Everything LED, Open Source Light?

[Scooby_Snacks]

I'm not sure about everyone else but with the amount of LED journals popping up all over it's no longer as easy as it was to find the info I'm looking for. We're also now starting to get results in from several grows. I figured this would be a good spot to post results of finished journals, compare results with other completed grows, and figure out the best way to use these lights. Hopefully we get a lot of useful information accumulated. I feel like we have more growers here who want to grow with LED than anywhere else.


In irishboys 126w vs. 180w thread some of us have started talking about what if we came up with our own "secret formula" for an LED and having them made in China ourselves. I've seen people getting quotes for 300w units for $300-$400. What nm to use and how many of each is the question.

 

[Scooby_Snacks]

Finished Comparison Grow 1000w HPS vs. 3 x 126w HGL LED.

End of day one 1g/w for each. ledtester thought he could possibly double results.

 

[zett]

Yeah lets start the open source led science

 

[logitech227]

I would love to put together my own LED light but it would cost so much to buy the many different combinations of individual LEDs to find out what works best. I know I would use 3 piece chips oppose to single diodes.

If I had the money I would customize a light that not only covers the correct wavelengths with sufficient IR but I would want actual light control.

Similar to lumigrow light but with more control. I would want a 300w light that has 600w of LEDs on bored. 300 watts of LEDs between 420nm and 470 and 300 watts of LEDs between 630nm-660nm. The light would never run all 600w of LED at once only 300 watts but it would give you the control to pick actually how much of what spectrum you want during whatever phase of growth. Say for the last three weeks of flower you wanted to stack you buds so you could total eliminate the blue spectrum (if you wanted).

Basically it would be two lights in one and you could pick and chose what you wanted. So theoretically it would be twice the size of your standard light but if would give the end users 100% control.

Like I said I dont know the correct ratios because it would cost alot to conduct that R&D but if I had the money I would figure it all out. Money..money....money......none...lol

 

[dogsnova]

Damm.... I got a spectrum chart from a previous edition of High Times mag. The chart shows the spectrum absorption peeks for cannabis.. I don't have enough post to attach images yet...I will do this here as soon as I can.

As far as IR or 730nm goes. Your better off adding that separately. If it's part of the board of led lights you don't have much control of when the IR 730nm is on.

BTW the next best thing to IR 730nm led's is Clear Incandescent light bulbs. Now here is something good for led growers.. Clear Inc's not only add 730nm (Internal plant clock speed) but they add HEAT. We all know how led is lacking heat in some situations. So supplemental Clear Inc's will kill two birds with one stone so to speak.. Hope this helps you guy's make BIG large buds with LED's.. You keep at this and you will see LED's can match HID all day long..

 

[zett]

hey, just upload the chart in your personal area and then attach it to your reply or give link to it.
how to upload pics here

 

[dogsnova]

Wow... that's alot but OK I'll give a try...Thanks

 

[dogsnova]

Here is the chart... Thanks for the help..

 

[IrishBoy]

thanks nice chart. seems you need at least 8 diff spectrum's to work good for mmj

 

[dogsnova]

The best results I've found is. 20% blue with 420nm and 440nm.. Then 80% red 660nm. That's it for the LED's... AS for the IR 730nm I use clear inc's.. I don't need the IR on the board, IR requires alot of control...

 

[IrishBoy]

The best results I've found is. 20% blue with 420nm and 440nm.. Then 80% red 660nm. That's it for the LED's... AS for the IR 730nm I use clear inc's.. I don't need the IR on the board, IR requires alot of control...

what is exactly clear inc's? where kind i buy these at? and how do you use them?
do u run them the whole time during lights on or only a few hours during lights on? thnaks ive always wanted to learn more about these light and uv

 

[dogsnova]

Standard Clear Incandescent Light bulbs. Sorry I didn't make that clear..(no pun intended)..Professional growers have been using clear inc's for many many years for a far red source (730nm) during the plants day time (when the lights are on). Black lights ( as long as they are Incandescent black lights with a filament inside) can be use for a 730nm source during the plants dark time. They help speed up the dark time.

730nm during flowering will cause stretch. So in the first two weeks you need to use very little.. After the first two week stretch phase is over you can ramp up the 730nm intensity.. That's one of the main reasons you don't want LED 730nm on the LED board.. You need to be able to control it.


The use of clear INC's during your (day time) can be done alot of different ways. One is sun up and sun down (witch is the most popular IMO).
This would be a couple of hours in the morning and then a couple of hours in the evening... You know before the lights go off for the night..

The other one is 1/2 hour on then 1/2 hour off for the entire time the lights are on 12 hours.. Works good also IMO

The other method is on the whole 12 hours. This method requires you to know your strain pretty good. You gotta watch for stretch..

Now on to the black lights...

Believe it or not you can run Incandescent black lights 11 hours of the dark time and this will allow you to flower using 13 hours on and 11 hours off. BUT this is not very efficient..

Most people just run black lights about hour after the light goes out to make up for the slow LED set ups..

Unfortunately most LED growers don't know about the clear INC's and use the black.. That's probably why you've heard about them..

Clear inc's durring the day time is much better for a 12/12 grow.

730nm is mostly for speed...

 

[Scooby_Snacks]

The Lurker seems to have some good information regarding customer LED's as well. I know he's got spectrum information worked up as well.

I have a feeling once people see a few grows with custom ordered LED's that will be the trend.

 

[IrishBoy]

Standard Clear Incandescent Light bulbs. Sorry I didn't make that clear..(no pun intended)..Professional growers have been using clear inc's for many many years for a far red source (730nm) during the plants day time (when the lights are on). Black lights ( as long as they are Incandescent black lights with a filament inside) can be use for a 730nm source during the plants dark time. They help speed up the dark time.

