereas lumen is the measure of the lamp output). Bear in mind that the light meter expects to see white light and is weighted towards green at the centre of the spectrum. In the absence of that green light it will underestimate the amount of red and blue light it is receiving.
I was drawn to investing in LEDs because of the low power consumption and minimal heat and I am very pleased with the result. I can't compare my project to using traditional lamps because I've never used them, but I have heard too many horror stories about fires, heat sensitive police helicopter cameras, and eyewatering electricity bills to think there can be any advantage which overrides the benefits of LEDs.
 
Hello sir i noticed youve tried both led n hps im new to growin was wondering if i get a 150w hps system and 2 45w led bulbs should it be effcient for 6 to 8 plant grown dwc i also have a hid and 2 mh for vegging
 
Just thought I would add to this thread. I just wanted to post on Lumens, cause it seems to keep coming up about the difference between the two! So here ya go!

Luminous flux is a measure of the amount of light that is visible to the human eye, and lumens are the unit used to describe this measurement. So, why don't lumens matter when it comes to growing plants? Basically, lumens will show you how well a human eye will be able to see under a given light source...but plants don't have human eyes.

Plants have a variety of pigments that use the energy in light to convert carbon dioxide and water into sugars (this process is known as photosynthesis). Different pigments use different wavelengths of light to accomplish this task: Chlorophyll a absorbs red and dark blue light; Chlorophyll b absorbs orange and light-blue light; Carotenoids absorb blue, purple, and ultraviolet (UV) light; and green/yellow light is essential for phytochrome response. While there is some overlap between the wavelengths of light useful to the human eye and those useful to plants for photosynthesis, different wavelengths are more important for each function. For example, the human eye is most sensitive to yellow light, so the measure of lumens is weighted with respect to that particular range of wavelengths, while photosynthetic plants make the most use of red and blue light. Another important consideration is that many plants utilize non-visible wavelengths of light. For example, UV light stimulates the production of defensive chemical compounds in many plants and specifically trichome and terpenoid production in cannabis. Lumens don't provide any information about the UV or Infrared (IR) content of a light source.

So, what should you look for in a plant grow light, if not lumens? Lumens will give you some information about the power of a light source, but it is more important to pay attention to the combination of Photosynthetically Active Radiation (PAR) and Yield Photon Flux (YPF). Measured in micromoles per second and per square meter (µmol·s-¹·m-²), PAR shows how many photons in the 400 to 700 nanometer (nm) range of wavelengths are being emitted by a light source. The number of photons emitted is useful because photosynthesis takes place when a photon of light is absorbed by a reaction center located inside a photosynthetically active pigment. YPF is a weighted measure of photon flux between 350 and 800 nm, meaning that it takes into account which exact wavelengths of light are most useful to plants and assigns those wavelengths a greater value of usefulness. YPF includes wavelengths outside of the visible range of light, which can cause the production of useful chemical compounds in some plants. And, this explains why a combination of wavelengths is beneficial when growing plants under artificial light.

lumens are the last aspect under consideration when designing LED grow lights. We have a saying–Stop using street lights, and Start using plant lights–Phyto-genesis Spectrum is based on a combination of PAR, YPF, and years of experience growing plants with LED lights...
 
What it is, and why it matters

photosynthetic absorptionPhotosynthetically Active Radiation (PAR) refers to one way of measuring the range of light wavelengths (400–700 nanometers [nm]) that can be used for photosynthesis (see absorption range for photosynthesis chart to right). This range covers the visible spectrum of light, which includes red (700–635 nm), orange (635–590 nm), yellow (590–560 nm), green (560–490 nm), blue (490–450 nm), and violet (450–400 nm) wavelengths. Plants obtain the most light energy from the red, blue, and violet portions of the spectrum because these wavelengths are the most readily absorbed by chlorophyll, the main pigment in plants. In order to determine whether plants are receiving the correct spectrum for efficient photosynthesis, it is important to measure the PAR value of the light being used. Typically, a higher PAR value equals increased growth and healthier plants. PAR can be expressed in energy units, as watts per square meter (wm-2), or in quantum units, as micromoles of quanta per second per square meter (µmol s-1 m-2).

As noted above, PAR is one way of measuring light that places more importance on specific wavelengths that are useful in powering photosynthesis. Another common but less accurate measurement of the quality of light put out by a light source is luminous flux, given in units of lumens or lux. Lumens and why they aren’t relevant when assessing the quality of a light source for growing plants in the article found above. This means that two lights can have the same lumen rating but one could have a significantly higher PAR rating if it uses more of the wavelengths used during the process of photosynthesis.
 
Hope the info helped, it did for me!
My Set Up is with HPS, now but after this harvest I will be changing to the LED! I will be keeping a record of the grow. so I will keep yall in-formed!
 
leds ARE better ..........it took me a long time to come around but i had to see it with my own eyes,,,,ditch those old technology hps/mh bulbs and get LED ....check out TOPLEDGROWLIGHT...........they have the real deal....peace
 
The time to move to LED is now I believe the tehcnology has advanced enough to give some very good results.

Everyone Ive talked to about LED tech has told me that the technology is not there yet. I disagree, I believe it has greatly improved in the past 4 years, I am currently testing an LED light of good quality, since there are so many crappy lights still out there I understand the skepticism.

Check out my LED grow, link is my signature :)
 
rtoddb72 said:
leds ARE better ..........it took me a long time to come around but i had to see it with my own eyes,,,,ditch those old technology hps/mh bulbs and get LED ....check out TOPLEDGROWLIGHT...........they have the real deal....peace
Click to expand...

Agree, very awesome unit.
I have a marsII1200 with the "custom" spectrum, and it really kicks ass. soo happy with it..have some other units bought in the past, and they are "sleeping" around..this light grow nice dank buds.
 
fletcher said:
Has anybody tried out the hybrid led and induction lights? I found a couple companies with them.
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I would stay away from unproven Induction Grow lights until the technology is proven to perform as well as LED or High Pressure Sodium lights for flowering. @mcloadie tested an Induction Grow light and the light did not come close to providing enough light for cannabis plants.
 
JonnyHempSeed said:
As the plant shown is the first one I've come close to finishing under LED, I don't have an exact/avg yield yet, but I will take pictures and weigh that one when finished. This was grown under a 65W CFL to start, then a 90W LED for the remainder. I added the 120W to the 90W to fill out the rest, and I have them set at opposing angles to reach most of the under-brush.

As for light penetration, anything over 90W seems to be able to reach down to the bottom effectively, even with the light source a good 5-6 feet from the plant. The majority of the newer generation all still have their first primary leaves intact and healthy through veg and into flowering, so I would say I'm very happy with that- I will take more pictures in a couple days to show.

Only a few airy/underdeveloped flowers on the first plant, off of branches that were less than 1 cm long when flowering started.
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I just joined merely to reply to this post: either you made a typo (in which case forgive me) or you are either an outright liar or a fool, or both. There is no way ANY light will give decent results at 6 feet from the plants, not even a 1000w HPS, let alone a 90 watt LED. I am desperately looking for good reliable info on LEDs, but I know enough about them to know this is utter twaddle. Do you work for the company, or are you actually believing your own bull? I only hope noone has relied on your info in their purchasing decision
 
I beg to differ , I have tremendous results using 600 watt HPS lights at 5 feet distance from sprout , of course I move the light closer as they establish but for seedling starting I never had any better results. Also keep in mind Johnny also mention he will be showing pics of results so we should wait for that. I understand your concern norman uk so feel free to look at all the other LED grow journals and compare notes from grower to grower. Keep in mind some people grow with different methods that can actually turn out good results doing it in a non "Conventional" way. There is trillions of ways to cultivate cannabis , it is amazing seeing as many of those ways as possible!
 
WildRosebud said:
I beg to differ , I have tremendous results using 600 watt HPS lights at 5 feet distance from sprout , of course I move the light closer as they establish but for seedling starting I never had any better results. Also keep in mind Johnny also mention he will be showing pics of results so we should wait for that. I understand your concern norman uk so feel free to look at all the other LED grow journals and compare notes from grower to grower. Keep in mind some people grow with different methods that can actually turn out good results doing it in a non "Conventional" way. There is trillions of ways to cultivate cannabis , it is amazing seeing as many of those ways as possible!
Click to expand...


Thanks for your comments Wildrosebud. I'm sure you would kill your plants "stone" dead (pun intended) if you put that 600w light too close. I wouldn't dream of using a 600w on cuttings, no matter how far away it was. CCFL are always gonna give better results for cuttings than a massively over-powered 600w HPS, but of course you can dilute the power by having it so far away, which is a total waste of electricity and creates unnecessary heat. If you were to do it "properly" you would use ccfl on cuttings and then MH on veg and HPS on flower stage.

So, I guess I didn't make it clear that I was talking about flowering, not growing, as I would assume that no-one would use a 600w HPS to veg or root cuttings. How wrong could I be! I'm not criticising you for using the 600w HPS to root cuttings, but have you ever tried using ccfl propogation lights at a couple of inches from the tops of the plants? I guarantee that you will get better cuttings that root quicker than the method you are using now.

Johny actually said he used 65w cfl for (what I assume is) the cutting stage and then moved to 90w LED at 5-6 feet (once ready to flower, I assume). This, even by Wildrosebud's description is not consistent with good practice. In fact I stand by my original statement - If you are using a 90w LED it will not produce decent flowers at 5-6 feet. My original frustration is still bugging me though - I am still looking for reliable info on LEDs and their ability (or not) to outperform (or even match) a 600w HPS. I, for one though, will not be relying too heavily on someone's info who claims that they can flower at 5-6 feet away using a 90w LED. Not sure if we can post links but "dream on you c**t dot com"

I'm not big on all the stats and all the umols/m2 etc.. I tend to go by results, but if anyone cares to look up the umol output of Johny's 90w LED I would bet it didn't put out anything like the 800 umol/m2 (or whatever it is we need to grow a decent crop with). Then I am sure the science will back up my statements and call this guy out to be what I initially said he was.


Disclaimer:

If an LED exists anywhere that can give better results than a 600w HPS AT ANY DISTANCE, then I would love to know about it. There's a couple of dodgy "side-by-sides" on youtube, but nothing that couldn't be faked. What I really wanna see is info from someone doing a grow like a 5k+ room who has done the HPS up until they become sold on the LEDs, and then they tell us they would never go back to HPS. Now that would be intriguing. But people who are completely missing the basics are not gonna convince me, but they may convince some newbie who is looking into what lights to buy. Hence my suspicion that The OP is a "plant" (pun again) and is only trying to convince people to buy something that doesn't really work. The only evidence that he is not a "plant" is that he should have made his claims a little more believable, so I guess that only leaves one possibility....


BTW - either the OP also has a strain that takes months and months to finish flowering, or he isn't actually gonna post those pics - it has been 3 months since I called him out on it....not that a couple of pics are gonna prove anything - the science is wrong for his claims to be consistent with reality.
 

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