730nm during flowering will cause stretch. So in the first two weeks you need to use very little.. After the first two week stretch phase is over you can ramp up the 730nm intensity.. That's one of the main reasons you don't want LED 730nm on the LED board.. You need to be able to control it.


The use of clear INC's during your (day time) can be done alot of different ways. One is sun up and sun down (witch is the most popular IMO).
This would be a couple of hours in the morning and then a couple of hours in the evening... You know before the lights go off for the night..

The other one is 1/2 hour on then 1/2 hour off for the entire time the lights are on 12 hours.. Works good also IMO

The other method is on the whole 12 hours. This method requires you to know your strain pretty good. You gotta watch for stretch..

Now on to the black lights...

Believe it or not you can run Incandescent black lights 11 hours of the dark time and this will allow you to flower using 13 hours on and 11 hours off. BUT this is not very efficient..

Most people just run black lights about hour after the light goes out to make up for the slow LED set ups..

Unfortunately most LED growers don't know about the clear INC's and use the black.. That's probably why you've heard about them..

Clear inc's durring the day time is much better for a 12/12 grow.

730nm is mostly for speed...

thanks man plus rep to you. this may sound stupid but what dose IR do during lights on? i understand what the black light dose for the dark period. IR helps with bud growth right, but isn't it mainly for the heat and radiant heat that leds don't put off right?

 

[zett]

dogsnova, thanx for sharing us this info!


what W and how many incs do you use? How do u position them?

 

[IrishBoy]

Here is the chart... Thanks for the help..

so dose anyone think that making a led light with all of these NM would make a better led light then what we have on the market right now. seems if a company or someone used these nm and found the right ratios, they would have a better grow light then whats out their right now. maybe i too high right now? but dosent that make sense?

 

[zett]

i think we must find out all possible info on constructing our ideal led light.

say, let it be cheap one – equivalent to 400W hps, so it wont be too pricey to make it and test


we must collect all knowledge and put it like:

for getting some 400W HPS results we need the following:

N leds (which manufacturer) with N wattage with N spectrum (nm) and how to position them on the plate

i guess it should be rectangular case, right?


i see a lot of wise guys here, so why not try?

 

[Bionic]

Personally, I think there should be an emphasis on strictly flower. A 300 watter (actual, not equivalent.) This product would have the most value for most, if not all. Having a specific light for veg. and one for flower may be better than one for both and you're not exactly steeping on any toes because that's not the focus of any of the sponsors.

 

[dogsnova]

thanks man plus rep to you. this may sound stupid but what dose IR do during lights on? i understand what the black light dose for the dark period. IR helps with bud growth right, but isn't it mainly for the heat and radiant heat that leds don't put off right?

Thanks for the rep there Irish... Plus Just so you no there are know stupid questions in my book. So please ask as many as you would like.. I will try to help.


Ok Clear inc's and black inc's both give off 730nm... Black Inc's have ZERO photosynthetic ability. They only give off 730nm...Plus they run very hot.
Clear inc's on the other hand have a much better photosynthetic ability (Still run hot, just not as hot as black inc's).. Witch means clear inc's actually add to the photosynthesis of your existing set up.

So running black lights during the day time would only give you far red 730nm, AND alot of heat.. Not a good choice.
Now clear inc's are going to give you 730nm plus photosynthesis. Much better choice.

Clear inc's also improve trich production and flavor noids. The funny thing is, you never hear of anyone saying use clear inc's for flavor... But you can now say you've read it somewhere...LOL..... If you do a side by side flower with and without clear inc's you will be able to see and taste the difference. Trust me...

So the reason you want to add 730nm in the first place is for speed. Without it your flowers Finnish slower.. So because most led grows need speed it's much better to use clear inc's for the speed.. They give you more then just speed...LOL .....And since they are a blue light source you can only run clear inc's during the day time..Running clear inc's during you night time will interrupt the plants dark time.. (sorry) That above statement was just for someone reading this that might not know better and try to run clear inc's during the night time.... Don't do it...

Black inc's only come in a few different wattages so you kind of have to use what you can find.
Clear inc's on the other hand come in all different shapes and sizes and wattages... Alot to chose form...

Clear inc's are a fun little toys IMO.... They kill three birds with one stone... Speed, Flavor noids and Trich production.. If you need heat in you LED grow room they can also help...But know it's not for the heat.. Heat is just a byproduct that some LED growers could use..Try them I think you will like it's effects....

Now let's talk about what happens outdoors.. This might help you understand the need for speed..LOL

Outdoors there is a good amount of far red in the morning (sun up) and there is a LOT of far red in the evening (sun down).. This is some of the magic that Mother Nature provides for plants outdoors. HID has a good amount of far red but you can't manipulate it. Clear inc's you can manipulate all day long....

 

[dogsnova]

so dose anyone think that making a led light with all of these NM would make a better led light then what we have on the market right now. seems if a company or someone used these nm and found the right ratios, they would have a better grow light then whats out their right now. maybe i too high right now? but dosent that make sense?

The HGL light has 440nm 470nm I think it might be 460 (same thing IMO) 640nm 660nm and IR and white. They are only missing 420nm.. But just adding 420nm to those lights are not gonna make them much better.

I know this might sound strange but you don't need to waste the board space with some of those spectrums.. Like I pointed out earler 420nm 440nm and 660nm is all you need on one board.. If you can afford it I would put the IR on seperate board so it can be miniuplated.. But I just use clear inc's or black inc's for the IR....It works better for me.